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RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 11:46:56 AM   
marieToo


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Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: zumala

I suppose I did couch the question in the most severe fashion possible.  It can be awkward to tell someone you can't relocate until you can get a job in their area.  They then wish to know what you do.  If you can't tell them, they may assume that it's not important and that you should get yourself a 'real' job. 
 
I've met the PUSHY who start sarcastically assuming you must be a spy for the government or something if you won't tell them what you do.  I've also met those who wish to assist, but can't because you aren't able to identify what you do.
 
zuma


I have met several men offline that I connected with on CM and on AOL.  I usually take it very very gradually.  I have no problem with my first name, of course.  As far as talking on the phone, I usually call them and block my number, or use my cell phone at first.  Once I start to feel more secure after talking with them, then I gradually loosen up a bit.  Let them have my number etc.  Maybe mention my child's first name in conversation.  But mind you, this is in cases where I have been talking with someone daily on the phone for several weeks and know where they work and have looked them up etc.  As far as my own work, I dont tell them that right off the bat either. I save all of that until we have been talking for a while on the phone.  I usually have a good sixth sense about this type of thing, so its not something I worry about.  Its just something that I proceed with using common sense.  If they get pissed because you dont want to give out all your info right away---too damn bad.  Ive had that happen also, and I just cut them right off.  
After the phone stage, meet them in public. Just do it gradually and trust your gut.  If the person is demanding and not understanding of your need to let the trust evolve, then let them go.  Any sane human being can understand in the world of internet connections, we have to take things just a bit more cautiously.  If they have a problem with that, then I would see that as a red flag.

(in reply to zumala)
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RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 11:57:58 AM   
LadiesBladewing


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Until we've met face-to-face, at least over a cup of coffee, people have a "right" to know exactly what I'm willing to tell them.

I don't share anything that could endanger myself or my family, or jeopardize our well-being. I don't care -who- is asking. He could be Prince Charles, or the head of the FBI... if he or she wants information, they can meet with me in person, show their credentials, and then we'll discuss it. Before then, if I'm not willing to share it, they don't get to know.

Da'Avatar ZWD


www.klashaan.org

_____________________________


"Should have", "could have", "would have" and "can't" may be the most dangerous phrases in the English language.

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(in reply to zumala)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 12:05:13 PM   
Bearlee


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From: South Central CO
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross
Again if you're not even at the stage where either of you can or want to devote time to even visit eachother, then there's no point in discussing relocation.
...
Personally, I don't even consider a relationship with someone until AFTER I meet them offline. 


I couldn't agree more, LA.  By my way of thinking...this is exactly how all those Velcro collars come to be!  <shudder>  I guess if someone ONLY wants an online relationship...perhaps meeting doesn't matter.  But then...why would having personal information about each other matter, either?
 
<no...I did NOT just suggest this was the case with the OP>

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 12:39:45 PM   
Proprietrix


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Frankly, I have no clue if I might even be slightly interested in a relationship with someone until after I have had not just one, but several, face-to-face contacts with that person. Online, I’m probably going to tell very little. At the first contact, I’m going to get a feel for them and decide how much more to tell.

I try to give what I’d expect.
I expect to know a first name, marital status, if they have kids, what they do for a living, what city they live in, whether or not they drink/use drugs, and what their general expectations for us are.
I’m willing to give all of that information in return.

I must add, if I ask a person "So, what do you do for a living?" and I’m met with secrecy, I’m not much inclined to go forward. Especially if I add that I really don’t want to know their employment address, just looking for a job title more than anything, and they continue to be secretive… I don’t know, it just kind of comes off as a bit deceptive or like they have something to hide. I’m really not concerned with whether you’re a stay-at-home mom, a trash man, janitor, doctor, or head of the CIA. But I would like to have some general idea. What one chooses as a career tells me a bit about them. I probably couldn't have a relationship with someone who makes their living off something I'm morally opposed to. If I try to open that conversation and I’m met with "no comment", it’s a red flag to me and I usually walk away without looking back and with no regrets.


_____________________________

IMO, IMHO, YMMV, AFAIK, to me, I see it as, from my perspective, it's been my experience, I only speak for myself, (and all other disclaimers here).

(in reply to zumala)
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RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 12:43:36 PM   
mastersayed


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as much info as you feel safe giving them

(in reply to zumala)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 12:49:06 PM   
zumala


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Proprietrix


Frankly, I have no clue if I might even be slightly interested in a relationship with someone until after I have had not just one, but several, face-to-face contacts with that person. Online, I’m probably going to tell very little. At the first contact, I’m going to get a feel for them and decide how much more to tell.

I try to give what I’d expect.
I expect to know a first name, marital status, if they have kids, what they do for a living, what city they live in, whether or not they drink/use drugs, and what their general expectations for us are.
I’m willing to give all of that information in return.

