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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 3:30:19 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
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From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

The fact that there was no up was the first choice or freedom taken away.  That has always been my point.



Unless you've embraced Communism at it's most repressive, Ron, that requires some explanation. I was free to take the job when I took it (beating out 40 other guys who showed up to apply/interview for the one opening, as it happened), and free to leave, when I did. Should my employer have been required to create a position to promote me into, when I got bored, and tired of the crazy hours, and insane commutes they needed me to do? I worked. They paid me. That was the deal.

I do something radically different now, and find much more satisfaction in the work. Did the old company need to change the nature of their business, so I could go home feeling like my day had meant something? Or should I have been a good little sheep, and just baaa'd along with my place in the grand order, for another 30 years?




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Profile   Post #: 21
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 3:32:50 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Well, if they wouldnt spend money lobbying and politicizing, and pay the CEO and upper management horrendous salaries and bonuses to fire people and cut corners...... 

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/4/2012 3:34:02 PM >

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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 3:38:00 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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Joined: 8/9/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Well, if they wouldnt spend money lobbying and politicizing, and pay the CEO and upper management horrendous salaries and bonuses to fire people and cut corners...... 


If you took every penny of the lobbyists expenses, the bribes, CEO and all upper management pay out of the equation...your medical premiums would fall by about 3 cents a month.

That ain't where the money is.

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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 3:50:16 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		But that isnt what I am arguing, but if you did that, they could pay the fines for these folks and a hell of a healthcare policy, AND the choice still exists, so equal freedom. 


Buy health insurance, or don't.  Pay the fine, or dont.  Speed or dont.  Work or dont. 
Pay into social security, or dont.  Pay your taxes or dont.   Vote or dont.   

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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 3:56:31 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline 		You left out "do, or don't".

And my personal favorite: "It ain't gonna suck itself ya know!"

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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 4:05:36 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

No, that's not what the goverment (government) states. That's what the PDF document of the bill that was voted on by both sections of Congress (comma) and signed into law by President Obama in 2010. If you actually READ THE BILL, instead of being spoon fed your information, you might know that. And 'no', (what are the quotes for?) its not new legislation, its (it's) been out for over a year now. I seriously wonder if you have it in you to actually read the whole document from begining (beginning...two n's)to end; (comma...a semicolon is inappropriate here) or if your (you're) like most conservatives and just to (too) dumb and ignorant to understand complex and complicated material. Not at all....I'm simply too lazy, but more importantly, I don't give a shit. It makes absolutely zero difference in my life. The 934 page document maybe a bit....dry....to read (ellipses....are unnecessary), it does spell everything out quite clearly ("clearly" is the appropriate choice here...."quite clearly" is quite clearly redundant. Here's how you can always tell: If a word removed doesn't change either the structure of the sentence, or minimize/reduce it's intended point...the extraneous word is redundant {notice how I snuck one in on you there? Did you catch where I said "quite clearly redundant"? That was actually two words that were "redundant" because, as you are no doubt now cognizant of, "redundant" in that sentence stands all on its own. Pretty neat how that all works huh?}). (It) Even sets (specific) dates for ("as to" would have flowed better here, but "for" is acceptable, although slightly errant) when things will happen to give lead times to company (ies) to change business practices without error or issue.

I did however, make one error in the OP:

"Just $285 or 1% of your income in 2014. By 2016, the penalty goes up to $2,085/year or 2.5% of income." In both cases, the greater of the amount between the fixed dollar and percentage is used. So in 2016, if you are making over $40,000/year, you will pay the 2.5%.


(I'm here to help...available 9 - 7 Pacific).

< Message edited by LookieNoNookie -- 7/4/2012 4:49:31 PM >

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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 4:41:09 PM   
TheHeretic


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Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Well, if they wouldnt spend money lobbying and politicizing, and pay the CEO and upper management horrendous salaries and bonuses to fire people and cut corners...... 



No, Ron, my old employer wasn't some vast corporate entity. The boss was the owner, the headquarters is in a loft above the shop floor. He got his start in life with some money in pockets, he saw a need, and built a company that met it. He did well for himself, and while I could easily bitch about some of the ways he did things, the paychecks bore his signature. How does any of that make him responsible for providing me with a path to greater personal fulfillment?

He paid me to show up on time, and do certain things. As time went on, he paid me more, because I did those things quickly and well, and didn't break shit. Later came a nice bump, when I demonstrated I could effectively teach the fundamentals, and guide trainees towards those skills and habits. And that was pretty much the end of what he was going to have for me to do. If I wanted to take my shower in the morning, instead of needing it the minute I got home, I had look outside his gates.

