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RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/3/2012 9:02:48 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

Is it possible for a submissive to also be assertive in other affairs?Its something I am trying to balance.On one hand,I do tend to be naturally submissive.Not just in the bedroom but just my overall personality.More passive,laid back,not afraid of my emotions.However,there are certain situations where I can be assertive.I don't mind taking charge for awhile anyways.I sort of like being alittle more assertive sometimes because I don't like people walking over me like a doormat.However,eventually,I tend back to my submissive nature.Is there a way to balance the 2 in a healthy manner?Or is just naturally being more passive and submissive just make it that much harder to be more assertive?

If you use up your energy being assertive because it goes against your nature, then what's left when you crawl through the front door into your chosen reality with your dominant woman? Just be yourself, dude. A lot of things are situational. Go with the flow and tend your nature.

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to Charles6682)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/4/2012 5:57:54 AM   
ChatteParfaitt


Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

My personal experience is that it takes a very strong willed, disciplined person to be a slave. And thus, it's also been my experience that, with those attributes in mind, many of the very best slaves I've owned and met have been highly assertive in nilla life.
Course, this really shouldn't come as too much of a shock.
Ask any Domme how many powerful crave to crawl...



I so agree with this statement. It takes enormous strength, not to mention trust in YOURSELF, to be a great s-type. It requires knowing who you are and what you need to function at an optimal setting, so to speak.

_____________________________



(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/4/2012 2:27:51 PM   
crazyml


Posts: 5568
Joined: 7/3/2007
Status: offline 		~ FR ~

For me it's not just possible for a sub to be assertive in other domains, it's an essential requirement.

_____________________________

Remember.... There's always somewhere on the planet where it's jackass o'clock.

(in reply to ChatteParfaitt)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/4/2012 3:07:02 PM   
JeffBC


Posts: 5799
Joined: 2/12/2012
From: Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana
My personal experience is that it takes a very strong willed, disciplined person to be a slave.

I might argue that it takes both strength (the ability to get done what you want to get done) and discipline (the ability to do it even when it sucks) in order to accomplish pretty much anything worthwhile in life. Carol, in fact, has both of those things in spades. It's just that her priorities are different than most. So yeah, she normally has a pretty meek demeanor... which is just the way she likes it. She likes to obey me... also just the way she likes it. And, as has been demonstrated to me quite thoroughly, she's more than able to take a stand when something is happening that she doesn't like... say... for instance.... me trying to release her.

I always hear the words "strength" and "discipline" as if they automagically go together with "alpha" or "dominant" and that's just not my experience. What I've seen is that anyone can take any set of personal priorities and bring strength to them.... even if those personal priorities look a lot like "submissive" or "meek" to the rest of the world.


_____________________________

I'm a lover of "what is", not because I'm a spiritual person, but because it hurts when I argue with reality. -- Bryon Katie
"You're humbly arrogant" -- sunshinemiss
officially a member of the K Crowd

(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 3:59:34 AM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana
My personal experience is that it takes a very strong willed, disciplined person to be a slave.

I might argue that it takes both strength (the ability to get done what you want to get done) and discipline (the ability to do it even when it sucks) in order to accomplish pretty much anything worthwhile in life. Carol, in fact, has both of those things in spades. It's just that her priorities are different than most. So yeah, she normally has a pretty meek demeanor... which is just the way she likes it. She likes to obey me... also just the way she likes it. And, as has been demonstrated to me quite thoroughly, she's more than able to take a stand when something is happening that she doesn't like... say... for instance.... me trying to release her.

I always hear the words "strength" and "discipline" as if they automagically go together with "alpha" or "dominant" and that's just not my experience. What I've seen is that anyone can take any set of personal priorities and bring strength to them.... even if those personal priorities look a lot like "submissive" or "meek" to the rest of the world.



Actually, she and I disagree on this point...and have for some time now.

I see what she does as taking strength, commitment, willingness, humility. You know, character.

She says it takes no work, that serving where she feels and is most comfortable in life, and thus, takes no strength and she shouldn't get any credit for doing what comes naturally.

Kinda funny, I think.

I end up all like, Hey, you are great." and her response is always something like, "Who? Me? What did I do?"

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to JeffBC)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 6:15:41 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline 		"thus, (it) takes no strength and she shouldn't get any credit for doing what comes naturally."

Hello Kana,
I would say it takes a great deal of strength to be one's natural self and swim upstream in a river of cultural norms.

Best,
sunshine
*edit - grammar*


< Message edited by sunshinemiss -- 3/5/2012 6:21:58 AM >

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 6:36:30 AM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss

"thus, (it) takes no strength and she shouldn't get any credit for doing what comes naturally."

Hello Kana,
I would say it takes a great deal of strength to be one's natural self and swim upstream in a river of cultural norms.

