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Online Relationships - 10/6/2004 2:30:49 PM   
SheElf


Posts: 2
Joined: 10/2/2004
Status: offline
Can one be in an online relationship and truly be a sub??

What is ti to be a sub? How does one act? Preform if it's online??

Also, what is the difference between Sub and Slave
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Online Relationships - 10/6/2004 6:14:16 PM   
sweetpleaser


Posts: 689
Joined: 8/5/2004
From: Florida
Status: offline
Welcome to the boards! You will learn a lot here. There are some great people involved with this site. You brought up three BIG topics. Our favorite thread puller is on vacation but start with this one

Slave/Submissive/Sensualist

Also, there is a search option at the top of this page that will bring you to any topic you are interested in.

Take care!

ann

_____________________________

~ann~

It's not the men in my life that count, it's the life in my men.--Mae West

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Online Relationships - 10/6/2004 7:11:42 PM   
INSIDEYOURMIND


Posts: 483
Status: offline
Can anything online be real?

I am sure you can get knowledge and fact by being online, but if you truly want to explore this, then go out amongst the living, and touch, taste and feel!

To me a sub does because she wants to, and a slave because she has to.

And by the way, why is it always the dark side? I kinda like doing it with the lights on!

< Message edited by INSIDEYOURMIND -- 10/6/2004 7:13:13 PM >


_____________________________

If I got smart with you.................
How would you know?

(in reply to sweetpleaser)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Online Relationships - 10/6/2004 9:27:37 PM   
sub4hire


Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Can one be in an online relationship and truly be a sub??

What is ti to be a sub? How does one act? Preform if it's online??

Also, what is the difference between Sub and Slave


Are you a real person? If so, I'd say someone can be a submissive and also be online.
It all depends on how much integrity a person has. Their moral standard. The list could go on and on. Anything is possible.

Don't really know how one would perform online. Unless you are speaking about cyber sex.

The sub vs slave question has been discussed many different times here on the boards. Plus I believe someone already added the link.

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 1:59:43 AM   
cariad


Posts: 943
Joined: 9/25/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline
this slaves relationship with her Master started out as an oline one and has since become a R/L relationship. she served Him drinks online, and yes the occasional cyber sex but for her serving online is just as real as if she were doing it R/L as her feelings are what she would/does feel R/L.

when she met Master in August for the first time, she was a bit nervous serving Him His drink for fear she'd make it too weak or too strong, was scared to even look at Him, even when He asked her to. she struggled with looking at Him due to her past training, as for serving Him His drink she did her best and that is all He asks of her is to serve to the best of her abilities.

_____________________________

The Path To Being A Good slave Takes Hard Work, A Willingness To Learn, Ability To Take Criticism and the Ability To Take Punishments Well. i Am Still Learning So Please Be Patient With me, As i Walk the Path to Being A good slave. SLRN: 742 958 000

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 12:40:28 PM   
BigBadVoodooDadd


Posts: 29
Joined: 6/23/2004
Status: offline
This is from another post I put up a bit ago... I think it might help!

I always saw as the "on line" scene as really a playground for people that have no balls to actually do things in real life. I have been in the lifestyle for about 10 years and I have to tell you that the thought of on line Domination does not make sense to me. I mean what is it supposed to do? The crack of the whip can not reach you through your monitor, I can't tie you up when I want to, there is no way for me to pull your hair and I can't make you do anything you really are not willing to do. There is no fear, there is no sexual tension and there is no intensity that a scene requires in order for it to be a great scene.

I feel that people doing things on line are affraid of making things happen in real life. I might be wrong but that is just the way it makes me feel.

There are things that one can learn on line. Reading forums or talking to people but I do not believe that there can be a D/s relationship on line.
It is like having an on line relationship of any kind. It just does not work and even though there are some people that have succeeded those are far in between and very rare.

Most Doms that actually do "on line" training lack real experience and what you learn from them is something that you can not use in real life. Also an on line training, if you can call it that way, takes much more effort and much more explaining than a real life relationship would. It is like trying to teach a blind person how to play basketball... it just does not work really well unless lots of effort and patience is put in and most people lack that. They lack the knowledge and the commitment to make it work and that goes for the subs as well as Dom's.

I think that there is a great way to learn on line. Sites like ALT, Bondage and Collarme offer lots of support and lots of information for people just getting into the lifestyle but I DO NOT believe that an on line D/s relationship is healthy or effective at all. I think that we should destinguish between learning on line from forums and support groups and actually having a D/s relationship on line.

