RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (Full Version)

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longwayhome -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 10:49:39 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
Interestingly do you think that most Muslims agree with FGM? T

100% of Muslim people in my country agree with FGM. 100% of Muslim women in my country have been FGMed.

So this is what the Muslims in my country believe in. And they believe this practice is mandated by Muhammad. It's not from their Malay culture. Literally they believe it's mandated by their Prophet. And they quote hadiths for it.

This is the reality in my world, and in my country. You are only in contact with Western born Muslims who may not be brought up in Islamic values and some may be educated with western ideas, but it doesn't mean that they are representative of the real Islam. And an example of Western Born Muslim is like the only that contributes in this forum, but her claim is that, All Muslim countries in the world are practicing fake Islam that only Western Born Muslims are practicing the real Islam because she cannot believe the real Islam practice in whole Islamic countries could possibly be the real Islam. She was brought up in western culture.

I feel like I am around real Muslims, in a country that legally permits certain aspect of Sharia Law. Like 4 wives and Sharia marriage and divorce. Some western born Muslims try to claim that 4 wives is an Arabic practice and nothing to do with Islam, but that's not what Muhammad said.

And am neighbours with 2 whole Muslim countries. Literally the two closest countries to me are full Islamic countries. Malaysia just permitted public caning for breaking Sharia law. Something like 100 lashes for adultery. But Malaysia is assuring non-muslims that it only applies to Muslims, so I guess that's what make them moderate. And Indonesia is the most populous Islamic country who prosecuted their governor for simply saying it's permitted for muslims to vote for non-muslims. That is probably one of the most radical things ever for a moderate Muslim country. And this wasn't even from their most radical part but by their civil government.


All fascinating stuff but it is just really an indication of how given half a chance you will turn any subject into more general Muslim-bashing.

FGM is a culturally specific practice, not one observed by all Muslims. The key risk factors are based on geography not religion.

Doesn't stop you coming out with a good rant about Muslims though, does it?




BoscoX -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 12:37:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
100% of Muslim people in my country agree with FGM. 100% of Muslim women in my country have been FGMed.


Which, speaking the truth about such things can only mean that you hate Muslims... [;)]




WhoreMods -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 12:38:33 PM)

Either that or she spends a lot of time inspecting twats.




BoscoX -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 3:23:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
Interestingly do you think that most Muslims agree with FGM? T

100% of Muslim people in my country agree with FGM. 100% of Muslim women in my country have been FGMed.

So this is what the Muslims in my country believe in. And they believe this practice is mandated by Muhammad. It's not from their Malay culture. Literally they believe it's mandated by their Prophet. And they quote hadiths for it.

This is the reality in my world, and in my country. You are only in contact with Western born Muslims who may not be brought up in Islamic values and some may be educated with western ideas, but it doesn't mean that they are representative of the real Islam. And an example of Western Born Muslim is like the only that contributes in this forum, but her claim is that, All Muslim countries in the world are practicing fake Islam that only Western Born Muslims are practicing the real Islam because she cannot believe the real Islam practice in whole Islamic countries could possibly be the real Islam. She was brought up in western culture.

I feel like I am around real Muslims, in a country that legally permits certain aspect of Sharia Law. Like 4 wives and Sharia marriage and divorce. Some western born Muslims try to claim that 4 wives is an Arabic practice and nothing to do with Islam, but that's not what Muhammad said.

And am neighbours with 2 whole Muslim countries. Literally the two closest countries to me are full Islamic countries. Malaysia just permitted public caning for breaking Sharia law. Something like 100 lashes for adultery. But Malaysia is assuring non-muslims that it only applies to Muslims, so I guess that's what make them moderate. And Indonesia is the most populous Islamic country who prosecuted their governor for simply saying it's permitted for muslims to vote for non-muslims. That is probably one of the most radical things ever for a moderate Muslim country. And this wasn't even from their most radical part but by their civil government.


All fascinating stuff but it is just really an indication of how given half a chance you will turn any subject into more general Muslim-bashing.

FGM is a culturally specific practice, not one observed by all Muslims. The key risk factors are based on geography not religion.

Doesn't stop you coming out with a good rant about Muslims though, does it?


Standing up for Muslim girls isn't Muslim bashing

You are an idiot

Muslim bashing is what you do, pretend that they are retards so anything they do including mutilate girls is okay




mnottertail -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 4:45:24 PM)

I dont see nutsuckers doing anything about it but felchgobbling putinjizz, borrow and spend, and name post offices after St. Wrinklemeat.




bounty44 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 5:37:23 PM)

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the meaningless of your posts is beyond compare...




Musicmystery -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 5:41:53 PM)

And, apparently, yours.




