RE: Legalize IT (Full Version)

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MzMinx -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:06:39 AM)

just on the question about driveing and drug testing ... australia has had traffic/driver spot testing for several drug substances for several years, no different than random alcohol breath testing and it spots recent usage. eg its aim is to look for people under the influence not who have ever consumed

the link below is one of our states web page on it

http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/roadsafety/alcoholdrugs/drugdriving/drugdrivingfaqs.html



tazzygirl -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:15:32 AM)

They had a road side test kit here in the US... and found it gave far too many false positives.



TheRaptorJesus -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:16:52 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

~FR

Im surprised to see so many men want it legalized considering pot was linked to an aggressive form of testicular cancer a couple of years ago.

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/138372.php


Maybe the men are just happy that THC has been shown to stop the spread of breast cancer because it helps the women we adore.

And to combat your link:

THC stops lung cancer: http://www.nowpublic.com/thc_marijuana_helps_cure_cancer_says_harvard_study

And the aforementioned breast cancer: http://mendonews.wordpress.com/2010/02/26/medical-marijuana-stops-spread-of-breast-cancer/



tazzygirl -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:20:23 AM)

I have no issue with pot use for medical purposes.

Your links dont combat what i posted. Pot use stops the spread of breast cancer and may cure lung cancer, according to your links.

Pot didnt cause them as in the testicular cancer..



SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:20:39 AM)

 
quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

I'm pretty confident more people have died from tobacco-related illnesses (cancer, emphysema, circulatory problems) than have died in marijuana-related accidents.



Tobacco its SELF and only TOBACCO when dried completely naturally is not HARMFUL its the products MADE from tobacco. Theirs a HUGE difference, why because tobacco products have added chemicals, that make them HARMFUL.

The chemicals in Cigarettes are what makes them harmful which is linked to the cancer the emphysema the circulatory problems.  IF you added the same chemicals to a different plant, youd have a slightly different taste but the same problems would occur. Ya know 150 years ago, people who smoked pipes really didnt cough all that much or have such issues, it wasnt until it was produced with chemicals it started to have an issue.

I dont have a problem with people smoking pot and staying in their homes until the effects wear off. I have a problem with those people doing several things
Driving while high,
smoking in enclosed corners where more then themselves are affected (contact high)
The effects of pot on them long term that can and will lead to the harm of others.

You see smoking pot wither or not you can comprehend it, KILLS brain cells, as brain cells are killed more and more, people smoking it more and more will become progressively stupider, doing things that they normally wouldnt do.

Have you ever seen the effects on someone whos smoked pot for 30 years straight? I have, they had difficulty adding things like multiplication, or even noticing the difference from the light changing from yellow to red.

You dont honestly think such things.....wouldnt lead to Deaths if pot is made legal... with out any way to test when people are pulled over figure out if theyve been smoking or not.....

Legal or not people are still going to smoke pot, Its just if its made legal more people will do it, which means more people will be affected by the harmful effects.


Aside from tax revenue what GOOD will come from making pot legal? Ive listed MOST of the BAD But no one has listed the positive effects of pot becoming legal. The only good thats been mentioned is less of a tax on the legal system, which isnt true because the people arrested for duis and other influence related crimes will be taking the place of those who are arrested for posession.



TheRaptorJesus -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:24:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I have no issue with pot use for medical purposes.

Your links dont combat what i posted. Pot use stops the spread of breast cancer and may cure lung cancer, according to your links.

Pot didnt cause them as in the testicular cancer..


By your statement I would assume you're against recreational use then?

Are you against tobacco being legal? Or alcohol?

It would be surprising for someone reading my posts to know that I don't actually smoke pot. I really dislike it, actually. It's just completely absurd that it's illegal.



CynthiaWVirginia -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:25:50 AM)

I haven't seen where making it illegal has prevented it's use.  I have always had some neighbor (sometimes half of the apartment building) using pot.  The pot smokers were quieter than the ones who drank alcohol.
 
I went to that link about testicular cancer.  Since drinking alcohol can cause cancer in the mouth and throat, on the cancer risk alone I cannot think of keeping it illegal.  Women get hormone pills that can give them breast cancer later on and these are not illegal.  (Nobody tell me this ain't so, because my gyn refuses to give me hormone replacement pills after having chemos for lymphoma because he's afraid of giving me cancer.)
 
In the past when I've had chemos, I wish pot had been legal and I wish I had been able to take it instead of compazine.  At least this would have given me some appetite and would have calmed my nerves a little, instead I was given additional nerve pills that had a warning label that said it would make me drowsy and not to drive a car.
 
I had heard that one area legalized pot for people with cancer to be able to grow two plants...but that feds came and hauled them off to jail anyway.  (I cannot back that up with any links because it was just talk among us cancer patients.) 
 
