RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion



Message

dcnovice -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/14/2012 7:21:31 PM)

quote:

Honestly, I don't understand why this is so complicated for people to understand.


Tweak may have hit upon an answer in a post on a related thread:

Perhaps more importantly, many straights quite erroneously see straightness as innately and naturally superior to gayness/queerness. This belief is rationalised through an imaginary heterosexual monopoly of reproduction (historically lots of queers have reproduced; today various artificial insemination technologies make this rationalisation even more tenuous)

Gay marriage challenges this assumed superiority - it challenges one of the last remaining bastions of assumed heterosexual superiority and real privilege. Many of these people might tolerate queers, but the thought that they are actually equal in all respects is too much for them to contemplate.




fucktoyprincess -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/14/2012 7:44:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

Honestly, I don't understand why this is so complicated for people to understand.


Tweak may have hit upon an answer in a post on a related thread:

Perhaps more importantly, many straights quite erroneously see straightness as innately and naturally superior to gayness/queerness. This belief is rationalised through an imaginary heterosexual monopoly of reproduction (historically lots of queers have reproduced; today various artificial insemination technologies make this rationalisation even more tenuous)

Gay marriage challenges this assumed superiority - it challenges one of the last remaining bastions of assumed heterosexual superiority and real privilege. Many of these people might tolerate queers, but the thought that they are actually equal in all respects is too much for them to contemplate.




I think this is true. And it is also true for issues of race, ethnicity, gender, etc. The problems associated from these various "groupings" or distinctions is always due to the fact that some individuals feel superior to others because of their membership in a particular group(s). So fundamentally anytime something like that happens, we are dealing with a civil rights issue.

Just as many whites see themselves as superior to blacks (still), and many men see themselves as superior to women (still), etc., basic prejudices and infringements of individual rights generally stem from a belief in superiority.



dcnovice -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/14/2012 9:45:19 PM)

quote:

But the modern insistence that they are an ethnicity, and that their issues are "civil rights" issues is absurd. Whatever these issues are or are not, they are NOT civil rights issues.


I have never heard anyone claim that gays and lesbians are an "ethnicity."

Nor have I heard that civil rights embrace only ethnic concerns. Wasn't the struggle of women to vote a civil rights issue? Wasn't the ability to worship freely a civil rights issue?

Given that the anonymous 'nilla poster seems a little unclear on exactly what civil rights are (except that gays don't get them), may I suggest drawing instead on wise counsel from two folks with some serious civil rights cred:

Coretta Scott King:

"Homophobia is like racism and anti-Semitism and other forms of bigotry in that it seeks to dehumanize a large group of people, to deny their humanity, their dignity and personhood."

"We are all tied together in a single garment of destiny...I can never be what I ought to be until you are allowed to be what you ought to be," she said, quoting her husband. "I've always felt that homophobic attitudes and policies were unjust and unworthy of a free society and must be opposed by all Americans who believe in democracy."

Desmond Tutu:

"This is a matter of ordinary justice. We struggled against apartheid in South Africa, supported by people the world over, because black people were being blamed and made to suffer for something we could do nothing about -- our very skin. It is the same with sexual orientation. It is a given. I could not have fought against the discrimination of apartheid and not also fight against the discrimination that homosexuals endure, even in our churches and faith groups."

"I am proud that in South Africa, when we won the chance to build our own new constitution, the human rights of all have been explicitly enshrined in our laws. My hope is that one day this will be the case all over the world, and that all will have equal rights. For me this struggle is a seamless robe. Opposing apartheid was a matter of justice. Opposing discrimination against women is a matter of justice. Opposing discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation is a matter of justice."








Moonhead -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/15/2012 4:56:10 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
(historically lots of queers have reproduced; today various artificial insemination technologies make this rationalisation even more tenuous)

A lot of lesbians want to have babies, no less than women who don't drink from the furry cup. It's one of the few advantages they have over gay males, as they don't have to adopt. Of course (as Tom Robinson and his Band have pointed out), there's no guarantee that a lesbian couple will be allowed to keep and raise one or the other of their children.
That's something that state recognition of gay marriage would presumably make a lot less troublesome, of course. Naturally though, the naysayers would continue to focus on irrelevant nonsense like church weddings instead of that.



sunshinemiss -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/15/2012 1:13:02 PM)

Sunny
Quote of the Day
goes to
dcnovice

for his response to this question:
What is to be gained by allowing homosexual marriage?


In a word, dignity.*

Some of you have heard this story before, and I apologize for repeating myself. But it's the best answer I know to this question.

In 2006, my Aunt Brenda--witty, wise, wonderful, and amazingly kind to yours truly during some rough patches--died in upstate New York (which had not yet achieved marriage equality). Seconds after she flatlined, a doctor burst into the room, demanding to speak to the next of kin. Brenda's beloved partner, Melanie, who had seen Brenda through an agonizing decline at the hands of a brutal affliction called multiple system atrophy, introduced herself and explained that she held Brenda's power of attorney.