I must add, if I ask a person "So, what do you do for a living?" and I’m met with secrecy, I’m not much inclined to go forward. Especially if I add that I really don’t want to know their employment address, just looking for a job title more than anything, and they continue to be secretive… I don’t know, it just kind of comes off as a bit deceptive or like they have something to hide. I’m really not concerned with whether you’re a stay-at-home mom, a trash man, janitor, doctor, or head of the CIA. But I would like to have some general idea. What one chooses as a career tells me a bit about them. I probably couldn't have a relationship with someone who makes their living off something I'm morally opposed to. If I try to open that conversation and I’m met with "no comment", it’s a red flag to me and I usually walk away without looking back and with no regrets.



Problem with a job title, Proprietrix, is that it would probably give too much of a clue.  I will simply say that 'government' jobs can be lifestyle sensitive.  Our 'pond' is small enough that any slip to the wrong person could lose us our careers permanently.  No Dom, no matter HOW good they are, is worth that to us.  There'd have to be a lot of relationship built up before they'd hear about the career.
 
zuma

(in reply to Proprietrix)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 12:53:04 PM   
trippingdaisy


Posts: 113
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From: Georgia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: zumala

I will simply say that 'government' jobs can be lifestyle sensitive.  Our 'pond' is small enough that any slip to the wrong person could lose us our careers permanently. 



Question, then...

'I have a job with the government but I can't be more specific than that' sounds like a very reasonable answer to me. Would this not suffice when sharing what you do for a living?

(in reply to zumala)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 1:23:32 PM   
CreativeDominant


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quote:

ORIGINAL: zumala

quote:

ORIGINAL: Proprietrix


Frankly, I have no clue if I might even be slightly interested in a relationship with someone until after I have had not just one, but several, face-to-face contacts with that person. Online, I’m probably going to tell very little. At the first contact, I’m going to get a feel for them and decide how much more to tell.

I try to give what I’d expect.
I expect to know a first name, marital status, if they have kids, what they do for a living, what city they live in, whether or not they drink/use drugs, and what their general expectations for us are.
I’m willing to give all of that information in return.

I must add, if I ask a person "So, what do you do for a living?" and I’m met with secrecy, I’m not much inclined to go forward. Especially if I add that I really don’t want to know their employment address, just looking for a job title more than anything, and they continue to be secretive… I don’t know, it just kind of comes off as a bit deceptive or like they have something to hide. I’m really not concerned with whether you’re a stay-at-home mom, a trash man, janitor, doctor, or head of the CIA. But I would like to have some general idea. What one chooses as a career tells me a bit about them. I probably couldn't have a relationship with someone who makes their living off something I'm morally opposed to. If I try to open that conversation and I’m met with "no comment", it’s a red flag to me and I usually walk away without looking back and with no regrets.



Problem with a job title, Proprietrix, is that it would probably give too much of a clue.  I will simply say that 'government' jobs can be lifestyle sensitive.  Our 'pond' is small enough that any slip to the wrong person could lose us our careers permanently.  No Dom, no matter HOW good they are, is worth that to us.  There'd have to be a lot of relationship built up before they'd hear about the career.
 
zuma


I agree with Tripping (hmmm, as an aside, I do agree with tripping too, but that's something else entirely).  Of course, as others have said, you have the right to disclose what you choose. 

I made the decision several years ago that I had to be willing to risk disclosure because I could see a submissive's point that, I could wait to tell her what I did for a living right up to the point where we were in a relationship, but then, what was to stop her from outing me if the relationship soured?  Good point.  It is either a bunch of one-night stands or take a chance and believe that even when things go wrong, that there is some basic goodness in people...even with the ex NOT being a good example of this, since she did try to out me to as many as she could.

(in reply to zumala)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 1:27:35 PM   
trippingdaisy


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From: Georgia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant

I agree with Tripping (hmmm, as an aside, I do agree with tripping too, but that's something else entirely). 



Haha, that made me laugh. Thank You. LOL

(in reply to CreativeDominant)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 1:30:34 PM   
zumala


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Joined: 6/16/2005
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I don't get the impression that these two are vindictive types.  Both of them are scientifically-minded, so they and I speak a similar language, if you will.  They give good advise the majority of the time, and if we don't agree on an issue (such as a religious viewpoint) that's okay.  We agree to disagree.
 
Still, with the career being such a touchy thing, that info will probably be released much later.
 
zuma

(in reply to CreativeDominant)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 2:04:23 PM   
Proprietrix


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From: Ohio/West Virginia
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I guess I can kind of understand what you’re saying, but I still would find it extremely difficult to build a relationship with someone who is so secretive about their career.