Best,
sunshine
*edit - grammar*



Hey. I utterly agree.

Look at flaming gay guys.
It takes tons and tons of guts to be yourself in the face of a society that trashes you at every turn...an I don't even wanna think how often they got beat up as kids...yet, they still have the cojones to be who and what they are in spite of that adversity.
I respect the fuck out of folks like that.

Same as I respect her for her commitment, courage, faith, trust, willingness, humility etc...

I was just offering her perspective.
She genuinely doesn't think it's a big deal...and ya know what? She is far from the first slave I've talked with who thinks in such fashion.

Maybe it's part of the slave mentality :-)


_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to sunshinemiss)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 6:43:10 AM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline 		Actually, Kana, I get that in a different way.  I am a tremendously quirky individual (shocking, I know).  And I remember feeling so completely ... alien... when I was growing up.  When I finally got out and about in the "world" I learned that there are scads of people as quirky as I am.  It turns out that I'm rather dull in the world of quirkdom.  :)  But I had to leave. "normal" society.  I've tried to hold it in, tried to not be myself, and it just destroys my spirit and soul.  I couldn't possible stop being true to myself and live to tell about it.  I'm not sure how people do it.

I think this is what you are talking about... that HAFTA do it / be it mentality until the point comes in one's life when we don't even see the stares, hear the heckling. 

Anyway, it's way past my bedtime.

Best wishes to you and yours,
sunshine


_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 6:43:22 AM   
LunaM


Posts: 183
Joined: 3/3/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana
My personal experience is that it takes a very strong willed, disciplined person to be a slave.

I might argue that it takes both strength (the ability to get done what you want to get done) and discipline (the ability to do it even when it sucks) in order to accomplish pretty much anything worthwhile in life. Carol, in fact, has both of those things in spades. It's just that her priorities are different than most. So yeah, she normally has a pretty meek demeanor... which is just the way she likes it. She likes to obey me... also just the way she likes it. And, as has been demonstrated to me quite thoroughly, she's more than able to take a stand when something is happening that she doesn't like... say... for instance.... me trying to release her.

I always hear the words "strength" and "discipline" as if they automagically go together with "alpha" or "dominant" and that's just not my experience. What I've seen is that anyone can take any set of personal priorities and bring strength to them.... even if those personal priorities look a lot like "submissive" or "meek" to the rest of the world.




Agreed but I think Kana was more saying that it does take discipline and strength to be in a slave mentality. Its handing over your mind, body, soul, and heart (in some instances, I'm speaking of romantic relations strictly as I can't speak for non-romantic relations since I am not in one) takes a lot of strength in doing so. Hell even letting someone whip you, tie you up, chain you up, takes discipline not to go into some frenzied state of panic.

_____________________________

~BloodRed's Slave~

~Love is our response to our highest values and can be nothing else~

~And yet she had never felt more totally committed to a will, which was not her own, more totally a slave and more content to be so~

(in reply to JeffBC)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 6:55:26 AM   
NiceButMeanGirl


Posts: 2756
Joined: 11/4/2011
From: Bellingham, WA U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Charles6682

Is it possible for a submissive to also be assertive in other affairs?Its something I am trying to balance.On one hand,I do tend to be naturally submissive.Not just in the bedroom but just my overall personality.More passive,laid back,not afraid of my emotions.However,there are certain situations where I can be assertive.I don't mind taking charge for awhile anyways.I sort of like being alittle more assertive sometimes because I don't like people walking over me like a doormat.However,eventually,I tend back to my submissive nature.Is there a way to balance the 2 in a healthy manner?Or is just naturally being more passive and submissive just make it that much harder to be more assertive?

Of course it's possible. As a matter of fact, I love it when an assertive man gifts his submission to me. It's a very precious thing. Although, someone who is naturally submissive is good too, I prefer someone with a backbone and opinions and ideas of his own over a doormat any day.

Having said all of the above, if you are naturally submissive, why try to change yourself when it's not you? It would waste a lot of time and energy just to be someone you're not, plus it would be frustrating in the end.

NBMG

_____________________________

I'm now SweetlySadistic1 on CollarSpace. NBMG is an old profile, please see my new one.


(in reply to Charles6682)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 7:12:23 AM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		Yes, Master and I always disagree on this issue lol.

He's right in that I don't feel it's a big deal. It comes naturally to me. It could be that in the environment I grew up in was very traditional...man as head of household, woman subservient to her husband. It could also be that my entire life I've been the "different" one. It's something I became accustomed to at a very early age. I can thank my older sisters and brother for that lol. I have a large family. I've also had to overcome many hardships in life that early in life I learned to just say "fuck it" and just be myself. So I never really had all the issues that I hear about when others enter into bdsm. I never had the questions or concerns or worries that I see posted so often by "newbies".

