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RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 5:36:16 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		You ain't a mongoose, UR.

quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Hey, Level, that sucks, but be glad you weren't bitten by THIS:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_mamba


When I was on Okinawa back 1983 as a Marine, the north side of the island had a place were you could pay a few bucks and watch a Black Mamba and a Mongoose fight in a ring. From all the marines who had watched these fights, not one time did I ever hear that the Mongoose had come out on the losing end.

(in reply to UtopianRanger)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 5:56:09 PM   
Chaingang


Posts: 1727
Joined: 10/24/2005
Status: offline 		I wanna be the mongoose!!!

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(in reply to Lordandmaster)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 5:56:46 PM   
acissej


Posts: 2370
Joined: 12/24/2005
From: New Jersey
Status: offline 		Oy vey.  Scary stuff.  I hope you make a full recovery soon, Level, and continue not to look like a horror film reject.  

(in reply to Najakcharmer)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 6:57:04 PM   
MizSuz


Posts: 1881
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		I'm glad you went to the doctor.  Don't be fooled by the seemingly insignificant external size.  Infections from brown recluse tend to tunnel.  It's possible it could be huge and long inside your leg and very small externally.

Please don't quit the antibiotics before you're done with the full course.  It could just ramp up an immunity to the drug and then you'll have to take something else.

I hope you get better soon.




_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 8:54:32 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		Level!!  Yikes - sounds awful.  I can't look at any of the links or I will end up in Heeby Geeby Hell!  Get better fast!!

Aileen, you're killing me, lol.

Marie, I used to use aerosol until I discovered the hand held vaccuum.

Kyra, I would have fainted right then and there. 

(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:16:55 PM   
SweetSarijane


Posts: 3788
Joined: 10/7/2005
From: KC area Missouri
Status: offline 		Those are nasty little boogers. I HATE them. Sounds like you maybe lucked out. A good friend of mine got bit on the top of her foot and finally went to a doctor when it opened up an area about the size of a quarter. She was told had she waited any longer, she would have lost a chunk of her foot. She has a scar but she has all her foot still.

I was bitten a few years ago myself, but it was pretty mild. They don't always get real nasty and horrible, it's just that those are the ones you hear about. Hope it heals up quick for you.

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Deviant Mind
Wild Side Readers KCSass

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:31:52 PM   
Najakcharmer


Posts: 2121
Joined: 5/3/2004
Status: offline 		I would not confirm those images as necessarily being representative of loxoscelism.  It's not impossible, but let's say that there are a lot of questions in my mind about the authenticity of those images.  There are a lot of other possibilities that come to mind as a medical origin.  Spider bite would not be my first guess.  

(in reply to SaphireLynn)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:33:28 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline 		There are 20,000 different kinds of spiders in the United States alone. Only 60 are capable of biting humans. And only 4 are dangerous. Those 4 are the Brown Recluse, the Black Widow, Hobo, and Yellow Sac. None are aggressive. They will bite usually only when they are threatened.

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:37:29 PM   
Lorelei115


Posts: 1933
Joined: 8/16/2006
From: Sin City
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie


Marie, I used to use aerosol until I discovered the hand held vaccuum.




But then you have to empty the bag, where the possibly still alive spider is lurking. They do lurk, you know.. I don't care what anyone says about spiders being non-agressive, those crawlers have it in for me... The stalk me, and if you kill one all its relatives come out for revenge..... *shudder*

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A sucessful life is not measured by what we do
But by the realization
Of who we are.

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Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:38:51 PM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		Considering that Level sounds a lot better (fortunately) and considering that this thread has already been macerated, I was going to say that my recollection of the "Mongoose/snake" fights in Okinawa are mongooses (which are possibly native) and the "habu" which is a native pit viper which is very slow.  Not a cobra (unless I misremember my little bit of snake taxonomy) and surely not a mamba.

E

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:44:44 PM   
Najakcharmer


Posts: 2121
Joined: 5/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

There are 20,000 different kinds of spiders in the United States alone. Only 60 are capable of biting humans. And only 4 are dangerous. Those 4 are the Brown Recluse, the Black Widow, Hobo, and Yellow Sac. None are aggressive. They will bite usually only when they are threatened.


