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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart?


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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/15/2005 5:50:33 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

How can anyone claim that the Gorean way is how things "should" be, when it has never worked in practice?


Seeing that the codes of conduct, the honour system and such to be found in Gor was dire4ctly taken from such areas as Greco/Roman periods and the Bushido codes, well documented here on planet earth, not in fiction but in fact, how can you say that such things are untried. They may be untried when taken as a whole or under the sociological label of Gorean, but if you really understood how the Gorean male who is also a member of the human race living and breathing (unlike the fun characters Norman depicted to populate his yarns, you would find Strength, Honour, certainly a system which is far more ridged and disciplined than many other areas of the broader lifestyle. However such things are not untried today either. If you want comparisons you need look no further than the training of the monks in the Shaolin temple or the training of Special Forces. There is Strength, Discipline and Honour in both. However I accept that I am a tad biased being one of those “Goreans in this forum treat the world of Gor as self-legitimizing and self-justifying, and they appear to forget that the Gorean system is untested fiction” to quote you, who not only talks the talk but walks the walk and lives the life. It works as long as you are sane and know where your shit is at. It’s a simple adaptation of a philosophy into a practical M/s sub lifestyle.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to ManOwner)
Profile   Post #: 301
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/15/2005 5:57:09 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
I post this for those who have never seen it.

quote:



Where is Gor?


Is it to be found online, amidst the chatrooms, corkboards and message centers of the internet? Is it contained within a particular IRC channel, or chat service, or roleplaying room? Is it to be found on a website, are even upon all websites?

No, it cannot be found there. Not in any online venue, nor in every online venue, nor in all of the online venues put together. Not upon the entire internet, with its thousands upon thousands of server computers, with its millions of gigabytes of retrievable data. And if one were to illegally scan in every page of every book which John Norman ever wrote, and place them upon every server computer attached to the internet... Gor would still not be there.

Where is Gor?

Is it to be found within the celluloid frames of the movies which were created to tell its story? No, not there. The films which were created to tell the story of Gor were sad and laughable things, full of inconsistancies and devoid of the trappings and exhuberance which fill the Gor books to bursting. The two films which were created, which supposedly dealt with the subject of Gor but which were actually just another attempt by filmmakers to cash in on the success of a rather popular series of science-fiction/fantasy books, were empty. They depicted the activities of people in some other place than Gor. They were Xena, minus the tongue-in-cheek humor of that modern and highly successful syndicated program... they were BeastMaster and Deathstalker, but lacked even the dubious production values of those films, and the others which emulated them during the 1980's. Don't look for Gor between the credits of either of the two supposed "Gor" films... because you won't find it there.

Where is Gor?

Is Gor to be discovered by memorizing passages of prose from the series of books which gave form to the Counter-Earth? Can it be squeezed and gleaned from websites which discuss the particulars of Gorean concepts, lifestyles and philosophy? Can it be unmasked and revealed through logging into a chat channel on the internet and typing in the right combination of phrases at the correct times, and in the correct order?

Never. Because Gor is bigger than all of that. Because Gor, though replete with whips and chains and swords and collars, though filled with war and combat and the struggles of Men and their women, is not about any of that. It is about something else.

Gor is based upon love. Believe it or not.

That is the source of its greatness, and its strength. Gor is based upon the love which people can experience for their world, for their companions, and for their humanity. It is built upon the concept that men and women can love the truth, and that they can pursue that truth to its fullest extent. Those who know Gor, know that in it are contained all expressions of the love for life, the love of beauty, the love of strength, the love of honor, even the love which a group of men can feel toward a simple stone.

Those who cannot understand that Gor can be loved, and lived, will never be able to understand its strength, its purity, and its majesty. The planet Gor does not, and cannot, exist. But there are still those brave men and women who close their eyes and dream about it. In their imaginations they see the endless vistas of the green sa-tarna fields which dot that world, they behold the trackless crests of the mighty Voltai mountains, they smell the dust of the Plains of Turia and they feel the sweet clean air of another world upon their skin.

