RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke

RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (Full Version)

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HeatherMcLeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:14:02 PM)
Happy to answer them. Yes we are. I see a therapist for my issues relating to my abuse. We follow Hanners' strategy of not prejudging men. Hanners has gotten back in contact with the men in her extended family after many years because she feels she can trust them and by doing so can reassure herself that there are normal everyday men who are decent (three cousins are write offs, oh well, that's still better than nothing). We have deliberately sought to make friends with men, we don't avoid them. That's pretty much what we're doing. We are far from the environment she was in. She keeps in touch with a few of the people she knew back then, but only the ones that are important to her. In my case the environment was my bedroom in my parents' house. I'm no longer there, but it's pretty hard to classify that as an environment expected to bring one in touch with the dregs of society. Well being in a lesbian relationship, our social circle doesn't include a lot of men, but Hanners works in a hardware store, and we socialize with the other employees when the opportunity presents itself. Hopefully this will change in the fall when i'm in school and we'll be able to encounter more men in a better milieu than at a bar or club. which isn't the best place either, the men there generally want to watch or join in, or "save" us, so they aren't really much better than what she encountered. No, Hanners isn't in any counseling. she has reasons i don't agree with, which she's talked about elsewhere in other threads, so i won't repeat them here. We also subscribe to the view that we are not victims, and that that is an unhealthy thing to do so. Hanners also thinks its an unhealthy thing to distrust all men, which is why she tries not to, she tries to give every man a chance. Thanks for asking. these are the sorts of questions I had hoped her post would generate. Any ideas that you think would be helpful are most welcome. Well Hanners informs me that my reply is perfect and I should stopp fussing with the wording and sentence structure and post it so we can go on to other posts, so...I'm done [:)]

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:18:54 PM)
quote: I question this, though. If someone starts out with a clean slate, why is there a need to prove himself? why? because its what everybody does, let people prove themselves good or bad. that's what not prejudging people means. i happen to expect most of them to prove themselves to be bad, because most of them do, but i keep hoping. see i didn't swear even once to you. hannah lynn

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:21:22 PM)
quote: "now this isn't because i hate men, i don't. i just have great disdain for, and a really shitty opinion of the vast majority of them." not all peon. ok. not all. i don't know what else i can say, or how many different fucking ways i can say it. i don't fucking hate men!

gungadin09 -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:24:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather there, i've answered every fucking question asked of me. Actually, you missed the most important one, which was this (by kaliko, i think): If someone starts out with a clean slate, why is there a need to "prove themselves". ETA: never mind pam

juliaoceania -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:24:42 PM)
I have many men in my family.... There is one man in my family I would never trust... there are many others I would be wary of. My mom was very protective of us girls because of what happened to her when she was younger My views on many of the things I have read on this thread, if the primary male who was responsible for you and your well being hurts you and sexualizes you, it may well have the net effect of jading you about all men for life. And I do not think that most people understand that unless they have lived it. I don't on an emotional level, although on an intellectual one I get it. It makes me sad. I have men in my life that I have had such deep respect for. One of them is my father. He was a wonderful person who valued women. He taught me I could be anything I wanted to be. I can't help think that this primary experience with a man set me up to get along with them, and most of my good friends are men. I love strong male energy.

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:26:21 PM)
quote: I also wondered what the reaction would be if I said that I gave every woman I met the chance to "prove" herself. my reaction would be that you are a sensible person who is willing to judge people on their own merits. i do let the women i meet prove themselves. i am surprised that this is a point of contention. doesn't everybody fucking do this? or do you assign each person you meet as trustworthy/untrustworthy, good/bad, decent/scumbag upon first meeting them, without getting to know them? hannah lynn

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:31:14 PM)
quote: whether or not she did a good job of that is immaterial i clearly didn't do a very fucking good job did i? [:D] but yes, that was pretty much the intent of the thread. i should just fucking well let little miss 175 iq write everything, because i sure as fuck don't seem to get across what i mean to most of the people here. ah well what can ya do? hannah lynn i'm wondering why i keep signing each post when i'm the only one using this fucking account now.

Kaliko -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:38:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather quote: I also wondered what the reaction would be if I said that I gave every woman I met the chance to "prove" herself. my reaction would be that you are a sensible person who is willing to judge people on their own merits. i do let the women i meet prove themselves. i am surprised that this is a point of contention. doesn't everybody fucking do this? or do you assign each person you meet as trustworthy/untrustworthy, good/bad, decent/scumbag upon first meeting them, without getting to know them? hannah lynn No, everybody doesn't do that. Some people do...you're definitely not alone. When you say "prove", I take that to mean that they are required to show you evidence in some way of their trustworthiness. Perhaps that's not the way you mean it. I wait for someone to show me evidence of their not being trustworthy before making them earn it. Everybody's got their philosophies and approaches that they are comfortable with. That's one of mine. Just different from yours and some others, I suppose.

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:45:35 PM)
i say fuck all the time, its my favorite fucking word. half the time i don't even know i'm saying it. its a habit. i swear, i curse. i am foul-mouthed.its the way i talk, i don't care if anybody likes it or not. i try to post the way i talk, its easier, and it feels more natural to me. when i censor it, it seems stilted. do not take my fucking this and fucking that as a sign of anger, its not. its just how i talk. i regularly say to heather "i fucking love you", "you're so fucking beautiful" and so on. its just the way i fucking talk. and i post the same way because i prefer to. the whole point of this thread is that i am trying to leave the cesspool behind. i readily admit i have a deep abiding hatred for the men who helped me form these opinions, who wouldn't? i don't give a fucking rat's ass about them, i have done the best i can to excise them and their ilk from my future. and i am doing my best to not let them influence my future interactions with men. and as for what i think of you, well you fucking piss me off at times, but so does pretty much everybody. most of the time i think you're pretty fucking cool.