I very much believe in the energy that is exchanged in a D/s relationship. A gentle touch in my slave's head while she is curled up at my feet to acknowledge my appreciation for her. A simple kiss on the forehead to show her that she is still my little girl. You can not do that on line, you can not have that kind of a dynamic over the internet. That is teh essential part of a D/s relationship, I think that everything else can be learned easily. Not just that but I think that a sub should educate herself about the lifestyle but leave the training to her Master once she gets in to a relationship. I do things differently than someone else might and in respect others like them done differently than I do. Having a slave trained one way and then me having to re-train her again later is just waist of her and my time. Bad habbits are much harder to get rid of than it takes to actually teach new habbits.


Anyways, I think that I have said enough.

I hope this helps!

BBVD

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 1:04:26 PM   
cariad


Posts: 943
Joined: 9/25/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline
"I always saw as the "on line" scene as really a playground for people
that have no balls to actually do things in real life. I have been in
the lifestyle for about 10 years and I have to tell you that the thought
of on line Domination does not make sense to me. I mean what is it
supposed to do? The crack of the whip can not reach you through your
monitor, I can't tie you up when I want to, there is no way for me to pull
your hair and I can't make you do anything you really are not willing to
do. There is no fear, there is no sexual tension and there is no
intensity that a scene requires in order for it to be a great scene. "

You say this but as a slave in the lifestyle for 13years and a slave to Master for over a year now and i can tell You that when someone says "Raises the whip, smiles as it lands on her ass hard, the sweet sound ringing throughout the room." for me it is the same as if they were standing behind me in my living room whipping me, the feelings are the same as if it was R/L. anything i do online i do as if it were actually happening R/L as those are my true feelings that i put into a scene online. You think there is no intensity but those are just Your opinions and You are entitled to them, but as a slave for 13yrs now i can tell You that there is intensity in the scenes i do online and R/L.

"I feel that people doing things on line are affraid of making things
happen in real life. I might be wrong but that is just the way it makes
me feel. " as a slave i'm not scared to do anything R/L however if it makes me uncomfortable i will use and have used my safe words, if i try something and don't like it i then speak to Master or the Dom i'm playing with and W/we talk it out so that They know why i'm not comfortable with it.

"Most Doms that actually do "on line" training lack real experience and
what you learn from them is something that you can not use in real
life." i can tell You Master does NOT lack real experience nor does any other Dom i've played with that i've met R/L, in fact they show more experience R/L than they do online as it is on a more personal level face to face. that is not to say They don't have any experience that They share online, Master is not only a "True" Dom/Master but has shown His experience in how He treats me, the scenes W/we did when i was there visting Him in August.

"They lack the knowledge and the commitment to make it work and that goes for the subs as well as Dom's. " Master does NOT lack Knowledge or Commitment to make it work, nor do i as a slave...in fact W/we both have discussed this several times and agree there are those who don't have the knowledge or commitment it takes to be a slave/sub or Dom/Domme.

this slave means NO Disrespect in her post but had to respond to this because she felt it wrong NOT to and Master has always told her that as long as she is respectful she has a right to speak her mind. if she has offended A/any she apologizes but felt the need to speak out in regards to the post that lead to her posting here today. again she means NO Disrespect by her post.

_____________________________

The Path To Being A Good slave Takes Hard Work, A Willingness To Learn, Ability To Take Criticism and the Ability To Take Punishments Well. i Am Still Learning So Please Be Patient With me, As i Walk the Path to Being A good slave. SLRN: 742 958 000

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 1:41:58 PM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
I was resisting temptation to beat this horse any further beyond it's death. I don't know why this is such a hot button issue for me, but there is no denying it is!

And every time I post to a similar thread I realize that arguing in this thread compares to arguing with the following.....

...Creationists regarding the dinosaurs.
...Pre-Galileo scientists regarding the sun being at the center of the solar system.
...Conspiracy theorists regarding the Kennedy assassination.
...Athesists about God.
...UFO-igists about ET.
...Red Sox fans about the Yankees. (vice versa applies)

Yet here I am again, because it frustrating that so many people are insecure and need to propagate their rationalization that they are in a 'relationship'. So many people here seem so sincere in their search - thousands are looking for the touch of another. Yet so many are satisfied by this cold, one-dimensional, excuse to isolate yourself in a dark room, lighted by the artificial glow of a computer screen.

On-line is a game, evolving as the D&D players reached puberty. It may even be a nice distraction between meetings to those with LTR. There is NO valuable BDSM lifestyle experience to be gleaned from a on-line relationship. The best possible result is that both of you finally become bored enough playing in this manner realize how silly hitting and clipping yourself is, wipe off the masturbatory residue, giggle about it and meet in person.

