Aneirin
Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
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As I said in post #36, I believe those that get their knickers in a twist when anyone questions religion which they possibly equate as attacking their religion and there, their belief to me display doubts in religion themselves.
This deduced from the fact that if one's faith and their belief is strong enough, an attacker would not be apparent, but those that question act as questioners not attackers. The 'doubting Thomas's' of this world should be accomodated, not repelled, and that I remember from my Christian religious indoctrination way back.
I understand you GotSteel are an unbeliever, agnostic or atheist, and that is your right, but I am also aware those that do not believe, i.e. are not a member of a religion or association of like minds are coming in for a lot of attack, especially in the USA.
Why is this, well perhaps for the fact that religious groups bear a lot of resemblance to tribalism, you are either one of the tribe, or an outsider, and as an outsider, you are distrusted and seen as a threat, a threat that ideally must be converted, or repelled and ultimately destroyed.
But it is a fact that many people seek belonging, they need to be part of something to feel complete, they need the company of others, a need which is ancient, but what those that need fail to recognise is that there are people who don't need to belong, individuals with their own equally valid train of thought.
Now I as an individual, a free thinker with no fixed allegiance to anyone other than myself (sometimes), I do not need to belong and although I have examined many of the religions in the seach for the truth that I seek, I have found all lacking, that being although I do have belief, it is not one as currently can be defined by any religious movement, ancient or modern, but similarities in my belief can be found world wide in many different beliefs. Which leads me to conclude that the truth that I seek, and perhaps this is the same for many who are brutally honest with themselves, the truth is not in religion, but in mankind as individuals.
Religion: My belief; although perhaps it had more honest roots where what it is that many seek was thought to be better obtained through the meeting of minds, it has degenerated into the leader/follower situation which is common to human society, where the leader leads and the follower follows, that being although the follower might have the answer, they are a follower and so must submit. This leads to the situation where original thought dies or the follower breaks away to seek more on the notion they have received either via other beliefs, or they follow their own belief.
So, could the question be asked those that break away from religion through disagreement with their faith or failing to find what they seek, could the notion they have received be the word of whatever entity they personaly are searching for ? But that is basically saying the word of whatever was received through a follower, not a leader. Now it is known leaders who hold positions of power and influence do not want to give up their positions easily, as many of those that actively seek leadership do so because of ego, they have to be a leader, be it a leader of an established community, or if the ego is particularly great, start their own community where they will preside over. So what hope the follower, what do they do, can they challenge the ego of the leader and there embroil themselves in the inevitable politics that often have absolutely nothing to do with the orignal reason for the formation of the group, as personal pride takes centre stage or choose to walk their own path, quite often disgusted with religious society, those that say they leave religion.
What was that Christian saying, ' The Lord works in mysterious ways ', so define mysterious, and then you will find what we have as the accepted structures of belief can be redundant, for if the Lord works in mysterious ways, then anyone can find what it is that they are personally searching for without adherance to what is basically a club with a fixed set of definitions, rules of membership.
But here I will reference a most palatable website I have recently discovered where in the case of the Christian an internet survey was conducted as to what the definition of a Christian is, and they came up with about 40 different and conflicting definitions, although it was noted of the websites it was very difficult in some cases to define what the community actually believed, as their modus operandi was not posted, but it is usual with websites, the webmaster's belief reigns supreme, but do the community know what that is, are they aware of what they are allying themselves to.
Who is a Christian according to Religious Tolerance.org
But as a personal disclaimer from me, for those that believe I am singling out Christianity for criticism, know this, I was cleansed of Original Sin, I was baptised and I grew up in an predominantly Roman Catholic household, where it seemed the Pope was god on earth, not the head of the Roman Catholic hierachy. I have a Christian upbringing, I attended Sunday school, and I attended church on Sundays and various other catholic holy days. I bucked the system, at a' Proddy' school I chose to go to with my friends, I sung hymns to the glory of god and I know the Lord's prayer off by heart. Further to that I remember the Scouting promises and have sworn alleigance to god through military service. So, I believe I am qualified to question that which I have been made. So Christian values one might say, but in my explorations of other beliefs, I am finding the very same values in many beliefs, when one cuts to the core belief, not the public face.
I call myself pagan and that because of the definition of pagan and in that, I do not subscribe to any organised belief, pantheistic, maybe, but I know all paths lead to the same source.
Although I still search and question, habit I suppose, or perhaps I just like to be sure, I believe I am ignoring the truth that is plain to see, for that truth, is personal responsibility, no more, no less, each and everyone of us is responsible for ourselves, the way we are and how we interact with others, it is all down to us as individuals in the present for the future, not the past, for the past is dead and gone, we are in effect on our own and have always been.
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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha
Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone
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RE: The Rise of Religious Conservatism ? - 
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