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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:02:12 PM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

How about having weapons kept under lock and key(under penalty if jail time) to keep the crazies from getting them?Would have workd in this case.


How dare you make sense.

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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:03:25 PM   
OsideGirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

How about having weapons kept under lock and key(under penalty if jail time) to keep the crazies from getting them?Would have workd in this case.


And I doubt any parent is going to be ok w/ a "volunteer" getting near their kids with guns.


A trained and tested and vetted professional guard or off-duty cop ....yes.


Volunteer watch caption George Zimmerman.........?


No fucking way. 


In Israel, the teachers are armed. Since everyone is required to serve in the military, they're trained to use it.


Those teachers are also trained IDF veterans.


Yes, which is exactly what I said.


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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:03:35 PM   
Owner59


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raptorsc

Semi-automatic AR-15s for sale to civilians are internally different from the full automatic M-16, although nearly identical in external appearance. The hammer and trigger mechanisms are of a different design. The bolt carrier and internal lower receiver of semi-automatic versions are milled differently, so that the firing mechanisms are not interchangeable. This was done to satisfy United States Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) requirements that civilian weapons may not be easily convertible to full-automatic

Per your own wikipedia link...

You're 100% right but that doesn't change the fact that the AR-15 and the M16 can be exactly the same gun. What you're saying is some AR-15's made after some point are harder to convert to full automatic. That does nothing to change the fact that the AR-15 is one of the prototypical assault rifles along with the AK. The 5.56N round was developed for use in assault rifles, the weapon itself was designed for military use to fulfill exactly the requirements I listed above. The weapon was designed to kill a lot of people quickly. It has no other use some other firearm cannot fulfill better.


It also doesn`t take but a parts change to make a AR-15 semi into full auto.

Sure it can`t be switched back and forth to semi....but it`s still full auto.

Same thing can be done to a SKS,a semi-SK-47 or to almost any semi-auto-rifle action, with a few file swipes to the right part.

What make the difference is magazine capacity.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 12/17/2012 2:04:26 PM >

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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:04:30 PM   
meatcleaver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Volunteers....I wonder,should such volunteers be armed with assault rifles,I mean the last thing we want is for them to be outgunned in the ensuing gun fights ?


Yep and what if one of the armed volunteers is a psychopath waiting for a switch to be flicked?

You are right, it is amusing that so many people think the cure for violence is more violence.


< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 12/17/2012 2:05:28 PM >

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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:06:31 PM   
OsideGirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

How about having weapons kept under lock and key(under penalty if jail time) to keep the crazies from getting them?Would have workd in this case.


How dare you make sense.


I agree with this.

It's a felony if you have a child in the house....and that child gains access to your weapons and causes harm. I don't see why it should be any different if you have someone in your household that has psychiatric problems.

My weapons are either with me or locked up in the safe. They're not laying around the house where someone else could have access.


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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:10:01 PM   
Owner59


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

How about having weapons kept under lock and key(under penalty if jail time) to keep the crazies from getting them?Would have workd in this case.


How dare you make sense.


I agree with this.

It's a felony if you have a child in the house....and that child gains access to your weapons and causes harm. I don't see why it should be any different if you have someone in your household that has psychiatric problems.

My weapons are either with me or locked up in the safe. They're not laying around the house where someone else could have access.




This, ladies and gentlemen....is what a responsible gun owner looks and sounds like.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 12/17/2012 2:11:04 PM >

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"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

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Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:11:11 PM   
tazzygirl


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Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		There are such people. I have never said there wasnt.

But there are plenty of irresponsible people as well.

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:12:05 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Liar
quote:

The AR-15 was eventually adopted by the United States military under the designation M16


What's not clear to you here? The AR-15 was and is a civilian weapon that the military adapted by adding automatic fire capability. Your claim to the contrary and your claim that "AR-15" is just a civilian designation for the M16 assault rifle are both pure bullshit.

K.

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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:13:37 PM   
Owner59


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

There are such people. I have never said there wasnt.

But there are plenty of irresponsible people as well.