Self titled 'masters' and 'slaves' are spawned in this medium. The image of a swarm of tadpoles wiggling in the mud of a lake bed drying in the sun comes to mind. They had their chance to swim to deeper water, but stayed where it was 'safe'.

Wonder why people don't show up to meetings or don't respond to offers to meet with seemingly meshing profiles? Most don't expect you to expect them. They didn't know it was a part of the game.

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 2:37:52 PM   
happypervert


Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline
quote:

There is NO valuable BDSM lifestyle experience to be gleaned from a on-line relationship.

I disagree. I suspect that a lot of folks first encounter D/s through on-line. For them it can be like dipping their toe in the water before deciding to plunge in. That could be due to having a dim view of what it's all about in the first place -- maybe just some images from an old Madonna video or maybe seing Mr Slave on South Park and so they could be scared to start off real life. I believe that when Proudsub gets back she could expalin it better than me.

Of course, I'd agree with most of what you said. And I dunno how the proportion of those that start of on-line and then go to meat life compares to those who never go beyond their keyboard. Like others here, it baffles me how someone can feel dominant because someone else capitalizes "You" and engages in other such rituals.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 3:08:48 PM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
happy,
The key word in the quote of my post was 'valuable'. Everything you do is an experience and if you never tried pizza, maybe someone describing it would make you hungry for it. But if you were really starving, would you be satisfied by someone emailing you a picture? No, most likely your valuable experience would cause you to order out or go to a pizza place and eat in real time.

(in reply to happypervert)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 3:36:15 PM   
INSIDEYOURMIND


Posts: 483
Status: offline
Timo,
I just emailed you a Pastrami on rye with Russian dressing from Katz's.
I hope you enjoy it!
Go Yankees!
Jeffrey

_____________________________

If I got smart with you.................
How would you know?

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Online Relationships - 10/7/2004 7:47:19 PM   
cariad


Posts: 943
Joined: 9/25/2004
From: Calgary, Alberta
Status: offline
it is part of this slaves training to capitalize a Dom/Domme as You or Sir/Ma'am. (not sure if You are a Domme or Dom or not but is always best to be safe than sorry)

_____________________________

The Path To Being A Good slave Takes Hard Work, A Willingness To Learn, Ability To Take Criticism and the Ability To Take Punishments Well. i Am Still Learning So Please Be Patient With me, As i Walk the Path to Being A good slave. SLRN: 742 958 000

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 12:34:34 PM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline
My first sub experience was online, and like cariad said, it can be very real. It depends on the players. With a good imagination, and very explicit scenes it is possible to have a positive experience. Web cams help a lot. My online Dom taught me most of what i know about BDSM. After two years of online submission it was very easy to take it to real life.

Here's a thread about online punishment that might interest you:

to all with an online submissive

Found another thread for you:

serving online

< Message edited by proudsub -- 10/10/2004 4:37:27 PM >


_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 4:05:57 PM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
Having spent hours reading forums and listening to discussions upon the validity of online subs/slaves/Dominants... I am finding it extremely alarming the amount of intollerant attitudes towards people who have either been involved in or are involved in such. Yes... some relationships in BDSM include spanking, knife plays and other physical pursuits... but equally there are non physical, but spiritual and mental practises.(And yes, I do understand that for some, the physical leads to the spiritual). And why cannot Online Relationships and teaching be yet another fetish enjoyed by someone? I cannot understand why people find it nessecary to ridicule others for something that is fulfilling to someone, somewhere. What makes them any less of a person because they are interacting online? Yes... There may be players and some very scary people online... but that can be equally said for any group/party/etc we attend.
What is so 'invaluble' about an online relationship? One persons diamond may be another persons coal, but it doesnt mean it glows any less given the right place.

For a collection of people ...(was going to use the word minority, but I have learnt that fetishists in all forms are more of a majority at times, even if its a hidden one).... who proclaim injustice so readily when we are portrayed so badly at time, we can show very little tollerence for others at times.


_____________________________


.dark.




...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to SheElf)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 4:09:46 PM   
ThornBlood


Posts: 91
Joined: 3/5/2004
Status: offline
*Looks at the title*

It's NOT about just serving, or punishment, or any of the myriad possibilities of the BDSM world. It's about knowing the person behind the screen; their likes... they're dislikes... that their child had a bad report card... that they happen to be sick today... that they lost their cat to a cougar today. Or they're happy because they're couch that they ordered came in, or they are dissapointed about it. Or that they're ex called and made them feel blue. Sometimes people are more truthful on-line when they can avoid the distractions of life for a bit and just relax.