Recluses are skittery and hard to handle, and they can be a bit defensive.  Black widows are easy to handle and simply don't bite unless they are crushed or physically restrained.  Never worked with Tegenaria or Cheiracanthium, but neither are very toxic to humans.  Yellow sac bites are extremely mild.  A bee sting is much worse.  Yellow sacs are not considered to be a medically significant species.  Hobo spider bites can actually cause systemic symptoms as well as necrotic arachnidism, putting Tegenaria up there with Loxosceles and Latrodectus as the three medically significant spider species in North America.

Most spiders can't physically bite people because their fangs are too small.  Even the ones on this list usually need to be "helped" with some outside pressure, eg, being trapped between clothing and skin, to deliver a sub-q injection to a human.  And typically they don't bite people unless they are trapped and crushed in this way.  There's a number of spiders in North America with fangs large enough to bite humans quite readily, but their venom is harmless to anything bigger than a bug.

(in reply to cyberdude611)
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RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:50:51 PM   
HollyS


Posts: 230
Joined: 1/5/2006
Status: offline 		I don't know much about spiders, snakes or mongooses, but since when has lack of subject knowledge been a barrier to posting?!?

Everything I know about cobras and mongooses comes from the Chuck Jones version of Rikki Tikki Tavi.  Let me tell you, Nag and Nageena weren't slow!!

Rikki was still faster. *grins*

~Holly, who has terribly fond memories of that show...

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Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 9:56:15 PM   
Najakcharmer


Posts: 2121
Joined: 5/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956

Considering that Level sounds a lot better (fortunately) and considering that this thread has already been macerated, I was going to say that my recollection of the "Mongoose/snake" fights in Okinawa are mongooses (which are possibly native) and the "habu" which is a native pit viper which is very slow.  Not a cobra (unless I misremember my little bit of snake taxonomy) and surely not a mamba.


Habu can refer either to Trimeresurus okinavensis, a large tree viper, or to Gloydius blomhoffi (formerly Agkistrodon blomhoffi), a close taxonomic relative of our cottonmouth.  I have worked with both species (had many successful breedings of the latter) and they are absolutely not slow.   Lightning fast strike when it's feeding time, just like all healthy vipers. Either one would seriously fuck up a mongoose in its natural healthy state, unless it was severely abused in some manner prior to the show.  Which would not surprise me, since the shows themselves constitute animal abuse of the lowest order.  They could also have been using nonvenomous snakes and calling them anything they wanted, since the average layperson is not going to be able to contradict them. 

Cobras are typically the venomous snakes used in mongoose shows, specifically because cobras are pitifully slow strikers and will always get their asses kicked.  The same trick doesn't work with vipers.  Unless you abuse the viper or stick it in the fridge before the show, in which case it will indeed be too slow to do much of anything even as it is being torn apart in slow agony.  It takes a reptile a very long time to die even of mortal wounds because of their high tolerance for metabolic acidosis and oxygen deprivation, and they are as well innervated and fully sensate as any mammal. 

I'd like to get my hands on the perpetrators of these shows.  I really would. 

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 10:11:07 PM   
Najakcharmer


Posts: 2121
Joined: 5/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HollyS
Everything I know about cobras and mongooses comes from the Chuck Jones version of Rikki Tikki Tavi.  Let me tell you, Nag and Nageena weren't slow!!

Rikki was still faster. *grins*

~Holly, who has terribly fond memories of that show...


Yeah.  I was rooting for the cobras even at that age.  LOL

Lemme explain "slow".  Special equipment is always helpful but really not necessary if one is in a hurry and needs to snitch a cobra.   The handler simply waves under the snake's nose with one hand and reaches for the back of the hood with the other.  The resulting strike (if it happens at all) is so slow that an alert handler is not even aware of moving all that quickly to avoid it.  This is for normal healthy animals held at 80-90F. 