That was a general reply.<muah!>

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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:15:28 PM   
stef


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

It also doesn`t take but a parts change to make a AR-15 semi into full auto.

Not quite. The AR15 and M16/M4 do not use the same lower receiver.



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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:21:32 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

I wonder,should such volunteers be armed with assault rifles,I mean the last thing we want is for them to be outgunned in the ensuing gun fights ?

I wish you'd abandon these "assault rifle" theatrics. The firearms you're on about are no different than any other firearm from the smallest pistol on up that doesn't have to be recycled manually to chamber a fresh round. They are not assault rifles.

K.

Sorry Kirata but your wishes are of no concern to me.
Especially when you are so blatantly wrong.
Could Fridays carnage have been committed if the idiot in question had entered the school with the "smallest pistol" ?
Don't bother answering,it's a rhetorical question.

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Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:23:11 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		I`ve seen a Colt AR-15 converted to full-auto.


Though Im no gun expert....I know what fully automatic looks like.


And when I called the NY state police about the asshole.....they blew me off.


Even with felony convictions and 2 PROs against him by two ex girlfriends.....this guy still has his AR-15 and scads of thirty round clips and was talking about(when we were still speaking)getting one of those nifty roto-mags that hold a hundred rounds.

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"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

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Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:25:30 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

Yeah, but the government definition of assault rifle for the purpose of banning isn't based on whether it is fully auto or not. It's based on the barrel shroud, the telescoping stock and the pistol grip, etc. (Full auto is banned in a lot states already)

Exactly. In other words, whether or not what it chooses to style an "assault rifle" is actually an assault rifle doesn't matter. I mean, we're down the fucking rabbit hole here folks. These people are crazy.

But I don't want to go among crazy people. ~Alice

K.

Finally ,
you and I can agree on something
Though I am quite sure we disagree on just who the crazy people are .

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:30:39 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50

For those of us who don't live in gun-nut heaven, "assault rifle" is a generic term for a general service military weapon. IE, a robust, all conditions weapon designed primarily to kill people.

I tend to think that's the spirit implied by the OP - a weapon purpose-built to kill PEOPLE, en masse.

And you can buy such weapons over the counter in the US??? For better home security, no doubt....

Yikes!



Forget it, Focus. This is an 'Americans Only' thread.

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:32:16 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Okay,I'm walking away again I swear I am...but I just caught a State Rep.from Oregon on CNN suggesting that we arm "volunteers" to protect out schools.That it is too expensive to expect law enforcement to do it,but that local leo's could in fact train and vett these proposed volunteers.


I get the idea that many believe that America does not have a gun problem....that instead what we are facing is a shortage of armed responders.
In other words America does not,currently,have quite enough folks walking around with loaded weapons.


Volunteers....I wonder,should such volunteers be armed with assault rifles,I mean the last thing we want is for them to be outgunned in the ensuing gun fights ?



I quite agree American has a gun problem. I just dont agree with the problem as you think it is.

The problem as I see it, is guns of any kind in our schools, and I dont care if it is a single shot flintlock pistol, target pistol, zip gun, i dont give a fuck what kind of gun it is, I want them kept out of our schools by what ever reasonable and insane means possible.

Put metal detectors and a couple of companies of armed national guard troops in every school in the country. If it works great, if it doesnt, put a battlion in the schools.

I am going to resist the knee jerk reaction I have to this post.....and calmly,calmly ask you if you would please read what you have posted here and tell me(or us) if you can spot the contradiction ?


Oh what the fuck,why run the risk that you can't
On the one hand you make an impassioned plea to keep all guns out of America's school...and than you would enforce this wish by introducing guns to every American school.
In other words you are willing to cut your nose to spite your face...as long as we don't discuss screwing with your ability to buy your next warm toy.
Turning America's schools into armed camps is a small price to pay,eh Jeff ?

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:33:58 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		General reply......


See what the guys says at the end......and switch the word "user" with crazie-killer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRL7hdJkx30

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwlFMqQfKcQ

Question.......why does anyone need to have that much fire power?

Why are companies making these super mags, for civilian sale?