Other factor such as distance, kids, school, etcetera get in the way. It's really not about whether you can feel the kiss of the whip, but how the two connect. It can be just as magical as real. And while I prefer real, it is not always possible. People live in small out of the way towns, far from a big hotbed such as San Francisco, or Seattle for that matter. I've attended munches, and play parties, but the norm at a play party is that you are already there *with* somebody. People are friendly, sometimes, or they are not. Cliques are just as much a reality there also. But the chances of actually meeting someone at one of these functions would be between slim and none. And if I were limited to only live meetings, I would have given up a long time ago. Online has expanded the gene pool so to speak.

And to be blunt, the message board is another unreal place. Just another collection of bits on a screen. You as just as "unreal" until I meet you in person. Pictures are easily faked anymore. *Shrugs* Could be just a 13 year old sitting behind a monitor. Do I listen to people's opinions anyway? (love the pizza argument.. good one). Yes... but I do filter them...

Can they feel the thud of the flogger or kiss of the whip? Well.. like the pizza arguement, if they have never experienced it, there will be something missing. But if they have experienced it before, having it described is no problem. (Can smell the cashews and chicken now). And usually there is something in everyone's experience that can come relatively close. And because the gene pool has expanded, not everyone is here to have a flogger thrown at them or a needle stuck into them. Everyone has different tastes and views. Would I encourage someone that if they are interested in that to go not only to a play party, but to live demos? Of course. They really have to go and experience it.

Go...

Eat the pizza at least once... Make sure ya like it.


(in reply to proudsub)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 7:27:06 PM   
stormiKnightBEAR


Posts: 306
Joined: 3/14/2004
Status: offline
ThornBlood,

While this girl is a 24/7 rt slave, what you said does make some sense Sir.

And with the next statement this girl will take yet once again another bashing she is sure.
But oh well,......suiting up in armour.

For this girl, online relationships are something of an oddity. stormi does not understand
them, does not understand what if anything makes them work, and quiet frankly has never
tried to have a online relationship. They make absolutely no sense to this girl.

How does one "Dom" online? How is one a Master online? The same of a sub/slave, how does
one do it online?

Did some get their start online? You bet. Did alot of us, stormi included learn alot online from reading
and visiting other sites as well as chatting. But again, how do you Dom/sub online?

For this girl, while fear is a reality, this girl tends to just grab the bull by the horns and go.
Sometimes for the better and sometimes for the worse. Personally, again for this girl, she feels
......a touch of sadness for someone who never gets outside the "online" world to experience all
the beauty of being a Dom/sub, Master/slave in person.

stormi knows people who do the online thing, some are very truthful, some are full of .......
stormi also knows some that met and now are 24/7 from their online chats. No matter how a person
Dom/sub or Master/slave gets their start or how they live the lifestyle they chose, hats off to them
for doing what makes them happy.

stormi does not think that anyone should share her opinion of online relationships. Trust this girl when
she says that online relationships are something that stormi just flat can not make sense of. To this
girl.......to an extent.......it's ...embarrassing...for lack of another word at the moment, to know people rt who put so much stock in online. That does not mean it's wrong. It's what this girl thinks.

One of the reasons for stormi's thoughts on this is the simplest of thoughts. Online anyone can be perfect.
Online anyone can serve or Dom another with pure perfection. Online does not always... note the word always,
require you to feel anything for that person, just type a few words. Online allows a person to backspace or delete a mistake.
Online another person can not see the emotion or feel your strength regardless of Dom or sub.
Online allows anyone the opportunity to hide from something that could be the ultimate joy.

stormi knows she will not be popular in these thoughts.. but then again... that's not new either.


be well,
stormi
property of Master Bear

_____________________________

owned white silk slave of TEMJI aka Master Bear

PROUD TO BE TEXAN AND AMERICAN BY BIRTH~
GOD BLESS TEXAS AND THE U.S.A !!!!

(in reply to ThornBlood)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 9:46:06 PM   
INSIDEYOURMIND


Posts: 483
Status: offline
stormi,
To begin with, our freedom to post and read others opinions does not make yours right or wrong, or something to criticize.
I happen to agree with you on this subject, and feel sorry for those that are only in an "online" relationship, they are missing so much.
There is a young (18) Dom that has begun posting, he states he has had many years of online experience, that means that at some point in time, he had subs, or slave submitting to him when he was 13-14 years old. Did they know?

I am not sure, does everyone know that AOL stands for All Outrageous Liars?

Just think ladies, it's late at night, and you are cyber subbing to this really handsome guy, and he sends you his photo.......................






