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RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 3:45:54 PM

Posts: 395
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quote:

Actually, I agree with Orion. Your approach may work for you, but I know people that have a contracted agreement where there isn't a romance....and they're perfectly happy.

I bet a brand new pony that the submissive in the relationship doesn't sign this "contracted agreement" unless he/she is getting something out of it. In effect, the submissive is getting his/her needs met. I think the main intent of the OP is to explain that you can't just expect a submissive or a slave to bow before you without getting anything in return, without having some of her "needs met." I agree. Even if those needs are feelings of degradation, or physical trauma, or whatever else floats her boat. I'm sure love and affection and feelings aren't necessary for a successful exchange of goods and services between two kinksters who get off on the power exchange, but let's be realistic, at the end of the day, both partners get the f*ck off.

There are way too many profiles along the lines of: Uz is mei SLAVE!!!!! NO LIMITS, BUT WHAT I SAY....yur happiness not matter....put you in hospital, you gRAtefills BITCH!

So, yeah...

(in reply to Kana)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 3:51:12 PM

Kana

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Joined: 10/24/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: monoPupil

LOL, you'd love that wouldn't you?

I would if there was any point to it.. we can throw insults at each other for hours and we still each will have our own view on it. Why put energy into it?

Which are exactly my points:
1-You are talking opinions. Me, and many others here talk from experience...which leads us to
2-It's pretty much the collective experience of the forums here (I ain't speaking for any or everyone, just giving an idea of what I perceive the general consensus to be) as well as myself that in BDSM there is no one right or wrong way, that every relationship has it's own rules that work for the internal participants. Now obviously there are certain lines (Legal for instance) that shouldn't be crossed, but in general one persons wildest fantasy is almost guaranteed to be anothers most disgusting vile unthinkable act-that's simply human nature. So on the forums folks tend to be pretty open minded about lots of stuff, but aren't to hot at being open minded about close minded people. There've been way to many "One Twue Way" folks who have wandered in here over the years.
3-Don't know about anyone else, but I always find it amusing that anyone into kinky sex and BDSM would ever judge anothers sexual acts. I mean seriously folks, we are talking diaper wearing adults infatuated with leather, latex, piss, scat, whipping, beating, tickling, pet play, crawl like a dog people and they are gonna get on a pedestal and judge folks? Oooooooooo-Kaaaaaay.

edited cuz I can't capitalize

< Message edited by Kana -- 2/9/2012 3:53:16 PM >

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
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(in reply to monoPupil)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 3:54:10 PM

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No, apparently only you can. Must be awesome being you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: monoPupil

Can any of you ever give constructive feedback, or all you all just into bashing each other and feeling empowered by doing so???

I think he is very right in understanding that a slave or submissive whose needs are not looked after, is not a happy one. Surely, for some the needs *are* to not be allowed any needs... but you must wonder how realistic that is. For a while, fine, for a lifetime, its just not going to last. If it does, well sorry, I think that's called abuse. Even if the slave "agrees" to that fate, it does not mean it's "fine" and it should be totally acceptable as just a different form of relationship. Pedophiles also believe they mean well for the kids they abuse, and it really doesnt harm them all that much... Just because YOU think its ok, doesn't mean it IS ok!

Well written, Ohanasvib

quote:

try looking deeper than the surface perhaps? try looking at yourself critically instead of defending?

You are the only deep person here. Everyone else, myself included are shallow twits, with no souls.

quote:

yaaawn.....

and apparently we are shallow twits that are boring you. Now please excuse me .. your pedestal is getting in my way.

< Message edited by JanahX -- 2/9/2012 4:25:13 PM >

_____________________________

The first rule of Fight Club is you do not talk about Fight Club.

The second rule of Fight Club is you do not talk about Fight Club.

(in reply to monoPupil)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 3:54:47 PM

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quote:

I think he is very right in understanding that a slave or submissive whose needs are not looked after, is not a happy one. Interesting choice of words. "I think." Not "I know." Not "I have experienced." Just, "I think." which implies you are speaking out yo ass, talking smack bout something you have zero personal experience with. It also lets us know that we are talking about an opinion...and we all know what those are worth.Surely, for some the needs *are* to not be allowed any needs... Yeah, like the gal I own and many others on here. but you must wonder how realistic that is No. Not really. Point of fact I never do. Why would I when I can roll over and kiss her or slap her or fucking fist her whenever I want.