There are other ways in which they can surprise you or move quickly, but the stand and strike isn't one of them.  That's how those silly snake charmers get away with kissing them.  It's really that easy.  I don't think it is a good idea to do stupid snake tricks, but if I ever wanted to, say, put a little Santa Claus hat on a cobra for laughs, it would be remarkably easy.  The poor snake couldn't do a darn thing about it.  Which is why I'll giggle at the notion and leave it at that. 


(in reply to HollyS)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 10:27:10 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lorelei115

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie


Marie, I used to use aerosol until I discovered the hand held vaccuum.




But then you have to empty the bag, where the possibly still alive spider is lurking. They do lurk, you know.. I don't care what anyone says about spiders being non-agressive, those crawlers have it in for me... The stalk me, and if you kill one all its relatives come out for revenge..... *shudder*

No no no there is no bag.  It's a bin that gets emptied.  But only after I leave it on for about 10 minutes making sure it is good and dead.  LOL @ lurking.  Gee thanks, now I can have nightmares all night. 

(in reply to Lorelei115)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 10:44:08 PM   
ShreveportMaster


Posts: 899
Joined: 10/6/2004
From: Dallas, Tx
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Najakcharmer

quote:

ORIGINAL: HollyS
Everything I know about cobras and mongooses comes from the Chuck Jones version of Rikki Tikki Tavi.  Let me tell you, Nag and Nageena weren't slow!!

Rikki was still faster. *grins*

~Holly, who has terribly fond memories of that show...


Yeah.  I was rooting for the cobras even at that age.  LOL

Lemme explain "slow".  Special equipment is always helpful but really not necessary if one is in a hurry and needs to snitch a cobra.   The handler simply waves under the snake's nose with one hand and reaches for the back of the hood with the other.  The resulting strike (if it happens at all) is so slow that an alert handler is not even aware of moving all that quickly to avoid it.  This is for normal healthy animals held at 80-90F. 

There are other ways in which they can surprise you or move quickly, but the stand and strike isn't one of them.  That's how those silly snake charmers get away with kissing them.  It's really that easy.  I don't think it is a good idea to do stupid snake tricks, but if I ever wanted to, say, put a little Santa Claus hat on a cobra for laughs, it would be remarkably easy.  The poor snake couldn't do a darn thing about it.  Which is why I'll giggle at the notion and leave it at that. 




I'd love to see that one, I think it'd be cute, and quite harmless to the wormy in question. You could also send it to your nigerian romance scammer as a token of the festival of Chrismahaunakwanzakah.

_____________________________

"And to sooth the Bosk, there was found a Singing Cowboy. To soothe the Cowboy, a kajira is needed."

Riders of Gor
Book 37, Pg 298 ;-)

(in reply to Najakcharmer)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 11:14:29 PM   
Vendaval


Posts: 10297
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline 		Dear Level,
 
I had the same thing happen to me twice, once on each leg; complete
with redness and swelling and fever.  Keep taking all the antibiotics
and some Advil or Tylenol to aid in the soreness and fever.
 
Wishing you a good recovery,
 
Vendaval

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE


http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to Level)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 11:17:34 PM   
Missokyst


Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline 		Oh FINE!  Now I will never sleep! EWWWWWWWWWWWW
Kyst

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterKalif
maybe it put eggs in your arm.....yuuuck.


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pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses your understanding ~Gibran, Kahlil

“The truth is, everyone is going to hurt you. You just got to find the ones worth suffering for.”
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Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/6/2006 11:34:30 PM   
Stunning


Posts: 76
Joined: 7/16/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Chaingang

I wanna be the mongoose!!!

No, Gir.

(in reply to Chaingang)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Brown recluse spider - 12/7/2006 12:19:21 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Najak, I hear we here in the Carolinas have a pretty good assortment of snakes as compared to the rest of the country.
I've seen the usual assortment of copperheads squashed on the road in summer months and some black ones that I didn't know what they were.
You seem pretty well versed in herpetology, what do we have in the Carolinas?

(in reply to Najakcharmer)
Profile   Post #: 60
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