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What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philosophy? - 10/23/2016 11:41:57 PM   
sweetblackrose


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Forgive me if this question or similar questions have been asked earlier. I admit I didn't go through all the forums.

What role does race play in Gorean philosophy, if any? I have interest in Gor and I am beginning to learn more about it. I have not read the books. Do the books mention anything at all about race? Is it mandatory for me to read the books before seeking a house to be owned by? Thanks...
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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/24/2016 5:21:02 AM   
WhoreMods


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You'd probably better read at least a few of the books, otherwise you'll find the jargon incomprehensible, along with some of the mindset that's been adopted. It'd be a bit like talking about Jedi and the Sith when you've not seen any of the Star Wars films, and as a quick browse in here will show you, there's a fair few Goreans who take a rather dismissive attitude towards those who don't know the books as well as they do. Most are more reasonable and less anal, but it would be a good idea to at least have some of the basics down.

As for your other question, while "John Norman" does get a lot of flack for his views on politics and gender, I don't think I've seen him accused of racism. This is mainly because the books seem to have an all white cast so don't involve any of the thoroughly unpleasant blather about black or asian people that turns up in a lot of puip era sword and sorcery, and also because the main non-human group (the Priest Kings, and you definitely need to know who they are) are deliberately presented as being alien, rather than an existing ethnic group in a cunning disguise.

(This does make me wonder, I wonder if there'd be a market for an Idiot's/Bluffer's Guide To Gor? I'm sure there's a Tolkein one...)

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/24/2016 6:14:03 AM   
Malkinius


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The only difference race makes in the books is where you are from either on Gor or from Earth. After that...it makes no difference what so ever. If a character is from Schendi they are probably black. If from Torvaldsland, probably white. If they are Panni then Japanese. Most red savages are American Indian just as most of the wagon peoples are Mongolian. The characters are mainly of European or Mederterranian because the main character of the series starts in that area. What city you are from matters more than your race. There is no racial based slavery on Gor as in only one race is enslaved. Any one from any place and of any race ends up as a slave at some time and place. Most slaves are of the same race as their owners.

I don't think that Norman would allow a guide to Gor. In most cases, he doesn't allow other people to do that sort of thing if it is a money making venture without his permission. But who knows...write up a proposal and submit it to his agent. If you have a history of writing such books, they might let you.

Malkinius of Chicago



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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/24/2016 7:20:13 AM   
Bhruic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

...It'd be a bit like talking about Jedi and the Sith when you've not seen any of the Star Wars films...


Very good analogy. It's exactly like that.

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/24/2016 9:20:42 AM   
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That's a relief. I was worried that might sound a bit belittling.

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/24/2016 11:11:02 AM   
Malkinius


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sweetblackrose......

I missed part of your question above and mostly concentrated on the race question which is one that is not asked very much.

The books help you determine whether or not someone you are talking with has a clue what it means to be Gorean. There have been many people claim to be Gorean just to get a slave and then all pretense of it drops. About as many claim to be Gorean just to get a slave as they think, or thought, that it was the easy way to do it and actually get a slave and not a sub who won't obey them. If I seem cynical, I have too many years seeing that happen over and over again. Since Gor is not the "in" thing for getting a slave right now (that seems to be being a DaddyDom) there is less of it. It comes down to....how do you know if someone is telling you the truth about themselves? The real Goreans mostly will. Every one else is up for grabs. The advantage you can have as a potential slave is that YOU can learn to know the difference. 34 books and many of them are 500-800 pages long is not an easy way to start something. Being Gorean is not an easy way to live. We know that those who do not attempt will never make it.

The advice that has been given in this forum over and over is that anyone who says if you are a slave you don't need to read them or only read the "slave POV" view books hasn't read them and is not someone with much of a clue how to train a slave in any case. Start at the beginning and keep reading. There is not only philosophy in the books but romance and some good adventure stories as well as one very long story line that goes from the first book to the current one. They also read much better in sequence as they do refer to previous things in some of the books. The writing reads better too. Remember that this was written by a PhD and professor of philosophy. It is a bit academic and stilted at times.

