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Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/2/2012 8:44:48 PM

tweakabelle

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Like many people I don't pretend to be top of the detail of the climate change debate. It's far too technical for me. So I'm forced to rely on the public debate. To date, I've been singularly unimpressed by the case put up by the deniers.

Leading climate change denier, Ian Plimer, Prof of Geology at Adelaide Uni and one of the few academic voices opposing climate change debates the issues with 'greenie' George Monbiot of 'The Guardian' here. For an a academic, Plimer's performance is simply astonishing. He barely bothers to deny charges of falsification of evidence made against him by Monbiot. Any self respecting academic would not only strenuously deny such charges, but also immediately sue for defamation. Some academics' reactions to Plimer can be seen here. To my eyes, Plimer is not credible at all.

Another serious plank in the deniers' case is the matter of the Uni of East Anglia CRU emails, which are said to show solid evidence of data manipulation and deceit. No less than six different inquiries have investigated this matter. All six have failed to find any evidence of "scientific misconduct". Again the deniers' case dissolves into nothingness.

Is there any serious credible evidence out there to support the deniers case that stands up to serious scrutiny? If so I would like so see it or hear of it. As things stand, the case against climate change is failing by default - there just isn't a case.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 1/2/2012 8:48:42 PM >

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/2/2012 11:05:34 PM

popeye1250

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Ah,....Tweakabelle, there's no more "debate."
I don't think there ever was a "debate" with all those mentally deranged idiots haranging (sp) at anyone who would "dare" disagree with them.
Now we just make fun of them and ridicule them as the anal-retentive imbeciles that they are.
Every once in a while one shows up in here and we have fun playing "whack-a-mole" with them.
No-one can wear tin foil hats like them.
And that feels good after the years of yelling and screaming by those fucking morons.
I guess you didn't get the memo.
False alarm.

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 1/2/2012 11:56:18 PM >

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 1:31:40 AM

Owner59

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It was 50 degrees here yesterday pops.

The 2nd of January and it`s tee-shirt weather up here.

The ground is usually frozen by now.

Hey pops,tell us.Growing up in NH,what kind of weather was it like at this time of year up there?

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 1/3/2012 1:34:50 AM >

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 4:54:11 AM

erieangel

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We've finally got some snow along the shores of Lake Erie. Usually, we have white Christmases--this year I didn't even wear a winter coat. And the snow? Its just a dusting nothing major like we had when I was a kid.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 4:57:55 AM

Sanity

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Every time theres a record cold wave the leftists scream that weather isnt climate..

But the epic fail is on the part of the thread header because no one denies that the climate changes, it has been changing continually since the Earth first formed

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:04:34 AM

seababy

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http://www.desmogblog.com/ian-plimer

Yes good old Ian who has been pocketing alot of money over the years from the mining company sector. Conflict of interest much?

So where are we at the moment in terms of climate change?

There is little argument now that significant climate change is ocurring. The argument is what is the cause of the observed changes?

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:12:39 AM

seekerofslut

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The climate is always changing. But that is not the real issue, now is it? AGW is as much political as it is science. What I do not understand is why every Greenie / Environmentalist is not driving a Chevy Volt.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:16:41 AM

Sanity

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Why do some of them take vast entourages of limos and jets to exotic resort destinations

Live in large mansions etc

quote:

ORIGINAL: seekerofslut

The climate is always changing. But that is not the real issue, now is it? AGW is as much political as it is science. What I do not understand is why every Greenie / Environmentalist is not driving a Chevy Volt.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:22:56 AM

seababy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: seekerofslut

The climate is always changing. But that is not the real issue, now is it? AGW is as much political as it is science. What I do not understand is why every Greenie / Environmentalist is not driving a Chevy Volt.

I would consider myself an enviromentalist and I catch public transport and use my bike.
What surprises me is that everyone doesn't identify themselves as an enviromentalist. Its seems like insanity not to see that taking action to look after the ecosystems that ultimately sustain life on earth as a priority.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:28:16 AM

thishereboi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

It was 50 degrees here yesterday pops.

The 2nd of January and it`s tee-shirt weather up here.

The ground is usually frozen by now.

Hey pops,tell us.Growing up in NH,what kind of weather was it like at this time of year up there?

Well if it is hotter where you live, then I guess that proves global warming.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:29:02 AM

leonine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
But the epic fail is on the part of the thread header because no one denies that the climate changes, it has been changing continually since the Earth first formed

This is a quibble. The "climate change" debate has always and only been about whether (a) abnormally rapid climate change is happening right now, and (b) whether this is manmade. You might as well say that there are no Holocaust deniers because everyone agrees that large numbers of people were killed by someone somewhere sometime.