BoscoX -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 6:09:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

the meaningless of your posts is beyond compare...


Sadly, the best that most of the leftists here can do in any given "debate" is rarely any better

Quoting VOX as a news source etc, and really believing it? They're retards, all of them





bounty44 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 6:13:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

And, apparently, yours.


hey mnottertroll, look, one of your fellow comrades agrees with me!




bounty44 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 6:14:55 PM)

honestly, im not aware of one of them really worth talking with.




mnottertail -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 7:22:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

And, apparently, yours.


hey mnottertroll, look, one of your fellow comrades agrees with me!

Hey dogshit44 you are still an uncomprehending retard.....Whooosh!!! go back to your station at the toilet stall, we will call you if we need any putinjizz felchgobbled retard.




mnottertail -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 7:25:19 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44

honestly, im not aware of one of them really worth talking with.

Then it is good that you can nurse putinjizz from each other, you have communion. Felchgobble the putinjizz boys. You ineffectual, inept, imbecilic, ignoble, impotent, toiletlicking nutsuckers.




longwayhome -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 9:57:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX


quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
Interestingly do you think that most Muslims agree with FGM? T

100% of Muslim people in my country agree with FGM. 100% of Muslim women in my country have been FGMed.

So this is what the Muslims in my country believe in. And they believe this practice is mandated by Muhammad. It's not from their Malay culture. Literally they believe it's mandated by their Prophet. And they quote hadiths for it.

This is the reality in my world, and in my country. You are only in contact with Western born Muslims who may not be brought up in Islamic values and some may be educated with western ideas, but it doesn't mean that they are representative of the real Islam. And an example of Western Born Muslim is like the only that contributes in this forum, but her claim is that, All Muslim countries in the world are practicing fake Islam that only Western Born Muslims are practicing the real Islam because she cannot believe the real Islam practice in whole Islamic countries could possibly be the real Islam. She was brought up in western culture.

I feel like I am around real Muslims, in a country that legally permits certain aspect of Sharia Law. Like 4 wives and Sharia marriage and divorce. Some western born Muslims try to claim that 4 wives is an Arabic practice and nothing to do with Islam, but that's not what Muhammad said.

And am neighbours with 2 whole Muslim countries. Literally the two closest countries to me are full Islamic countries. Malaysia just permitted public caning for breaking Sharia law. Something like 100 lashes for adultery. But Malaysia is assuring non-muslims that it only applies to Muslims, so I guess that's what make them moderate. And Indonesia is the most populous Islamic country who prosecuted their governor for simply saying it's permitted for muslims to vote for non-muslims. That is probably one of the most radical things ever for a moderate Muslim country. And this wasn't even from their most radical part but by their civil government.


All fascinating stuff but it is just really an indication of how given half a chance you will turn any subject into more general Muslim-bashing.

FGM is a culturally specific practice, not one observed by all Muslims. The key risk factors are based on geography not religion.

Doesn't stop you coming out with a good rant about Muslims though, does it?


Standing up for Muslim girls isn't Muslim bashing

You are an idiot

Muslim bashing is what you do, pretend that they are retards so anything they do including mutilate girls is okay


Where did I say I supported FGM?

This is a fantasy you have.

Taken in the best possible light, this thread was about you trying to accuse the Democrats (and by implication the left) in Maine of supporting FGM because there isn't a specific state law to complement the federal law against FGM. It was like a competition where both sides oppose FGM but you were claiming that the left were dragging their feet, because of course the all of the ills in the US are down to Democrats and lefties.

I have argued that there are problems with prosecuting people for FGM which stem from the excessive secrecy surrounding the practice and that having the right law is only part of it, pointing out that doctors and family members have been, quite correctly, prosecuted in other countries.

I have also pointed out that FGM is a specific cultural practice, confined to people coming from specific geographical areas and not a religious practice which all Muslims observe. Attacking Muslims as a group for being responsible for FGM is not therefore accurate or helpful, because many if not the majority of Muslims oppose the practice.

No-one here is supporting FGM despite your fevered accusations. The best you can get is a claim that Maine democrats haven't done as much as you would like to prosecute people. That is a very different thing.

In the UK there are both laws against FGM and national training for health professionals in recognising and dealing with FGM to try to tackle the secrecy and the stigma so that victims can be supported and prosecutions brought. I fully support these practical measures against this terribly disfiguring practice.

What I am not doing is having a general rant about Muslims like some other posters, who see any topic and find a way to rant about everyone who follows that religion. Tackling FGM is about protecting women and children, whereas attacking all Muslims for supporting FGM, when it is a minority practice concentrated in certain cultural groups, is just prejudice.