There are few black or asian Goreans. For whatever reason, I have seen and met very few. The same goes for kajira. I have only met, and worked with, one who wanted to be a kajira. She has read some but not all the books so far. They are out there but just not very common.

When you ask questions of Goreans, you will get answers. You may not always like them, but you will get them. As you have them, ask and they will get answered.

Malkinius of Chicago

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/25/2016 3:35:01 PM   
eliseobeys


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lol

We did used to joke when I was training the first time that reading all the books in order was the crucible of any would be kajira.

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/26/2016 11:21:05 AM   
UllrsIshtar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Do the books mention anything at all about race?


Yes they do. Gor has several different races in several different areas, all with their own culture.

They're various quotes in the books to the effect of (don't have the exact quote on hand so paraphrasing): Goreans don't care much about race, but are very sensitive to city (Home Stone), caste (profession), and language (whether somebody speaks Gorean natively or not).

There's not a single example of racism in the books, and various instances of slaves of a certain race being priced highly in areas where that racial group isn't common (White slaves in the Tahari, Shendi, or the World's End; Black, or Asian slaves in the high cities) because they're considered 'exotic' and rare.

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Is it mandatory for me to read the books before seeking a house to be owned by? Thanks...


Nope. Not at all.
And whether or not you'll be required to read the books after being owned by a Gorean is completely up to the Master in question.
One of my friends has been owned by a Gorean for years, and has never read a single one of the books. He doesn't require her to, and she's not really interested, but he still keeps her as any Gorean would keep a slave girl.

In some ways, not having read the books makes it easier for her, because she didn't enter his collar with any preconceived notions of what it would mean to be his slave. Instead she just obeys him, and he trains her as it pleases him.
She doesn't really need to know the 'why', considering that she obeys the 'what' just as well without knowing why.

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/26/2016 11:24:37 AM   
UllrsIshtar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

This is mainly because the books seem to have an all white cast so don't involve any of the thoroughly unpleasant blather about black or asian people that turns up in a lot of puip era sword and sorcery


Nope.

Gor doesn't have an 'all white cast' at all.
It deals with various ethnic groups, including Middle Eastern, Black, White, Inuit, Mongolian, and Asian... and I'm probably forgetting about a couple. All of these are described of inhabiting their own geographical location, and having their own customs and culture.

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/26/2016 2:37:50 PM   
WhoreMods


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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar


quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

This is mainly because the books seem to have an all white cast so don't involve any of the thoroughly unpleasant blather about black or asian people that turns up in a lot of puip era sword and sorcery


Nope.

Gor doesn't have an 'all white cast' at all.
It deals with various ethnic groups, including Middle Eastern, Black, White, Inuit, Mongolian, and Asian... and I'm probably forgetting about a couple. All of these are described of inhabiting their own geographical location, and having their own customs and culture.

Point taken. I was thinking of the protagonists, who are all white earthlings.

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/26/2016 9:04:40 PM   
UllrsIshtar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods


quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar


quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

This is mainly because the books seem to have an all white cast so don't involve any of the thoroughly unpleasant blather about black or asian people that turns up in a lot of puip era sword and sorcery


Nope.

Gor doesn't have an 'all white cast' at all.
It deals with various ethnic groups, including Middle Eastern, Black, White, Inuit, Mongolian, and Asian... and I'm probably forgetting about a couple. All of these are described of inhabiting their own geographical location, and having their own customs and culture.

Point taken. I was thinking of the protagonists, who are all white earthlings.


