A very disturbing trend: (Full Version)

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angelikaJ -> A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 9:25:50 AM)

CDC Fears Rising Treatment Resistant Gonorrhea




windchymes -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 9:51:50 AM)

Just a little FYI, if anyone's interested, because this is what I used to do for a living.....

The large spots all over that photo are the nucleii (nucleuses) of white blood cells, and very large numbers of them. Each nucleus is surrounded by a circle of really pale pink, that's the cell itself. This is probably a photograph of the drainage from the genitals of the infected person.

If you look in the center cells, there are bunches of little dots in clusters, and if you look really close, you can see that they're sort of arranged in pairs (once again, not a good slide in that photo). That's classic for Neisseria Gonorrhoea, the bacteria that causes gonorrhea, called gram-negative diplococci. And if you look even closer, you can see that the groups of the bacteria are actually contained in the cells themselves.....the cells are doing their jobs as "Pac-men", gobbling up the bacteria, the immune system hard at work. [:)]

And that was the microbiology lesson for the day, hope it wasn't TMI, but I get off on that kind of stuff, lol.





angelikaJ -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 10:21:38 AM)

I appreciated the lesson, windchymes.

And for people who did not click on the link: "Gonorrhea may be losing its susceptibility to cephalosporins, the only available antibiotic class remaining to treat the sexually transmitted infection, the CDC is warning."

"...In the past, Bolan added, the CDC responded to resistance by suggesting doctors switch antibiotics.
"We are now at impasse, as we have no new drugs to switch to," she said."




HeatherMcLeather -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 11:41:49 AM)

That's really not good.




windchymes -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 12:06:06 PM)

Actually, the gonorrhea "super-bug" has been around for awhile, it's not a new thing. I'm sure the pharmaceutical companies have been working on effective drugs to replace the ones they have now, if they don't already have one. Our FDA is what holds things up, it takes around 10 years to get a new drug approved.




Moonhead -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 12:07:47 PM)

Aren't the pharmaceutical companies most of the reason (apart from tits who stop taking antibiotics as soon as their symptoms clear up) that there are antibiotic resistant strains of the clap in the first place?




angelikaJ -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 12:11:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

Actually, the gonorrhea "super-bug" has been around for awhile, it's not a new thing. I'm sure the pharmaceutical companies have been working on effective drugs to replace the ones they have now, if they don't already have one. Our FDA is what holds things up, it takes around 10 years to get a new drug approved.


I think this newer change of there being only one class of drugs to treat it occurred around 4 years ago.

This is yet another reason why abstinence only sex-education is dangerous.




windchymes -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 12:30:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Aren't the pharmaceutical companies most of the reason (apart from tits who stop taking antibiotics as soon as their symptoms clear up) that there are antibiotic resistant strains of the clap in the first place?


I've not heard that.....they would have to genetically mutate existing strains of bacteria and send them out into the general population, and I'm not aware of anything documented that they have done this. Though anything's possible.....

Antibiotics have been over-prescribed by doctors for decades now. Patient has a cold, which is caused by a virus, which mean antibiotics won't help. Patient demands immediate cure in the form of a pill, Doc says, ok, here, just take them as a precaution to ward off a "secondary infection", and that sounds good, so we take them. Cold runs its course, which it would have done anyway, but we credit the antibiotics. It only takes one "rogue" bacterium to mutate itself into something resistant to an antibiotic, then it grows and multiplies....

No, I blame the tits, lol.




LillyBoPeep -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 1:24:00 PM)

agreeing with windchymes (who i'm braintastically swooning over at the moment -- diplococci for the win!)
it's not the pharm companies, it's rampant overuse and misuse by everyone else. =p

i mean, some people will keep an old prescription around for a "rainy day," and when they're feeling under the weather, they'll pop 2 or 3 antibiotics and go on their way -- people seriously do that. =p or they share a pill or two with a sick friend who needs a FULL COURSE of the things.
(oh AND don't forget the haphazard use of antibiotics in factory farming; that's a BIIIIG ONE.)




windchymes -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 1:34:10 PM)

You're too funny, LillyBo!

*hugz* [:)]




Charnegui -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 1:39:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Aren't the pharmaceutical companies most of the reason (apart from tits who stop taking antibiotics as soon as their symptoms clear up) that there are antibiotic resistant strains of the clap in the first place?


I've not heard that.....they would have to genetically mutate existing strains of bacteria and send them out into the general population, and I'm not aware of anything documented that they have done this. Though anything's possible.....

Antibiotics have been over-prescribed by doctors for decades now. Patient has a cold, which is caused by a virus, which mean antibiotics won't help. Patient demands immediate cure in the form of a pill, Doc says, ok, here, just take them as a precaution to ward off a "secondary infection", and that sounds good, so we take them. Cold runs its course, which it would have done anyway, but we credit the antibiotics. It only takes one "rogue" bacterium to mutate itself into something resistant to an antibiotic, then it grows and multiplies....