RedMagic1 -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:50:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather i should just fucking well let little miss 175 iq write everything, because i sure as fuck don't seem to get across what i mean to most of the people here Your voice is just as important as hers. You understand many things she does not. It isn't her intelligence that produces less pushback; it is her less confrontational nature. You appear to be spoiling for a fight 24/7/365. You had to be that way for a long time, I know. It is as though you are back from Iraq, but your mind is still partly there.

slaveluci -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:52:19 PM)
~FR~ I've skimmed through most posts on most pages to get a feel for how folks are responding to the OP. A few things occurred to me based on my own personal experiences, the most important being: I'm pretty sure Hannah hasn't been any lower in the gutter than I personally have. I've been at the bottom of the barrel and met lots of folks -men & women - that could rightly be said to"suck." That doesn't mean that by any means "most" men aren't worth a shit. A few "bad" ones I met, sure. "Most" men, in general? Bad bad stats, I'm afraid. Sounds like anecdotal "evidence" at best. You lived a rough life for a bit and encountered some shady characters. That doesn't translate into "most" men are assholes. Maybe most of the men you've personally met but not most men in general who exist. There's many, many very good ones (some of whom may have even hired a whore before) and I'm sorry you haven't lived long enough or simply had the good fortune to know any/many of them............luci

RedMagic1 -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:55:57 PM)
Oh, and, I just read your signature. I see you are now a Professional Canadian.

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 8:55:57 PM)
quote: I wait for someone to show me evidence of their not being trustworthy before making them earn it. Everybody's got their philosophies and approaches that they are comfortable with. That's one of mine. Just different from yours and some others, I suppose. i suspect that's because as a rule the people you've encountered have been trustworthy (that's not the case with me), so that's the box you put them in. its more convenient, that's where you expect them to end up, so that's where you put them. i didn't use to with men, they automatically went into the scumsucker pile. i made a conscious decision not to do that. that's why i said they get a clean slate. they get to prove themselves good or bad. sorry, i can't just put them in the good pile. i can't just trust them right away. in the 10 years of my life since i turned 18, most men have proven themselves to not be trustworthy, so i can't just overlook that, the best i can do is start them off with no pluses or minuses, and let them show me what sort of person they are. hopefully, in time, there will be more pluses than minuses, and i'll get to the point where i can do what you do, but that's not up to me, its up to them.

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 9:04:19 PM)
quote: Sounds like anecdotal "evidence" at best. christ on a cupcake! i'm talking about my personal fucking experiences for fuck's sake, what else could it be but anecdotal?

PeonForHer -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 9:04:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather quote: "now this isn't because i hate men, i don't. i just have great disdain for, and a really shitty opinion of the vast majority of them." not all peon. ok. not all. i don't know what else i can say, or how many different fucking ways i can say it. i don't fucking hate men! All right, Hannah. I must admit, right now, I'm beginning to think: it's only a blasted internet forum anyway.

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 9:06:10 PM)
quote: I must admit, right now, I'm beginning to think: it's only a blasted internet forum anyway. you shouldn't bitch you know, you're one of the men who gives me the most hope.

HannahLynHeather -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 9:07:17 PM)
lol, isn't he just fucking great!! did you see the one where he was talking about his youtube account being hacked? fucking hilarious!

Arturas -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 9:13:27 PM)
Hi. I'm a man. I know you don't hate me. I know you don't have disdain for me. I don't have disdain for you either. Quite the contrary. I do realize you have a good reason to say what you say. Possibly it's because you have not YET been cherished or loved by a man who cares for you even if only as a true and close trusted friend, one who wants to make you laugh and smile and wants your smile in return and to hear what you think about things and depend on you just as you do him even if "only" for friendship. Or dinner and maybe a movie and ice cream afterward and only a kiss at the door and a good night. Corny but then most good men can be corny and it will seem right to you at the time if you are with a good man. I wonder if you'd consider something? When I want something, I find that I need to think positively about it, especially about women. That positive thinking will in turn attract good people and in contrast negative thinking will also attract that which you disdain. You might disagree but I also think positive thinking makes a woman more beautiful, more than they already are. But what the hell do I know about women and positive things? I'm a man [:D] Be well.

Aynne88 -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 9:14:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse It would be encouraging if people could manage, just once in awhile, to step outside their own box of existence and see the world through the eyes of another. i'm sorry, i generally like you, but that's just way too ironic. all the supporters of Hannah's conclusions only want people to see through her eyes and see her conclusions. doesn't seem like anyone's in a hurry to see through Aynne's eyes, for instance. i've had plenty of less-than-stellar men in my life, but even i don't agree with Hannah's conclusions, because reality isn't one way or another, reality is as grey as it gets. Just got home from a long ass day at work and only read this far as of yet, but honestly after the really personal attacks I got, let me just say, I so truly and really appreciate this Lilly, you made me feel so much better. I was re-reading what I had written this morning trying to see what and where I had posted anything that called for the vitriol I got and I just didn't see it. Thanks love. I am going to start from your post now and read through the rest of this train wreck. I hope it improves. Hugs babe.

RedMagic1 -> RE: guys suck, but i'm not a man-hating dyke (6/15/2011 9:14:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather lol, isn't he just fucking great!! did you see the one where he was talking about his youtube account being hacked? fucking hilarious! You have nothing to worry about. I will not hunt you down.

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