Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (Full Version)

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GeekyGirl -> Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:00:52 AM)

I'm mostly writing this to vent my own feelings, but also to hear the advice of those older and more experienced than I.

Here's the background story. I have been involved for almost 6 months now with a dominant. We have a dom/sub relationship ( not a Master/slave one.)  We also consider each other "boyfriend/girlfriend" or "lovers" etc (i.e. there is an agreement of affection, love, etc as opposed to being purely a D/s or BDSM relationship.) The entire time we have been involved, things have been a "bit rocky.".

On my end, I have been involved in some abusive relationships and have some residual mental issues which occasionally flare up (especially trust, rejection and abandonment issues.) I tend to be a little on the overly affectionate or clingy side, I get jealous easily and I don't have the highest confidence or self esteem. If the guy is not very affectionate towards me or doesn't spend a lot of time with me, I get very depressed. Then I feel guilty for behaving in an "unsubmissive manner" when I request more time and attention.

Throughout these months, this guy has tried hard to help me with these issues , but I still have a hard time trusting him and I get very upset when I feel he isn't spending much time with me.

On his end,  he hasn't been in a relationship for almost 3 years (and the last one he was in ended very badly.) He tends to be very aloof at times and needs an inordinately large amount of  "space." He says he still isn't comfortable yet with being back in a loving relationship and that he sometimes isn't sure how to act or react.

It's been an issue from the beginning that I feel he neglects me (doesn't call often enough, doesn't see me enough, etc). He feels that I smother him and don't give him enough space. I'm one of these lovey-dovey people who wants to be with my partner 24/7 and he's this tough military veteran who has this macho attitude that doesn't leave much room for passion and romance, and he doesn't want to be around me as much as I feel I need.

We live 3 hrs apart and when we are together in person, we have a great time.  However, due to work, we only see each other every 3 or 4 weeks, and I feel he doesn't spend enough time with me over the phone in between. He may go 2 or 3 days or even more without calling me. I do not feel he is involved with another person...I just feel he is very reclusive and likes to be alone most of the time.  He has his own mental and depression issues that act up. It is still hurtful for me, because I feel he doesn't make time enough for me.

I feel like he wants me to be this good friend that does what he says and has sex with him, where I want a passionate romance.

I have a hard time feeling submissive towards him because I don't feel he is actively involved in my life. I don't feel like he takes it seriously to help me with my day to day problems. He gets frustrated because "You're always coming to me for answers." Well, duh..he's my dominant...I turn to him in times of stress to help me make good decisions.

He also maintains a stong emotional distance, and is very vehement about the fact that he is not in love with me and that he is not as attached to the relationship as I am.  I think this is partially "all talk" because any time I've talked of ending the relationship, he's taken steps to convince me to stay. He says he enjoys my company and that I make him happy but that I also "annoy the hell out of him" with my clingy-ness.

I am clingy towards him because I have strong feelings for him. I always get very attached to my dominant.That's just how I am.

However, here lately I have genuinely felt like ending the relationship. I care for him and when I'm with him, I can't imagine being with anyone else..but when we're apart, he becomes so cold and aloof and doesn't want to spend as much time with me as I feel he should.

His side of the story is that I'm being unsubmissive, demanding, whiney, clingy, etc. "I"ve never had a submissive this dependant/attached to me before," he says. He feels like he's making a conscious effort to be there for me and to spend time with me and doesn't understand why I am not satistified.

In addition to the time/attention issue, I am also unsatified with our sex life. He is 37, I am almost 24. I feel like I want it 2 or 3 times a day and he only wants it once a day or once every other day when I'm with him. He seems to have a somewhat low sex drive and says that d/s relationships have never been about sex for him. He says he likes sex but that he's not "obsessed" with it like I am. He feels like I'm sex-crazed and that I put too much emphasis on it, and gets genuinely offended when I ask why we don't have sex more often. His attitude is , "Excuse me for trying to treat you like a friend and human being instead of just a sex object..that's what your ex's did to you and that's part of why you 've got mental problems."

I also feel like we don't do enough BDSM oriented sexual activities. Most of our relations are along the lines of "rough sex" but there's rarely any of the activities I enjoy (paddling, flogging, bondage, etc.) He has all the equipment but he hasn't shown much interest in using it on me (he says he doesn't like to do those activities early on in a relationship and that he doesn't feel that I'm emotionally ready for such things.) I've done all these things and more with past partners, but he feels my last Dominant used these activities abusively and that this is why I have certain issues.

Overall, I do feel like he thinks he's TRYING to be a good guy, but I still end up feeling lonely and neglected. I'm afraid that he's always going to be more emotionally distant than I'm content with and that I will always drive him crazy with my affections.

I don't want to just totally give up on him, because of the fact that I do feel he cares for me and tries to work on our problems...but then again, I worry that we'll never be able to make each other happy. I don't know if I should hold on a little longer to see if things get better or just cut my losses and move on.....

I don't feel like either one person is "right or wrong"...but just that we're having major compatibility issues. He's very stubborn and prideful and like most dominants I've known, doesn't much like the idea of compromise. Maybe this means I'm not a real a "real submissive", but I feel like I do at least have the right to feel emotionally satisfied in a relationship and to be happy.



juliaoceania -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:11:07 AM)

You know, this is one of the most objective self reflective posts I have ever seen, without blaming. You are a very mature lady. No matter what happens, you are going to have a lot of growth from this experience, if that is any consolation at this point.

