RE: Multiple Personality Disorder

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sunshinemiss -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 3:46:05 PM)
I've treated two. They are pretty darned rare. DID (which was formerly MPD) was the fad diagnosis for awhile. Not nearly as many people have it as have been told they do. A lot of it is creative use of intelligence for survival, sometimes it's just a "meditation guide" kind of thing, sometimes it's not clearly defined, but there is dissociation. The point of DID is to appear normal. If people were seeing DIDs willy nilly, it wouldn't be very effective, would it?

DeviantlyD -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 3:48:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or "Termy, what made the mother what she was is meth. Meth, meth, meth. That's all." Sorry, I don't buy that. I have known too many people who did drugs to believe that. ... I knew a meth head. T^T So because you knew "a" meth head and other drug abusers you know how all meth addicts behave? shakes head To the OP: Oprah Winfrey has dealt with this on her show many times. You can read about it here. quote: ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus I saw this docco on a little girl who was schizophrenic from birth, evidently--creepiest thing EVER was watching this baby watching things that were NOT there to our eyes. When she got language, she was able to speak quite clearly about who/what she was seeing. At least someone dissociating knows (or do they?) that it's all pieces of themselves in there. LadyHibiscus: The child you referred to is January Schofield. I saw the same documentary, plus, her family was also on Oprah. The following link provides more information about this. http://health.discovery.com/tv/psych-week/articles/born-schizophrenic.html

Arpig -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 3:52:54 PM)
quote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't schizophrenia and related conditions the result of imbalances in brain chemistry that have nothing to do with environment? Whereas multiplicity doesn't necesarily have an organic cause; it's either the result of trauma and/or a natural, developmental predisposition. I know schizophrenia can run in families but I've never heard of multiplicity being hereditary. I don't know enough about multiplicity to say one way or another, but yes schizophrenia is a generally considered to be due to messed up brain chemistry, but nobody quite knows just what chemicals are out of whack or what causes that imbalance. It isn't the same for everyone either, which is why some drugs work for some people and not others. Some speculation does trace it back to traumas, but its sort of dubious reasoning at best. It goes like this: Person is traumatized -> Person has issues -> Person self medicates -> Drugs cause imbalance -> Schizophrenia. The main problem I have with that idea is that it A) Doesn't fit with either my story, or those of any of the few schizos I have gotten to know well enough to ask that sort of thing, and B) I have a hard time accepting that drug use could have such a long lasting and profound effect on brain chemistry, it should get better in time if the drugs are withdrawn...it doesn't. It never gets better, it only gets worse. As well, there doesn't seem to be any particular drug they associate it with, so saying any drug can cause it is just a little too Nancy Reagan for me.