Again not true.
While Tarl is white, Talena is described as 'olive-skinned', as is Marlenus. And in each other the books that deals with one of the various described ethnic groups it is always Tarl, along side a main character (for that book or series of books) of the ethnic group in question which share the protagonist role.
It is typical for it to be Tarl + colored-person-important-in-that-geographical-area who are both in the lead, for a good half to third of the series. Where Norman deals with other ethnic groups they always have a prominent role in the story, and there is at least one major character of that ethnic group which gets featured as prominent as Tarl is in the book in question. To claim that the Gor series "don't involve any of the thoroughly unpleasant blather about black or asian people that turns up in a lot of puip era sword and sorcery" is blatantly absurd considering how often Norman features colored people, and the prominence of the roles he gives them. People of color have major parts throughout the series. They always have, but especially in the later books dealing with the Pani.

In addition to that, aside from Tarl and the girls in the leads in the slave girl books, none of the other protagonists are Earthlings.




< Message edited by UllrsIshtar -- 10/26/2016 9:09:10 PM >


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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/26/2016 11:26:44 PM   
sweetblackrose


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Thank you Sir Malkinius and other Masters and Mistresses for your answers. I do agree that reading the books will allow me to know if the Masters and Mistresses I am talking to are truly Gorean or not. So I will definitely in the future read the books. I don't have access to them at the moment, and probably won't for a little while.

Thank you Miss UllrsIshtar for your answers as well. I was very intrigued by your answers. I hope you don't mind if I ask you more questions? I really found your suggestion that reading the books is not required to be interesting and contrary to what I understood. I always thought I couldn't be a true gor slave unless I read the books and understood them. But thinking about what you have written, I agree that at the end of the say, my duty is a slave would be to obey my Master, not necessarily understand why. Would it be accurate to say that not all Goran Masters may follow all the same rules from the book? I am assuming they may have their own rules, but follow the Gorean philosophy, so in a way it helps if I don't read the books. That way they can teach me their way, and I don't have preconceived notion regarding expectations of what I read in the books.

Regarding race: What if an Inuit or a black Master came to live in a city among white masters, would that black or Inuit Master be looked at differently if he were to desire to own white slaves? Based on what you have written I am assuming that for the most part each races live in different cities, except few scattered slaves of different races in each cities. Is that accurate assumption? Also in the current time, are their any benefits of owning slaves of different ethnic backgrounds by mostly white (as there are mostly white masters practicing gor) masters?

Also, what if I as a slave own a property (house for example), would I be giving that up once I am owned by my Master/Mistress?

Also I just want to point out to all the Masters and Mistresses here to please correct me if I am not using proper terminologies or if I am not being respectful enough. I am the student here, and I wish to respect all those I learn from. I have simply always been fascinated by Gorean philosophy and I see myself in a Gorean house some day, but I am just starting now to learn more about it.


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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/27/2016 12:38:28 AM   
Malkinius


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sweetblackrose.....

Ishtar is very right if you have someone you are or have decided to submit to. If you want to know who knows what they are talking about, that is where the books come in. Otherwise help in identifying real from fake, and there are many many fakes out there, would need to rest on someone else besides yourself.

What does a slave give up when she becomes a slave? That depends. The biggest thing she gives up is her time. You now do things when your Master wants them done. That when might be by next Tuesday or two minutes from now, but if they have a choice, it is their choice, not yours. If they do not choose to do something or make something happen by a specific time, that is their choice. So yes, if you were my slave and I held out my mug and said, "coffee," I would not care what you are doing right then. You take the mug, fill it with coffee as I like it, bring it back and give or serve it to me. That doesn't mean you can't have a few seconds to put something down or prevent something from coming to harm by not being there. I am not stupid about this. But as quickly as you can is what I want even if you have to make a new pot of coffee. Coffee is, as I usually say, my most common command to a slave. <grins> What else you give up is what else your owner wishes you to give up. If you own a home, he could have you sell it, or he could move into it with you or leave it empty or something else. When you are dealing with real property like a car, house, investments, children, etc., it is always best to work out ahead of time what a prospective owner wants to do or you to do with them. That is something which will help you decide if you wish them as an owner or not.