With all due respect, Kana, monoPupil has a point. A slave or a submissive whose needs are not met or recognized isn't going to be a happy one. Trust me. If you lock your slave in a trunk for two weeks, feed her through a straw inserted through the keyhole, and leave her to become infected by her own filth, I have my doubts she'll be happy or healthy. There are basics that all human beings NEED in order to remain sane and happy: Food, water, shelter, access to health care. Any submissive denied these basics is either unhappy or mentally damaged. You seem to be equating "completely controlling by slave" with "denying my slave her needs." Those aren't the same thing. You can take away a slave's rights, her freedom, her decision making power and she'll still be happy, if that's the dynamic she seeks. Prevent her from actualizing her physical and mental needs, and you'll get fucked up property. There are people who do this to those they "love." Its called abuse. And its illegal.

(in reply to HisPet21)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 3:55:27 PM

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quote:

Why put energy into it?

Because Mr Kana on a mission is sexy as all fuck

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RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:00:12 PM

Kana

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HisPet21

quote:

I think he is very right in understanding that a slave or submissive whose needs are not looked after, is not a happy one. Interesting choice of words. "I think." Not "I know." Not "I have experienced." Just, "I think." which implies you are speaking out yo ass, talking smack bout something you have zero personal experience with. It also lets us know that we are talking about an opinion...and we all know what those are worth.Surely, for some the needs *are* to not be allowed any needs... Yeah, like the gal I own and many others on here. but you must wonder how realistic that is No. Not really. Point of fact I never do. Why would I when I can roll over and kiss her or slap her or fucking fist her whenever I want.

With all due respect, Kana, monoPupil has a point. A slave or a submissive whose needs are not met or recognized isn't going to be a happy one. Trust me. If you lock your slave in a trunk for two weeks, feed her through a straw inserted through the keyhole, and leave her to become infected by her own filth, I have my doubts she'll be happy or healthy. There are basics that all human beings NEED in order to remain sane and happy: Food, water, shelter, access to health care. Any submissive denied these basics is either unhappy or mentally damaged. You seem to be equating "completely controlling by slave" with "denying my slave her needs." Those aren't the same thing. You can take away a slave's rights, her freedom, her decision making power and she'll still be happy, if that's the dynamic she seeks. Prevent her from actualizing her physical and mental needs, and you'll get fucked up property. There are people who do this to those they "love." Its called abuse. And its illegal.

Errrrrrr dude. I have a slave because I am a man of sound mind, not some wanker knucklehead who is gonna pull some ridiculous act that's gonna risk her life. That's part of why she chose to serve me, not some other idjit.
I am talking with the idea that we are discussing sane rational adults (Points at his post-notes where he says his slut is such a creature)who make decisions, like most people, based on what fills their needs in the best possible way. You know, basic risk/reward type stuff.

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to HisPet21)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:02:19 PM

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Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HisPet21

quote:

Actually, I agree with Orion. Your approach may work for you, but I know people that have a contracted agreement where there isn't a romance....and they're perfectly happy.

I bet a brand new pony that the submissive in the relationship doesn't sign this "contracted agreement" unless he/she is getting something out of it. In effect, the submissive is getting his/her needs met. I think the main intent of the OP is to explain that you can't just expect a submissive or a slave to bow before you without getting anything in return, without having some of her "needs met." I agree. Even if those needs are feelings of degradation, or physical trauma, or whatever else floats her boat. I'm sure love and affection and feelings aren't necessary for a successful exchange of goods and services between two kinksters who get off on the power exchange, but let's be realistic, at the end of the day, both partners get the f*ck off.

I'll agree to an extent. It's a power exchange which means that both sides should be getting their needs met.

My post was actually referencing this comment:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ohanasvib

It truly begins with a relationship filled with love, respect and TRUST

There is a portion of the community that believes love is not necessary or shouldn't even exist in that type of relationship. Never at any point did I say that these people weren't getting their needs met. I merely pointed out that his view of what those needs are don't apply universally.

You can't throw a formula out there and expect every relationship to fit into it.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to HisPet21)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:07:38 PM

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Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: monoPupil

Can any of you ever give constructive feedback, or all you all just into bashing each other and feeling empowered by doing so???

I think he is very right in understanding that a slave or submissive whose needs are not looked after, is not a happy one. Surely, for some the needs *are* to not be allowed any needs... but you must wonder how realistic that is. For a while, fine, for a lifetime, its just not going to last. If it does, well sorry, I think that's called abuse. Even if the slave "agrees" to that fate, it does not mean it's "fine" and it should be totally acceptable as just a different form of relationship. Pedophiles also believe they mean well for the kids they abuse, and it really doesnt harm them all that much... Just because YOU think its ok, doesn't mean it IS ok!

Well written, Ohanasvib

Hummm... is that what you consider constructive? You sounded rather defensive to me and I do wonder how constructive a position of defensiveness can be. First of all, I don't believe from my take on what the OP stated, that he was looking for constructive criticism. He sounded like he was making some new revelation and teaching from that stand point. I will respond to that after this post. From what I took from what others said, they were pointing out that what works for the OP, may not work for others. I find it interesting when there is an elementary statement made as if it is rocket science, that is a method of what works for them and stating it as if teaching the right way and said to those living their own relationships, whether good or bad... in a manner that could be seen as corrective. Why correct or instruct when there hasn't been anything to bring that statement/correction or instruction and then who the hell asked them?