hausboy -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 3:55:30 PM)
I contemplated whether or not to respond to this thread but I found it very moving....so I'm typing away. First- my heart just aches for that little boy and those who love and care about him. The damage is not only to him, but those who love him and can't help him any further. Sexual abuse doesn't damage just one life--it damages the lives of those around them as well. Sadly, it is not an unusual event today--one of the "effects" of meth is a hyper-sexuality, and many meth houses are strewn with porn & such. (I've encountered more than one--and hope to never see one again.) Professionals (healthcare workers, medics, police etc.) are trained that if we encounter meth houses that have children living in them, to exercise especially careful and sensitive "handling" of these children because quite often, children found living in meth homes are sexually (and usually also physically) abused at a higher rate. The postings here on MPD and dissociative disorder really strike a chord too. I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse--the first time I experienced flashbacks of it was in my early 20's. What I experienced for the months to follow, was described by my therapist as a form of dissociative behavior. I was petrified that I was schizophrenic and/or had MPD....and the only thing that really saved me was talking to other survivors who could at least help validate what I was going through. During this time, I met a number of people who were living with a range of emotional disorders including those discussed on this thread. It was eye-opening to me. I hope I never go through it again, and it did change my viewpoint on MPD. My ex-wife has a schizophrenic father (and likely, a schizophrenic brother too based on his behavior) and as a result, I tried to learn as much as I could about the disease. A few years ago (I think it was 2005 or 6?) an acquaintance of mine, who I knew from my Gay AA meetings, started acting weirder and weirder. He was schizophrenic--an intelligent, gentle, articulate and soft-spoken man -- and his erratic behavior was starting to frighten us. We thought he had either started using illegal drugs again....or was off his meds. He became belligerent towards members of the AA group, and he was told that while we loved him and cared about him, he could not come to the group on nights when he was feeling violent. The moderator made him promise. He did. And breaking an AA rule, the moderator called his mother (whom he lived with) --she told her that she had already put in an emergency order with the police to get him help, and force him to take his medications. The next Thursday, he didn't show up at the AA meeting. To our horror, we turned on the news that night. As soon as they described the suspect, we all knew who it was. Before we could grab the phone to dial the police to give them his address, his face and name were all over the news. Instead of coming to the AA meeting, he went on a shooting spree, killing five people--two of them, the police officers who were coming to take him to the hospital. The weeks to follow were a roller coaster of emotions. I mourned the lost lives....but I also mourned for our friend and his mother, who was beyond consoling at what had happened--she felt responsible for it all. The media portrayed him as a monster--there were so many false accusations made about him it was equally as sickening. When I went to work, I had to listen to my colleagues talk about how much they wanted "this monster" to rot in hell. I finally spoke up--that "monster" was already in hell, and if they forced him to take his meds, he will be absolutely horrified when he is told what he did--he will live in that hell forever. It caused a terrible rift at work--how dare I sympathize with what they called a non-human. But he is not a monster. He is a very sick man who had no control over his disease, and it ultimately ended with tragic results. He is spending the rest of his life locked up--he was ruled mentally unfit to stand trial. I forget if it was dateline or 48 hours...one of those shows made it into a headline story. The cameras came from everywhere, all wanting to hear about what an evil, vile person he is. My friends and I refused to be interviewed--we saw first-hand how any time the media interviewed someone who provided a view of him that wasn't "satan", they edited the interview and took things out of context. We tried to explain what he was really like, but the TV shows cared only about ratings, not enlightening the public about what schizophrenia is. (or isn't!) Through my job, I arranged for a crisis team to come to the AA meeting, and they gave us a brief in-service on schizophrenia, what's it like, and why patients stop taking their meds....followed by a debriefing and resources to get additional support. The event changed forever how I viewed schizophrenia, and changed my views on the death penalty, among other things. I never thought I would ever have compassion for a convicted murderer...esp. one who killed cops...and yet, there I sat with my friends, feeling the conflicted emotions. Thank you for sharing that old thread from Arpig. It brought back a lot of these emotions. Mental illness is so misunderstood and it just seems like most of our society has so little patience or compassion for illness that is not obvious or physical. I have a profound respect for those who fight the daily battles with this terrible disease, and tremendous respect for those like Arpig, who have the courage to share their experiences with others.

SylvereApLeanan -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:03:43 PM)
quote: The main problem I have with that idea is that it A) Doesn't fit with either my story, or those of any of the few schizos I have gotten to know well enough to ask that sort of thing, and B) I have a hard time accepting that drug use could have such a long lasting and profound effect on brain chemistry, it should get better in time if the drugs are withdrawn...it doesn't. It never gets better, it only gets worse. Well, I know it's possible to permanently screw up your brain chem with drugs. There are a couple of residential treatment centers here that deal with schizophrenic clients. I had a couple of friends who worked in them. In one of the homes, there was a kid who was once brilliant, at the top of his high school graduating class. The summer after his graduation, he started experimenting with LSD and got to the point he was biting big chunks out of sheets of tabs. He is now a permanent resident because he has drug-induced schizophrenia and hallucinates constantly. However, the trauma > drug > schizophrenia hypothesis discounts those people who develop schizophrenia but have not used drugs, so I question whether it's valid in a majority of cases.

Rule -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:04:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet Has anyone else ever encountered someone they think has multiple personalities? I have. She had a positive attitude and enjoyed the other three. I already had developed my thesis on the structure of the mind and told her it was normal. She knew a LOT: she had a better idea of the structure of the mind than I did. At first I had difficulty to calibrate our individual models, but I succeeded. Once a week she counted items for a morning to get some rest from the talker personality. I determined the probable cause of her dissociation and counseled her. When her circumstances changed, I told her that she could reintegrate again. She did and after some time told me that the other 'girls' were nearly completely gone. She is one of my very good friends. In another case I may have done some damage, though. [&:] As for the case in this thread, I think that destructive personality is way over my head.

DeviantlyD -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:14:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig Nothing happened, nothing caused it, it's just the way I am. [sm=dunno.gif] Quite. It is your natural condition. It ain't a problem if it is natural. Elephants have trunks: that is natural also and it is an asset for them, not a problem. (Unless they get a cold, of course. Then they require huge handkerchiefs. [;)]) That's a fairly simplistic viewpoint. Sometimes "nature" messes up. A cleft palate isn't from an artificial source. Sickle cell anemia occurs because of a substitution of one nucleotide (valine for glutamic acid) in a gene. These are "natural" events and they are definitely a problem.

Rule -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:20:19 PM)
Sickle cell anemia is a beneficial mutation for populations living in malaria invested regions. I dunno about cleft palates, but that might be due to a dietary lack in the mother during pregnancy. So you think that elephants are messed up because they have a trunk?