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"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:34:02 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
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From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

I wonder,should such volunteers be armed with assault rifles,I mean the last thing we want is for them to be outgunned in the ensuing gun fights ?

I wish you'd abandon these "assault rifle" theatrics. The firearms you're on about are no different than any other firearm from the smallest pistol on up that doesn't have to be recycled manually to chamber a fresh round. They are not assault rifles.

K.


Yep, way to derail discussion with semantics.

For those of us who don't live in gun-nut heaven, "assault rifle" is a generic term for a general service military weapon. IE, a robust, all conditions weapon designed primarily to kill people.

I tend to think that's the spirit implied by the OP - a weapon purpose-built to kill PEOPLE, en masse.

And you can buy such weapons over the counter in the US??? For better home security, no doubt....

Yikes!

Focus.

I think you understand the op and some of the responders quite well Focus...as a matter of fact you have got things pretty well nailed
Thank you

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to Focus50)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:34:05 PM   
stef


Posts: 10215
Joined: 1/26/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

I`ve seen a Colt AR-15 converted to full-auto.

Even if so, it takes considerably more than dropping a couple of different parts into an AR to accomplish that.

quote:

And when I called the NY state police about the asshole.....they blew me off.

Even with felony convictions and 2 PROs against him by two ex girlfriends.....this guy still has his AR-15 and scads of thirty round clips and was talking about(when we were still speaking)getting one of those nifty roto-mags that hold a hundred rounds.

If he is truly a prohibited person, you should consider calling the ATF instead of the SP. They take these things a little more seriously.

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Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:37:18 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

How about having weapons kept under lock and key(under penalty if jail time) to keep the crazies from getting them?Would have workd in this case.


And I doubt any parent is going to be ok w/ a "volunteer" getting near their kids with guns.


A trained and tested and vetted professional guard or off-duty cop ....yes.


Volunteer watch caption George Zimmerman.........?


No fucking way. 


In Israel, the teachers are armed. Since everyone is required to serve in the military, they're trained to use it.


We don't live in Israel,and we as a country are not surrounded by hostile nations...hence no compulsory military service.
That is nothing more than a red herring...and is not in any way germane to this conversation.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to OsideGirl)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Armed "volunteers" in our schools - 12/17/2012 2:40:27 PM   
Raptorsc


Posts: 35
Joined: 7/20/2012
Status: offline 		They are Magazines... please call them magazines, you guys are making my Drill Seargent roll over in his grave...

Responsible gun ownership is the bottom line people, 30 rounds, 3000 rounds, full auto semi auto bolt action automatic grenade launcher, nuclear warheads... they are all tools, they are inanimate, they do not kill, the USER kills. the USER is what makes it dangerous. When will people stop blaming inanimate objects for their own failings in responsibility?

The definition of assault rifle is PURELY cosmetic. AR doesn't even stand for "assault rifle" it stands for "automatic rifle" defineing it's operation not the fact it fires fully automatic. it automatically chaimbers another round via a gas fed blowback system meaning you dont need to manually chaimber another round after each firing.

Magazine size means ziltch in the grand sceme of things, do you really think you are limited to how many magazines you can carry if you have 10 round or 100 round magazines? this aint a video game man, I can haul around 30 ten rounders just as easily as i can haul around 10 30 rounders. you think stopping to reload is going to be a problem when your targets are frightened people? do you honestly believe smaller magazine sizes are going to save anyone?

It seems to me the media and most public figures are looking at these numbers like 30 and 100 and assault and thinking oh mah gawd so skurry! if only he had 20 less rounds in that "clip" (shudder) or if it wasnt a *gasp* "assault rifle" maybe all those people wouldn't have died! No they would have because he would have reached into his pocket, pulled out another of his completely legal 10 round magazines that you feel "safe" with and killed 10 more people.

The bottom line is his mother should have locked her fire arms up, or gotten rid of them with a depressed child in the home and perhaps payed a little more attention to her kid and did her motherly duties. Its tragic, it's sad, people, children died. but dont blame the equipment blame the useless sacks of genetic material who used it.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 60
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