What you are seeing in my opinion, isn't anything but a response to someone that thought it necessary to come tell other adults how to do things according to what he believed. Whether he is correct in what he was saying or not... why would he think that coming to tell people how it should be, was appropriate or would be appreciated?

Now, had he really had something of great worth to share... the response may have been different. You can't present simplicity as if it is more than simplicity and not get a few... and? or so's or is that so, how about looking at this another way?

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No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!

(in reply to monoPupil)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:15:07 PM

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quote:

There is a portion of the community that believes love is not necessary or shouldn't even exist in that type of relationship. Never at any point did I say that these people weren't getting their needs met. I merely pointed out that his view of what those needs are don't apply universally.

You can't throw a formula out there and expect every relationship to fit into it.

I agree with you. The whole "love thy sub" proclamation was a little strong, but the gist of his post was that those who do not consider the needs of those they are responsible for are *ssholes. I completely agree. I know, I know...we all have an overwhelming urge to haze new posters we aren't familiar with at the slightest indication that they "have opinions we don't like" or, god forbid, are "closed-minded"? *Gasp* The horror!!!!!!!!

The OP over stepped in some ways, but also had some very good points to make. Let's not all jump him at once, or I won't get my kick in.

quote:

I am talking with the idea that we are discussing sane rational adults (Points at his post-notes where he says his slut is such a creature)who make decisions, like most people, based on what fills their needs in the best possible way.

My point exactly. You're assuming that the OP's audience is those who address the needs of their subs. I didn't get that impression at all.The OP seemed to be bashing those who completely neglect their sub's needs and/or think that subs shouldn't have need. Come on. You know as well as I do that the vast majority of profiles on here are written by "idjit's." Give the OP a break.

< Message edited by HisPet21 -- 2/9/2012 4:19:46 PM >

(in reply to Lockit)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:19:40 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ohanasvib

A slave's acceptance, (The pivot point)
As a Master, one may think you grab a woman with a fist full of hair and drive her into submission whether it be sexual or BDSM and she is to perform to unrealistic expectations. The reality could not be farther from the truth... At least foe me.
It truly begins with a relationship filled with love, respect and TRUST, in time, it is the responsibility of the sub/slave to offer her self in service or as possession, I call this the pivotal point of the total power exchange. Newbie Dom/Masters commonly miss this or deny this in haste as a means to .... well you know the rest...
Short term or casual play is one thing BUT, accepting the slave and the responsibility for her also means fulfilling her emotional needs, this is not a small milestone. Before you say, "but she is a slave, she has no rights to feelings.". To you I say Wake up ! Is she less than a dog ?even a dog has feelings, she may be a slave in her heart, she may long to serve but when she is happily and emotionally secure and invested she is then free with the power to serve beyond your dreams and desires. Taking responsibility for her is to accept full responsibility for her heart and happiness. You think you are going to keep an unfulfilled and unhappy woman because you can overpower her? Your life will be miserable because she is. Remember who is in charge and controlling the future. Be a real Master!
Yes domination is a part, but it is equally balanced with important fulfillment of her needs. Will she serve without it? Perhaps, for a while. The question is, "is she serving because it is a part of who she is and overbearing shallow dominance is forced at the time? Or is it love from the depths of her soul. Remember this, when she is in her zone of fulfilled emotional needs you will receive her gifts beyond all expectations. My happiness as Master starts with my responsibility to her for both of us.

Who might I ask you are talking to? You came in as if you were here to argue a point or prove your point with an argument and what you had to say on a whole was rather elementary and situational depending on the adults involved. Whether I can agree with something or all of what you said or not, your presentation of whatever point you were trying to drive home wasn't thought out well, wasn't presented as a full picture and was rather basic for those that do believe in accountability and having a personal relationship that includes love or romantic feelings. You posted this in the master forum with dominants of varying styles, life styles, experience and relationships as if you were talking to newbies or those less informed than you are.

In all... whether I agree or not or live a certain type of relationship, your post was a fail in my book as it wasn't clear, wasn't directed and was so basic I wonder why you felt it so important to announce it as you did.

_____________________________

No matter how old a woman gets, some men will think she was born yesterday! ROFL... I love this place!

(in reply to Ohanasvib)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:43:35 PM

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quote:

The OP over stepped in some ways, but also had some very good points to make.

I'd like to think he's trying to be helpful, but I have to ask myself who was his target audience?