Arpig -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:20:57 PM)
quote: drug-induced schizophrenia and hallucinates constantly Or, which is more my thinking, he was schizophrenic to begin with and the drug use was an early symptom. This was definitely the case with me. I had an increasingly violent temper through my early teen years, and also a growing paranoia, which manifested itself in doubts about being liked or loved. That led to drinking and drugs. I now quite firmly believe this is the case with my eldest brother as well, who was never diagnosed and died 40 years ago, so we'll never know. But he had violent outbursts and outright psychotic episodes while growing up, and he too turned heavily to drugs. The same thing happened to the girl I mentioned on the old thread, the drugs were a reaction. It is a common theme in the stories of the schizophrenics I have interacted with, so I have come to doubt the reality of "drug-induced" schizophrenia. Every one of the schizos who used drugs that I spoke to, when they took the time to think carefully about their time before using, would see the signs of the disease. Granted, it's not a scientific study, but it's not most of the people I've spoken to, it's all of them.

hausboy -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:23:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig quote: drug-induced schizophrenia and hallucinates constantly Or, which is more my thinking, he was schizophrenic to begin with and the drug use was an early symptom. This was definitely the case with me. I had an increasingly violent temper through my early teen years, and also a growing paranoia, which manifested itself in doubts about being liked or loved. That led to drinking and drugs. I now quite firmly believe this is the case with my eldest brother as well, who was never diagnosed and died 40 years ago, so we'll never know. But he had violent outbursts and outright psychotic episodes while growing up, and he too turned heavily to drugs. The same thing happened to the girl I mentioned on the old thread, the drugs were a reaction. It is a common theme in the stories of the schizophrenics I have interacted with, so I have come to doubt the reality of "drug-induced" schizophrenia. Every one of the schizos who used drugs that I spoke to, when they took the time to think carefully about their time before using, would see the signs of the disease. Granted, it's not a scientific study, but it's not most of the people I've spoken to, it's all of them. Arpig Same with the man I mentioned--he turned to drugs and alcohol to "cope" with the voices he heard.

Arpig -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:26:25 PM)
quote: So you think that elephants are messed up because they have a trunk? No. I also don't think I am messed up because I am schizophrenic. I know for a fact that I am.

SylvereApLeanan -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:27:37 PM)
Natural or not, whether or not something is a problem is typically determined by whether or not it interferes with day-to-day functioning and relationships. Schizophrenia is "natural" in that it is assumed to have an organic cause. However, I don't think there's going to be much disagreement about whether or not the attendant delusions and hallucinations are a problem. Similarly, some multiple systems are high-functioning and able to live full lives without the need for integration. OTOH, some systems are extremely dysfunctional and struggle to maintain even the semblance of normalcy. Whether or not multiplicity is natural isn't as important as whether or not it's interfering with functioning in the outside world in an acceptible fashion.

DeviantlyD -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:33:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule Sickle cell anemia is a beneficial mutation for populations living in malaria invested regions. I dunno about cleft palates, but that might be due to a dietary lack in the mother during pregnancy. So you think that elephants are messed up because they have a trunk? Re-read my post. You're being deliberately obtuse.

Arpig -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:35:05 PM)
quote: Same with the man I mentioned--he turned to drugs and alcohol to "cope" with the voices he heard. I think that might be a bit of what is behind the idea of drug-induced, the voices, so many people focus on the hallucinations. They are the flashy or sexy symptom of schizophrenia, but they aren't the only one, and nor are they the worst of them. The worst is the irrational thinking, then comes the paranoia, which is facilitated by the irrational thinking. Then come the hallucinations. If it weren't for the irrational thinking, one wouldn't believe the voices. And if it weren't for the paranoia, the voices wouldn't have anything to work with. So, in my experience, it is the loss of rationality that is the biggest problem, and that isn't an obvious thing. Couple that with paranoia and you have a very difficult situation for a young person to deal with. And that is something that can exist for years without anybody, including the one affected being aware of it. I certainly wasn't, it's only in retrospect that I see it.