I was also told that in my state if anyone is caught driving while impaired by any kind of medication, even something like Benadryl, they would be jailed.  We already have laws on the books for driving under the influence of alcohol or meds that would cause impairment.  If someone got drunk on vodka and chewed some grape Bubble Yum (that's what they were doing in my jr. high to disguise the smell), how would a policeman know when he cannot smell it and there are no containers in the vehicle?  Walking a line and touching the nose, something like that...  What would work with pot?  Something similar?  A drug dog?  How the heck do they know someone is impaired by Benadryl or something?  There must be some way to know or there wouldn't already be laws on the books being enforced. 



TheRaptorJesus -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:27:45 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpiritedRadiance

Aside from tax revenue what GOOD will come from making pot legal? Ive listed MOST of the BAD But no one has listed the positive effects of pot becoming legal. The only good thats been mentioned is less of a tax on the legal system, which isnt true because the people arrested for duis and other influence related crimes will be taking the place of those who are arrested for posession.



The reason the DEA supports decriminalizing it (reread that please... the DEA supports it) is because it would take a lot of power away from the Mexican drug cartels.

It would also lead to less people drinking or becoming alcoholics... would relieve stress of a lot of wound up people. And hey... it's freedom. Sweet, delicious freedom. Why do you hate freedom?



SpiritedRadiance -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:35:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheRaptorJesus


The reason the DEA supports decriminalizing it (reread that please... the DEA supports it) is because it would take a lot of power away from the Mexican drug cartels.

It would also lead to less people drinking or becoming alcoholics... would relieve stress of a lot of wound up people. And hey... it's freedom. Sweet, delicious freedom. Why do you hate freedom?



Your facts supporting that for a fact it would take away the power from the drug cartels? Last I checked pot wasnt the only drug in the world,......Coke is still going to be a problem and its still going to be smuggled in and they are still going to have the same amount of power.......

Your facts to prove people would drink less? What makes being addicted to the feeling of being high any less then drinking?So instead of Alcoholics we will have more drug addicts..... Yes thats the solution.....

Are you assured it would relieve the stress of wound up people? You do realize Pot affects people differently not everyone gets mellow... in fact some people get MANIC Hell some people go psycho... You cannot assure that EVERY person doing pot is going to be mellow, just like you cant assure everyone who drinks is going to be a happy giggly drunk.... The difference is you can tell when someones had to much to drink and you can cut them off, you cant tell if one puff or one bowl is too much for someone smoking pot.

And what makes it freedom? Theres nothing that will come of making pot legal aside from death of innocent people, and people taking in the tax revenue that lines the pockets of everyone but the average tax payer,

ETA a part then to fix it because Im forgetting words....



tazzygirl -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 12:43:17 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheRaptorJesus

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I have no issue with pot use for medical purposes.

Your links dont combat what i posted. Pot use stops the spread of breast cancer and may cure lung cancer, according to your links.

Pot didnt cause them as in the testicular cancer..


By your statement I would assume you're against recreational use then?

Are you against tobacco being legal? Or alcohol?

It would be surprising for someone reading my posts to know that I don't actually smoke pot. I really dislike it, actually. It's just completely absurd that it's illegal.



I dont believe the effects, long term, have been sufficiently studied.

I used to smoke pot. I would never drive.

I rarely drink and i always take a cab if i do.

I do smoke, never indoors.

I work with a kid who admits to coming to work stoned. His car looks like he was stoned.

I truly have no issue with people using in their own homes, minus the kids. Same way i feel about alcohol.

Its the effects on the public that i have the most concern with. My son, oh about 12 years ago, wrote a letter to the Editor asking why breathalyzers arent mandatory in every car to prevent drunk driving. Bet you can guess he never got a response. And i couldnt agree more with my kid.

In the privacy of your own home, where you are affecting no one but yourself, i could care less what you do.

When you go out in public, and affect the health and well being of others, then i have every right to speak up.



Charles6682 -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 1:05:51 AM)

Where's the Conservative Republican's on this issue.This is the most confusing aspect to me out of all of this.They say they are for "less government",yet they continue to advocate this being illegal more than anyone.Democrat's aren't any better but at least they are easing up off of the medical marijuana debate.Come on conservative's,you claim you are for more freedom and less government.This area just might bring you some hidden and unknown Republican's.



willbeurdaddy -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 1:53:30 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

You really have no idea how prevalent casual and recreational drug use is, do you Wilbur?




I know quite well. I also know how much worse it would be with legalization.



thishereboi -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 5:21:11 AM)

quote:

I dont have a problem with people smoking pot and staying in their homes until the effects wear off. I have a problem with those people doing several things
Driving while high,
smoking in enclosed corners where more then themselves are affected (contact high)
The effects of pot on them long term that can and will lead to the harm of others.
Really, could you expand on this one and provide a few links to show us.


