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The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:02:28 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		The Music-Copyright Enforcers
Wow.   This is a 6 page read-  in short- any place in public might suppose to have a music license.    It sounds sticky.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:26:52 PM   
sappatoti


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Status: offline 		What's sticky about it? This isn't anything new.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:34:51 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		I did not know a simple coffee shop has to pay $800 a month for license fees.  That seems excessive.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:38:51 PM   
Jeffff


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Status: offline 		PA?.. .I love you like a gay Scout Leader, but we have been over this before.

ANTING you broadcast it or use it COMMERCIALLY, you pay.

EVERY TIME a song is broadcast OR used commercially, who ever owns the publishing gets paid.


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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:40:24 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		No.   We did not cover this.


Read the 6 pages.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:42:17 PM   
poise


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Status: offline 		Applesauce is sticky. But yummy goodness!

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:43:52 PM   
sappatoti


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Status: offline 		That would depend upon how the music was being used now, wouldn't it.

Starbucks uses a lot of music, some even in their promotions (remember the music giveaways on iTunes?) All that music needs to be licensed and, given the volume of songs given away or played, I'm guessing their bill was for a whole lot more than $800.00.

Now, mom-n-pop coffee who only uses music to fill their backoffice, where there is no possibility of customers hearing any of it might not have to pay anything.

The music licenses aren't a standard price. They are determined by how many locations a business has, how many customers they serve at any given time, how the music is played, whether the music is used directly in sales to customers or used in promotions, etc., etc., etc. The rate is based upon all of those factors, which means it will vary from one business to another.

On the flip side, if $800 is a price that's too steep to pay, then the fictional coffee shop shouldn't play music. After all, it's the coffee the customers are coming for and not the music playing in the background. So, perhaps they should just turn the music off.

Actually, I have stopped into mom-n-pop operations that didn't have music playing in the background. It can be quite a break away from the relatively noisy world outside their doors.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:44:20 PM   
Jeffff


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Status: offline 		The same rule applies.

You may listen to your music all you want, you own it.

As soon as you use it commercially you have to pay.

Like a juke box, remember those? You and Peggy Sue, or Bobby Joe?, would go down to the malt shop. You looking so adorable in your poodle skirt and bobby socks!

You'd put a nickle in the juke box and dance and dance.

Some of that nickle paid the owner of the song.

Does the skirt still fit?

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:50:49 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		Many places here play the radio.

It almost sounds like that too would be an act requiring a license.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:52:22 PM   
Jeffff


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Status: offline 		They radio station pays.

You are enjoying the broadcast.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:54:06 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		--  it was an interesting read.

:-)

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 1:55:11 PM   
Jeffff


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Status: offline 		WHat about the skirt?

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 2:00:52 PM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		^ pinches Jefffs hot azz ^

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 2:15:19 PM   
igor2003


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Status: offline 		You would be surprised how much you DON'T actually own music once you bought it. For instance, if you are at a picnic or party with 4 or 5 of your friends and you play music...you are SUPPOSED to have a license! It doesn't have to be commercial. At least I know this was the case about 10 years ago, so maybe it has changed since then, but I doubt it. Of course it also depends on who's music you are listening to. There are at least two different licencing companies or organizations and each one has it's own rules and regulations, and some music isn't licensed at all. Not long ago Taylor Swift was suing a small bar in Idaho because the Karoke DJ was offering her music without a license. It really gets pretty nit-picky and is often hard to know which license you are even supposed to have. A number of years ago I was taking dance lessons at a dance studio that thought they had all the right licenses, but it turned out one of their licenses was wrong somehow, so they had to play elevator music for a while until the mess could be straightened out. (Which was when I really started researching it to see what was what.) There really are a lot of variables and it isn't simply a matter of whether it is commercially used or not.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 2:21:08 PM   
Jeffff


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Status: offline 		I was trying to keep it simple.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 2:23:17 PM   
pahunkboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: igor2003

You would be surprised how much you DON'T actually own music once you bought it. For instance, if you are at a picnic or party with 4 or 5 of your friends and you play music...you are SUPPOSED to have a license! It doesn't have to be commercial. At least I know this was the case about 10 years ago, so maybe it has changed since then, but I doubt it. Of course it also depends on who's music you are listening to. There are at least two different licencing companies or organizations and each one has it's own rules and regulations, and some music isn't licensed at all. Not long ago Taylor Swift was suing a small bar in Idaho because the Karoke DJ was offering her music without a license. It really gets pretty nit-picky and is often hard to know which license you are even supposed to have. A number of years ago I was taking dance lessons at a dance studio that thought they had all the right licenses, but it turned out one of their licenses was wrong somehow, so they had to play elevator music for a while until the mess could be straightened out. (Which was when I really started researching it to see what was what.) There really are a lot of variables and it isn't simply a matter of whether it is commercially used or not.


I know the rules have been there for a long time-  it does seem tho abit of overkill.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 4:00:41 PM   
DomImus


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Status: offline 		This has been the situation for as long as I can remember. I played in bar bands on and off for about twenty years. I doubt that most of the establishments I played in were up to date on their licensing fees. I recall seeing a BMI or ASCAP decal on the door of one of the bars but it had been expired by about five years at that time. The band or performer is not responsible for these fees. The bar or restaurant owner is. I read a recent article where Bruce Springsteen sued a NYC bar for such. Actually as the story states it was not Bruce but he took a lot of heat for it.

< Message edited by DomImus -- 8/9/2010 4:02:20 PM >

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 4:45:54 PM   
sappatoti


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From: the edge of darkness...
Status: offline 		The band I worked with didn't want to play a gig one night at a bar that was a three hour drive in the mountains. They asked the bar owner to produce his licensing and when he couldn't, we didn't play.

It was a PITA place anyway. Winter time... mountains... breaking down or sliding off the road at 3:00 AM in the Adirondacks just wasn't our idea of a fun time.

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 5:36:13 PM   
Arpig


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Status: offline 		Too strict enforcement will be detrimental to the music industry

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RE: The Music-Copyright Enforcers - 8/9/2010 5:43:24 PM   
sappatoti


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Too strict enforcement will be detrimental to the music industry

You're right. It's all about how the PROs go about educating and collecting the licensing fees.

The one point of interest I got from the OP's referenced article is just how laid back BMI is in their collection efforts. Persistent, but still pretty laid back. I got the impression that while a heavy-handed legal option is available to them for enforcement of the collections, they oft times prefer to wait out a business (ten years in some cases, it appears).

The RIAA, on the other hand, seemed to have gone right to the heavy-handed legal approach when dealing with individuals. That just made everyone angry and even more rebellious.

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"Community, Identity, Stability." ~ A Brave New World, Aldous Huxley, 1932

If you don't like my attitude, QUIT TALKING TO ME!

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