Quite promptly after giving my notice, I received some papers in the mail, letting me know about COBRA, and what it was going to cost. I was free to say, "fuck that," rely on the vets clinic if I needed a prescription for antibiotics, be sure not to break an ankle, and keep that chunk of change available. Lots of people make similar choices, every day. Take away choices, you are taking away liberty.

At least they didn't let them do it under Commerce.

< Message edited by TheHeretic -- 7/4/2012 4:42:15 PM >

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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/4/2012 5:16:02 PM   
Sanity


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Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
Last time I checked 2,085 was thousands

Has that changed?

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

How much will that 'tax' conservatives are now bitching about cost you, the American tax payer?

Just $285 or 1% of your income in 2014. By 2016, the penalty goes up to $2,085/year or 2.5% of income. Thats REALLY what is stated in the ACA. So stop watching all the conservative crap that state you'll be paying thousands of dollars because of this law. Actually, you'll be paying thousands of dollars for NOT having good health care coverage. When your at the ER, with super intensive pain; you'd be amazed at what you'll sign just to have the pain go down. The insurance companies will have you over a barrel at that point. That is not the place to be during your ER visit!







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Profile   Post #: 28
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 2:31:55 AM   
joether


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Joined: 7/24/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Last time I checked 2,085 was thousands

Has that changed?

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

How much will that 'tax' conservatives are now bitching about cost you, the American tax payer?

Just $285 or 1% of your income in 2014. By 2016, the penalty goes up to $2,085/year or 2.5% of income. Thats REALLY what is stated in the ACA. So stop watching all the conservative crap that state you'll be paying thousands of dollars because of this law. Actually, you'll be paying thousands of dollars for NOT having good health care coverage. When your at the ER, with super intensive pain; you'd be amazed at what you'll sign just to have the pain go down. The insurance companies will have you over a barrel at that point. That is not the place to be during your ER visit!



Yes, that number is indeed thousands; you get a cookie. However, which will be less to pay? A) Not getting a health care plan and just paying the penalty? B) 4 days in a typical hospital dealing with a serious health issue? I have witness quite a few whose ego was such that they believed themselves immortal and were struck down within 24 hours with a deadly illness and THEN find themselves up the creek without a paddle. We are not talking flood, fire, or theft insurance for your house. Or ID theft protection for your bank accounts. This is your health and life. As the old saying goes: If you dont have your health, what really do you have?

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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 5:39:34 AM   
GotSteel


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Joined: 2/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie
If you took every penny of the lobbyists expenses, the bribes, CEO and all upper management pay out of the equation...your medical premiums would fall by about 3 cents a month.

That ain't where the money is.


That's an extremely specific number, would you be so kind as to show us where you got it.

(in reply to LookieNoNookie)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 6:18:39 AM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie
If you took every penny of the lobbyists expenses, the bribes, CEO and all upper management pay out of the equation...your medical premiums would fall by about 3 cents a month.

That ain't where the money is.


That's an extremely specific number, would you be so kind as to show us where you got it.


I'm guessing Steel...it was conjecture but I can assure you as a nearly 40 year business person (as in...having been in business nearly 40 years) it's probably fairly close. It wouldn't be all that difficult to validate. Look up what the insurance industry spends their funds on.

I'd bet all of the above mentioned items are far less than 1/4 of 1% of the total cost of insuring a person.

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 10:27:03 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

How much will that 'tax' conservatives are now bitching about cost you, the American tax payer?

Just $285 or 1% of your income in 2014. By 2016, the penalty goes up to $2,085/year or 2.5% of income. Thats REALLY what is stated in the ACA. So stop watching all the conservative crap that state you'll be paying thousands of dollars because of this law. Actually, you'll be paying thousands of dollars for NOT having good health care coverage. When your at the ER, with super intensive pain; you'd be amazed at what you'll sign just to have the pain go down. The insurance companies will have you over a barrel at that point. That is not the place to be during your ER visit!



Do you feel the same way about why the government says we are in the sandbox?

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha......

(Sorry....I stutter on occasion...it's not my fault.....).

"Thats REALLY what is stated in the ACA. "

Well.....if that's what the government has told us....it surely must be true.

Thank you for that. I feel better now about this new legislation.