To such people, the Counter-Earth, though not a real place, is a true place. It is the stuff of myth. It is the Isle of Avalon; it is the Hidden Land under the Hollow Hills. It is the Faery Homeland of the Sidhe. It exists just beyond the borders of our waking world, ever ready to embrace those who dare to cross its boundaries and seek it, those who insist upon loving it for its own sake.

So, when you glance around you and feel cheated by the limitations of the internet and IRC, when you are appalled at the mess which has been made online and off by those who seek to emulate, but who can never understand, Gor, those who seem unable to simply love it for its own sake, never forget that Gor and the internet are not the same thing. At such times, do not despair; simply pick up one of those Gor books and close yourself up in a quiet room, and begin to read. Let your imagination take flight to another place, a better place, a place of wonders and truth and sacrifice and the honest sweat and labor of men and women who are working together to create an eden upon the other side of the sun. Read, and as you read, imagine that mankind can still be as innocent and as savage as it would be there, should Gor exist. Close your eyes and imagine that there could be Goreans, and that you might find your place among them.

Perhaps the power of Gor is that we cannot attain it, except through our dreams. We can strive to come closer to it, to understand it a bit better, and to immerse ourselves in the ebb and tide of Gorean interaction as it exists upon our world... but we cannot ever get there. It remains just beyond our reach, tantalizing us with glimpses of its honesty and beauty. But we cannot "make" Gor, not here upon Earth. Nor can we live *the* Gorean Lifestyle. There is no single Gorean Lifestyle to be lived. We can simply strive to live *a* Gorean Lifestyle, and attempt to find our own niche of Gorean simplicity, honor, and the love of life, here upon our own gray world.

Simply look around you. When the endless bickering and name calling and pontificating becomes too much for you to bear, when it begins to drown out the truth of what Gor is, and how it is, and how we might strive to be worthy of it, turn away and seek it elsewhere. Find the books which teach us of it, and travel beyond the sun to another world. And learn to love Gor, not for what you can make of it, but for its own sake.

That is where Gor is. In the hearts and souls of those who truly love it, and who have come to understand it and appreciate it for its own sake, not because it has impregnated the particular online medium which they typically frequent. One cannot find Gor in an IRC channel, or upon a website; one must seek it elsewhere, somewhere within oneself. The books are there to show you the way. They are the magic gateway you seek, which will reveal all of the triumph and despair and wonder of another, truer place. Pass through that gateway and know that only there, within those pages, is the genuine article you search for. There are good channels and poor ones, quality websites and foolish ones... but they are all things of Earth. To find Gor one must go beyond them, and look within oneself to discover whether or not one can love the Counter-Earth, for all of its faults and foibles.

To one who can do that, the endless insipidities of the online melieu fade into the background, and assume their correct position of importance, which is less than nothing when compared to the vastness and glory of the Counter Earth.

If you would know Gor, submerge yourself and give yourslf over to that fictional place. Imagine yourself among the denizens of that other world, and discover whether or not you can love it for its own sake, minus all of the ridiculous trappings of the internet and IRC. The measure of how "Gorean" you are comes not from how well you can type words to a screen, nor how well established is your channel or how many flames you can type to castigate others. The true battle must be fought within. Are you Gorean? Do you really wish to be?

Could you be?

If you would be Gorean, learn to love Gor. If you would live as a Gorean, learn to live with the same joy and earnest simplicity, and strength of heart, shared by the Goreans described in those books.

The millions of bytes of digital data being tossed around the bandwidth highways mean nothing to the Goreans, and should mean nothing to those who would emulate the Goreans. All of the retrievable memory on every computer in the world mean nothing when compared to the simplest stone in a summer garden. Pick up that stone and hold it, and know it to be real. Now pick up a handful of words, and weigh the two for yourself.

Gor is an idea, an ideal, a philosophical viewpoint; but it is also a real and discernable force in the lives of those who have embraced it, and love it. We are not measured for what we say; we are measured by who we are. The intricacies of the internet have little to do with it.