I see this a lot with people online who get their paycheck from public funds. For me (and I’m not saying this is the case with you, just how it tends to come across to me), it’s almost like folks online want to inflate their own ego by saying "I can’t comment. It’s a government job." Like, I’m really a cook for the local head start kids, but I want to feel more important, so I’ll make it out like I work for the secret service. It comes across like being a player and I think to myself, why fuck around with this person. They could have just said "I’m a cook."
"Working for the government" is a very broad term. Government jobs range from city, to county, to state, to federal.
A "government worker" can be a janitor, a bus driver, nurse, physical therapist, judge, clerk, attorney, secretary, receptionist, investigator, dentist, president of the United States, telephone operator, construction worker, agriculture, animals, human services, psychology, and on and on and on….. Saying "I work for the government" tells me no more about one’s chosen career than saying "I don’t work for the government."

Damn near any job can be a government job. All that tells someone is that your paycheck comes from tax money.
I don’t know the exact figures, but I would take a guess that about half of Americans are working "government jobs". If I say "what do you do for a living?" and someone answers "I work for the government." I’m thinking… umm yeah, so does half the population, but I didn’t ask you where the funding for your job comes from. I kind of wanted to know what you do. Are you crunching numbers? Styling hair? Helping people? Saving the whales? Sweeping floors? Icing cakes? Filing papers? On the phone? Modeling your body? Going up in airplanes? Saving lives? Building buildings? Unclogging drains? Selling cars? Putting out fires?
When I ask someone about their job, I’m really not all that concerned with who signs their paycheck, or what their chain of command is. I’m more interested in what they have chosen to do with their life.

Maybe you could give someone a general idea of what you do, without even mentioning the fact that the government issues your paycheck. The secretary for the district attorney could just say he’s a secretary. A prison warden could say he works in security or corrections. A judge could say he works in law, or he’s a mediator, or he works in the courthouse. The fish and game warden can say he works in wildlife or with animals. Even a highly specialized position can be broken down. Maybe you’re the one person in a town of 500 people who specializes in jury selection. At the bare minimum you could say "I help out in criminal cases." or "I work with groups of people." or "I help settle disputes." It’s giving someone a general idea of how you choose to spend your days, without giving the specifics of your employment, and without sending their mind on this wild goose chase of all the 25,000 different types of government jobs.

But, like everything else, it’s left up to you what you do and don’t tell someone. I’m just saying don’t be surprised when people decline to go forward if they feel you’re being too secretive for them or if they feel you are putting on airs to inflate your own ego.

(And none of that was said in anyway against you zumala. I'm just trying to give you the mind-set of someone on the receiving end of the words "I work a government job.")


_____________________________

IMO, IMHO, YMMV, AFAIK, to me, I see it as, from my perspective, it's been my experience, I only speak for myself, (and all other disclaimers here).

(in reply to zumala)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 2:09:52 PM   
zumala


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Federal.  And I don't know how we'd word what he does so that it wouldn't give him away.  Maybe that he works with people.  Me?  I'm a biologist by education.  If I get into my choosen fed career, I'd tell you I was a biologist but I wouldn't say who I worked for.  It's too easy to track someone that way.
 
zuma

< Message edited by zumala -- 6/15/2006 2:11:22 PM >

(in reply to Proprietrix)
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RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 2:37:22 PM   
enigmabrat


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It is very importent to be safe here online and in saying that
you do not give any more infermation here then you would to a person you were getting to know in venilla life
there are guys I got o scgool with that I was interested in and I would never give them my home adress when first talking to them
you have to be even more carfull online you should give no personal info untill you feel safe and know for sure about this person and even then you only give a little at a time they have to right to insist on info Dom or not that would be an abuse of power if a dom aspecaily one you arent a sub to yet to isnist on personal info that may make you unsafe

_____________________________

Leather strap $85.00 on Master card
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(in reply to darkinshadows)
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RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 2:45:26 PM   
KnightofMists


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quote:

ORIGINAL: zumala

When you've met someone that you *think* you might be interested in entering a relationship with, but you haven't actually met them face-to-face yet... what do they have a right to know about you? 


At this stage everything they have is a Privilege.  Don't give more privilege than has been earned.  Give it cheaply and it will be cheaply valued.  Require to high a price and you will have no buyers.  It's a tight rope to walk.... only you can answer it for you!!!

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to zumala)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Right to Know - 6/15/2006 3:22:40 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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I would disclose only what I felt comfortable with to someone. I would give them my first name for sure, I would probably disclose what I did for a living, maybe not where I worked.

When I met the person I am seeing currently we live like 5 hours apart, so I gave him my landline number, and for some reason I just felt comfortable telling him my first and last name (I would not usually do that). I didn't hide my info at all. When we first met before we took our first "date" from over coffee to other places I called and left his license number with two people, one that lives in another state and my own mother. He insisted I do so, and his license plate number too. He wanted to make sure I felt safe... and I was.

But I would trust my intuition about new people, and if I didn't feel safe i wouldn't give them any info. Coffee is really not dangerous, especially in your case seeing your hubby would be with you, right? Two people would be more safe than one.

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to zumala)
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