RE: Forgive Student Loans? (Full Version)

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PeonForHer -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 11:23:22 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ArizonaBossMan

and it doesn't work in other countries... look at greece.. look at a lot of them in europe, about to go belly up. Like Lady Thatcher once said, "Socialism works great until you run out of other people's money"


Public spending went up under Thatcher. Just saying.



Kana -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 11:29:52 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

quote:

So bailing out the banks and auto companies teaches good responsibility? What am I missing


I think there should have been investigations, indictments, prosecutions, and jail terms.

[image]http://notmytribe.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/adbusters-occupywallstreet-bankers-Y-U-No-in-jail.jpg[/image]


Yep. There should have been. Instead not one SEC employee lost their job, and, outside of a few of the most flagrant mortgage companies, not one single exec has gone to jail.
That we kicked out 15 trillion and not one damn thing was changed, instead it's just business as usual, is a national disgrace.

And to add as a note, I worked in the finance department of a major university when the bailouts occurred and not one, none, zero, zip, nada, of the finance profs thought the bailouts were a good idea.
And these are folks from myriad backgrounds/countries/cultures/political ideologies/etc... that didn't agree on anything.
The folks who know numbers, who do em for a living, knew the bailouts were a joke before they happened.
That folks are upset the banks got bailed out while they (You know, the public, the folks whose money got so easily, callously and carelessly spent) are sinking into debt isn't shocking at all.
What's shocking is that more people aren't in the streets foaming at the mouth.



FirmhandKY -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 11:42:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

quote:

So bailing out the banks and auto companies teaches good responsibility? What am I missing


I think there should have been investigations, indictments, prosecutions, and jail terms.

[image]http://notmytribe.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/adbusters-occupywallstreet-bankers-Y-U-No-in-jail.jpg[/image]


Yep. There should have been. Instead not one SEC employee lost their job, and, outside of a few of the most flagrant mortgage companies, not one single exec has gone to jail.
That we kicked out 15 trillion and not one damn thing was changed, instead it's just business as usual, is a national disgrace.

And to add as a note, I worked in the finance department of a major university when the bailouts occurred and not one, none, zero, zip, nada, of the finance profs thought the bailouts were a good idea.
And these are folks from myriad backgrounds/countries/cultures/political ideologies/etc... that didn't agree on anything.
The folks who know numbers, who do em for a living, knew the bailouts were a joke before they happened.
That folks are upset the banks got bailed out while they (You know, the public, the folks whose money got so easily, callously and carelessly spent) are sinking into debt isn't shocking at all.
What's shocking is that more people aren't in the streets foaming at the mouth.

You know why there were no "prosecutions" and such don't you?

Because the bankers et al were just following the lead and guidance of what the politicians wanted and in some cases demanded.  If they started to investigate and subpoena, they know exactly where the inconvenient fingers will start to point.

Firm



kalikshama -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 11:45:55 AM)

Good.



GreedyTop -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 12:43:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: samboct

Change the laws so that if you declare bankruptcy- your student loan is dealt with the same as any other debt. Let the damn banks actually earn their money and make sure not to loan it out so frivolously. This is really the same crap as the housing meltdown- too many liar loans which is very much a function of banking deregulation- the mantra pushed by Ronnie and the Republicans for decades.

Agreed.  Except about the part where it's all Reagan's fault, anyway. [;)]

Firm




jeeez. I agree withyou again! HOLY SHIT!! I've become a Righty! *giggle*



FirmhandKY -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 12:48:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

jeeez. I agree withyou again! HOLY SHIT!! I've become a Righty! *giggle*

The Dark Side always wins, in the end.  [sm=evil.gif]



DomYngBlk -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 12:51:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

quote:

So bailing out the banks and auto companies teaches good responsibility? What am I missing


I think there should have been investigations, indictments, prosecutions, and jail terms.

[image]http://notmytribe.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/adbusters-occupywallstreet-bankers-Y-U-No-in-jail.jpg[/image]


Yep. There should have been. Instead not one SEC employee lost their job, and, outside of a few of the most flagrant mortgage companies, not one single exec has gone to jail.
That we kicked out 15 trillion and not one damn thing was changed, instead it's just business as usual, is a national disgrace.

And to add as a note, I worked in the finance department of a major university when the bailouts occurred and not one, none, zero, zip, nada, of the finance profs thought the bailouts were a good idea.
And these are folks from myriad backgrounds/countries/cultures/political ideologies/etc... that didn't agree on anything.
The folks who know numbers, who do em for a living, knew the bailouts were a joke before they happened.
That folks are upset the banks got bailed out while they (You know, the public, the folks whose money got so easily, callously and carelessly spent) are sinking into debt isn't shocking at all.
What's shocking is that more people aren't in the streets foaming at the mouth.

You know why there were no "prosecutions" and such don't you?

Because the bankers et al were just following the lead and guidance of what the politicians wanted and in some cases demanded.  If they started to investigate and subpoena, they know exactly where the inconvenient fingers will start to point.

Firm



That doesn't ring right. I will go with wall street taking a look around in the early part of 2008 and saying Oh Shit....and then convincing the Bush White House to play it out near the election.



GreedyTop -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:02:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

jeeez. I agree withyou again! HOLY SHIT!! I've become a Righty! *giggle*

The Dark Side always wins, in the end.  [sm=evil.gif]



you realize, I am just buttering you up so that I can get up close and personal with Treasure, right?

edited because I STILL havent gotten used to the lappy keyboard size..