When next you wish to scream and rage at the indignities being heaped upon Gor upon the internet, simply recall that the internet is not connected to Gor. It cannot touch, or effect, anything Gorean. Those who fail to understand what Gor is all about, and who fail to respect and appreciate what Gor signifies, are doomed to eternal disappointment. They choose their fate by refusing to seek Gor for what it is, to understand and commune with its spirit and philosophy. They would define it, and simplify it, and weaken it, to make the task of understanding it easier for themselves... when all the while, all they have to do is simply find and read the Gor books and learn to love Gor. And if they cannot do that, then they would be better served by seeking some other goal, one within their abilities and easier for them to grasp.

When I am assailed by those who insist upon tearing out their hair in great handfuls at some recent rash of online idiocy, I simply have to laugh. I cannot help myself. I see people screaming that the ship is sinking, when the reason they boarded that ship in the first place was to seek the ocean. And while the ship may sink, the ocean remains, unchanged. One has only to stroll down the beach to the water's edge to find it; one has only to swim in it to understand it, and to learn that perhaps one need not fear it at all.

Gor is there. It will always be there, for those who wish to seek it. And to do so, they need only purchase a book and visit it. The often rampant silliness of IRC, and the various channels of half-baked pseudo Goreans, will pass away in time, perhaps to be replaced by another group of would-be Goreans who seem to think that Gor exists within the tiny databits which pass between computers.

It doesn't matter, though. Mixed in among such people, there will always be those who know and understand that Gor is not a thing of computers and typed commands. And while we can communicate with one another in a thousand different ways, it is those who love Gor who will determine how best that can be accomplished. The internet can be made to serve Gor; but Gor does not exist to serve the internet. It is far, far bigger than that.

Love Gor. Do not attempt to change it. Do not attempt to explain it away. Do not attempt to capture it and own it for yourself, because that is foolish vanity. Simply love it. And treasure those books, so that if you ever wish to experience Gor in its truest form, you can do so simply by diving in and taking a swim in it. And washing yourself clean of the lies and poisons, and the computer driven agendas, of Earth and its misguided inhabitants.

You may encounter me there, splashing around and enjoying myself immensely. If you do, and you ever feel yourself slipping beneath the waves for the third time, simply extend your hand, and it will be taken by myself, and by others who love Gor for its own sake, who will gladly keep you afloat as you come to know and understand the power of the sea in which we all swim... the sea of living, and the love of beauty, and simplicity, and truth.

You will have found Gor.

I wish you well.

And I, and those like me, shall continue to do all we can to find the lost ones, and bring them home.
Marcus ~ of ~ Ar







_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 302
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/15/2005 6:54:37 AM   
nella


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Joined: 12/30/2004
From: Norway
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i must admit i get angry at Gorean bashing, not becouse i love the books, becouse i dont as i have said before, it is partly becouse i like the lifestyle and were i free from other engangments, i would perhaps have liked to be a Gorean slave, the other thing is thati to use somthing from a fiction book, in my spiritual practices that mean so mutch for me, i have taken an Energy exersise that form alot of the basis for the system i use from a fantasy book. And i ahve worked hard, i study, i do many exersises every day, and then somone tell me i am not a serious occultist becouse the system i work whit just happen to come from a fantasy book, at first i got sad, but now i try not to mind. Somthing, whatever it is an artform, a way of life or a system of spiritual practices, is not nessesary bad, or unserious, just becouse it comes from fiction.

For what do it matter, fiction is the child of the human mind, and if somone invents somthing to practice in the real world, or for his or her charecters to use in fiction, it are still the seedsof the imagination that brings it to life.

(in reply to IronBear)
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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/16/2005 10:04:43 PM   
OscarHargraves


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Do your research. Read the books. Enjoy them for what they are, but remember they are FANTASIES and not real life. Very few Doms I know could live up to the sword swinging heroics of the Masters in those novels. And very few Subs/slaves I know would want to live the way the women on Gor do. My suggestion: Take the parts that work for you and your Dom/Master and leave the rest in the book rack with the covers still on them. But be sure to communicate with your Dom/Master and know what both of you want and are willing to do. After all, you do have to live in the real world and this is Earth, not Gor.

_____________________________

Never drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ! !