What you can not give up is your legal rights under the law. However, you can decline to enforce them or some of them against your Master. He can decline to have you do so. It all comes down to the people involved. How much do you want to give up and how much are you willing to give up to be someone's slave? How much of you does he wish to control now and in the future? What will he do with his property? What do you want him to do with you?

All of the Goreans I know would not care what the race of someone was if they wanted to be Gorean. The only questions would be, have you read the books and how many, what do you know and why do you want to be a part of our group? We will not shy away from mentioning someone's race but it is to identify them to others if needed. We care about the person inside the skin. That is Gorean philosophy for you. Why should I care what race someone else has as a slave? I don't care what race I have as a slave. But the idea of having one of each major racial group at the same time.......interesting. <grins>

You are doing pretty well so far. You are asking intelligent questions and responding properly. It is just that some of your questions have been asked before and some times many times before.

Malkinius of Chicago

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/27/2016 12:58:05 AM   
UllrsIshtar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

I really found your suggestion that reading the books is not required to be interesting and contrary to what I understood. I always thought I couldn't be a true gor slave unless I read the books and understood them. But thinking about what you have written, I agree that at the end of the say, my duty is a slave would be to obey my Master, not necessarily understand why.


Whether or not it would be required depends entirely on the Master in question. It is certainly not a requirement to become owned by a Gorean that you would have first read the books though. Many Goreans would collar a slave they found pleasing even if she had never even heard of Gor, if they were convinced that she'd be a good fit for their households.
My slave had never heard of Gor before she begged her collar, neither had my friend who I spoke of in my earlier post.
However, I'm requiring my slave to now read the books because I think it will help her grow in her collar; my friend's Master never required her to read them because he didn't deem it necessary, or helpful with her. Instead he's having her learn how to pole dance.
Apparently that pleases him more than having her spend all those hours reading. *grins*


It totally depends on the whim of the owner, what he wants from the slave, and how reading the books may help him get that from her.
Reading the Gor books won't make you a better kajira.
In the end, the only thing that will make you a better kajira is the quality of training you receive from the person who owns you.
If that training is lacking, you'll never be a slave that other men feel envious to own, no matter how many books you read. If you get that quality training, you will become a dream of service and pleasure in ways you cannot even imagine, without needing to ever read a single word to get there.

For some slaves it helps to read the books, because they train easier if they understand the 'why', my slave being an example of that. However, reading the books will not teach you how to be a slave -only your owner can do that. The only thing will do is give you the 'why' on why your owner might train you a certain way, but not another way... and it will probably also cause you to feel at least a little bit uneasy, and maybe even resentful, any time he decided to do something differently with you than what is done in the books, and you personally deem that the book way is better than whatever it is he's doing.

Even though my slave had never heard of Gor before she got collared, now that she's a few books in, I'm already sometimes getting a "But Mistress, kajirae are supposed to X.". To which my standard reply is: "Are you owned by John Norman or by me?".

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Would it be accurate to say that not all Goran Masters may follow all the same rules from the book?



If he's a Gorean man, he won't give a hoot about any of what the books say on the treatment of slaves, and will do as he pleases.
If he's set on treating a slave exactly as the books describe the slaves are treated because that's what the books say he should do, then he's not a Gorean man.

Goreans consider slaves as livestock. Chattel. Owned property. No different from a valued pet dog really...
They don't consider them to be "a person who has decided to agree to act like a slave would act" like most of the BDSM crowd does.
Because of that, they will treat their slaves exactly as they want to treat them. They're not copying the way slaves in the books are treated because "that's what you're supposed to do" any more than a dog owner would copy the way Lassie was treated just because they're a fan of the movie.

That being said, most Goreans will have a fair bit of customs from the books mirrored in how they treat their slaves, but not because the books say that this is the way it's supposed to be, but instead because they find it a beautiful, pleasing thing to do with their slaves.
Kneeling in nadu is a classic example that you can find in any Gorean household I know of.

