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Black Boxes in Cars - 12/9/2012 4:43:43 AM

Zonie63

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http://azstarnet.com/news/national/psst-your-car-may-rat-you-out/article_245b471a-7666-538c-99cb-08751e6df165.html

quote:

WASHINGTON - Many motorists don't know it, but it's likely that every time they get behind the wheel, there's a snitch along for the ride.

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration on Friday proposed long-delayed regulations requiring auto manufacturers to include event data recorders - better known as "black boxes" - in all new cars and light trucks beginning Sept. 1, 2014.

But the agency is behind the curve. Automakers have been quietly tucking the devices, which automatically record the actions of drivers and the responses of their vehicles in a continuous information loop, into most new cars for years.

...

The idea is to gather information that can help investigators determine the causes of accidents and lead to safer vehicles. But privacy advocates say government regulators and automakers are spreading an intrusive technology without first putting in place policies to prevent misuse of the information collected.

Data collected by the recorders is increasingly showing up in lawsuits, criminal cases and high-profile accidents.

Massachusetts Lt. Gov. Timothy Murray initially said he wasn't speeding and that he was wearing his seat belt when he crashed a government-owned car last year. But the Ford Crown Victoria's data recorder showed the car was traveling more than 100 mph and Murray wasn't belted in.

In 2007, then-New Jersey Gov. Jon Corzine was seriously injured in the crash of an SUV driven by a state trooper. The SUV's recorder showed the vehicle was traveling 91 mph on a parkway where the speed limit was 65 mph, and Corzine didn't have his seat belt on.

It's extremely difficult for car owners to disable the recorders. A federal requirement that automakers disclose their existence in owner's manuals didn't go into effect until three months ago. Automakers that put recorders in vehicles are also now required to gather a minimum of 15 types of data.

I don't know what bothers me more. A federal mandate to put data recorders in our vehicles, or the fact that automobile companies have been doing it already without being told to and without the knowledge of the consumers.

I thought that big companies didn't like government interference, yet here, they're doing it even before the government tells them to.

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RE: Black Boxes in Cars - 12/9/2012 8:33:55 AM

DomKen

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The manufacturers have been doing it because it protects them from lawsuits. Also it has not been secret.

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RE: Black Boxes in Cars - 12/9/2012 7:56:54 PM

TheHeretic

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The big brother stuff always creeps me out a little, but I don't think this is there yet. How long a loop, and how can it be accessed? If a roadside scanner is telling the local CHP dispatch what I've been up to over the last 100 miles, then yeah, I'm going to see an issue.

Just as a drunk can refuse to blow in the little tube*, vehicle owners should be able to deny access to the information, though. Your car should not be able to testify against you.

*Snarker note: Yes, there are an assortment of exceptions, legal remedies, and penalties associated with refusing to take a BAT, as there should be in the matter at hand here.

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RE: Black Boxes in Cars - 12/10/2012 2:46:14 AM

SadistDave

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I really don't have a problem with these things. But then, I don't drive like an idiot (unless you ask my ex-wife). I find that, for the most part, if you obey the traffic laws and drive sensibly then there is no reason to be concerned about what the car is recording. I find myself wondering why anyone who is driving correctly and following the law should be concerned about privacy and Big Brother. I suppose if you're a maniac behind the wheel, then it could be terribly inconvenient not to be able to lie about your disregard for the law and the lives of innocents in court though. Other than that... unless it can be proven that there is a reasonable degree of inaccuracy in the recordings of these black boxes, or someone can present a reasonable argument detailing how such information could be used for nefarious purposes by the government, I consider it to be a non-issue.

-SD-

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RE: Black Boxes in Cars - 12/10/2012 4:41:00 AM

thishereboi

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I am not concerned about them finding out how I drive but it does bother me that I am going to have to pay more for my next car because of it.

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RE: Black Boxes in Cars - 12/12/2012 10:01:54 AM

graceadieu

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I suppose it depends on what they record? I mean, if they can record what I'm saying in my car, I'd be really bothered by this. And if this is sending some GPS signal or other info to somebody showing where I go, it's a problem.

But if it just records how fast you're going, how sharply you turn, that kind of stuff, and is secret unless you physically take the box out of the car after an accident, than I don't have so much of a problem with that. I guess that could help eliminate the dispute of who's at fault in a car accident, e.g. one car was going straight at 60mph, and the other car was swerving wildly at 100mph. Or one car's engine failed and that's why they drove off the road.

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RE: Black Boxes in Cars - 12/12/2012 11:14:52 AM

Marc2b

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I don't see a civil rights issue here so long as the authorities can't access it without probable cause... that is, without obtaining a warrant.

On a side note: you're wrong about big companies (or any company for that matter) not liking government interference. They actually love it... if such interference works in their favor and against that of the competition.

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RE: Black Boxes in Cars - 12/12/2012 11:23:38 AM

subspaceseven

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I think this falls in with the photo tickets at stop lights...they sold it as way to lower accidents, which turns out is not true, it had no effect on lowering accidents, it simply raised revenue.

There is so much collection of data, now we will have no way of knowing where the information is being sold to or who is using it. Just like the data collected from our cell phones, electronic tollway payments as you drive through, the information is being used in lawsuits, tracking people down, for private matters, not public.

I think this is going to happen no matter what, the Right to Privacy, no longer seems to be a right as long as someone with money wants to collect data on you...so they can make more money

To think the information collected will not be sold is a joke, the first step is to allow the government to collect it, then with a Freedom of Information lawsuit all our data is released.... to the highest corp paymaster... Hell they track you with that Onstar if you pay for the service or not.....it is a pain in the ass to have it turned off, and by turned off I mean disconnected...

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