(in reply to iiinterstate)
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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/19/2005 4:13:37 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: OscarHargraves

Do your research. Read the books. Enjoy them for what they are, but remember they are FANTASIES and not real life. Very few Doms I know could live up to the sword swinging heroics of the Masters in those novels. And very few Subs/slaves I know would want to live the way the women on Gor do. My suggestion: Take the parts that work for you and your Dom/Master and leave the rest in the book rack with the covers still on them. But be sure to communicate with your Dom/Master and know what both of you want and are willing to do. After all, you do have to live in the real world and this is Earth, not Gor.


Again I shall repeat myself. We don’t attempt to emulate the characters we follow a philosophy and a code of conduct, similar to many of the military or martial codes. Regarding your comments about sword play, I know many a Gorean Lifestyle Master who does spend time facing of in combat with sword and shield.. Medieval combat. I turn 60 in a week or so and yet I can still don 35kg of body armour and a 17lb steel helm and swing with either hand a 10lb hand and a half spring steel sword…. I’m not to grubby with my katana and that little baby will slice a man in two… That I know from experience.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to OscarHargraves)
Profile   Post #: 305
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/19/2005 11:07:10 AM   
nenakajira


Posts: 221
Joined: 7/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: OscarHargraves

Do your research. Read the books. Enjoy them for what they are, but remember they are FANTASIES and not real life. Very few Doms I know could live up to the sword swinging heroics of the Masters in those novels. And very few Subs/slaves I know would want to live the way the women on Gor do. My suggestion: Take the parts that work for you and your Dom/Master and leave the rest in the book rack with the covers still on them. But be sure to communicate with your Dom/Master and know what both of you want and are willing to do. After all, you do have to live in the real world and this is Earth, not Gor.


You're right, very few submissives and slaves would want to live this way. There are those, whoever, that do live this way. And no, we do not think that we are characters or inside of a book.
However, your "suggestion" is insulting to those of us who do live this way. We are all very aware of what planet we are on. After all, Gor is a fictional planet. We are also very aware of what we can take from the books.
It's not like we're recruiting. We're not. Ask any Gorean and the first thing you're likely to hear is "This is not for everyone. Only a small percentage of people that are interested have the strength or desire to stay".
So, considering that, you think you could stop trying to recruit us to your way of thinking. I feel like Im dodging mormons at my door every day when I read the boards lately. (no.. quick.. hide behind the couch.. they wont see us. ack! no! dont answer the door! theyll talk for hours about their beliefs and think we need to feel the same!)

Have a good day,
nena{R}
Raven's whore

(in reply to OscarHargraves)
Profile   Post #: 306
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/19/2005 6:39:05 PM   
kry


Posts: 19
Joined: 7/24/2005
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Knock knock knock...

Is there a large population of Goreans out there claiming that Gor actually EXISTS and I have just somehow, by sheer luck, missed the brochure? Is there some assumption that being Gorean lends itself to having a VERY bad sense of direction? We're on Earth? Damn - knew we should have taken that left turn at Albuquerque.

_____________________________

kry{Rk}

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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/20/2005 8:25:56 AM   
MstrHellsFury


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this has turned into a very long and very combative thread...my question is a simple one...isn't this lifestyle big enough to accomodate all of us reguardless of what we do within it...can't we all have opinions and state them without attack...seems like gor..poly...and any other non generic type of activites are somehow not the norm...but isn't the entire lifestyle...not the norm...or am I missing something...do we really have to spend so much time defending ourselves within our own community when we spend so much time trying to live in the general world community...just a random thought here...and I get so few of them...

Fury

(in reply to iiinterstate)
Profile   Post #: 308
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/20/2005 8:27:28 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrHellsFury

this has turned into a very long and very combative thread...my question is a simple one...isn't this lifestyle big enough to accomodate all of us reguardless of what we do within it...can't we all have opinions and state them without attack...seems like gor..poly...and any other non generic type of activites are somehow not the norm...but isn't the entire lifestyle...not the norm...or am I missing something...do we really have to spend so much time defending ourselves within our own community when we spend so much time trying to live in the general world community...just a random thought here...and I get so few of them...

Fury


Well said Fury. Damned well said man!