However, in the end, if he's Gorean, the only thing that you can count on is that he's see you as an actual piece of owned property. A different class of human being than himself. Not as an "equal human being who has decided for the time to act as a slave would" but as an actual slave. Everything else is subject to his whim.


quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Based on what you have written I am assuming that for the most part each races live in different cities, except few scattered slaves of different races in each cities. Is that accurate assumption?



Yes that's correct.

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Regarding race: What if an Inuit or a black Master came to live in a city among white masters, would that black or Inuit Master be looked at differently if he were to desire to own white slaves?



While Goreans travel -and sometimes extensively so- it would be unusual for a Gorean to permanently go live in another city, due to various cultural reasons having to do with Home Stones.
That being said, in the situation you describe, Goreans wouldn't care what color a man's skin was, and what color the skin of his slaves were. The way Norman describes Gor, skin color isn't really noticed by Goreans any more than we notice each other's eye color.
So for a Gorean your question would be the same if you asked if a man with blue eyes would be looked on differently if he decided to own a slave with brown eyes: it just doesn't matter what the color of the eyes/skin is to Goreans. What matters is their language, culture, city, caste, etc.

Goreans on Earth I can't speak for, other than that I've never met a Gorean who has said anything even remotely indicating that skin color would be an issue for them.


quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Also in the current time, are their any benefits of owning slaves of different ethnic backgrounds by mostly white (as there are mostly white masters practicing gor) masters?



There are no benefits that I know of. Neither are there drawbacks as far as I'm aware. But I haven't given it much thought either way.


quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Also, what if I as a slave own a property (house for example), would I be giving that up once I am owned by my Master/Mistress?


It depends entirely on the Master.
Goreans in the books hold that slaves cannot own property, as they are themselves owned.
Goreans on Earth handle matters financially however they seem fit to do. The girl I spoke about before signed over all her possessions to her Master and legally owns nothing at the moment. With my own slave it was the same. She owns nothing at the moment. What little she had before begging her collar she transferred to us when it was granted.
However, I know other men who have allowed their slaves to -legally and in name at least- hold tittles to property, and even have their own bank accounts, etc.

< Message edited by UllrsIshtar -- 10/27/2016 1:07:45 AM >


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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/27/2016 1:05:26 AM   
UllrsIshtar


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Malkinius
But the idea of having one of each major racial group at the same time.......interesting. <grins>


That's such a thing with you men:

I want one of each. One with big tits, and little tits, and medium tits, and a blond one, and a red hair, and a brunette, and one of every skin color imaginable, and every eye color, and ...

When are you men finally going to learn that the increase in headaches doesn't add up, but squares, everything you add another woman to your home?

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 10/27/2016 7:06:37 AM   
Malkinius


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Ishtar......
I had four at once in house for about two months. I learned that lesson the hard way. You are right about the headaches and how fast it adds up. That doesn't make certain thoughts.....interesting. <grins> It just means that I am not stupid enough to actually do it....or do it on a long term basis. Now...I might relent for a weekend. I think they could last that long. <evil grin>

Malkinius of Chicago

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RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 11/1/2016 2:02:54 PM   
sweetblackrose


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quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

I really found your suggestion that reading the books is not required to be interesting and contrary to what I understood. I always thought I couldn't be a true gor slave unless I read the books and understood them. But thinking about what you have written, I agree that at the end of the say, my duty is a slave would be to obey my Master, not necessarily understand why.