And in the early days there were a great many people strenuously denying point (a). As other posters have noted, their numbers dwindle with every anomalous finding, but there are still a few hardliners who continue to insist that the data are either a random blip, or all faked by a global conspiracy of meterorologists.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:52:03 AM

Hillwilliam

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Continuing like we are going because "We probably aren't causing the change that is happening" makes about as much sense as riding down a long mountain road in a car with brakes that "Were failing last week but I think they're ok now because long downgrades probably don't make it worse and brakes naturally go in cycles"

I know of a couple of posters here who would be happy to drive that car. Who wants to be their passenger?

1. Oil is finite.

2. There are a lot of non fuel uses that make our modern civilization possible that come from oil.

3. We run out of oil, civilization as we know it ends.

Does anyone wish to declaim any of the above facts?

We need a "Space Race" like Kennedy started to develop renewable and alternative energy. If we can do that, 2 things will happen.

1. The US will return to the pinnacle of the world for scientific advancement and manufacturing capabilities.

2. Those bastards in the middle east who have been anally raping our wallets for the last half century can EAT their fucking oil.

There is only one thing stopping this from happening. Oil company lobbyists who feed the pockets of those on both sides of the aisle.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:53:13 AM

Sanity

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The REAL debate has always been, who gets to profit over which government edicts

(Al Gore has been doing very well for himself of late)

quote:

ORIGINAL: leonine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
But the epic fail is on the part of the thread header because no one denies that the climate changes, it has been changing continually since the Earth first formed

This is a quibble. The "climate change" debate has always and only been about whether (a) abnormally rapid climate change is happening right now, and (b) whether this is manmade. You might as well say that there are no Holocaust deniers because everyone agrees that large numbers of people were killed by someone somewhere sometime.

And in the early days there were a great many people strenuously denying point (a). As other posters have noted, their numbers dwindle with every anomalous finding, but there are still a few hardliners who continue to insist that the data are either a random blip, or all faked by a global conspiracy of meterorologists.

< Message edited by Sanity -- 1/3/2012 5:56:10 AM >

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:54:57 AM

mnottertail

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No, that never has been the real debate, that has been the neo-con teabagging derail.

Al Gore has a long history of advocating wiping your ass after you take a shit instead of saying, well, its just gonna get dirty again anway; way before the baggers derailed it.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 1/3/2012 6:05:25 AM >

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 5:55:42 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

The REAL debate has always been, who gets to profit over which government edicts

quote:

ORIGINAL: leonine

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
But the epic fail is on the part of the thread header because no one denies that the climate changes, it has been changing continually since the Earth first formed

This is a quibble. The "climate change" debate has always and only been about whether (a) abnormally rapid climate change is happening right now, and (b) whether this is manmade. You might as well say that there are no Holocaust deniers because everyone agrees that large numbers of people were killed by someone somewhere sometime.

And in the early days there were a great many people strenuously denying point (a). As other posters have noted, their numbers dwindle with every anomalous finding, but there are still a few hardliners who continue to insist that the data are either a random blip, or all faked by a global conspiracy of meterorologists.

Does this mean you are in agreement with my post above?

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 6:02:30 AM

Sanity

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If you are referring to the way that Obamas buddy Jefferey Immelt is poised to do extremely well financially due to "climate change" legislation then yes we are in total agreement

< Message edited by Sanity -- 1/3/2012 6:03:59 AM >

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 6:10:03 AM

Hillwilliam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

If you are referring to the way that Obamas buddy Jefferey Immelt is poised to do extremely well financially due to "climate change" legislation then yes we are in total agreement

My post has nothing to do with Immelt or so called climate change legislation. My post has to do with getting congress out of the pockets of OPEC and Big Oil and making this country great again.

I guess you'd rather us be a second rate nation bent over an oil barrel with a Sheikh butt fucking us.

I want something better.

< Message edited by Hillwilliam -- 1/3/2012 6:12:48 AM >

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 6:20:19 AM

Sanity

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I guess someone has to break it to you...

This thread is about climate change

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 6:26:20 AM

kalikshama

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quote:

Its seems like insanity not to see that taking action to look after the ecosystems that ultimately sustain life on earth as a priority.

The imminence of the Rapture makes sustainability irrelevant.

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RE: Climate change denial: Epic fail? - 1/3/2012 6:34:10 AM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

If you are referring to the way that Obamas buddy Jefferey Immelt is poised to do extremely well financially due to "climate change" legislation then yes we are in total agreement

You're arguing it isn't a good thing when a US manufacturing company develops new products and sells them for a profit?

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