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to MstrHellsFury)
Profile   Post #: 309
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/21/2005 8:50:30 PM   
bottominwa


Posts: 240
Joined: 7/20/2004
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There are times...when she has no time to peruse these boards. Master is in a mock field exercise this week so she has nothing but time...so she comes and she finds now a second thread of complete horse malarky.
Generally people get offensive when they feel threatened...why how We live is so threatening to so many she will never understand.
Perhaps because it is hardline to walk...and most of us...want the easy way out
of everything.

she hopes this finds E/everyone in good humor...and that the Gorean bashing comes to an end...for all the Gorean men she knows and has the privilege of serving...who fight the good fight, so that W/we all have this free speech to chastise others...may the bashing end.
It's blatantly disrespectful...if you knew the men this girl knows...and what They have been throught the last four years in the name of freedom....you wouldn't be so quick to call how They live..."retarded or Trekkie".

May you never know what They know. Your ignorance is a gift given to you by Men who would die that you could be so.

And this is most certainly not in reply to the men above her in the thread. It just posted that way. Apologies.
sabrina King
kajira/alpha bicce
House of King
Rarii Enclave Lewis/McChord/Kitsap


< Message edited by bottominwa -- 8/21/2005 8:52:00 PM >

(in reply to IronBear)
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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/21/2005 9:50:56 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
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From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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Trik, thank you such a post. You show the true kajira heart and bring honour to your Master and his home. Many of my Gorean male friends also fought but in another war in "Nam and they too were honourable men in every sence of the word. I ask only that you pass on my greetings to your Master when he returns home.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to bottominwa)
Profile   Post #: 311
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/23/2005 7:06:52 PM   
bottominwa


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You are most welcome Master Iron Bear.

sabrina King

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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/29/2005 11:22:03 AM   
LaughingDan


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From: United Kingdom
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I read the books as a teenager (strangely, they were in the school library) and although I thought they were hot at the time, I don't see that they represent a practical lifestyle guide of any kind.

They can provide inspiration for aspects of a lifestyle, but then do a lot of things - "I dream of genie" for example.

Your best research would be to read all the books and take your pick as it suits you.

< Message edited by LaughingDan -- 8/29/2005 11:23:44 AM >


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I write random stuff too.

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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/29/2005 2:19:39 PM   
nella


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Joined: 12/30/2004
From: Norway
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to take inspiration from a fictional setting would not mean that you belive that setting is all around you. Let us take an example out of the blue, let us say somone was faniated whit Jedi from Star Wars and desided their codes was good to live by, so he or she begin to act werry kind to everyone, speaking whit honor an integrity and helping pepole when he or she can, like doing the dishes for the old lady in your building that can not do it herself and helping out at the local soup kitchen. Even if you got the idea from a fictional work, do not mean you belive there are aliens everywere and your kitchen knife is a lightsaber, it simply mean you did see somthing you liked and adepted it to this world, just so whit the Goreans to, they are not insane wierdoes, they are simply pepole that have gotten sinpiration for a lifestyle from a fictional insead of an historical or cultural source.

(in reply to LaughingDan)
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RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 8/29/2005 11:39:07 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaughingDan

I read the books as a teenager (strangely, they were in the school library) and although I thought they were hot at the time, I don't see that they represent a practical lifestyle guide of any kind.

They can provide inspiration for aspects of a lifestyle, but then do a lot of things - "I dream of genie" for example.

Your best research would be to read all the books and take your pick as it suits you.


Tal Dan,

Tell me, have you read all the posts on this thread? Have you read any of the other threads? I will believe that from your own comments that you have little idea of Gorean Lifestyles. I have news for you, we are used to people who make throw-away snide remarks, people who lump us with Star Trek followers or who just plain bask Gor and Gorean Life Stylers..

I notice that you joined CM on Aug 24th 2005. Now unless you've been on under another name, wouldn't you think that its a tad early for you to make such comments as you did without being educated Gor wise? there is a quote from the books which summs uop my attitude to folks who make assine comments.. It may or may not apply to you, I dont know because I dont know you and have no intentention of doing so,,,,

"You may judge and scorn the Goreans if you wish. Know as well, however, that they judge and scorn you. They fulfil themselves, as you do not. Hate them for their pride and power. They will pity you for your shame and weakness." Beasts of Gor pg 11.