Greta75 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/14/2017 11:52:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX
Which, speaking the truth about such things can only mean that you hate Muslims... [;)]

Precisely. The only thing that is stopping FGM from being eradicated from Singapore is Islam. We are unfortunately nested right in the middle of 2 massive Muslim countries and the way we treat our Muslims is important in maintaining civil relations with the other 2 Muslim countries who could turn hostile on us anytime. Consider we are just a tiny dot on the map, it just takes one missile from any of those countries to kill our entire country, don't even require nukes and I don't think we have missile defense system. So FGM is allowed. 4 wives is allowed. Certain aspects of Sharia is allowed after a negotiation and compromise. We do what we have to do to survive. Including allowing FGM. Because Islam dictates it.




Greta75 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/15/2017 12:12:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
whereas attacking all Muslims for supporting FGM, when it is a minority practice concentrated in certain cultural groups, is just prejudice.

My view is that Islam made FGM mandatory for women. IF there are Muslims on this Universe who are mere humans and unable to fulfill every single obligation required of their religion, that is normal for most religious people, but it is false to say that FGM is not mandatory in Islam. The truth is not prejudice, just facts. FGM is Islam!

For more reading on this:
https://islamqa.info/en/60314

Circumcision is not an inherited custom as some people claim, rather it is prescribed in Islam and the scholars are unanimously agreed that it is prescribed. Not a single Muslim scholar – as far as we know – has said that circumcision is not prescribed.

Their evidence is to be found in the saheeh ahaadeeth of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), which prove that it is prescribed, for example:

1-

The hadeeth narrated by al-Bukhaari (5889) and Muslim (257) from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him), that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "The fitrah is five things – or five things are part of the fitrah – circumcision, shaving the pubes, cutting the nails, plucking the armpit hairs, and trimming the moustache."

This hadeeth includes circumcision of both males and females.

2-

Muslim (349) narrated that ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “When a man sits between the four parts (arms and legs of his wife) and the two circumcised parts meet, then ghusl is obligatory.”

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) mentioned the two circumcised parts, i.e., the circumcised part of the husband and the circumcised part of the wife, which indicates that a woman may be circumcised just like a man.

3-

Abu Dawood (5271) narrated from Umm ‘Atiyyah al-Ansaariyyah that a woman used to do circumcisions in Madeenah and the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to her: “Do not go to the extreme in cutting; that is better for the woman and more liked by the husband.” But the scholars differed concerning this hadeeth. Some of them classed it as da’eef (weak) and others classed it as saheeh. It was classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood. The fact that circumcision for women is prescribed in Islam is confirmed by the ahaadeeth quoted above, not by this disputed hadeeth.




Greta75 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/15/2017 12:26:39 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
it's catching the perpetrators in the first place because of the conspiracy of silence that surrounds FGM. In other words it isn't necessarily a democrat versus republican issue in the first place.

If you actually read the article that OP posted.

8 cases of FGM happened. Current laws were helpless in prosecuting those crimes, because of some loopholes in definition that were vague interpretations. This whole "Medically necessary for "health reasons", is seriously a giant loophole. As when it comes to medical science, when people can justify why chemo which are practically poison can be beneficial. Anything can be argued for the sake of health. Just like morphine is illegal as a recreational drug but still heavily used in hospitals when medically necessary.

It leaves a big gapping hole.

I think the court needs to come out with very very clear definition of what type of problems would FGM be necessary for babies to be extra crystal clear and make sure if FGM happens, it wasn't for some frivolous "health reasons" that a very intelligent Muslim doctor who believes in FGM could easily come up with.

Or alternatively, ALL FGM are banned. IF doctors feel FGM is necessary to save a baby's life, then they need to apply to courts and justify the reason and seek approval.

After all, Charlie Gard parents have to apply to courts permission to just seek experimental treatment to save their baby life.

All pro-FGM doctors should do the same.

The whole point of OP is what is going on with this state that they refuse to set clearer laws to protect babies from FGM. This shouldn't even be a confusing thing. Everyone should be a no brainer 100% for it.

I can't even think there would be many situations where FGM is medically necessary to save a baby's life.




Lucylastic -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/15/2017 12:57:55 AM)

honey you dont even know where your peehole is...
your medical knowledge dont mount to a hill o beans.




longwayhome -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/15/2017 1:06:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
whereas attacking all Muslims for supporting FGM, when it is a minority practice concentrated in certain cultural groups, is just prejudice.

My view is that Islam made FGM mandatory for women. IF there are Muslims on this Universe who are mere humans and unable to fulfill every single obligation required of their religion, that is normal for most religious people, but it is false to say that FGM is not mandatory in Islam. The truth is not prejudice, just facts. FGM is Islam!

