RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War

RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (Full Version)

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JeffBC -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 9:25:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 I`m also pleased you have hope for us,being that you`re just one more state of the Unites States of America.[;)] Actually, I'm an American citizen so that us included "me". Nor did I mean to say that I was always so acutely aware of reality. In point of fact I wasn't... and I said so... witness my voting for Obama in round 1. My "hope" wasn't meant to sound condescending. It was more akin to "man, I was pretty fucking unaware and I eventually woke up. Maybe enough others will also before it's too late." Nor is it particularly accurate to call Canada "just one more state". Sure, Canada is unwisely following in the US's footsteps but they still have a functioning supreme court here which actually cares about it's constitution which is very different than that of the United States. Culturally Canada is also pretty different than the US.

Moonhead -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 9:35:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead Really? So where were those WMDs, then? You've been whining about being conned into invading Iraq on false information for the last decade, just like the eeevil liberals. Why would you even ask such a stupid question, Moon? And who the fuck do you have me confused with? That was a general "you", not you specifically. No fucker in the Republican party has "owned" the invasion of Iraq, particularly since it's turned into an ongoing waste of effort with no end in site. If you're willing to accept that, then I'm afraid you're in a bit of a minority among the neocon massive. Even the people who engineered the misinformation about WMDs and Al Queda are now complaining that they were misinformed, which looks a bit deceitful after telling various domestic and foreign intelligence agencies exactly what information they were expected to find to justify the invasion, doesn't it?

YN -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 9:36:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: YN The "runup" has been going on since the Anglo-American corporate oil puppet Pahlavi was tossed out in 1979. Well, probably true but that doesn't get Mr. "Yes we can" off the hook. And honestly, in this case I doubt that it has much to do with oil. The US desperately NEEDS to go to war with someone. But we don't want it to be an actual war. Iran is as good a pick as any. Obama is playing just one trick, and the one he was handed to play in this card game. You'll note the EU also has been playing this game, NATO as a group, along with England, France, Israel, the Gulf oil parrots, and several other national players are also after this prize. And it would not have mattered which president the United States elected, nor who was (in theory) the head politicians or rulers of the other parties, for the multinationals would be driving any of the lot towards the goal of liberating Iranian oil. So it is unfair to claim this is the United States game in whole, the EU, Isreal, the Gulf puppet states and more are up to their eyes in this scheme.

Moonhead -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 9:37:34 AM)
Given it's the only game in town, what else are they going to play?

JeffBC -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 9:41:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead Given it's the only game in town, what else are they going to play? Heh... it's the only game in town as long as bankers are running the show. I agree. But that still doesn't make me very forgiving of Obama. In point of fact it's sort of pointless to even ponder what our politicians might want. That thought pattern assumes they are the ones making decisions.

Owner59 -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 9:44:56 AM)
Being unable to read sarcasm...I`m doubting your American`ness...[;)] I`ll also mention that if hussain was in fact part of the 9/11 attacks,I wouldn`t have needed to be bull shitted with bottles of fake white powder or faked intel to be for killing/capturing hussain. Of course I realize that bush would still have bungled it,even if the action was justified.

YN -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 9:50:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead Given it's the only game in town, what else are they going to play? Is it the only game in town? How does British Petroleum getting their Persian oil fief back benefit you or any other English serf? Or any other plebe in the EU? How does this benefit anyone who does not own large blocs of multinational oil company stock in Anglo-America? Do you think any taxpayer in the EU or North America funding this thing will see any return on their investment, save possibly what comes to their door in a body bag? Granted the Israelis and the Arabian oil sheiks would like things going this way, but who else cares?

vincentML -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 10:00:43 AM)
quote: Bullshit. You put words in my mouth that never came from there, and then reversed what I was saying. Maybe they've got different words than "lie," for that, where you hang your hat? What words did I put in your mouth, Rich? What was my LIE, Rich? What did I turn around in your remarks? Show me where you did NOT single out Liberals and OMIT Neocons. And "enjoying their gloat over the dead!" That's disgusting. Good God! Do you really believe that shit? Give me particulars instead of just your usual wounded accusations of being misquoted.[:-] quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic Ten years out, and the dim-witted libbies and leftards are still deluding themselves that their hands are clean of the mess, and enjoying their gloat over the dead. Really? Only Liberals are embarrassed by that travisty? Maybe so. Bush, Cheney, and others on the right still defend what they did. But not all. At least the Repubs had the decency to disinvite W to their convention. Feeling our shame. Care to share in it, Rich? Or just content to point the finger away from the neocons? Yeh, we were conned. But we didn't do the conning. quote: Don't leap to a strawman, that I'm laying the mess all at the liberal's feet, or trying to rehab Bush and Co. Miss the part where I said he exploited the opportunity? Where I said the chances for diplomacy were mighty slim? I hope not, because you cited both. Oh yeh, later. After you realized your original statement was stupid. Are we supposed to read your mind now?

Owner59 -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 10:15:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead Given it's the only game in town, what else are they going to play? Heh... it's the only game in town as long as bankers are running the show. I agree. But that still doesn't make me very forgiving of Obama. In point of fact it's sort of pointless to even ponder what our politicians might want. That thought pattern assumes they are the ones making decisions. He`s not the emperor of America....just say`n.[:D] I`ll also admit that you are partially correct, that all Americans in general share some blame for letting this tragedy happen(the Iraq one,to be exact). It shouldn`t have happened ....and IMHO,wouldn`t have save the 9/11 attacks. If I have any criticism for democrats and Obama....it`s for not going after rice and the rest for their maleficence.