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to LaughingDan)
Profile   Post #: 315
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 9/9/2005 8:12:24 PM   
submissiveK


Posts: 1
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

I notice that you joined CM on Aug 24th 2005. Now unless you've been on under another name, wouldn't you think that its a tad early for you to make such comments as you did without being educated Gor wise? there is a quote from the books which summs uop my attitude to folks who make assine comments.. It may or may not apply to you, I dont know because I dont know you and have no intentention of doing so,,,,



That's a bit unfair, I think. Certainly, CM isn't the only source of information out there.

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 316
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 9/9/2005 9:02:57 PM   
Phoenixandnika


Posts: 748
Joined: 4/22/2005
From: Aberdeen Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

I think I dislike gorean style Ds for 2 main reasons. One is that it is a highly structured social dynamic. I'm an individualist. I refuse to do things "because society says its how its to be done" and gorean pretty much is that. Now, I have no problems adopting social norms IF THEY SUIT ME. For this, I understand people who DO choose to be gorean, because it suits them. But I'm simply too individualistic, and more than willing to toss aside any "should dos" I come across that don't suit who I am to work happily within such a structured system.

Secondly, I really don't see much consistency even within the practice of gorean Ds. At some points slaves are "chattel" and yet at others, they are supposed to be treasured and protected. Now, there's no reason not to protect property and treat it and bring it up right, but I think to be true to gorean, if a gorean dom came across a better slave, wouldn't it make sense for him to either add that new one on, or try and make a trade for the old one? From what I know, goreans don't form relationships based on love, but on service- the slave is only as good as long as they serve well and there isn't a better option out there. But I've never seen that in practice.




Greetings ,

I wonder how many who judge those within the Gorean lifestyle take time to know those that practice it. I amnto talking about clumping us all together, we all have meet with the bad experiences weither in the gorean lifestyle, BDSM, or vanilla. I am talking about getting to know those you judge here and now.

The gorean lifestyle for the most part is very black and white compared to the BDSM lifestyle. However, because we are human we all perceive things differently, we all practice and carry out things differently. I do not do things because the "Gorean Society" demands it. I do things because my Owner demands it.If you take time to get to know the individuals that arepart of this lifestyle you might just find that we are very individual even in our unity.

I will use myself for an example simply because that is whom I am most familiar with and I can not / will not speak for others. I am gothic and wiccan. I am typically very much outside of the box in dress and attitude. I do not typically speak 3rd person unless being punished. I sleep with my Owner every night unless being punished. Am I like every other Gorean slave you will meet? No, and my Master likes it that way. Evenin my slavery He allows my individuality. However, I am required tofolow social protocals. Why? Simply put , I am slave and it is what he wishes.

As far as slaves being chattel or treasured. Much like in any relationship no 2 people are the same, no 2 dynamics are the same. People have different expectations however, I would venture to say that forthe most part those that are in the Gorean lifestyle hold fast tothe main points of the lifestyle although we may express them or their roles in differnt ways.

Most of those whom own slaves do love them, treasure them, cherish them, protect them, as well as meet their needs.

My Master loves me as I love him. He is my best friend. He was my best friend for along time before we became Master and slave. Because he loves me he will be stern with me, his grip will be tighter than if he did not care or did not love me. To be a love slave is a very precious thing but does not come without cost or work. Wenow raise to children together, those children see love and cherishment but they also see my collar, his control.

What makes a Master who replaces his slave with another any different than a Dominate who replaces his submissive for another or a vanilla husband who replaces his wife?

Blessed Be,

Nika{Phoenix}
His Gothic Slave

_____________________________

"Life is neither a bed of roses nor a carpet of thorns, it's just what you make of it."



(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)
Profile   Post #: 317
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 9/9/2005 9:18:02 PM   
Phoenixandnika


Posts: 748
Joined: 4/22/2005
From: Aberdeen Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: iiinterstate

I am beginning some research on the Gorean lifestyle, but I am very overwhelmed.

The quotes from the novels seem to be very different than the way slaves are actually treated.
I'm not sure what is true or what is just literature.
I know the writing style has a lot to do with it.