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Profile   Post #: 32
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 12:54:27 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether

How much will that 'tax' conservatives are now bitching about cost you, the American tax payer?

Just $285 or 1% of your income in 2014. By 2016, the penalty goes up to $2,085/year or 2.5% of income. Thats REALLY what is stated in the ACA. So stop watching all the conservative crap that state you'll be paying thousands of dollars because of this law. Actually, you'll be paying thousands of dollars for NOT having good health care coverage. When your at the ER, with super intensive pain; you'd be amazed at what you'll sign just to have the pain go down. The insurance companies will have you over a barrel at that point. That is not the place to be during your ER visit!


Where does the ACA provide "good health coverage" at? All it does is force the middle class to buy insurance, and the last time I looked, "affordable" insurance was pretty bad... High deductibles, lousy coverage, have you got a link to the actual policy the ACA demands we buy?


Correct, the repubs and the industry won that round...there will be no legally definitive baseline health insurance coverage, only the age and previous illnesses required.

So true to form in my for-profit nirvana, I might take your few hundred a month for years and when it comes time to pay, except for those two instances...I'll still be able to very profitably...refuse you. Don't ya just love...the American way.


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Profile   Post #: 33
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 12:57:15 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie


quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie
If you took every penny of the lobbyists expenses, the bribes, CEO and all upper management pay out of the equation...your medical premiums would fall by about 3 cents a month.

That ain't where the money is.


That's an extremely specific number, would you be so kind as to show us where you got it.


I'm guessing Steel...it was conjecture but I can assure you as a nearly 40 year business person (as in...having been in business nearly 40 years) it's probably fairly close. It wouldn't be all that difficult to validate. Look up what the insurance industry spends their funds on.

I'd bet all of the above mentioned items are far less than 1/4 of 1% of the total cost of insuring a person.

FACT: 30% yes 30 cents of every health insurance dollar goes to attempts not to pay...anything.

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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 3:30:52 PM   
Sanity


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Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
13,000 Pages of Regulations for New ObamaTaxes Drafted...

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/07/lawyers-have-already-drafted-13000-pages-of-regulations-for-new-obamatax-law/






Attachment (1)

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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 3:53:37 PM   
Edwynn


Posts: 4105
Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline
Now we know why you are so jealous and spiteful of the President: he has better teeth than you, by far. You even put up a graphic to point that out.

Quit beating yourself up over it, please.



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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 4:09:50 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		A quote from Rehberg, a world reknown idiot.  No crediblity.  He should be working on the deficit, he don't know what lawyers have done, which lawyers or why its spewing asswipe.

He is pudpounding into his fantasies, much like our friend rushfelches at every drop of a hat.



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RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 5:14:47 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
Speaking of Rush Limbaugh...

quote:


Imagine How the Left Will Use This Dictatorial-Type Power

RUSH: The Democrats asked for a mandate that would allow them to tell us what we have to buy or don't buy -- and penalize us, tax us, whatever. Forget the penalty. Forget the tax. Think about just that.





Attachment (1)

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Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 5:23:41 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		Capt. decisive does it again.....



"Romney switches position on individual mandate"


"Days after the Supreme Court decision on Obamacare, one might think Senator Scott Brown, while checking out a Falmouth, Mass. farmer's market, might be flooded with questions about the ruling.

But most of these folks were happy with a photo and a handshake.

Still, for those following the court decision's political aftermath, there is interest over Brown's position on the individual mandate – especially in light of former Mass. Governor Mitt Romney's stance.

Romney's senior adviser, Eric Fehrnstrom, said Monday that the Governor disagrees with the high court, believing the mandate is a penalty – not a tax.

Yet by Wednesday, while vacationing in New Hampshire, Romney surprised many by saying, "The Supreme Court has spoken and while I agreed with the dissent, that's taken over by the fact that the majority of the court said it's a tax. And therefore it is a tax."

Democrats immediately called it a flip flop – but political analysts say it was a change Romney had to make.

"They don't want to be accused of having raised taxes when he was Governor of Massachusetts," said analyst Peter Ubertaccio. "Because one their primary lines of attack against the White House is that this President has raised taxes repeatedly on the middle class."

Which brings us back to Brown and his position on the mandate."





http://www.necn.com/07/05/12/Romney-switches-position-on-individual-m/landing_newengland.html?blockID=736004&feedID=4212

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: The ACA 'Tax' - 7/5/2012 5:36:20 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Boy, it must be a scary place out there for a knownothing who gets his worldview from rushfelching.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 40
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