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What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 1:42:32 PM   
yourMissTress


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A multitude of threads that I have read today have lead me to ponder a few things.  I don't want to make this a gender or orientation issue and I'm sure there are more than a few on both sides of the fences.  But it seems to me that sub men are more likely to look for any warm body and try to mold them into the Dominant woman of their dreams than they are to be patient and wait for the woman that already fits that mold.
 
Is it patience?  Is it selfish?  Is is a fetish?  Is it...what?
 
What is the point of trying to mash a square peg into an octagonal hole?
 
 

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Tress


"If you have to tell people that you are a lady, you are not." My Grandmother

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 1:47:17 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


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quote:

ORIGINAL: yourMissTress
A multitude of threads that I have read today have lead me to ponder a few things.  I don't want to make this a gender or orientation issue and I'm sure there are more than a few on both sides of the fences.  But it seems to me that sub men are more likely to look for any warm body and try to mold them into the Dominant woman of their dreams than they are to be patient and wait for the woman that already fits that mold.

Is it patience?  Is it selfish?  Is is a fetish?  Is it...what?

What is the point of trying to mash a square peg into an octagonal hole?


Honestly?  I think women are just more subtle about it.  They don't need to chase, men unfortunately tend to need to be the active seekers.

Women are far more subtle and long term about changing men.  You hear about it all the time "If only he..." "Why won't he just...?"  "I thought he would..."  And all the admonishing "Don't go into a relationship thinking you can change him!"

And need we go over all the threads from females that start with "How do I get him to be the dom I want him to be?"

Men are just more open and aggressive about it.


_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 1:53:19 PM   
yourMissTress


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Yes, I know women do it too, I know Dom/me's all do it as well.  My point, and maybe I wasn't clear enough is....
 
WHY does ANYONE do it?

_____________________________

Tress


"If you have to tell people that you are a lady, you are not." My Grandmother


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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 1:58:07 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


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quote:

ORIGINAL: yourMissTress
WHY does ANYONE do it?


Cause we get taught that love = relationship, therefore if you love someone, obviously they are the right person for you.

And because we care more about the status of being "in a relationship" more than being happy and fulfilled as people.  The frenzy to get a collar asap, the status it gives someone.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 1:59:02 PM   
juliaoceania


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I saw the thread that spawned this one (at least partially), and I think that the problem the other thread addressed (sub men trying to recruit sub women to dom them) is maybe more a gender issue than an orientation one.

Before I go on anymore, the vast majority of men read profiles and do not email if inappropriate, and I am not saying that men do not read our profiles, but I am only viewing it through my own eyes, and only had maybe two lesbians email me and about 25 sub men do so...

It is not just a sub male thing to try to get their fantasy fulfilled, I think that dom men have been totally inappropriate to me and ignored what I had on my profile have also been guilty of this (my profile is blank now, but it didnt used to be). There have been domme women that have complained of dom men trying to change them also.

In closing I think that there are people that are clueless regardless of their gender, age, ethnicity, role, orientation, or any other self-described label. There are people that think they can change someone to fit what they "need" in the vanilla world too. So while on CM it looks to be a gender or role issue, it is probably just a human issue.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:03:58 PM   
Proprietrix


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quote:

ORIGINAL: yourMissTress
But it seems to me that sub men are more likely to look for any warm body and try to mold them into the Dominant woman of their dreams than they are to be patient and wait for the woman that already fits that mold.


My guess is that it's because they will *never* find the woman that fits the mold.

A lot of sub males are wandering about with the belief that Dominant women fit the stereotype they've learned from media portrayal. We are all 6 feet tall and weigh 115. Our hair is at least waist length, and has that jet-black glow, contrasted by our perfectly applied make-up. We spend our days clad in leather and PVC body suits, aggressively humiliating, spanking, queening, and cuckolding them. We are independently wealthy beyond compare, own a mansion, which they will dutifully, yet lightly, clean whilst sissied up in french-maid attire. And we will end each perfect day by locking them in their chastity belt (*after* they have cum and been forced to eat it off our thigh-high boot), and then tucked them into their little cage for the night.

