The Gun Control divide

The Gun Control divide (Full Version)

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[Poll]

I despise you and your poll.

19% (5)

I need a weapon so I can defend my family from others and tyranny.

15% (4)

I need a weapon so I can defend my family from tyranny.

0% (0)

I need a weapon so I can defend my family from others.

0% (0)

I don't need a good reason for owning a gun. It's my right.

26% (7)

Weapon access causes harm, individual rights wins because Constitution

3% (1)

Weapon access causes societal harm which trumps individual rights

26% (7)

Access to weapons does not cause societal harm

7% (2)

Total Votes : 26

(last vote on : 6/19/2016 9:25:06 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )

Message

Awareness -> The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 9:49:21 AM)
The Gun control debate is usually about ends and what it misses are the differing fundamental assumptions that people operate from. This poll is aimed at effectively gaining an idea of the popularity of a few of these various presuppositions. I don't have a specific agenda here, and you may not wish to play along but it might be worth giving it a go. A) Do you effectively believe that free access to weapons is a societal problem which causes harm? If no, then choose option 8 in the poll. Otherwise proceed to the next question. B) Does the individual's right to a weapon trump the harm which the free access of weapons provides? If no, then choose option 7 in the poll. Otherwise proceed to the next question. C) Does your right to a weapon trump societal harm primarily because of the Constitution or for your own reasons? If the Constitution, then choose option 6 in the poll. Otherwise proceed. D) Do you need a justification for having a gun? Or is it your right and all other considerations are irrelevant? If you don't need a justification for owning a gun and it's your right regardless of what else is happening in society, choose option 5. E) Does your right to a gun trump societal harm because you need to defend yourself against your fellow citizens or against the government or both? If citizens choose option 4, if the government, choose option 3, if both, choose option 2. If you despise this poll and the person who made it, choose option 1... but only after choosing one of the other options first.

CreativeDominant -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 10:49:04 AM)
Twisted reasoning, much?

Awareness -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 11:20:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant Twisted reasoning, much? What reasoning? It's a clear cut set of questions to try and get an idea of what principles and beliefs drive people's attitudes towards gun control.

Nnanji -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 11:55:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant Twisted reasoning, much? Ya really. What about Guns are just a tool like any other tool and everyone should have access to one just like a screw driver. Or, In the history of mankind weapons have always been part of life because good people have always realized there are bad people in the world and it wasn't until the advent of facism and socialism that some people realized if they took weapons away from others they could be in control. Or how about, I think it's just normal for guns to be around the house and just like mom taught me not to stick my tongue in a power socket, dad taught me the proper use of a gun as well as how not to misuse it. Or...I can go on.

CreativeDominant -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:06:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant Twisted reasoning, much? What reasoning? It's a clear cut set of questions to try and get an idea of what principles and beliefs drive people's attitudes towards gun control. What reasoning? So, you see none also. Clear cut? Sure is...it's clear to anyone with a brain...even those never reading your prior posts on the subject...that you're anti-gun.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:09:35 PM)
Sorry, but none of the answers provided fits.

Nnanji -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:12:11 PM)
Then make a few of your own like I proposed. [:)]

bossman777 -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:21:56 PM)
Does no one remember the mass shootings in France a couple months ago? Where having any gun is totally illegal? Where the bad guys still managed to get them and use them to kill some 89 people at a music concert? I mean, why on Earth would anyone think that banning them would work to stop such incidents?

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:23:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nnanji Then make a few of your own like I proposed. [:)] Not my poll.

sloguy02246 -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:28:31 PM)
Please don't waste your time - and everyone else's - with polls such as this one. Take a look at just the most recent "gun" threads on this forum. Read all the redundant comments about the pros and cons of owning or being denied ownership of firearms. There is no middle ground. Neither side is willing to budge. Realize that in this forum a reasonable discussion about guns is impossible, no matter what "massacre" might once again have caused a thread to be started. Kudos for trying, but...