(its MY story... go with it... )



joether -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:12:15 PM)

Here we are at page 5. What does any of the last ten posts have to do with the main topic? Absolutely Nothing! The idea of cancelling out student loans would be an immediate boon to the middle and poor classes in America. Yeah, the rich would get 'hurt' if those loans were through them. They can cry me a river for all I care! I've not found one conservative on here point out actual facts or evidence that this WOULDN'T be a good idea for America. The effect would be nearly immedately felt (within two or three months) by the middle and lower class. I doubt the majority would take that new found money and place it into investments. More likely use it to pay off OTHER debts and/or buy stuff at a faster rate.



kalikshama -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:15:28 PM)

Obama on Bank Prosecutions: They Did Nothing Illegal, Only Found Loopholes That We Worked to Close

For perhaps the first time, President Barack Obama was forced to explain why there have been no prosecutions of Wall Street executives for their fraudulent actions during the run-up to the financial crisis. Asked by Jake Tapper to explain this behavior, Obama basically suggested that most of the actions on Wall Street weren’t illegal but just immoral, and that his Administration worked to re-regulate the financial sector with the Dodd-Frank reform legislation.

“Banks are in the business of making money, and they find loopholes,” the President said. Apparently forging and fabricating documents to prove ownership of homes that are subsequently stolen from borrowers is now a loophole.



joether -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:24:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama
Obama on Bank Prosecutions: They Did Nothing Illegal, Only Found Loopholes That We Worked to Close

For perhaps the first time, President Barack Obama was forced to explain why there have been no prosecutions of Wall Street executives for their fraudulent actions during the run-up to the financial crisis. Asked by Jake Tapper to explain this behavior, Obama basically suggested that most of the actions on Wall Street weren’t illegal but just immoral, and that his Administration worked to re-regulate the financial sector with the Dodd-Frank reform legislation.

“Banks are in the business of making money, and they find loopholes,” the President said. Apparently forging and fabricating documents to prove ownership of homes that are subsequently stolen from borrowers is now a loophole.


What's does THIS, kalikshama, have to do with the topic of the thread?



Hillwilliam -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:29:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

jeeez. I agree withyou again! HOLY SHIT!! I've become a Righty! *giggle*

The Dark Side always wins, in the end.  [sm=evil.gif]


Not unless you have cookies.



kalikshama -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:33:24 PM)

The thread has included bank bailouts since DBG's post 32.

quote:

This is what I think not forgiving student loans teaches:

1. Young graduates are expected to accept more responsibility than banks.

2. Students aren't allowed to file bankruptcy, but all banks have to do is ask for a bailout.

I wonder if Bank of America plans to forgive any private Bank of America student loans of the workers they lay off. After all, it will be their fault the ex employees can't pay them anymore.



DomYngBlk -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:42:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

Obama on Bank Prosecutions: They Did Nothing Illegal, Only Found Loopholes That We Worked to Close

For perhaps the first time, President Barack Obama was forced to explain why there have been no prosecutions of Wall Street executives for their fraudulent actions during the run-up to the financial crisis. Asked by Jake Tapper to explain this behavior, Obama basically suggested that most of the actions on Wall Street weren’t illegal but just immoral, and that his Administration worked to re-regulate the financial sector with the Dodd-Frank reform legislation.

“Banks are in the business of making money, and they find loopholes,” the President said. Apparently forging and fabricating documents to prove ownership of homes that are subsequently stolen from borrowers is now a loophole.


No argument from me red panties. He should still go after the bastards. And when they announce they are going to lay people off he should have meeting each time with the Board of Directors of each wall street firm to reaffirm why he should go after them......I think that would save a few jobs.

But mostly I said that cause I can see Firm heading down his "Gov't is always evil" trail and wanted to point out that his theory didn't make sense.



FirmhandKY -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 1:46:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

But mostly I said that cause I can see Firm heading down his "Gov't is always evil" trail and wanted to point out that his theory didn't make sense.

I have never said that "Gov't is always evil", DYB.  It is a necessary part of a civil society that should be watched, starved and properly caned on a regular basis, so that it doesn't start to think it is the master, rather than the servant.

Firm



HeatherMcLeather -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 2:12:48 PM)

quote:

Public spending went up under Thatcher. Just saying.
Shhhh, don't say that, ABM is a factophobe. Have a little compassion.



DomYngBlk -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 2:14:50 PM)

As I said, you think Gov't is always evil.



HeatherMcLeather -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 2:24:42 PM)

quote:

I said I'm against the fix of across the board student loan forgiveness. How did you come to the conclusion that I am against any and all actions?
How by reading your words, that's how.
quote:

What does that teach about responsibility? That it's ok to incur 6 figures worth of debt and have it erased? You can generally color me liberal, but I think this is ridiculous.
quote:

If you don't want the debt of an expensive school, go to a cheaper one.
quote:

in the US, the state universities and colleges are considerably cheaper than private colleges. So there's choices between moderate debt and crushing debt right there.
Now combine those words with the fact that you haven't suggested even one viable alternative and you get the basis for my impression.



Iamsemisweet -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 2:43:52 PM)

If the loans that are forgiven are federally guaranteed, though, it doesn't affect the banks.  The government pays the bank off (that's what a guarantee is), which means the taxpayers are picking up the tab.  Again.  Not exactly sticking it to the man, in my opinion.



kalikshama -> RE: Forgive Student Loans? (10/18/2011 3:38:00 PM)

Wow, and you seemed to have such a good grasp on logical fallacies.



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