Since that's the goal, and it doesn't exist, the next best route is to find someone who might-kinda-maybe fits that role (read: Female Dominant), and start molding her into that image, hence reaching the ultimate goal.

Of course, in reality, one never really reaches that goal, because it was based on a fantasy in the first place. So, they move on to the next... and the next... and the next...
I don't think it's really a whole bunch of male subs. I think there's really only about 100 of them and they keep popping up with new names, new sites, new background stories, and more expectations.

(Or I could just be fed-up today and projecting it on male subbies. I might have a different perspective on the question in the morning.)

_____________________________

IMO, IMHO, YMMV, AFAIK, to me, I see it as, from my perspective, it's been my experience, I only speak for myself, (and all other disclaimers here).

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:17:42 PM   
LadyRope


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I think that its all part of human nature..and this site,like any other on here,is a microcosim of whats in real life..some people respect  and some dont..I have met some wonderfully interesting decent people on here,and some not so...I take it all with a grain of salt and pass it off ..I have encounteed male doms at clubs or fet parties who have stated right in front of my face,that all woman are submissive and need to act that way,looking directly my way..all I can do is laugh at the ignorance and closed mindedness of that person,and believe that the next person I encounter will be more open and much more enlightened...

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:35:57 PM   
MistressOfGa


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quote:

We are all 6 feet tall and weigh 115. Our hair is at least waist length, and has that jet-black glow, contrasted by our perfectly applied make-up. We spend our days clad in leather and PVC body suits, aggressively humiliating, spanking, queening, and cuckolding them. We are independently wealthy beyond compare, own a mansion, which they will dutifully, yet lightly, clean whilst sissied up in french-maid attire. And we will end each perfect day by locking them in their chastity belt (*after* they have cum and been forced to eat it off our thigh-high boot), and then tucked them into their little cage for the night.


LMAO!! Nice!

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:37:29 PM   
BitaTruble


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quote:

ORIGINAL: yourMissTress

Yes, I know women do it too, I know Dom/me's all do it as well.  My point, and maybe I wasn't clear enough is....
 
WHY does ANYONE do it?


Desperation and impatience? It's just a guess.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:42:23 PM   
LaTigresse


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Hello Tress!......good question. I think that it stems from a basic immaturity and the need they feel to hurry up and BE what they want. It's not happening fast enough so they begin to look at every potential and see only the ways in which that person fits their ideal and ignore the things that do not. Unfortunately, sooner or later, all the other stuff has to come to light and, because it's always easier to blame someone else for our own mistakes....."it was a bad Domina!" or whatever the case may be. I have to admit that early on I was a little guilty, everytime a pretty face showed interest I got excited, then let down when I had failed to heed the warning signs and it became glaringly obvious. Now, I am not even let myself get excited until I have their sweet lil hiney in person begging me!

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:43:49 PM   
amayos


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quote:

ORIGINAL: yourMissTress

A multitude of threads that I have read today have lead me to ponder a few things.  I don't want to make this a gender or orientation issue and I'm sure there are more than a few on both sides of the fences.  But it seems to me that sub men are more likely to look for any warm body and try to mold them into the Dominant woman of their dreams than they are to be patient and wait for the woman that already fits that mold.

Is it [im]patience?  Is it selfish[ness]?  Is is a fetish?  Is it...what?


It is a reality of the male animal—that when they act "submissive" many of them are not. The male is so naturally hardwired for dominance that even in his servitude he will gravitate toward prostituting a female to achieve union with his idealized "goddess". Thus his worship is often an egocentric inversion where he is kneeling before an image he has of you, and not you as you are. Despite my sex, I am often leery of males who claim to be complete and total slaves to females.