TheHeretic -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 10:34:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML quote: Bullshit. You put words in my mouth that never came from there, and then reversed what I was saying. Maybe they've got different words than "lie," for that, where you hang your hat? What words did I put in your mouth, Rich? What was my LIE, Rich? What did I turn around in your remarks? Show me where you did NOT single out Liberals and OMIT Neocons. And "enjoying their gloat over the dead!" That's disgusting. Good God! Do you really believe that shit? Give me particulars instead of just your usual wounded accusations of being misquoted.[:-] quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic Ten years out, and the dim-witted libbies and leftards are still deluding themselves that their hands are clean of the mess, and enjoying their gloat over the dead. Really? Only Liberals are embarrassed by that travisty? Maybe so. Bush, Cheney, and others on the right still defend what they did. But not all. At least the Repubs had the decency to disinvite W to their convention. Feeling our shame. Care to share in it, Rich? Or just content to point the finger away from the neocons? Yeh, we were conned. But we didn't do the conning. quote: Don't leap to a strawman, that I'm laying the mess all at the liberal's feet, or trying to rehab Bush and Co. Miss the part where I said he exploited the opportunity? Where I said the chances for diplomacy were mighty slim? I hope not, because you cited both. Oh yeh, later. After you realized your original statement was stupid. Are we supposed to read your mind now? Nice bit of quoting, Vince. The colored highlite is helpful. I said liberals think they are blameless, you turned it into, "only liberals are embarassed." I'm working from blame on the Bush administration as a given. He wanted it. He made it happen. And the libs hit all their marks on cue for him.

Owner59 -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 10:39:47 AM)
It`s the guilty conscience that`s always seeking to share blame or shirk it all together..... Adults the though......know better.

JeffBC -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 11:19:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 It`s the guilty conscience that`s always seeking to share blame or shirk it all together..... Uh, you feel no concerns at all about the fact that substantial numbers of democrats voted in favor? Specifically, 40% of the representatives and 58% of senators. Sure, the whole thing was orchestrated with malice aforethought by Bush. But about half the democrats lined right up. Do you really believe they were all duped? If you do, I have a bridge I want to sell you. While we're at it, given that the facts are now well established do you have any thoughts on why we haven't brought the guilty parties to justice?

TheHeretic -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 11:45:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 It`s the guilty conscience that`s always seeking to share blame or shirk it all together..... Uh, you feel no concerns at all about the fact that substantial numbers of democrats voted in favor? Specifically, 40% of the representatives and 58% of senators. None at all, Jeff. They got tricked by the stupid monkey, so all must be forgiven and forgotten.

JeffBC -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 11:47:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic None at all, Jeff. They got tricked by the stupid monkey, so all must be forgiven and forgotten. nods He likes the blue pill. Although honestly it ain't much different than the red pill.

FrostedFlake -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 12:42:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: tweakabelle You're welcome JeffBC. Is the reaction you describe a case of when in doubt, shoot the messenger? [:D] I don't think so. I think it's patriotism taken to a point where it doesn't matter WHAT the US government does or how heinous it's crimes. There are those who will stand behind the government just because it's the government. If you look at the stuff collectively you've got quite a catalog of crimes but god forbid we should expose them because that might harm the state's interests. In the it's a code of morality that places the US flag over anything else. There is a standard method to ensure loyalty to a cause that deserves none. It is, to lead the initiate (that's you) to perform in the name of that cause a reprehensible act. The worse, the better. Then, ever after, the initiate will be unable to question the cause, its leaders or thier orders, without automatically and immediately facing guilt, personal and collective. The greater the guilt, the less likely the initiate is to be willing to face it.

Owner59 -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 1:05:15 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 It`s the guilty conscience that`s always seeking to share blame or shirk it all together..... Uh, you feel no concerns at all about the fact that substantial numbers of democrats voted in favor? Specifically, 40% of the representatives and 58% of senators. Sure, the whole thing was orchestrated with malice aforethought by Bush. But about half the democrats lined right up. Do you really believe they were all duped? If you do, I have a bridge I want to sell you. While we're at it, given that the facts are now well established do you have any thoughts on why we haven't brought the guilty parties to justice? Yes I do believe they and most good people were duped. You seem pretty sure you`re smarter than the average joe and now, after the fact,who knows if you`re just one more full of shit know-it-all? Bashing the victims of a fraud,especially the folks who lost someone in the 9/11 attacks or subsequent Iraq tragedy,though it may inflate your ego,is NOT classy. As for getting justice for the victims.....we have an entire political party(the gop,for the 2 Y/Os)obstructing it.... Just look at how much effort and energy the denialists are put into this.

vincentML -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 1:30:45 PM)
quote: Nice bit of quoting, Vince. The colored highlite is helpful. Always happy to help, Rich. [:)] quote: I said liberals think they are blameless, you turned it into, "only liberals are embarassed." I'm working from blame on the Bush administration as a given. He wanted it. He made it happen. And the libs hit all their marks on cue for him. Sorry. I don't read minds on weekends.

TheHeretic -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 1:58:05 PM)
No need to read minds, Vince. If I could master that one, I'd be making a nice living in the poker rooms. It was there. Maybe you meant, "I don't read well, on the weekends?"

vincentML -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 2:09:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic No need to read minds, Vince. If I could master that one, I'd be making a nice living in the poker rooms. It was there. Maybe you meant, "I don't read well, on the weekends?" Boy, you can't leave it alone can you, Rich? I guess I had trouble interpreting what you didn't write because I was too busy gloating over the dead. Are you proud of that one, Rich? Did I mis-read it? [:'(]

ElChupa -> RE: 10th Anniversary of the Iraq War (3/17/2013 2:10:56 PM)
howz that peace prize winner doing with all this? wadda guy!

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