Any "D" type that needs to be told that, most likely isn't going to listen. I would hope that he thinks "s" types are smart enough to know that they have needs and they deserve to have those needs be met.

< Message edited by OsideGirl -- 2/9/2012 4:44:00 PM >

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to HisPet21)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:45:30 PM

MissImmortalPain

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Call it the cynic in me but I'm not sure if you are looking for a discussion or if this is posted in hopes adverising yourself to attract someone that will enjoy this point of view. I will not say if I like the point of view or not, as it has nothing to do with how you live your life. But was there a question? Do you want to know if others agree? Are you trying to teach us something? I wonder because I have to say that this

quote:

It truly begins with a relationship filled with love, respect and TRUST

is not how I have seen it start in most cases. Love has to grow, it is not given from the starting point. Respect and trust both must be earned, and should not be given away freely. To say nothing of the fact that some peoples "needs" are met simply by service. I also have to add(because I'm like that) that though you posted this in ask a master not all subs are female.

*edit* because I forgot an s.

< Message edited by MissImmortalPain -- 2/9/2012 4:54:39 PM >

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It is always by way of pain that we arrive at pleasure.

We must all go through a right of passage,and it must be physical, it must be painful,and it must leave a mark.

(in reply to Ohanasvib)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:48:48 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissImmortalPain

Call it the cynic in me but I'm not sure if you are looking for a discussion or if this is posted in hopes adverising yourself to attract someone that will enjoy this point of view.

He's got the same thing posted in his profile and he's got a pretty dim view on Sado-masochism.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to MissImmortalPain)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:55:11 PM

MissImmortalPain

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Well , maybe that is a part he doesn't see, or isn't attracted to. I don't have an issue with that. I'm just trying to figure out if he is looking for a conversation or not.

_____________________________

It is always by way of pain that we arrive at pleasure.

We must all go through a right of passage,and it must be physical, it must be painful,and it must leave a mark.

(in reply to OsideGirl)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:56:45 PM

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FR

Just going to mention, the OP does have "at least it is for me" (or something like that) in the very beginning of the post. Though I agree it is a bit too flowery for my taste, it seems that the existence of other ways of viewing it all is acknowledged.

(in reply to monoPupil)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 4:57:15 PM

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I dont think so ... he be gone since he posted this.

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The second rule of Fight Club is you do not talk about Fight Club.

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RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 5:03:19 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissImmortalPain

Well , maybe that is a part he doesn't see, or isn't attracted to. I don't have an issue with that. I'm just trying to figure out if he is looking for a conversation or not.

He refers to sadists as "sickos who will beat you without care".

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to MissImmortalPain)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 5:09:08 PM

MissImmortalPain

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Oh, does he now? I didn't look at his profile(don't intend to either) But I know I at least beat people with a great deal of care. He should come back and find out if I care if they like it or if they care if I do

_____________________________

It is always by way of pain that we arrive at pleasure.

We must all go through a right of passage,and it must be physical, it must be painful,and it must leave a mark.

(in reply to OsideGirl)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 5:41:46 PM

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Wow, Deep Breath hyper posters..... why so much bitterness?

Do you really need to prove the macho attitude on, of all things an internet message board? Is that where your happiness comes from, bullying yourself right because your opinion is stronger than anyone who dares to write something?

Kana, Who are you trying to sell on your ALL-MIGHTINESS? It may just me be me but your coming off like an adolescence in some prep school cafeteria with hormones and emotions getting the best of you. The real fact is If you are SOOOO happy and not BS-ing to assist in making your point then GREAT! Make your point without all the drama. Be happy and you will more than likely be looked up to for your heart felt opinion. (That is what your after to help that self esteem issue right?) But pack-ratting with back-benchers (daaa, yea... go tell em Kana...yuk,yuk yuk... LOL) and bullying only makes your case weak and in the best case make you personally look less than the real adult that we really belive you are and not just using your dad's username and password here.

Your Nubie comment is taken as a shot, but it falls short. You see you are a little misguided unless the only thing that counts is 2847 posts in 5 1/2 years on a frigging message board.

I'm not here to claim facts, flame or get involved in petty childish name calling. I gave an opinion. like it or not, it is what it is. My advice to you Kana, reread the original post, stealthy apply a bit here and there....don't worry you don't need to report back and God forbid lose your All-Mightiness, just keep it to your self, You never know, some of your anger may just take care of it's self with the prospect of a happier woman in your life. She is a woman right ?

Take it as a self improvement, That is if your greatness can be improved upon. We see it,,,, really we do.

All the best

(in reply to monoPupil)

RE: The emotional side of Mastership - 2/9/2012 5:47:27 PM

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I do believe this is my first time ever using this smiley. Here goes...

(in reply to Ohanasvib)

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