A new hope (Full Version)

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Aneirin -> A new hope (12/4/2010 10:45:32 AM)

Some very interesting points raised in this article that would benefit all to read ;

Zionism predates Fascism, the two are one in the same






DarkSteven -> RE: A new hope (12/4/2010 11:28:41 AM)

That article is complete junk.First off, it never defined Zionism, which to me used to be a movement to establish a Jewish state and is now a movement to keep the Jewish state.  A few points:

1. "
Golda Meir had also told him on camera that, "There was no such thing as Palestinian." And according to Hart, "Her statement represented Zionism's official line on the matter; a line that was accepted and repeated parrot-like by Israel's unquestioning supporters everywhere."

So what IS A Palestinian, then?  Saying that everyone believes it is not adequate.  Hell, everyone believes in the law of gravity as well.  The fact that it's a popular view means that it is NOT enough to simply dismiss it out of hand.

2. "
Hart said that since the unilateral declaration of independence by Israel an informed and honest debate has not been possible on this subject because of fear of being labelled anti-Semitic. He attacked the media and politicians for allowing themselves to be blackmailed by the Zionists. According to Hart journalists were not necessarily sympathetic to the Zionist state but the problem was with the owners of big publishers who were afraid of being punished for their honesty by their advertisement plugs being pulled."

Yeah, yeah.  We Jews with our international conspiracy own the media.  I've heard that one before.  It predates the founding of Israel, BTW.

And this idiot needs to learn what the word "blackmail" means.  It is a big, scary word, but it is NOT a blanket replacement for the word "pressured", which is what he means.  He also mused the word "eluded" instead of "deluded" previously.  And later "inhuman" for :inhumane" and "migrating" for emigrating".  Maybe the reason that nobody was willing to publish his book was due to lousy writing, not controversial views?

3. "
Hart stressed that Zionist propaganda is aimed at getting away with its crimes and impress upon Americans, Europeans and the Jews outside that there has been a threat to its existence. He said that there has never been a threat to the existence of Zionist state."

I am impressed that just on his say-so, the Six Day War never happened.

The following website describes the anti-Israel actions prior to that war: http://www.zionism-israel.com/dic/6daywar.htm

4. "
Persuading Muslims in the UK to be more politically active and be part of the democratic setup, Hart said that in response to one programme news organisations receive thousands of phone calls and emails by the supporters of Zionism but few from Muslims."

So popular opinion is against him, and he blames that on "the silent majority" of Muslims.

5. "
He stressed that the existence of Israel is illegal and anyone in the world who could give legitimacy to the Zionist state it is the Palestinians, the rightful owners of the occupied land. He said that two state solution is not a solution. The only solution, he said, was "one state" in which Jews and Palestinians can live together."

Where do I begin?  Israel's original legitimacy stems from the UN.  It also won the Six Day War, giving it a SECOND claim to legitimacy, neither one of which is adequate for the author.  He gives no backing for his claim that the Palestinians are the rightful owners of the land.  And Jews and Palestinians DO live together in Israel today - he neglects to mention how his vision differs from current reality.

6. "
In his vehement condemnation of Zionism, Holocaust survivor Dr Hajo G Meyer said that Zionism predates fascism and fascists and Zionists had a history of cooperating with each other. He said that the Zionist state of Israel wants to create anti-Semitism in the world so that more and more Jews start migrating to Israel."

Huh?









DomKen -> RE: A new hope (12/4/2010 12:10:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

That article is complete junk.First off, it never defined Zionism, which to me used to be a movement to establish a Jewish state and is now a movement to keep the Jewish state.  A few points:

1. "
Golda Meir had also told him on camera that, "There was no such thing as Palestinian." And according to Hart, "Her statement represented Zionism's official line on the matter; a line that was accepted and repeated parrot-like by Israel's unquestioning supporters everywhere."

So what IS A Palestinian, then?  Saying that everyone believes it is not adequate.  Hell, everyone believes in the law of gravity as well.  The fact that it's a popular view means that it is NOT enough to simply dismiss it out of hand.

This is really well settled. Try and find the term palestinian before about 1965. The people who are so labelled are mostly simply arabs with no particular ancestral tie to the area in question. Arafat is the classic example, Yasser Arafat's famly was Egyptian and his only connection to Palestine was his father's short residence in Gaza before his birth.

Another point to be kept in mind is that before the Jews came in a dug wells the entire area could barely support a few tens of thousands of people. It is literally impossible that all the people who claim to be palestinian could have all had ancestors living in the area in 1948. Population expansion from less than 100k to the couple of million who claim the "right to return" would require family sizes of ludicrous proportions in the 60 years available..




truckinslave -> RE: A new hope (12/4/2010 12:39:40 PM)

I see that anti-semitism is alive and well.




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