RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case

RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 12:36:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl ~FR Ah... no wonder why O'Mata bypassed the SYG hearing... No, the hearing is still planned. http://foxnewsinsider.com/2012/08/14/zimmerman-defense-opts-not-to-use-stand-your-ground-law/ The lawyer for George Zimmerman says his team has decided not to rely on the Stand Your Ground law as a defense. Zimmerman is the self-proclaimed neighborhood watchman who shot and killed teenager Trayvon Martin in February. He is charged with second-degree murder for the death of Martin and prosecutors claim that he profiled Martin and then followed him.

Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 12:37:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro Also remember the some 28 calls Zimmerman made to the police prior to killing Martin were all black suspects, no whites.[;)] Also untrue. True, what gets me is that if the blacks were adult Zimmerman was afraid to go out and confront them, then one was a teenager who Zimmerman was very egar to go out and confront, however, his wife Shellie talked him out of it. It is also interesting that one call to the police by Zimmerman was of a black male going in and out between the building, turned out to be the garbage collector[:D] And there was the one call about the suspicious hispanics and white guy, another call about the white guy calling a disturbance, etc making your claim that all of his calls were about blacks untrue. I did some figuring and that still leaves Zimmerman calling almost 90% on blacks, interesting since Sanford Flordia black population is only about 25% http://www.clrsearch.com/Sanford_Demographics/FL/Population-by-Race-and-Ethnicity[sm=blasted.gif]

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 12:41:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl ~FR Ah... no wonder why O'Mata bypassed the SYG hearing... No, the hearing is still planned. http://foxnewsinsider.com/2012/08/14/zimmerman-defense-opts-not-to-use-stand-your-ground-law/ The lawyer for George Zimmerman says his team has decided not to rely on the Stand Your Ground law as a defense. Zimmerman is the self-proclaimed neighborhood watchman who shot and killed teenager Trayvon Martin in February. He is charged with second-degree murder for the death of Martin and prosecutors claim that he profiled Martin and then followed him. September 29th, O'Mara says in a lecture at a gun convention that they should be ready for the hearing in the Spring. Edit to add: Maybe you're just confused by the terminology; the media and even the others have gotten it wrong. The hearing that O'Mara is planning on has been called a "Stand Your Ground" hearing though O'Mara is trying to change that. O'Mara is seeking a motion to grant immunity under the same statute that grants immunity from SYG. Some are accusing O'Mara of playing semantics games, that 776.012, 776.013 and 776.032 all are correctly identified as SYG statutes, even though O'Mara is insisting it's not a SYG defense while arguing it's a justified homicide per 776.012.

BamaD -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 12:53:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle The 'reasonable doubt' is that the injury was in any way actually threatening, and that George ( once again that evening ) overreacted, but instead of just acting like a total douchebag this time, his overreaction ended up killing an innocent kid. That's the key here. GEORGES PERCEPTIONS AREN'T REASONABLE. What is the root cause of George's unreasonable beliefs? Who cares? It's GEORGE'S RESPONSIBILITY to ensure the medicine he's taking doesn't make him dangerous to the public or whatever. Maybe George isn't guilty due to insanity? FWIW, if I was O'Mara, ( given George's lack of candor with him ) I'd wonder if that's not a better strategy. Lie on your back let someone start beating on you while you are drowning in your own blood then tell us what is reasonable. Stretching that a bit far arent you? Drowning in your own blood? What happens when you are breathing hard and flat on your back with a broken nose? Lots of blood runs down your throat and into your windpipe. Isn't the technicalterm for that drowning in your own blood?

mnottertail -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 12:54:01 PM)
Nope.

tazzygirl -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 1:29:55 PM)
quote: What happens when you are breathing hard and flat on your back with a broken nose? Lots of blood runs down your throat and into your windpipe. Isn't the technicalterm for that drowning in your own blood? No. What happens when that victim stands up with that condition? Blood pours down the front of him. For your theory to be correct, his shirt would have been covered with his own blood.

Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 1:36:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle The 'reasonable doubt' is that the injury was in any way actually threatening, and that George ( once again that evening ) overreacted, but instead of just acting like a total douchebag this time, his overreaction ended up killing an innocent kid. That's the key here. GEORGES PERCEPTIONS AREN'T REASONABLE. What is the root cause of George's unreasonable beliefs? Who cares? It's GEORGE'S RESPONSIBILITY to ensure the medicine he's taking doesn't make him dangerous to the public or whatever. Maybe George isn't guilty due to insanity? FWIW, if I was O'Mara, ( given George's lack of candor with him ) I'd wonder if that's not a better strategy. Lie on your back let someone start beating on you while you are drowning in your own blood then tell us what is reasonable. Stretching that a bit far arent you? Drowning in your own blood? What happens when you are breathing hard and flat on your back with a broken nose? Lots of blood runs down your throat and into your windpipe. Isn't the technicalterm for that drowning in your own blood? You have medical proof that is what happen to Zimmerman....NOPE[:)] In fact the EMT did not report that happening either.... in fact witnesses say Zimmerman was walking around...can you walk and drown at the same time...I don't think so. I will even go as far as to say there is no proof it was blood, no test to prove it...could have been Zimmerman, could have been Martin..(Okay I just got a mental picture of that one[:'(]), could have been road kill, could have been ketcup for all anyone knows.. [sm=flameout.gif]

Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 1:41:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: farglebargle The only person who says that happened is George Zimmerman -- and he has no credibility. There may be some facts which support his story, but again, since he's so out of touch with reality that night he say that Trayvon Martin circled his car and frightened him, and then he GETS OUT OF THE CAR. Reasonable? No. You left out the part where Trayvon was running away and George was asked where he was running before he got out of the car. It's not unreasonable to think that George had no expectation of running face to face with him since he was running away, and even if it was unreasonable, there's nothing illegal about his decision to get out of the car. You have no proof Martin was running....you are spectulating.... If George had a reasonable belief that force was needed to prevent imminent severe bodily injury, then that force was justified; no matter how reasonable it was to get out of the car earlier. I still remember that lawyer "If he (Zimmerman) did not have the gun, he wouldn't have gotten out of his truck"

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 1:42:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I still remember that lawyer "If he (Zimmerman) did not have the gun, he wouldn't have gotten out of his truck" Do you have proof of that? NOPE.

Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 1:48:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I still remember that lawyer "If he (Zimmerman) did not have the gun, he wouldn't have gotten out of his truck" Do you have proof of that? NOPE. The Lawyer was on CNN, we all know Zimmerman carried a gun, or are you saying Zimmerman did not have a gun on him when he got out of his truck, it just magically appeared out of no where on his waist band when he needed it to shot Martin? Oh I am quoting a comment by someone else, you direct your question "Do you have proof of that?" to him, I am just agreeing.

mnottertail -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 1:49:17 PM)
What happens when you are breathing hard You breathe thru your mouth. and flat on your back with a broken nose? (cracked septum at best btw) You breathe thru your mouth. Lots of blood runs down your throat and into your windpipe. Not lots at all, but down your throat till your sinuses swell, and block the flow (about 20 seconds) Isn't the technicalterm for that drowning in your own blood? NOT the way you got it. but you would drown in your own blood if it filled your lungs, which a broken nose wont do. In fact one of the reasons you have to go to a doctor for a broken nose is to insure that it doesent deform your sinuses permanantly, there is buchu pressure in there, but no outlet. (thats the internal part) the external bleeding is due to the multitude of small vessels in the outer parts of your nose, and if you feel in your mouth upper lip where that bit of skin is, under there is the vein that feeds it, and you can suck down on like a wad of toilet papter and stop that blood, (or you can press hard with your finger and you will feel your nose go strange)....

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 1:58:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I still remember that lawyer "If he (Zimmerman) did not have the gun, he wouldn't have gotten out of his truck" Do you have proof of that? NOPE. The Lawyer was on CNN, we all know Zimmerman carried a gun, or are you saying Zimmerman did not have a gun on him when he got out of his truck, it just magically appeared out of no where on his waist band when he needed it to shot Martin? I'm sure you know what it is that you don't have proof of. It's not about whether or not he had the gun; it's about whether that had an effect on him getting out of the car. That lawyer was just speculating, just as you are now. I see no reason to leap to such a conclusion. I see no compelling evidence to indicate that George ever intended or had an expectation of running into Trayvon.

mnottertail -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:00:04 PM)
Yeah, my understanding is he was packing to buy a carton of milk at the grocery store.

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:01:48 PM)
I carry as well when I go to the grocery store. That does not prove I have an intent or expectation to start something when I do.

mnottertail -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:04:53 PM)
Yeah, it proves nothing, until such a time as you do start something. I can't begin to tell you how many times I have had to throw down on a carton of milk. It will have relevance.

Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:08:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I still remember that lawyer "If he (Zimmerman) did not have the gun, he wouldn't have gotten out of his truck" Do you have proof of that? NOPE. The Lawyer was on CNN, we all know Zimmerman carried a gun, or are you saying Zimmerman did not have a gun on him when he got out of his truck, it just magically appeared out of no where on his waist band when he needed it to shot Martin? I'm sure you know what it is that you don't have proof of. It's not about whether or not he had the gun; it's about whether that had an effect on him getting out of the car. That lawyer was just speculating, just as you are now. I see no reason to leap to such a conclusion. I see no compelling evidence to indicate that George ever intended or had an expectation of running into Trayvon. Really? Dispatcher: Are you following him? (meaning Martin) Zimmerman: Yeah Sure sounds like Zimmerman was trying to meet Martin.....

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:09:19 PM)
Of course, there's no proof so far in this case of George "starting anything" beyond simply trying to get police involved. I did much the same once. I saw a guy running out of a Wal-Mart carrying a TV he had just stolen. I stepped out of the building, walked the 40 feet or so to get around the corner to observe where he was running to as I contacted the police to let them know where he ran. Because the guy was running I had no expectation that I would end up running into him; much like I doubt George had that expectation when Trayvon ran.

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:10:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: Nosathro I still remember that lawyer "If he (Zimmerman) did not have the gun, he wouldn't have gotten out of his truck" Do you have proof of that? NOPE. The Lawyer was on CNN, we all know Zimmerman carried a gun, or are you saying Zimmerman did not have a gun on him when he got out of his truck, it just magically appeared out of no where on his waist band when he needed it to shot Martin? I'm sure you know what it is that you don't have proof of. It's not about whether or not he had the gun; it's about whether that had an effect on him getting out of the car. That lawyer was just speculating, just as you are now. I see no reason to leap to such a conclusion. I see no compelling evidence to indicate that George ever intended or had an expectation of running into Trayvon. Really? Dispatcher: Are you following him? (meaning Martin) Zimmerman: Yeah Sure sounds like Zimmerman was trying to meet Martin..... No it doesn't.

Nosathro -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:10:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun I carry as well when I go to the grocery store. That does not prove I have an intent or expectation to start something when I do. You right...it just an ego thing.[;)]

Raiikun -> RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case (10/15/2012 2:12:11 PM)
Wrong again.

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