You see smoking pot wither or not you can comprehend it, KILLS brain cells, as brain cells are killed more and more, people smoking it more and more will become progressively stupider, doing things that they normally wouldnt do.

Have you ever seen the effects on someone whos smoked pot for 30 years straight? I have, they had difficulty adding things like multiplication, or even noticing the difference from the light changing from yellow to red.

Actually I know several people who have smoked it the majority of their lives and they can still add, subtract and tell the difference between colors. In fact a few of my classmates are long time smokers and still manage to get really good grades. Now it is possible that they would be that much smarter if they had never smoked, but the one I just talked to said she will settle for her 3.8 average, thanks all the same. Maybe your friend was just really stupid to begin with?




rulemylife -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 5:21:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I don't have a problem with making it legal. 858,000 were arrested in the US last year for this. That is a huge strain on law enforcement. Passing this proposition in CA will not make it legal however. It will have to be done on a Federal level.


I know, but it will be a start and put pressure on the federal government to rethink the policy.



thishereboi -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 5:24:50 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

Where's the Conservative Republican's on this issue.This is the most confusing aspect to me out of all of this.They say they are for "less government",yet they continue to advocate this being illegal more than anyone.Democrat's aren't any better but at least they are easing up off of the medical marijuana debate.Come on conservative's,you claim you are for more freedom and less government.This area just might bring you some hidden and unknown Republican's.



Well I am conservative and I have posted my opinion a couple of times on cm. What confuses me is why it matters what side of the fence I am on. Does everything have to be taken to the right vs left with you? Can you ever talk about something without bringing that bs to the boards?



rulemylife -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 5:59:29 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

Its not that they think its harmless, its that they are ignorant of the extent of the risks.


Why don't you point those out for us Willbeur?

Instead of your usual platitudes maybe you can actually get off your ass and offer some proof for once.



barelynangel -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 6:38:15 AM)

Actually many car crashes are DUIs and that doesn't mean its just alcohol.  Also, i will find it amusing when people start suing the govenment for harm marijuana causes them because the government decided to legalize it after it being illegal.

They are caught between a rock and a hard place, if they keep it illegal it will always be a nuisance, if they legalize it they are making themselves responsible for anything that goes wrong with it.

The fact that its been illegal for almost longer than most of us have been alive is a big factor, by keeping it illegal we are saying any harm that comes from it s expected.  By making it legal, we are saying ohh its not that bad, its okay, and opening the government and suppliers and such to being held responsible for the harm it may cause.

I can see why they don't want to legalize it.  People are way to happy to place responsibility of their actions on others, and just the fact that it was illegal for such a long time will set up this government for a responsibility i don't believe it should or can accept.

In this day and age, they would be stupid to legalize it.

angel



slvemike4u -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 6:41:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

You really have no idea how prevalent casual and recreational drug use is, do you Wilbur?


You could've stopped at "You really have no idea"...yes,its an incomplete sentence....but in this case ,and considering who it was addressed to, it would have covered things fine



slvemike4u -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 6:49:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Actually many car crashes are DUIs and that doesn't mean its just alcohol.  Also, i will find it amusing when people start suing the govenment for harm marijuana causes them because the government decided to legalize it after it being illegal.

They are caught between a rock and a hard place, if they keep it illegal it will always be a nuisance, if they legalize it they are making themselves responsible for anything that goes wrong with it.

The fact that its been illegal for almost longer than most of us have been alive is a big factor, by keeping it illegal we are saying any harm that comes from it s expected.  By making it legal, we are saying ohh its not that bad, its okay, and opening the government and suppliers and such to being held responsible for the harm it may cause.

I can see why they don't want to legalize it.  People are way to happy to place responsibility of their actions on others, and just the fact that it was illegal for such a long time will set up this government for a responsibility i don't believe it should or can accept.

In this day and age, they would be stupid to legalize it.

angel
If this were true why isn't the gov't sued after an accident involving alcohol?
In this day and age they are stupid for delaying the inevitable.....it will be legalised sooner or later.The societal drain of keeping this a criminal offence is enormous....and to no advantage.



barelynangel -> RE: Legalize IT (10/30/2010 6:55:09 AM)

Because prohibition occured a long time ago, when people actually took responsibility for their own actions so when it was lifted people didn't blame the govenment they took responsibility for own actions because they chose to drink it which allowed a status quo to be set -- i.e., you can't win if you sue the govenment for lifting prohibition.  However, people DO in fact sue bars and bartenders and liquor stores for their choosing to drink alcohol.  The status quo wouldn't hold if people tried to start suing now. 

And people nowadays would in fact blame the government and blame suppliers etc. So while the criminal aspect may be lifted, the drain on the govenment entities would still be there -- it would just be a change in geography.  And, as it is not a majority concept accepted throughout the country, it would not bode well for the government if they started being sued for making it legal and people are being harmed.

I don't believe it is inevitable it will be legalized.

angel



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