Musicmystery -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:33:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness The Gun control debate is usually about ends and what it misses are the differing fundamental assumptions that people operate from. This poll is aimed at effectively gaining an idea of the popularity of a few of these various presuppositions. I don't have a specific agenda here, and you may not wish to play along but it might be worth giving it a go. A) Do you effectively believe that free access to weapons is a societal problem which causes harm? If no, then choose option 8 in the poll. Otherwise proceed to the next question. B) Does the individual's right to a weapon trump the harm which the free access of weapons provides? If no, then choose option 7 in the poll. Otherwise proceed to the next question. C) Does your right to a weapon trump societal harm primarily because of the Constitution or for your own reasons? If the Constitution, then choose option 6 in the poll. Otherwise proceed. D) Do you need a justification for having a gun? Or is it your right and all other considerations are irrelevant? If you don't need a justification for owning a gun and it's your right regardless of what else is happening in society, choose option 5. E) Does your right to a gun trump societal harm because you need to defend yourself against your fellow citizens or against the government or both? If citizens choose option 4, if the government, choose option 3, if both, choose option 2. If you despise this poll and the person who made it, choose option 1... but only after choosing one of the other options first. See, this is not the debate. It's not guns or no guns -- it's what guns, and under what circumstances. This is the debate: [image]http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-i-do-not-believe-in-taking-away-the-right-of-the-citizen-for-sporting-for-hunting-and-ronald-reagan-57-76-62.jpg[/image] Anything else is simply parroting the modern NRA nonsense, in its present day capacity as shill for the gun manufacturers. And it's unnecessary, because the "no restrictions ever" gun-tokers are pretty gullible and will buy whatever special gun/ammo you come up with and tell them is potentially threatened.

Nnanji -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:44:30 PM)
You're going to have to earn better English in order to express your thought if you wish others to understand. You don't even see the falicy of your statements because while you are calling people gullible, you're parroting the koolaide fed you and can't conceive you are the one gullible. It's just a silly statement that you seem to think is wise.

bigjb62 -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:48:10 PM)
[image]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Buu5kj8wl00/UWhQqrywisI/AAAAAAAAsRs/0mjvJ-ifdlw/s640/chicago+gun+control.jpg[/image]

Musicmystery -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:48:22 PM)
Way to dodge all of the points raised! Perhaps a night school class in logic? Sorry if you believe Reagan got it wrong.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:55:29 PM)
FR What I find interesting is how people will say not having fully automatic weapons is not an infringement of the 2nd, but not having semi auto weapons is. I would love to hear the "rationale" for that.

Musicmystery -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 12:59:03 PM)
So you feel Reagan opposed the 2nd Amendment?

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 1:03:27 PM)
quote: So you feel Reagan opposed the 2nd Amendment? Handy hint: Read what you are responding to in context before replying, it will help you maintain the illusion of intellectual superiority you deem so needful.

Musicmystery -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 1:06:32 PM)
Nonsense. I responded specifically to what you wrote. And when caught out, you attacked me instead. There's a contradiction in your views that you've decided to pretend doesn't exist. [sm=dunno.gif][sm=dunno.gif]

Nnanji -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 1:07:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick FR What I find interesting is how people will say not having fully automatic weapons is not an infringement of the 2nd, but not having semi auto weapons is. I would love to hear the "rationale" for that. Personally, I have owned fully automatic weapons and I can assure you that they didn't get up and do drive by shootings on their own with any more alacrity than did my semi-automatic weapons. It's entirely legal to own automatic weapons in the U.S. Well, in the free states of America. For instance California is not a free state and makes automatic weapons illigal. In, I think, 1934 and in 1968 there were major gun laws in the U.S. Part of those laws dealt with destructive devises (bombs, rocket launchers, and what not) and automatic weapons. There is no Federal Law against a machine gun. I don't shoot them because...well...the thrill is gone and keeping them fed is very very expensive. In Free America, all you have to do to own a machine gun is buy a, I think, $200 tax stamp. There is no rational difference between having the right to own either. Many people do and you never hear of those people going on killing sprees. But, just as the Heller case noted, some reasonable regulation is acceptable. So, again I think since 1934 I'll have to look it up, there has been extra regulation on fully automatic weapons that most people just don't want to deal with.

Nnanji -> RE: The Gun Control divide (6/14/2016 1:08:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Nonsense. I responded specifically to what you wrote. And when caught out, you attacked me instead. There's a contradiction in your views that you've decided to pretend doesn't exist. [sm=dunno.gif][sm=dunno.gif] I agree with her. You don't seem to bright.

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