That's not to say I don't struggle sometimes and wonder if I'm not being assertive enough in my life with him. I know he doesn't want a weak slave. But I admit I'm more comfortable not being assertive. Life throws you things though and you have no choice but to be. Oh how I hate it though.


_____________________________

Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

(in reply to NiceButMeanGirl)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 8:19:07 AM   
chatterbox24


Posts: 2182
Joined: 1/22/2012
Status: offline 		Just my dime, but if i was to make a guess....half the fun for a dom is the challenge of breaking in a slave/sub. Once you are in the total YESSUM stage, its just a matter of time you will be replaced in most cases. Does anyone really respect someone like that for real? I am being totally serious here. (no sarcasm lol)

(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 8:22:41 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

Just my dime, but if i was to make a guess....half the fun for a dom is the challenge of breaking in a slave/sub. Once you are in the total YESSUM stage, its just a matter of time you will be replaced in most cases. Does anyone really respect someone like that for real? I am being totally serious here. (no sarcasm lol)


You've guessed incorrectly. And I am being totally serious.

Based upon what I've seen, what a dominant person wants is nearly as varied as dominant persons.

I am at at a point in my life where I don't want to play games. If a woman wants to submit to me, because of the woman I am, fanfuckingtastic. If she wants to play coy games and attempt to lead me on some merry chase, I have no interest.

It has nothing at all to do with respecting her or not. That is a totally different kettle of fish and has nothing to do with submission or lack thereof.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to chatterbox24)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 8:24:51 AM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		I dunno. Master seems quite happy with me being a "Yes Master" type. We both find our lives run much smoother. No arguments, no second guessing, no struggles. Easy as pie lives together. Who wants someone who is gonna fight you all the way?

_____________________________

Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 8:45:19 AM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse
I am at at a point in my life where I don't want to play games. If a woman wants to submit to me, because of the woman I am, fanfuckingtastic. If she wants to play coy games and attempt to lead me on some merry chase, I have no interest.

It has nothing at all to do with respecting her or not. That is a totally different kettle of fish and has nothing to do with submission or lack thereof.


Amen

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 8:50:04 AM   
chatterbox24


Posts: 2182
Joined: 1/22/2012
Status: offline 		WEll remember I am bat shit crazy, but myself I like someone who has some kick, edge, sass, backbone, will argue if they have to............making up is half the fun. But thats me. Not total chaos, but I honest to God find taking your own beliefs and changing them to suit another as really weak. Its cool if people want to do that, takes all kinds, but definitely not my thing. I think after awhile most people are going to explode trying to stuff themselves.

(in reply to littlewonder)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 8:52:55 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

WEll remember I am bat shit crazy, but myself I like someone who has some kick, edge, sass, backbone, will argue if they have to............making up is half the fun. But thats me. Not total chaos, but I honest to God find taking your own beliefs and changing them to suit another as really weak. Its cool if people want to do that, takes all kinds, but definitely not my thing. I think after awhile most people are going to explode trying to stuff themselves.


What I've bolded is not at all what the thread is about. I think most people here fully advocate being authentic to who a person is, regardless of dominant or submissive. You are confusing authentic submission with pretending to be submissive to please another.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to chatterbox24)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 8:58:32 AM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

A submissive has to be submissive for his or her Dominant. And nobody else.


This exactly. Not sure why people have a problem understanding the concept; we are complicated creatures and how you are in one aspect of your life is not the same in all aspects.

(in reply to DarkSteven)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 9:02:21 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

A submissive has to be submissive for his or her Dominant. And nobody else.


This exactly. Not sure why people have a problem understanding the concept; we are complicated creatures and how you are in one aspect of your life is not the same in all aspects.


I don't understand that either. The two most submissive (to me) women I've ever had in my life were to others, the most assertive and non submissive personalities of all. One has been the dominant in all of her other relationships including her most recent.

It's a dynamic between individual people, not always an 'all inclusive' of who a person is outside of that dynamic.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to sexyred1)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Assertive Submissive - 3/5/2012 9:02:33 AM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse


quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

WEll remember I am bat shit crazy, but myself I like someone who has some kick, edge, sass, backbone, will argue if they have to............making up is half the fun. But thats me. Not total chaos, but I honest to God find taking your own beliefs and changing them to suit another as really weak. Its cool if people want to do that, takes all kinds, but definitely not my thing. I think after awhile most people are going to explode trying to stuff themselves.


What I've bolded is not at all what the thread is about. I think most people here fully advocate being authentic to who a person is, regardless of dominant or submissive. You are confusing authentic submission with pretending to be submissive to please another.


This.

I haven't changed myself at all to be with him. He's simply enhanced me for the better.


_____________________________

Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 40
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