< Message edited by amayos -- 5/17/2006 2:53:20 PM >

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:48:02 PM   
meatcleaver


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For me you could be describing a female, though I know you don't want to make this a gender issue. However, women get the man they want and then try to change him into the man the REALLY want. It's the same thing.

A sub thing maybe?

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 2:53:55 PM   
Mercnbeth


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You guys are missing something that's fairly obvious from my observations. Men are primarily focused on one goal - sex, or some any form of physical contact. Woman tend to be relationship oriented. Men will accept any relationship to have access to physical contact. Woman will accept, albeit more selectively, physical contact in hopes it will lead to a 'relationship'

Disclaimer: The words "all", or "you personally" were NOT implied. "Many", "most", or "generally speaking" apply but only in addressing personal opinion as a reason for the issue raised by the OP.

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 3:00:53 PM   
meatcleaver


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Yep. Well said.

You just packed the whole thread up in a nutshell!

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 5/17/2006 3:01:23 PM >

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 3:03:24 PM   
naughtynick


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Women are difficult to please, men are... lets say easier to please not difficult. Many women want a higher standard in a male than their own standard.

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 3:07:29 PM   
WhiteRadiance


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Oh I agree 110%!  You are a hoot!  ;D
 
BUT you forgot, we all have dungeons, and all of our Domme girlfriends (20 or so...)  are somewhere in the shadows, carrying whips and smoking cigarettes in long cigarette holders, their lithe bodies sculpted by latex.  We all are attired in fetish gear, down to the stilettos we wear while grocery shopping, slave in tow, crawling behind on all fours..   After a day of degredation, I ass fuck the slave in front of my Domme friends,then pass IT on so they may do with IT as they see fit...


quote:

ORIGINAL: Proprietrix

A lot of sub males are wandering about with the belief that Dominant women fit the stereotype they've learned from media portrayal. We are all 6 feet tall and weigh 115. Our hair is at least waist length, and has that jet-black glow, contrasted by our perfectly applied make-up. We spend our days clad in leather and PVC body suits, aggressively humiliating, spanking, queening, and cuckolding them. We are independently wealthy beyond compare, own a mansion, which they will dutifully, yet lightly, clean whilst sissied up in french-maid attire. And we will end each perfect day by locking them in their chastity belt (*after* they have cum and been forced to eat it off our thigh-high boot), and then tucked them into their little cage for the night.


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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 3:15:23 PM   
pollux


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Until about three years ago, I was completely unaware of the existence of  a creature that goes by the name "lifestyle dominant female".  I thought female domination was the product of pornified male fantasy, and the prospect of pursuing a relationship with a flesh-and-blood dominant woman never entered my mind.  If any did exist, I figured they were dysfunctional or harbored beliefs about men that would be harmful to a relationship over the long term.

If the person you're looking for doesn't exist in reality, it's only a natural human tendency to try and create/invent/transform reality so that it matches your imagination.  People do this all the time.  It's not just men, and they do it with many things -- not just relationships.

There's another thing at work here, which is the sociological fact that women tend to choose their mates.  Men may need to be the pursuer in order to gain the attention of a woman they are wooing, but it is the woman that ultimately makes the choice.  When a sub man feels he's been "chosen" by someone who isn't dominant (for example) -- and given all these other things I've mentioned -- is their response really all that irrational?

I guess my point is, it may not be very wise that they do this, but it's certainly understandable.