For instance, is a slave really expected to give up all contact with her family?




Greetings,

Let me start by introducing myself.
I am Nika, Owned by Phoenix. I have been in the Gorean lifestyle for almost 10 years. I am a mother and as my Master says a deviant gothic.

*laughs*I have read the books 4 times and I personally find Norman's writing style rough. The books are a good start, however; I would urge you not to take them literally. There are many contridictions and many things that are simply unrealistic or fantasy all together. I would urge you to get involved in Gorean forums online as well real life.

I would also suggest that if possible to find a mentor.Someone who has been in the lifestyle awhile to help guide you in the protocals and rituals of the lifestyle. There are many of both. Please remember that although we all practice the samephilisophies, how we practice them is as individual at times as we are.

You will meet some "Masters" who make demands from the get go, however; I would urge you to take your time. Get to know the lifestyle and those that will seek to collar you in the future. Becoming a slave, is hard, a Gorean slave is harder in my opinion. Remember this though until you beg collar you have to protect yourself, to maintian yourself. You have the control until you conscent to nonconscent.


I would be very cautious about someone demanding you alienate your family and friends. Granted there are some situations where some are deemed unhealthy for a slave and her Owner demands she step away. Though I do not see that as the same thing. I have seen situations where "Masters" demand slaves give up custody of chidren before taking collar. Yet, it is the slaves choose at that point to do so and take the collar or simply walk away. I personally would walk away.

I hope this helped you in some way.

Nika{Phoenix}
His Gothic Slave


_____________________________

"Life is neither a bed of roses nor a carpet of thorns, it's just what you make of it."



(in reply to iiinterstate)
Profile   Post #: 318
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 9/9/2005 9:29:14 PM   
Phoenixandnika


Posts: 748
Joined: 4/22/2005
From: Aberdeen Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

this has turned into a very long and very combative thread...my question is a simple one...isn't this lifestyle big enough to accomodate all of us reguardless of what we do within it...can't we all have opinions and state them without attack...seems like gor..poly...and any other non generic type of activites are somehow not the norm...but isn't the entire lifestyle...not the norm...or am I missing something...do we really have to spend so much time defending ourselves within our own community when we spend so much time trying to live in the general world community...just a random thought here...and I get so few of them...

Fury


Master Hells Fury this post made me smile. I have said it time and time again. This lifestyle, is like any part of the BDSM lifestyle outside ofsociety's norm. Therefore should we not be a tadbit more tolerant of differnces? Do we not get enough greif from those who have no idea of what a submissive, Dominate, Master, top or bottom, or switch is. Do we have to spend so much time and enery on what is in my opinion symantics.

We are all human. We will always have different perceptions than the person sitting right next to us. Why? Because we are human nomattter what your lifestyle role.

I do not expect kumbia when coming to forums, however; I would think here I would not /should not have to defend who and what I am or how my Master and Ichoose to live our life and our roles.

Thank you again for you post Master Hells Fury

Nika{Phoenix}
His Gothic Slave

_____________________________

"Life is neither a bed of roses nor a carpet of thorns, it's just what you make of it."



(in reply to MstrHellsFury)
Profile   Post #: 319
RE: Gor: How do I know what should be taken to heart? - 9/10/2005 10:01:43 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
Tal submissiveK

quote:

ORIGINAL: submissiveK

quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

I notice that you joined CM on Aug 24th 2005. Now unless you've been on under another name, wouldn't you think that its a tad early for you to make such comments as you did without being educated Gor wise? there is a quote from the books which summs uop my attitude to folks who make assine comments.. It may or may not apply to you, I dont know because I dont know you and have no intentention of doing so,,,,



That's a bit unfair, I think. Certainly, CM isn't the only source of information out there.


Then let him (LaughingDan) step up to the plate and respond personally if he has any issues with my post. If he can show me that I was wrong in surmising he has little knowledge regarding the Gorean Lifestyle, then I'll be happy to appologise. Untill then my comments stand.

< Message edited by IronBear -- 9/11/2005 12:58:44 AM >


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to submissiveK)
Profile   Post #: 320
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