"That expired when she did," the doctor replied. "I need to talk to a member of the family."

I invite any of our eloquent posters on this issue to argue that that would have happened to a legal spouse.

And that's what "homosexual marriage" is all about, Charlie Brown. Being recognized, after years of loving and faithful union and in the most heartbreaking moment of one's life, as "a member of the family."

Edited for typo, alas.



* This one-word answer does not, of course, include the more than a thousand marriage-related rights and privileges conferred by U.S. law.
[/quote]

http://www.collarchat.com/m_4116946/mpage_2/key_/tm.htm#4118078



Just1on1 -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/15/2012 3:29:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Someone needs to tell Reince Priebus."IT'S THE ECONOMY STUPID!!!"


Someone tell Obama.



Moonhead -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/15/2012 3:33:46 PM)

So what's Romney talking about doing to fix the problem?
He's spent most of the last month talking about irrelevent flapdoodle rather than addressing that one.



GotSteel -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/15/2012 3:47:09 PM)

.

[image]local://upfiles/566126/F4AF7090DFAA4991A8875F13E031A00D.gif[/image]



dcnovice -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/15/2012 5:41:52 PM)

Excellent cartoon, Steel! Thanks.



AlexDom3 -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 12:13:37 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML


quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

FR

Coretta Scott King, who was not unfamiliar with the struggle for civil rights, made a 2004 statement that she saw gay marriage as a civil rights issue.

"Gay and lesbian people have families, and their families should have legal protection, whether by marriage or civil union," she said. "A constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriages is a form of gay bashing and it would do nothing at all to protect traditional marriages."

Source: USA Today



Heard it said that the only time we have ever Amended the Constitution to restrict individual liberties was for the Prohibition of alcohol. The 18th? How did that work out? All this while we thought the purpose of the Constitution was to limit government infringement on individual liberty. The small govt GOP is showing us a new but distastful aspect of the role of government, as they did in North Carolina. Quite an amazing time we inhabit [8|]




The 16th amendment is a violation of individual liberty.



SternSkipper -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 2:40:36 PM)

quote:

You should probably read Obamas statement again. I am for civil unions because I believe it is within federal purview under equal protection, don't care one way or another personally whether you call it a marriage or not. I think the 'marriage' part is a states rights issue, although a distinction without a difference.


With all the "Aha" moments the bdsm scene around his place must be a real hoot



SternSkipper -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 2:49:39 PM)

quote:

The 16th amendment is a violation of individual liberty.


Good ... then for your ninth post could you abolish it?
We'd ALL be really impressed... promise [8D]



SternSkipper -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 2:51:18 PM)

quote:

So what's Romney talking about doing to fix the problem?
He's spent most of the last month talking about irrelevent flapdoodle rather than addressing that one.


1000 Points Of BackTurning



SternSkipper -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 2:52:55 PM)

quote:

Sunny
Quote of the Day
goes to
dcnovice


I second that. Sometimes eloquence has it's place in this dump



AlexDom3 -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 4:43:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper

quote:

The 16th amendment is a violation of individual liberty.


Good ... then for your ninth post could you abolish it?
We'd ALL be really impressed... promise [8D]


Done.



SternSkipper -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 5:42:17 PM)

quote:

quote:

The 16th amendment is a violation of individual liberty.



Good ... then for your ninth post could you abolish it?
We'd ALL be really impressed... promise



Done.


Shouldn't I feel different?
[:D]



slvemike4u -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 5:52:53 PM)

Trust me.....you are fucking "different" [:D]



Musicmystery -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/16/2012 7:28:57 PM)

quote:

So what's Romney talking about doing to fix the problem?


"Bush's plan on steroids," the NY Times calls it.

It worked so well the first time...

Justin Fox — the current editorial director of the Harvard Business Review – noted in Time three years ago that Bush “stacks up as probably the least-successful President on the economic front since Herbert Hoover.”

Think Progress’ Pat Garofalo has a good rundown:

After all, under his watch, “growth in investment, GDP, and employment all posted their worst performance of any post-war expansion,” while “overall monthly job growth was the worst of any cycle since at least February 1945, and household income growth was negative for the first cycle since tracking began in 1967.” As the Economic Policy Institute found, “between the end of the 2001 recession (2001Q4) and the peak of that expansion (2007Q4), the U.S. economy experienced the worst economic expansion of the post-war era.”



dcnovice -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/22/2012 6:28:24 PM)

FR

Another perspective from folks with some Civil Rights experience:

quote:

(Miami, Florida) The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People released a resolution on May 19 supporting marriage equality. At a meeting of the 103-year old civil rights group’s board of directors, the organization voted to support marriage equality as a continuation of its historic commitment to equal protection under the law.

Press release and resolution text at NAACP




SternSkipper -> RE: Republican says Same Sex Marriage Isnt Civil Rights Issue (5/22/2012 9:41:41 PM)

quote:

Trust me.....you are fucking "different"


I got one of those whistling painful laughs from this one.



Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy
0.03125