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 3:38:10 PM   
Dustyn


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For the better part of 20 years, I've had this ideal concept of a partner in my mind, and from time to time, I feel like I've found her, only to realize that I want the dream to become reality so badly that the phrase "Any port in a storm," comes to mind.  I'll post the story of it at the end of this post, just in case anyone feels like reading it.  Always get annoyed with myself when I let myself try to force someone that could never be this ideal into being it.

quote:

I don't know who she is, but it is as if she holds my very soul in her fingertips, watching it as if it were a sphere of perfect crystal.  I tremble at the thought of holding her, touching her.  I know her laugh like I know the scent of water, pure, clean and refreshing.    The only place that I have ever known her is in my dreams, but there is nothing dreamlike about the time that I spend with her when she graces my sleep.  There isn't that detached feeling to the dream, but more like it is a memory.  Not even memory, but like I am actually with her.  Actually feeling her lips on mine.  My skin still burns with the desire I have for her.  My lungs ache for air at the sure grip of love that constricts my chest and heart with her every sound.
  I first met her 6 years ago in a dream, dressed in a short, plaid skirt, looking for all the world like she was a pin up girl for the punk scene.  Piercings everywhere, hair died those garish colors they tend to prefer.  But through that facade of grit and grime, the delicate simplicity of her shone through like the sun shines through a thin piece of silk.  It was over a year before she graced my bed with her body, before she gave me everything that she was.  I spent nearly an entire day asleep with her in my arms, holding her close and simply talking about the world.  Talk about what we wanted, how we felt.  I'm not ashamed to admit that the first true heartbeat of love I have ever felt came from her, but in her eyes, I lose that hesitancy that plagues me.  There is pure surety in my hands and in my mind.   She's slim without being thin.  She's sleek, like me, steel muscles under a suit of taut flesh.  Her hair has never been long, but at least she stopped hiding that rich auburn with that disgusting bright red and purple mixture she used to wear.  The piercings are gone, as is the punk motif that she used to hide within.  The silky length of her hair isn't even to her shoulders, but at least she is growing it, and from her own lips, she said she's growing it to see what she looks like in my eyes.   I know her as one knows the world exists.  Fire burns, water flows, earth holds and air blows.  That is the utter certainty that defines her in my mind, and in my soul.  No one captivates me the way that she does, even in this most recent time spent with her, when she slipped into my house in just a pair of sweatpants and a t-shirt.   I know her body like I know my house in the dark.  There is not an inch of her flesh that I haven't memorized a million times, only to forget and memorize yet again.  Small, firm, round breasts that fit perfectly inside of my hands.  Lips as soft as summer rain, but rain has never been as soothing nor as sweet.  Every kiss is lightning through my nerves.  Every moan is pure ecstasy.  She is my ultimate indulgance; my ultimate addiction.  She is my ideal and my curse, because I don't know if I will ever find her, or if she truly is only a figment of my dreams.  The instant I hear her, not just her voice, but just the sounds she makes as she walks, none of that matters.  In her arms, I am neither man nor beast, but simply me, both at the same time, neither at the same time.  With every choice I make in my life, I know I draw closer and closer to possessing her; to being possessed by her.  For her, the world is not enough, nor is the universe.  I wouldn't capture the stars for her, but instead would make entirely new ones simply to see her smile in glee.   I have dozens of sketches of her scattered through my art books, even if they do fail to capture even a hint of her beauty.  My words will never do justice to what she is, or to who she is.  She is my respite from love, hate, and everything else.  Together, we exist solely for the other.  In her dark brown eyes, I am able to stand tall, and stand with pride of who I am, despite my past.  She knows my every secret, and not only understands them, but understands why they exist, or are remembered.  She has seen the demons, the angels, the beauty and the vileness that wrestles inside of me; that wars inside of me.  No condemnation in her eyes, nor in her heart, which I feel beating as surely as I feel my own heart beating in my chest.   In her eyes, I am my own ideal person.   Now if I simply knew her name.  I know it when I am with her, but when she is not in my arms, I can no more remember it than I can remember what it is like to fly on feathered wings.  That is the sole regret I hold for her.  One day, I will lock my eyes on her outside of the dreams, and I will know her name with the same certainty that I know mine.  