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by INSIDEYOURMIND -- 10/10/2004 9:50:12 PM >


_____________________________

If I got smart with you.................
How would you know?

(in reply to stormiKnightBEAR)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 10:50:17 PM   
Suleiman


Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

On-line is a game, evolving as the D&D players reached puberty.



HEY!!! Watch it, Bub!!!

I will point out that this is simply cliquishness in action. Every group has a certian degree of disdain for other subsets of their same community. It's just basic monkey behavior, seemingly inescapably hardwired into our primal methods of social interaction.

Among gamers, there are five major social subsets: Wargamers, Roleplayers, LARPers, CCG players, and Online or computer gamers. They all identify as RPGers. We occasionally get into mixups, and even the occasional dustup, over what actually constitutes an RPG.

Wargamers are our version of "Old Guard". Many of them are older folks, or were trained by older folks. Many have played a Role Playing version of their favorite fantasy game, but for the most part remain "purists" and "traditionalist".

Roleplayers are the second wave, and essentially set the gold standard by which all the other subsets are judged. Wargamers formed the first wave of "old school" roleplayers back in the '70s with D&D, Traveller, Gamma World, and a plethora of other game systems, which were basically just wargames with rules for interaction between characters. There are now three "waves" of roleplayers out there - Old School, of which I am a part, New School, with whom I interact frequently, and the current batch of younguns who're still trying to make a name for themselves.

LARPers are the direct descendants of the "New School" gaming revolution that happened in the late 80s and early 90s with the advent of entirely dramatic games such as Vampire. Because epic quests and physical combat were secondary to these games, it became possible for people to dress as their characters and interact with each other, crossing the border between "Roleplay" in the gaming sense and "Roleplay" in the kinky sense. A lot of roleplayers, especially those in the Old School, consider LARPers to be kind of creepy.

CCG players are an odd subset of people who play the various card games like "Magic" or "Yugi-O". Many of them are also roleplayers, typically of the New School or Modern variety. Old Schoolers consider CCGers to be fakes or "wannabes" who do nothing more than take up valuable table space at the game store or convention. Kind of like how gothy fetish fashion has a lot of posers showing up at clubs and events, apparantly masquerading as part of the community (and possibly even interested in or curious about the lifestyle) but are unwilling to actually go past dressing the part.

Online Gamers are a subset of Old School that took the wargaming aspects of RPGs a little too seriously. Since geeks are frequently multidisciplinarian, there was a solid core of Old Schoolers who were also interested in computers and were therefore there at the dawn of the internet, getting their game on with people from all over the world. I have been told by onliners that their games are just as good, or even superior to, an actual face-to-face game. I've tried it, but I still prefer the feel of dice in my hand, the sense of exultation as I get the number I need, the crackle of my character sheet, the looks on the faces of my peers as I manage to slay the dragon with an almost impossible crit.

I don't really understand online gaming any more than I understand online relationships. I am not, however, going to devolve into the same cliquish behavior that had me being shunned as a child for not being like the "normal" children.

And please - I respect your community. Try to respect mine.

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 11:24:59 PM   
ThornBlood


Posts: 91
Joined: 3/5/2004
Status: offline


quote:

One of the reasons for stormi's thoughts on this is the simplest of thoughts. Online anyone can be perfect.
Online anyone can serve or Dom another with pure perfection. Online does not always... note the word always,
require you to feel anything for that person, just type a few words. Online allows a person to backspace or delete a mistake.


This is such a good point as to why a person might actually prefer an online relationship over a real one... And might even be drawn into the lure of staying there for a long time.

Err.. besides one doesn't have to watch Master belch in a stinky ole t-shirt. lol

Let me put this in another light. Many people even in the vanilla world are forced every day to have an online or long distance relationship, and have done so for ages. In WW1, WWII, and even the Civil war this was done through letters. (I believe there are a few more than famous examples of this). People have lived this way for years. Sales jobs, work that takes you away to other states, and military life are all examples. I work with people that travel to my worksite, work all week and go home for the weekend. You are lucky that you don't have to live with this type of situation, but some people do. And they are just trying to do the best with what they have.

And nah.. don't really believe in flames.. kinda like fire play though..

(in reply to stormiKnightBEAR)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Online Relationships - 10/10/2004 11:42:50 PM   
ThornBlood


Posts: 91
Joined: 3/5/2004
Status: offline
Oh.. yeah.. and have seen a lot of online that errr.. wasn't even CLOSE to perfect.. lmao

(in reply to ThornBlood)
Profile   Post #: 20
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