SylvereApLeanan -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:39:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig quote: drug-induced schizophrenia and hallucinates constantly Or, which is more my thinking, he was schizophrenic to begin with and the drug use was an early symptom. I can't begin to speculate on that. To my knowledge, there was no history of schizophrenia in his family and he did not show any signs prior to experimenting with drugs. However, he could have developed schizophrenia around the same time as he began using drugs. IIRC, it's most common for schizophrenia to manifest in adolescence to early 20s so it's certainly possible he was self-medicating in an attempt to alleviate his symptoms. His "official" diagnosis was drug-induced schizophrenia, but no one will ever know whether or not the onset of his hallucinations came before or after he dropped the first tab. I don't doubt that the vast majority of people with schizophrenia developed the condition prior to any drug use. However, I don't discount the possibility that brain chem could be irrevocably affected by heavy or prolonged drug use. There are enough people with alcohol-induced dementia to suggest drug use can permanently alter the brain. I do agree with you that schizophrenia is more likely to be a cause of drug use than the result.

fragilepieces -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:40:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet The one thing I have read about MPD in relation to abused children is that they are usually not violent. I am not sure where you are reading this stuff---but think about it. A child is abused, he is TAUGHT violence---not to mention s/he probably has a lot of pent up anger and rage that must be released. How on earth does one think that these pent up emotions are released? In a happy go lucky positive healthy way? As to asking if it exists, define it first. MPD or DID is an altered state of mind. OP do you believe in sub space? Do you think it's real? Because really all sub space is--is an altered state of mind. True MPD and sub space are not exactly the same thing and how one gets there is totally different but they are both an altered state of mind.

Termyn8or -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:41:17 PM)
"Sadly, it is not an unusual event today--one of the "effects" of meth is a hyper-sexuality," Hmmmm. I didn't notice that, and it's not like I only knew one or two people who did it. As such I wonder if it's a chicken or egg thing, as in people with that proclivity would choose that particular drug. I notice you did put the word effect in quotes. However most people I have known have done many drugs, I mean a variety, not just get hooked on one or two. When you deal with this you deal with motive. That is very hard to determine. The way I see it the chosen drug is the one that suppresses and/or enhances aspects of the user's own personality to his or her preference. If a libido enhancing drug is chosen, who can say that it is not because that is what the user wants ? So there is not much of an argument there, it's just not something I've noticed. It is coming clear to me that my crowd is not normal and never was. We played with drugs. Only a couple of people really "fell". Very few ever got busted or hurt anyone. "I forget if it was dateline or 48 hours...one of those shows made it into a headline story. The cameras came from everywhere, all wanting to hear about what an evil, vile person he is. My friends and I refused to be interviewed--we saw first-hand how any time the media interviewed someone who provided a view of him that wasn't "satan", they edited the interview and took things out of context. We tried to explain what he was really like, but the TV shows cared only about ratings, not enlightening the public about what schizophrenia is. (or isn't!) " Rule came on here and said that the kid in the OP maybe should be shot. I said the meth head mama should be burned alive. She wrecked his life, he is sitting in a cage. I nice padded cage but it is still a cage. Is he better off dead ? And if she ever comes to the realization of what she has done, ahould she be allowed to die ? Your acquaintance from AA, should he be forced to live with it ? How precious is life that we can't let some people out of their misery ? If faced with life in an institution I would rather die. Am I unusual in that regard ? If I were ever convicted of killing someone, remorseful or not I would not express remorse to the court. I would do everything in my power to get myself executed, really. Now in saying that, do others think there is something wrong with me ? Of course this is not a democratic matter but I just thought I would ask. You probably did the right thing not talking to the media, they are some folk who should also be roasted to a golden brown crispiness. If I saved someone from a burning building I wouldn't talk to those people. I respect everyone's courage for coming out and telling their own stories about these issues. And I'm glad that you all can. I mean physically, that you are not dead, in jail or a rubber room somewhere...... beyond the fact that you can bring yourselves to do it. Somehow you "made it". Perhaps you'll be an inspiration to someone out there. T^T

Arpig -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:45:05 PM)
quote: However, I don't discount the possibility that brain chem could be irrevocably affected by heavy or prolonged drug use. There are enough people with alcohol-induced dementia to suggest drug use can permanently alter the brain. I do agree with you that schizophrenia is more likely to be a cause of drug use than the result. True. I suppose it depends on how long and how heavy the use. Though I always was under the impression that alcohol affected the brain by literally destroying it, by killing off brain cells, rather than by altering the brain chemistry.

Arpig -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:49:22 PM)
quote: True MPD and sub space are not exactly the same thing and how one gets there is totally different Welllllll.....they're not the same thing, but a lot of what we do to put a person into subspace does look an awful lot like abuse...just saying. [:D]

SylvereApLeanan -> RE: Multiple Personality Disorder (8/22/2011 4:52:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arpig Though I always was under the impression that alcohol affected the brain by literally destroying it, by killing off brain cells, rather than by altering the brain chemistry. You're probably right, but then drug use of any sort destroys brain cells. You could probably make a case for drug use resulting in destruction/impairment of the serotonin receptors or whatever it is that triggers schizophrenia. I'm not going to do it, though, because I'm not an expert in neurochemistry. I just read a lot and psychology fascinates me.

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