No, I blame the tits, lol.


Well, do not forget what foodproducers puts into animals today. The more meat you eat, the more resistent of anti-biotics you become....

just sayin'




bemyslut -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 7:45:43 PM)

true---as long as you are eating the meat raw!!!!!


quote:

ORIGINAL: Charnegui

quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Aren't the pharmaceutical companies most of the reason (apart from tits who stop taking antibiotics as soon as their symptoms clear up) that there are antibiotic resistant strains of the clap in the first place?


I've not heard that.....they would have to genetically mutate existing strains of bacteria and send them out into the general population, and I'm not aware of anything documented that they have done this. Though anything's possible.....

Antibiotics have been over-prescribed by doctors for decades now. Patient has a cold, which is caused by a virus, which mean antibiotics won't help. Patient demands immediate cure in the form of a pill, Doc says, ok, here, just take them as a precaution to ward off a "secondary infection", and that sounds good, so we take them. Cold runs its course, which it would have done anyway, but we credit the antibiotics. It only takes one "rogue" bacterium to mutate itself into something resistant to an antibiotic, then it grows and multiplies....

No, I blame the tits, lol.


Well, do not forget what foodproducers puts into animals today. The more meat you eat, the more resistent of anti-biotics you become....

just sayin'




LadyConstanze -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 7:58:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bemyslut

true---as long as you are eating the meat raw!!!!!



You mean without eating eggs (some like them sunny side up or soft boiled) or milk, oh and nobody ever heard of a virus that doesn't care for the species and might become resistant in one animal and also affect another animal, oh no, nobody ever has heard that... Oh and of course the animals never pee or defecate and the manure is never used for fertilizing the ground and of course nothing ever washes into the soil and the water, of course it's harmless and we should just give the animals more antibiotics, because antibiotics can never be wrong.... Where on earth do all the resistant strains come from? Oh, the devil sent them or something like that...

http://www.naturalnews.com/030132_antibiotics_meat.html




sirsholly -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/11/2011 8:44:42 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze


quote:

ORIGINAL: bemyslut

true---as long as you are eating the meat raw!!!!!



You mean without eating eggs (some like them sunny side up or soft boiled) or milk, oh and nobody ever heard of a virus that doesn't care for the species and might become resistant in one animal and also affect another animal, oh no, nobody ever has heard that... Oh and of course the animals never pee or defecate and the manure is never used for fertilizing the ground and of course nothing ever washes into the soil and the water, of course it's harmless and we should just give the animals more antibiotics, because antibiotics can never be wrong.... Where on earth do all the resistant strains come from? Oh, the devil sent them or something like that...

http://www.naturalnews.com/030132_antibiotics_meat.html
Quoted for truth!!




LillyBoPeep -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/12/2011 6:43:11 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bemyslut

true---as long as you are eating the meat raw!!!!!



that is not entirely correct.
bacteria can pick up DNA information even from dead bacteria, say the antibiotic-resistant ones that are killed when you cook meat. when bacteria die, they release their genetic information in the form of "plasmids" into whatever environment they're in. cooking meat properly will destroy them, but they have been known to survive.

quote:


http://dwb4.unl.edu/chem/chem869k/chem869klinks/www.fda.gov/fdac/features/795_antibio.html

FDA is investigating whether bacteria resistant to quinolone antibiotics can emerge in food animals and cause disease in humans. Although thorough cooking sharply reduces the likelihood of antibiotic-resistant bacteria surviving in a meat meal to infect a human, it could happen. Pathogens resistant to drugs other than fluoroquinolones have sporadically been reported to survive in a meat meal to infect a human. In 1983, for example, 18 people in four midwestern states developed multi-drug-resistant Salmonella food poisoning after eating beef from cows fed antibiotics. Eleven of the people were hospitalized, and one died.


plus, as was said before, the bacteria that exists in the animals while they're alive can pass all sorts of plasmids back and forth between each other. when the animals poop, the bacteria meet new bacteria outside, or the plasmids of other dead bacteria that are hanging out in the environment. bacteria can pick up genetic information in all sorts of ways (see below). people come in contact with them and ingest them through some means or another, and the bacteria pass information to the ones in your body.
thorough cooking will reduce the chance of bacteria and their plasmids surviving in food, but you even know what constitutes "thorough cooking"?

quote:


http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~wilkins/writing/Samples/policy/antibiotics.html
Several methods of genetic transfer allow bacteria to pass these mechanisms of resistance. Bacteria have special DNA elements called R plasmids that contain resistance genes and are easily passed to other bacteria. Bacteria may also take up random sequences of DNA encountered in their environment. If this DNA contains resistance genes, the bacteria could become resistant. Viruses can also serve as a means of DNA transfer. Occasionally, when viruses are made in an infected bacterial cell, DNA with resistance genes may accidently be encapsulated into a daughter virus particle. When this daughter virus infects another bacteria, DNA for antibiotic resistance is spread to that cell.6 Finally, since bacteria reproduce as rapidly as once every 15 minutes, if a cell contains resistance genes, all daughter cells will also have these genes. The large amount of transfer methods demonstrates the ease and speed at which an antibiotic resistance mechanism, once developed, can be passed to other bacteria. When antibiotics are present, the large number of transfer methods guarantees that resistance genes can be passed to other cells.




kalikshama -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/12/2011 6:49:03 AM)

What happened to this?

