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9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Attacks? - 9/10/2016 8:30:26 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline 		I do not want to discuss any conspiracy theory relative to the towers, pentagon or the downed flight in PA. In this thread, I would like to discuss the possibility that the US government allowed the terrorist attacks on 9-11-2001. I would like to discuss why they would do that, and who would benefit from it. I am fine with speculating, but please, if possible, remain within the realm of reality. I am interested in hearing what people think, mostly for my personal edification.

My personal take on this topic is that it is very possible that the government allowed the attacks to take place. The defense contractors would benefit, the contractors rebuilding the damage after the war would benefit, the oil companies sure benefited. However, aside from the money (most likely the primary reason) why would they do such a thing? So many people died as a result of that day.

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.
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RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 8:42:52 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
Joined: 9/11/2008
Status: offline 		It would possibly also allow government agencies to increase their ideas of security and surveillance of the citizenry; making keeping a closer check on said citizenry's movements etc, that much easier ?

(in reply to Gauge)
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RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:05:00 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline 		sadam hussien was beating the drum to sell oil in euros,
the talahaliban cut the cia out of its source of black ops income
the brits couldnt get their oil pipe to the black sea
the us fucked over the saudi investments



the evidence in the demolition itself, you cant get damn near every floor blowing out debris if not by some kind of explosive or incinderary device and the planes did not have to plant all those explosives.

They simply blew it all to hell.


The fact that the commission report is literally born out of fraud, NIST got busted on many things that they today have redacted.


Pilots for truth have the records and demonstrated how the planes were swtiched, I have that convo somewhere if I can find it I will post it.

I dont think osama bin laden could do that.

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 9/10/2016 9:08:21 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Gauge)
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RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:17:11 PM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

My personal take on this topic is that it is very possible that the government allowed the attacks to take place. The defense contractors would benefit, the contractors rebuilding the damage after the war would benefit, the oil companies sure benefited. However, aside from the money (most likely the primary reason) why would they do such a thing? So many people died as a result of that day.

You give reasons about why they might do that. Just speculations by you. Not much different from the conspiracy theories you correctly condemn imo.

But how was it done? Who was involved? Did GWB or Cheney give the command for the CIA and FBI to stand down? Why would those agencies do that? You have to be careful at this point because you are right on the edge of a new conspiracy theory.

_____________________________

vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

(in reply to Gauge)
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RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:18:03 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge

why would they do such a thing? So many people died as a result of that day.



Why would churchill and eisenhower murder nearly a 1/2 million refugees and civilians in to the tune of less than 14 hours at dresden alone, a defenseless nonmilitary target?


In addition to the problems listed in my first post read this, dubya did.





_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Gauge)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:20:24 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

It would possibly also allow government agencies to increase their ideas of security and surveillance of the citizenry; making keeping a closer check on said citizenry's movements etc, that much easier ?



Yep, the Patriot Act, in it's very name, if you didn't agree with it, you were not a "Patriot".

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to Dvr22999874)
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RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:22:33 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Not much different from the conspiracy theories you correctly condemn imo.





In order to condemn 'CORRECTLY' the conspiracy theories (which many of them today are btw are 'conspiracy FACTS') you first have to the gubmints 'conspiracy theory' is correct, I dont see that from you, so git crakin.

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 9/10/2016 9:23:02 PM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:26:30 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

<snip>



Did you miss the part where I didn't want to discuss anything about the towers, the Pentagon or the downed flight in PA?

Dude, you are not going to suck me into your outlandish conspiracy theories on a thread where I expressed no interest in them.

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:30:05 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

<snip>



Did you miss the part where I didn't want to discuss anything about the towers, the Pentagon or the downed flight in PA?

Dude, you are not going to suck me into your outlandish conspiracy theories on a thread where I expressed no interest in them.



that wasnt a lead in to discuss the towers, its a fact that every one can see and anyone with even a blush of rudimentary knowledge would know that you dont get shoots of debris all the way up the side of a building where there are no holes.

No discussion offered no discussion required. Its a very simple fact. One that proves involvement.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Gauge)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:37:16 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

You give reasons about why they might do that. Just speculations by you. Not much different from the conspiracy theories you correctly condemn imo.

But how was it done? Who was involved? Did GWB or Cheney give the command for the CIA and FBI to stand down? Why would those agencies do that? You have to be careful at this point because you are right on the edge of a new conspiracy theory.


You have a point, however, in my opinion, conspiracy theories kind of go like this:

But anomaly this and anomaly that and speculative this and that PROVE that it was, in fact the anomaly.

Whereas, I am not offering anything as fact. I am clearly speculating, and not professing any factual information. The difference being, all I want are opinions, I am not saying my opinion is factual. I'm inviting speculation... because I want to know why, if at all, some folks could believe the government could do such a thing.