Whether or not it would be required depends entirely on the Master in question. It is certainly not a requirement to become owned by a Gorean that you would have first read the books though. Many Goreans would collar a slave they found pleasing even if she had never even heard of Gor, if they were convinced that she'd be a good fit for their households.
My slave had never heard of Gor before she begged her collar, neither had my friend who I spoke of in my earlier post.
However, I'm requiring my slave to now read the books because I think it will help her grow in her collar; my friend's Master never required her to read them because he didn't deem it necessary, or helpful with her. Instead he's having her learn how to pole dance.
Apparently that pleases him more than having her spend all those hours reading. *grins*


It totally depends on the whim of the owner, what he wants from the slave, and how reading the books may help him get that from her.
Reading the Gor books won't make you a better kajira.
In the end, the only thing that will make you a better kajira is the quality of training you receive from the person who owns you.
If that training is lacking, you'll never be a slave that other men feel envious to own, no matter how many books you read. If you get that quality training, you will become a dream of service and pleasure in ways you cannot even imagine, without needing to ever read a single word to get there.

For some slaves it helps to read the books, because they train easier if they understand the 'why', my slave being an example of that. However, reading the books will not teach you how to be a slave -only your owner can do that. The only thing will do is give you the 'why' on why your owner might train you a certain way, but not another way... and it will probably also cause you to feel at least a little bit uneasy, and maybe even resentful, any time he decided to do something differently with you than what is done in the books, and you personally deem that the book way is better than whatever it is he's doing.

Even though my slave had never heard of Gor before she got collared, now that she's a few books in, I'm already sometimes getting a "But Mistress, kajirae are supposed to X.". To which my standard reply is: "Are you owned by John Norman or by me?".

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Would it be accurate to say that not all Goran Masters may follow all the same rules from the book?



If he's a Gorean man, he won't give a hoot about any of what the books say on the treatment of slaves, and will do as he pleases.
If he's set on treating a slave exactly as the books describe the slaves are treated because that's what the books say he should do, then he's not a Gorean man.

Goreans consider slaves as livestock. Chattel. Owned property. No different from a valued pet dog really...
They don't consider them to be "a person who has decided to agree to act like a slave would act" like most of the BDSM crowd does.
Because of that, they will treat their slaves exactly as they want to treat them. They're not copying the way slaves in the books are treated because "that's what you're supposed to do" any more than a dog owner would copy the way Lassie was treated just because they're a fan of the movie.

That being said, most Goreans will have a fair bit of customs from the books mirrored in how they treat their slaves, but not because the books say that this is the way it's supposed to be, but instead because they find it a beautiful, pleasing thing to do with their slaves.
Kneeling in nadu is a classic example that you can find in any Gorean household I know of.

However, in the end, if he's Gorean, the only thing that you can count on is that he's see you as an actual piece of owned property. A different class of human being than himself. Not as an "equal human being who has decided for the time to act as a slave would" but as an actual slave. Everything else is subject to his whim.


quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Based on what you have written I am assuming that for the most part each races live in different cities, except few scattered slaves of different races in each cities. Is that accurate assumption?



Yes that's correct.

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Regarding race: What if an Inuit or a black Master came to live in a city among white masters, would that black or Inuit Master be looked at differently if he were to desire to own white slaves?



While Goreans travel -and sometimes extensively so- it would be unusual for a Gorean to permanently go live in another city, due to various cultural reasons having to do with Home Stones.
That being said, in the situation you describe, Goreans wouldn't care what color a man's skin was, and what color the skin of his slaves were. The way Norman describes Gor, skin color isn't really noticed by Goreans any more than we notice each other's eye color.
So for a Gorean your question would be the same if you asked if a man with blue eyes would be looked on differently if he decided to own a slave with brown eyes: it just doesn't matter what the color of the eyes/skin is to Goreans. What matters is their language, culture, city, caste, etc.

Goreans on Earth I can't speak for, other than that I've never met a Gorean who has said anything even remotely indicating that skin color would be an issue for them.


quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Also in the current time, are their any benefits of owning slaves of different ethnic backgrounds by mostly white (as there are mostly white masters practicing gor) masters?



There are no benefits that I know of. Neither are there drawbacks as far as I'm aware. But I haven't given it much thought either way.


quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

Also, what if I as a slave own a property (house for example), would I be giving that up once I am owned by my Master/Mistress?