That is the sole consolation I have with my failure to know her name when I am awake.   Another night spent with her, and the enchantment around my very being is drawn that much tighter, not that I care.  Her name dances on the tip of my tongue, but for the life of me, there is no chance that I can utter it.  The damnable thing is that when I am with her, it is never an issue, but when I am apart from her, it consumes me.   Is this my punishment for my life, or a vision of what could be, if I could only find her in the waking world, instead of the dreamscape?   The concept of Hell cannot frighten me more than the thought of never holding her in my arms and watching the sunlight dance in her hair, instead of the moonlight in her eyes.  In truth, I won’t deny that the beauty of watching the stars grow older with her is the most peaceful sensation I know.  But the thought of her being just a creation of my mind, a fantasy in which I torment myself, scares me more than I would ever admit to any living person.   There is a simple, sweet beauty to her that I simply cannot find in anyone else that I know in this life, and I know several hundreds of people, thanks to my time on the Internet.  She is as direct as I am in everything that she says, which I cherish.  I’ll be the first person to admit that I do not catch subtle twists in conversation readily, or to be blunt, I’m just dense at times.  I consider it a small foible in my character, but I know that it infuriates people on a regular basis when I don’t catch the hint, so to speak.   I can smell the strawberries from her shampoo when I wake, and still taste her breath on my lips.  Her touch is like pouring battery acid across bare flesh, but instead of pain, it is rapture to hold her in my arms.  She is like nothing I have ever known, man or beast.  Sweet, honest, caring, practical.  The list of words to describe her is truly endless I think.  But I cannot tell if she is real, or if she is a dream walker like I am.  When ‘A’ would cross over to me, I knew it was her like I know that water is wet.   This woman is truly my ideal, if not perhaps my soul mate.  The contentment that I feel after a night spent with her, regardless of how the time is spent, is something that I would kill to possess, and have less than a heartbeat of regret at the effort.   “There she is.  Your Venus.”   A single line from a movie that embodies her, to some degree.   I am petrified that this woman, for she is definitely no girl, doesn’t exist beyond the insides of my eyelids.  I am afraid that I am in love with a dream, because it would mean that my sanity is slipping yet again into that dark void.   So many pieces of other people can be found in her that she could very well be a dream, although I would barter my soul and breath away to give her life if she is simply a dream.  No one that innocent and beautiful should ever be forced to be trapped in my mind.  No deed, or lifetime of deeds, could warrant such a dreadful punishment as to be caged away with the things that I lock inside of me.   She has Rhonda’s strength of character.  Kris’ honest love.  Heather’s playfulness.  Andria’s passion.   And my heart.   I dare not speak of her with anyone that is close to me, simply because I will be thought of as insane again, and that is something I despise ever going through again.   But still she haunts me, and captivates me at the same time.   If only I could remember her name.


I do apologize for the names inside of it, since they will mean nothing to most anyone that reads this.


_____________________________

Mother is the name for God on the lips and hearts of all children.

Murderer?! Murderer! Let me tell you something about murder. It's fun; it's easy; you gonna learn ALL about it. - Tin Tin

Can you be more amusing?

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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 3:46:01 PM   
Wulfchyld


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If you would look through the threads you will find over and over that male subs aren’t real, HNG's, yada yada yada. With all that negative feedback and the fact men take a more "physical" approach and women a more analytical approach. Whether /s males are trying to lure a Domme into conquer mod (which I suspect is a lot of it) or just voicing the fact that they wanted noticed, appreciated, and even wanted.

_____________________________

Loki, forum god of Mischief

Submission is not a gift... it is plunder!
Where there is a whip, there is a way!
Dom/mes of a feather, beat the f*ck out of slaves together


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RE: What's the point of...? - 5/17/2006 4:35:12 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: naughtynick

Women are difficult to please, men are... lets say easier to please not difficult. Many women want a higher standard in a male than their own standard.


And don't we know it.

It's one of the reasons I stay single. The effort and the cost isn't worth the while. Not for a full time relationship anyway.

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