(NaturalNews) On June 28 of [2010], the FDA issued a draft of new guidelines urging meat producers to refrain from using antibiotics to promote livestock growth, calling the practice an "urgent public health issue."

"To preserve the effectiveness [of antibiotics], we simply must use them as judiciously as possible," said FDA Deputy Commissioner Joshua Sharfstein.

The livestock industry regularly gives antibiotics to healthy animals to make them gain more weight faster, as well as to prevent infection.

For more than 30 years, public health experts have warned that this practice is contributing to the evolution of drug-resistant bacteria, including strains that can infect humans.

"We are seeing the emergence of multidrug-resistant pathogens," Sharfstein said. "FDA believes overall weight of evidence supports the conclusion that using medically important antimicrobial drugs for production purposes is not appropriate."

In order to preserve the effectiveness of "medically important" antibiotics, including penicillin, tetracyclines and sulfonamides, the FDA issued new guidelines reiterating that antibiotics should be given to food animals only for health-protection purposes, and that veterinarians should oversee all such drug use, from selection to treatment.

Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/030132_antibiotics_meat.html#ixzz1RtmKH2eL









LadyConstanze -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/12/2011 7:46:03 AM)

I thought I linked to this very article?




kalikshama -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/12/2011 9:15:41 AM)

Yes, I was wondering what happened to the proposed guidelines.




LadyConstanze -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/12/2011 10:10:30 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

Yes, I was wondering what happened to the proposed guidelines.


Not too familiar with the US but in Europe there was this big uproar about how the farmers would all go broke, blah blah, as far as I know the EU standards forced the medication down a bit, now they get around that by claiming one animal has symptoms and all others have to get the meds to avoid them getting infected and more such rubbish... As a result more and more people are buying less but higher quality meats, for example from free ranged animals that are raised as natural as possible.




Aswad -> RE: A very disturbing trend: (7/13/2011 9:31:16 AM)

~QR~

Noncompliance and overuse are the two major issues in resistance, apart from convenience. I live in Norway. We don't have an MRSA problem at all. Hell, good ole methicillin nukes just about any of the native bacteria. Same thing for most other potentially resistant organisms. The few cases that crop up, are generally in people who have been on vacation and picked it up abroad. So, how come we don't have a lot of resistant strains running around?

1. Doctors are more restrictive in prescribing antibiotics. People generally understand that sometimes you get ill and have to suck it up. Just one of the many occasional inconveniences of being a biological life form. Antibiotics are for treating things that can have lasting consequences, not for making people feel better.

2. Prescription of third line drugs (and sometimes second line drugs) is restricted to specialist health care. A general practicioner cannot prescribe drugs that are intended for resistant infections, as a general rule, and a specialist in the relevant area (e.g. dermatologist, opthamologist, gastroenterologist, etc.) must consult the patient for these to be used. When they are, the infection is always sampled and sent to the antibiotic resistance monitoring center for sequencing.

4. If an infection is not killed off by the second attempt, the strain is sequenced to match it to a susceptibility profile and the most narrow-spectrum effective antibiotic is used.

5. Three strikes and you go to the isolation unit at the hospital, along with anyone you may have contaminated (for screening). Here, they give you the equivalent of an antibiotic nuclear bomb that is targetted at the specific strain of the disease, and you are not allowed to leave until the infection has been eliminated completely, as a matter of public safety (resistant bacteria are, as people are starting to realize, a real threat to public safety). Single resistance is tolerated, sometimes two-drug resistance, though one can choose to be admitted. Multidrug resistance is not tolerated.

As an added benefit, the problem of non-compliance disappears with in-patient treatment.

Of course, with non-cooperative corporate socialism (e.g. USA), the battle is lost before it is even begun. Outpacing bacteria is never going to be financially viable, as they have greater numbers, no restrictions on ethics, no beurocracy, no need to test before deploying, and all the resources of our bodies at their disposal, along with the best motivation of all: losing the war means going extinct. Any illusion to the effect that such a battle can be won by the current approach is only maintained by borrowing against the future of our health, and taking the financial cost individually. And, eventually, the cost in lives. Tactics require cooperation and focus on non-corporate interests. Without tactics, it's David in an arm-wrestling match with Goliath, on the losing end.

Resistant gonorrhea isn't a major problem on the scale of things, really.

Unless one emphasizes abstinence, of course.




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