It depends entirely on the Master.
Goreans in the books hold that slaves cannot own property, as they are themselves owned.
Goreans on Earth handle matters financially however they seem fit to do. The girl I spoke about before signed over all her possessions to her Master and legally owns nothing at the moment. With my own slave it was the same. She owns nothing at the moment. What little she had before begging her collar she transferred to us when it was granted.
However, I know other men who have allowed their slaves to -legally and in name at least- hold tittles to property, and even have their own bank accounts, etc.


Thank you Mistress UllrsIshtar.

I wanted to respond to each section by section but I don't know how to do it here...

Yes, I think I should wait until I am owned before I read the books. It might be better if my Owners guide me in reading the books, i.e. what books to read and what they think will be beneficial for me. Yes, I figured a true Gorean master will not follow anyone's rules, but simply a philosophy and will have his own rules. I also understand the difference between the normal bdsm world and the Gors. This is not simply about plays for those in the Gorean lifestyle, but it's a deeply held beliefs and philosophy, and that is what I truly respect. And real slaves were never allowed to truly own anything, so as harsh as that may sound, it is the right way of going about things.

I noticed you said you own a slave, Mistress UllrsIshtar. Is the slave owned primarily by you or Master of the house, or to both equally? How does a Gorean woman become a free woman capable of owning slaves while others like me remain slaves?


(in reply to UllrsIshtar)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 11/1/2016 2:07:46 PM   
sweetblackrose


Posts: 6
Joined: 8/23/2015
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: UllrsIshtar


quote:

ORIGINAL: Malkinius
But the idea of having one of each major racial group at the same time.......interesting. <grins>


That's such a thing with you men:

I want one of each. One with big tits, and little tits, and medium tits, and a blond one, and a red hair, and a brunette, and one of every skin color imaginable, and every eye color, and ...

When are you men finally going to learn that the increase in headaches doesn't add up, but squares, everything you add another woman to your home?


I suppose Masters do like their variety in slaves, Mistress UllrsIshtar. I imagine free women who are bisexuals may equally desire variety in their slaves, I mean why not if they can? :)

(in reply to UllrsIshtar)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 11/1/2016 2:36:28 PM   
UllrsIshtar


Posts: 3693
Joined: 7/28/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetblackrose

I noticed you said you own a slave, Mistress UllrsIshtar. Is the slave owned primarily by you or Master of the house, or to both equally? How does a Gorean woman become a free woman capable of owning slaves while others like me remain slaves?



Those questions have long and extremely complicated answers that I really don't feel like getting into in an open forum.

Sufficient to say that Goreans believe that women are ultimately free or enslaved by the grace of men.
As such, it's the men in her life who will look at a woman and who will decided what she is best suited to be (in relation to themselves).

_____________________________

I can be your whore
I am the dirt you created
I am your sinner
And your whore
But let me tell you something baby
You love me for everything you hate me for

(in reply to sweetblackrose)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: What role does race (if any) play in Gorean philoso... - 11/1/2016 11:30:02 PM   
Malkinius


Posts: 1814
Joined: 1/9/2004
Status: offline
sweetblackrose.....
If you search long and hard and far enough, there will probably be a Master for you, perhaps even a Gorean one some day. The more people you talk to and learn from the better. As I said above, knowing the real from the pretend is the problem. I still disagree with Ishtar on the use of the books for knowing the difference between the two. It is not always evident. Some of us have known each other for years. Some have even met in person. If you find Goreans who regularly meet others offline and not at BDSM events, you are more likely to be finding the real ones than the fakes....or at least the want-to-bes rather than the wannabes.

As you need help or have questions, ask and we can and probably will help you.

Malkinius of Chicago

_____________________________

A questioner by inclination...An Auctioneer for the fun of it
http://www.HouseMalkinius.com    The goal is community.

(in reply to UllrsIshtar)
Profile   Post #: 20
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