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ORIGINAL: Arturas

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ORIGINAL: mnottertail

The self-styled constitutional scholars of the right are an interesting (if extremely uninformed) bunch, ain't they?

Are you asking me? I'm not a scholar but I do know the Consitution and Amercian history as do many Americans. You should read it some time.

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ORIGINAL: Arturas

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ORIGINAL: MusicalBoredom

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Because fifty percent of Americans pay no taxes now.

You do realize that 27% of the population is made up of children and 13% of the population is over 65 right? So this 50% of the population that don't pay taxes that certain groups keep talking about is made up mostly of people who are outside of the generally accepted working age group. I claim my kids as dependents. I pay their taxes. I don't consider them freeloaders.

ETA: Sorry Ron, I just saw you already covered this.

40-50 percent of working age Americans. Nice try.

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ORIGINAL: Arturas

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....the constitution would grew with the nation. If we applied your view point that the constutution is unable to change and it is in fact, set in stone, then we have created 17 amendments that shouldnt be there.

Yes. No.

The original (base) Consitution is set in stone. The amendments do not change the base Constitution. They add things to it that do not conflict with the original base Constitution. These are called the "Bill of Rights" and spell out Rights. Sooooo, one can make amendments to the Consitution but one cannot erase or redefine the Consitution, for example, one cannot change the intent of the orignial Commerce Clause to require Americans to buy something they do not want to buy, but one could extend commerce regulation to future space commerce, to prevent illegal activities in commerce, so the Consitution can "grow" but cannot "change" in meaning.

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

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ORIGINAL: farglebargle
When you buy health insurance you get a tax credit. Am I the only one who sees this?

See, now you're not telling the whole story, here.

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The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

Congress has the power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises. But, only for the enumerated purposes. Congress can't just collect a tax simply because it wants to.
The General Welfare clause was not intended to mean what liberals are claiming, so PPACA isn't a Constitutionally enumerated power of the Federal Government. And, since it's not an enumerated power (nor is it a necessary and proper extension of an enumerated power), the Feds can't lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts, and excises.

The taxing power granted under the Constitution is not limited by the enumerated powers of Art. I Sec 8. and is much broader.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

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ORIGINAL: farglebargle
When you buy health insurance you get a tax credit. Am I the only one who sees this?

See, now you're not telling the whole story, here.

quote:

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

Congress has the power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises. But, only for the enumerated purposes. Congress can't just collect a tax simply because it wants to.
The General Welfare clause was not intended to mean what liberals are claiming, so PPACA isn't a Constitutionally enumerated power of the Federal Government. And, since it's not an enumerated power (nor is it a necessary and proper extension of an enumerated power), the Feds can't lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts, and excises.

The taxing power granted under the Constitution is not limited by the enumerated powers of Art. I Sec 8. and is much broader.

So, you are going to tell me that Congress can lay taxes for anything, on anyone, for any amount, simply if it wants to? Seriously?

If that is the case, you have just showed me how irrelevant your posts are.

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle
When you buy health insurance you get a tax credit. Am I the only one who sees this?

See, now you're not telling the whole story, here.

quote:

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

Congress has the power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises. But, only for the enumerated purposes. Congress can't just collect a tax simply because it wants to.
The General Welfare clause was not intended to mean what liberals are claiming, so PPACA isn't a Constitutionally enumerated power of the Federal Government. And, since it's not an enumerated power (nor is it a necessary and proper extension of an enumerated power), the Feds can't lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts, and excises.

The taxing power granted under the Constitution is not limited by the enumerated powers of Art. I Sec 8. and is much broader.

So, you are going to tell me that Congress can lay taxes for anything, on anyone, for any amount, simply if it wants to? Seriously?

If that is the case, you have just showed me how irrelevant your posts are.

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
The taxing power granted under the Constitution is not limited by the enumerated powers of Art. I Sec 8. and is much broader.

So, you are going to tell me that Congress can lay taxes for anything, on anyone, for any amount, simply if it wants to? Seriously?

If that is the case, you have just showed me how irrelevant your posts are.

Just telling you the current state of the law. If you are serious about learning, let me know and I will provide citations to key cases. The taxes must have a least as part of their purpose raising revenue and must not violate any constitutional prohibition.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

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Is there any limitation on Congress's authority to lay taxes?

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No taxes means property taxes, gas taxes, franchise/excise taxes, sales taxes, state income taxes, alcohol taxes, ammunition taxes, personal property taxes, etc etc.

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ORIGINAL: PatrickG38
It is not limited by the enumerated powers, but it must serve at least a partial revenue function and not violate other prohibitions (a tax on Mormons would violate the First Amendment).

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

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ORIGINAL: erieangel

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No taxes means property taxes, gas taxes, franchise/excise taxes, sales taxes, state income taxes, alcohol taxes, ammunition taxes, personal property taxes, etc etc.

Lets see here. Six years ago, I did not own a house, so I didn't pay property taxes. I was disabled and on SSI so I did not pay income taxes. I don't drink much and six years not at all (couldn't afford to)--no alcohol taxes. Don't own a gun. No personal property worth taxing. Didn't drive (again couldn't afford a car)--no gas taxes.
I did pay sales taxes and taxes on my cigarettes, as I am a smoker. (Yeah, been trying to quit. Even went on Chantix, which messed me up badly.
Today I own my home (free and clear), work full time (but don't make enough to pay federal income taxes, just bought a new car (I drove for 2 weeks on 1/2 tank of gas in my Yaris). My son owns a hunting rifle. So yeah, I'm paying quite a few taxes these days. And honestly, I wish I made enough to pay federal income taxes.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

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ORIGINAL: farglebargle

When you buy health insurance you get a tax credit. Am I the only one who sees this?

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ORIGINAL: erieangel
But I didn't pay property taxes directly and I had more than one landlord lose their property to a sheriff's sale due to unpaid taxes. In truth the only reason I own my home today is because my grandmother gave me the house. But "giving" me the property cost me several thousand dollars, at a time when I was still on SSI. I paid the fees to have my name added to the deed (her name stayed on to save money) then when she died less than a year later, I had to pay inheritance taxes on the full value of the house. As bad as it sounds, if she had held on only 6 weeks longer, there would have been no inheritance taxes. Now I'm faced with a coming bill for another few hundred to have grandma's name taken off the deed. Needless to say, her name is remaining on the deed--I have better things to do with my money than give it to an attorney for something that doesn't really matter all that much unless I someday decide to sell.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

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ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

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ORIGINAL: farglebargle
When you buy health insurance you get a tax credit. Am I the only one who sees this?

Depends on whether you're a corporation.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)