For more reading on this:
https://islamqa.info/en/60314

Circumcision is not an inherited custom as some people claim, rather it is prescribed in Islam and the scholars are unanimously agreed that it is prescribed. Not a single Muslim scholar – as far as we know – has said that circumcision is not prescribed.

Their evidence is to be found in the saheeh ahaadeeth of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), which prove that it is prescribed, for example:

1-

The hadeeth narrated by al-Bukhaari (5889) and Muslim (257) from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him), that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "The fitrah is five things – or five things are part of the fitrah – circumcision, shaving the pubes, cutting the nails, plucking the armpit hairs, and trimming the moustache."

This hadeeth includes circumcision of both males and females.

2-

Muslim (349) narrated that ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her) said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “When a man sits between the four parts (arms and legs of his wife) and the two circumcised parts meet, then ghusl is obligatory.”

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) mentioned the two circumcised parts, i.e., the circumcised part of the husband and the circumcised part of the wife, which indicates that a woman may be circumcised just like a man.

3-

Abu Dawood (5271) narrated from Umm ‘Atiyyah al-Ansaariyyah that a woman used to do circumcisions in Madeenah and the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to her: “Do not go to the extreme in cutting; that is better for the woman and more liked by the husband.” But the scholars differed concerning this hadeeth. Some of them classed it as da’eef (weak) and others classed it as saheeh. It was classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood. The fact that circumcision for women is prescribed in Islam is confirmed by the ahaadeeth quoted above, not by this disputed hadeeth.



That is nonsense and just too easy to find any number of references to refute it.

Try Wikipedia as just one example.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation

"Surveys have shown a widespread belief, particularly in Mali, Mauritania, Guinea and Egypt, that FGM is a religious requirement.[133] Gruenbaum has argued that practitioners may not distinguish between religion, tradition and chastity, making it difficult to interpret the data.[134]

FGM's origins in northeastern Africa are pre-Islamic, but the practice became associated with Islam because of that religion's focus on female chastity and seclusion.[p] There is no mention of it in the Quran. It is praised in several hadith (sayings attributed to Muhammad) as noble but not required.[q][137] In 2007 the Al-Azhar Supreme Council of Islamic Research in Cairo ruled that FGM had "no basis in core Islamic law or any of its partial provisions".[138][r]

There is no mention of FGM in the Bible.[140] Christian missionaries in Africa were among the first to object to FGM,[141] but Christian communities in Africa do practise it. A 2013 UNICEF report identified 17 African countries in which at least 10 percent of Christian women and girls aged 15 to 49 had undergone FGM; in Niger 55 percent of Christian women and girls had experienced it, compared with two percent of their Muslim counterparts.[142] The only Jewish group known to have practised it are the Beta Israel of Ethiopia. Judaism requires male circumcision, but does not allow FGM.[143] FGM is also practised by animist groups, particularly in Guinea and Mali.[144]"




Greta75 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/15/2017 1:08:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

honey you dont even know where your peehole is...
your medical knowledge dont mount to a hill o beans.


It doesn't matter. Fact is that 8 FGM cases could not be prosecuted due to loopholes.

You guys citing Federal covers it are sideswiping the point that federal law is not air tight enough. Infact, they have to keep amending it to make it more and more air tight. Last amendments in 2013 I think to prosecute parents who bring their daughters overseas to do FGM too.

But still loop holed somewhere, medically. I don't have to be a medical expert to see that, there is enough concern that 8 cases went through scot free due to insufficient clear definition in the law.

You guys ridicule Bosco by saying it is already the Federal Law are like totally ignoring that the Federal law has loopholes and which is puzzling why this state knows there are loopholes but are hesitating to close them.




Greta75 -> RE: The Pussyhat Party Goes Easy On Female Genital Mutilation (7/15/2017 1:11:08 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation

I gave you an authentic Islamic Q&A site for Muslims to seek advice and clear their doubts about Islam.

And you give me Wikipedia? Who is not an authority in Islam? Not run by Islamic Imams.

Love it!

Islam originated from this man called Muhammad. Muhammad may have stolen the circumicsion ideas from African Tribes, but he IS the originator of Islam who set the law that FGM is necessary for women.

The Quran is not the only official holy book of Islam. It does not work like Christianity where there is only the bible. The Hadiths are as authentic as the Quran, and Islam is practically based on how the Hadith explains how the Quran verses are interpreted.

"Quran-Only-Muslims" is a Western Born Muslim idea to find a way to make Islam more compatible with western laws. But not what the real Islam is.




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