Forgive me but my insomnia, I fear, has made me unclear... have I proffered anything I have said as factual?

Edited to add: The bolded part is not intended as snark. I suffer from insomnia and if I am saying something that is not clear, I want it to be clear.

< Message edited by Gauge -- 9/10/2016 9:46:38 PM >

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:39:51 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

that wasnt a lead in to discuss the towers, its a fact that every one can see and anyone with even a blush of rudimentary knowledge would know that you dont get shoots of debris all the way up the side of a building where there are no holes.

No discussion offered no discussion required. Its a very simple fact. One that proves involvement.


Once more for the cheap seats...

You are discussing the towers. A subject that I asked not be discussed. Was I not completely clear?

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:46:28 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

that wasnt a lead in to discuss the towers, its a fact that every one can see and anyone with even a blush of rudimentary knowledge would know that you dont get shoots of debris all the way up the side of a building where there are no holes.

No discussion offered no discussion required. Its a very simple fact. One that proves involvement.


Once more for the cheap seats...

You are discussing the towers. A subject that I asked not be discussed. Was I not completely clear?


No I am discussing the OP and used a condition of the tower that is impossible wthout government involvement, the tower was the evidence not the claim, as well as the other claims I made.



_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Gauge)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:48:59 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

You give reasons about why they might do that. Just speculations by you. Not much different from the conspiracy theories you correctly condemn imo.

But how was it done? Who was involved? Did GWB or Cheney give the command for the CIA and FBI to stand down? Why would those agencies do that? You have to be careful at this point because you are right on the edge of a new conspiracy theory.


You have a point, however, in my opinion, conspiracy theories kind of go like this:

But anomaly this and anomaly that and speculative this and that PROVE that it was, in fact the anomaly.

Whereas, I am not offering anything as fact. I am clearly speculating, and not professing any factual information. The difference being, all I want are opinions, I am not saying my opinion is factual. I'm inviting speculation... because I want to know why, if at all, some folks could believe the government could do such a thing.

Forgive me but my insomnia, I fear, has made me unclear... have I proffered anything I have said as factual?

Edited to add: The bolded part is not intended as snark. I suffer from insomnia and if I am saying something that is not clear, I want it to be clear.


no facts? then this thread is a total waste of time.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Gauge)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:50:30 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

No I am discussing the OP and used a condition of the tower that is impossible wthout government involvement, the tower was the evidence not the claim, as well as the other claims I made.



I did not want to discuss the towers. What was not clear about that?

You have offered nothing regarding government involvement regarding the attacks sans the towers, the pentagon or the aircraft downed in PA.

Do that, and I will respond to your input. Continue to espouse your rhetoric and I will, once again, refer you to my OP.


_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:52:27 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
Joined: 9/11/2008
Status: offline 		I never really studied the patriot act but it sounds very much like that old saw about, "have you stopped beating your wife ?"............Everything you say is going to be wrong if the questioner wants it to be so.

(in reply to Real0ne)
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RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:53:32 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

no facts? then this thread is a total waste of time.



Then stop wasting my time.

I never asked for speculative 'facts'. I asked, specifically for speculation, not speculations believed to be factual, regarding government involvement... which, if it was not clear, it should be by now.

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:56:11 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
Joined: 9/11/2008
Status: offline 		And I hate to say it, but I am not much of a patriot and would probably be even less of one if somebody tried to force it down my throat with some spurious act of Parliament.

(in reply to Dvr22999874)
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RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:56:34 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

I never really studied the patriot act but it sounds very much like that old saw about, "have you stopped beating your wife ?"............Everything you say is going to be wrong if the questioner wants it to be so.



Would you please clarify your statement?

I would like to understand, with clarity, your post. Again, not snarky... I want to understand your post and I don't.

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to Dvr22999874)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 9:58:34 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

no facts? then this thread is a total waste of time.



Then stop wasting my time.

I never asked for speculative 'facts'. I asked, specifically for speculation, not speculations believed to be factual, regarding government involvement... which, if it was not clear, it should be by now.



dood all the NIST redactions 'IS' a fact, not a speculation, it proves gubmint involvement, but thats ok if you think arguing fantasy speculations has value be my guest.




_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Gauge)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: 9/11: Could the US Government Have Allowed the Atta... - 9/10/2016 10:03:21 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
Joined: 9/11/2008
Status: offline 		Basically, as you said, if you didn't agree with the patriot act, you weren't a patriot. No dissent was allowed. you either answered the way the government wanted you to answer or you were one of the bad guys.

With the wife beating theme............no matter which answer you give, yes or no, you have to be wrong as you are admitting to beating your wife in the past or continuing to beat her now.

I think I would have been classified as one of the bad guys *smile*

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 20
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