My impression, both of you have very different relationship needs in important areas, and if that bridge cannot be crossed you may well drift apart even further. It seems you can see that it is not your responsibility to cross the divide, but his also. And your right, it does not make either of you "wrong" because you have differing needs, it just is the reality of it. I have been in this situation more than once. I have remained friends with people that it just could not work with, because we were good people, just too different.

The bottom line is this, we all deserve to be in a situation that meets our needs, both of you have to decide whether that is possible in this situation... Good luck no matter the outcome.



LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:13:44 AM)

I agree with Julia on every point.  There's a lot here that makes it seem like you could make the relationship work- but it might just be a case of different needs at different times and your lives aren't moving towards the same point.



MasterFireMaam -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:14:48 AM)

My personal advice (and experience): if you need someone to pay attention to you (a valid thing) in a specific manner (lots of time together) in order to trust them, find someone who is a lot closer than 3 hours away.

Master Fire



GeekyGirl -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:17:48 AM)

Thank you for your responses...I agree that long distance relationships are not something I'm enjoying. If this relationship does not work out, I think I will never get involved with someone who lives so far away again.

It's further complicated by the fact that he is not willing to move closer to me (he has friends and family there.) I am not willing to move either (I have a good job with a good retirement plan that I do not wish to give up.)





Badkitty0810 -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:20:05 AM)

Ultimately, if you are not happy in a relationship and it is showing no signs of improving, you're best to end it.  My feeling is it's best to be single than to be in a bad relationship. You can't fix your Dom's issues and it sounds to me like he's not taking steps to fix them either.

I dealt with a lot of the same issues you're dealing with with regard to trust, abandonment, etc. by going to therapy. I was in therapy for 2 years but can honestly say that it significantly changed my life, however, I wanted to change. I don't want you to think that it was a miraculous cure-all and that I'm completely over things. What therapy allowed to do was regain a sense of self-worth and develop coping mechanisms for those times when I'm not feeling my best.

You need to be able to see yourself as the beautiful, intelligent, articulate young woman that you are and you need to believe deep down that you deserve to have a loving, stable relationship with someone who will value you. I wish you all the best. You deserve it. :)



lighthearted -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:21:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

You know, this is one of the most objective self reflective posts I have ever seen, without blaming. You are a very mature lady. No matter what happens, you are going to have a lot of growth from this experience, if that is any consolation at this point.

My impression, both of you have very different relationship needs in important areas, and if that bridge cannot be crossed you may well drift apart even further. It seems you can see that it is not your responsibility to cross the divide, but his also. And your right, it does not make either of you "wrong" because you have differing needs, it just is the reality of it. I have been in this situation more than once. I have remained friends with people that it just could not work with, because we were good people, just too different.

The bottom line is this, we all deserve to be in a situation that meets our needs, both of you have to decide whether that is possible in this situation... Good luck no matter the outcome.


I'd like to echo these thoughts.  from the impression I get from your post, you two are very different in a lot of ways, and they seem more like fundamental differences rather than superficial ones. 

I'd like to add too, that as much as you may be hoping things may change, they probably won't.  it has nothing to do whether or not you're not "submissive" enough...you're just both too different.  a trap I've fallen into myself - what if I was more ________ or _________, then he'd love me more/want me more/whatever.  in the end, I've made myself more miserable trying to be something I'm not.

good luck to you.



losttreasure -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:29:23 AM)

GeekyGirl, you've received a lot of wise words here.  I will only echo the thought that change is unlikely to happen.  You are with someone who has different needs than you... expecting his needs to change will only lead to disappointment.  His expecting your needs to adapt to his own would be equally unfair.  You both deserve people with whom you are truly compatible.



SlyStone -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:41:06 AM)

You are settling for less than you deserve because you are afraid to lose what little you have. I would hope that you allow yourself the possibility that there is something better and more rewarding for you out there and I would further hope that you find it.




SirDominic -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 10:49:11 AM)

geeky, I'm going to suggest some things, and I want you to know right up front that it is not meant to be mean or insulting. It's not criticism of you, it is my interpretation of your situation.

I think it is unrealistic to expect this Dom, or any other, to deal with your many issues. You have had abusive relationships (emphasis on the plural) and have emotional scars, including trust, rejection and abandonment. These are the kinds of deep insecurities that you should be talking to a professional about. You're trying to put this on your Dom, and he just isn't trained to help you appropriately, even if he wanted to.

From everything else you have said, I don't see a future to this relationship between you and him, your needs are too opposite. I think it is in your best interests to move on, try to find someone who, at least, wants the same level of commitment that you do. But you should also get yourself some professional counseling to help you learn to cope with those serious issues. Doing both will, I believe, bring you to a place where you can have everything you want.

I hope you find your way.
Namaste, Sir Dominic



MySweetSubmssive -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 11:11:49 AM)

Hi GeekyGirl,

Your answer is written right in your post.  You and your dominant have very different relating and coping styles.  Your past experiences make you want to get closer, that you want more from your partner.  His make him aloof.  Without a lot of conscious movement, it seems the two of you will continuously be frustrating each other.  You want more affection, he gives less.  You want reassurance and advice, he doesn't want to give as much as you want.  You want sex much more frequently than he does.  You want to spend more time together -- neither of you want to move.  These relating styles and issues aren't going to go away.

What I see in your post is that you are a person who has great, great needs.  You say that this is just the way you are, and that of course you turn to him in times of stress for advice, and that your clinginess is a sign of your affection for him.  In a post that is very self reflective (as juliaoceania noted), these behaviors seem to be your blind spot.  You're saying, "This is just the way I am." 

Would you be willing to be reflective about those behaviors?  It seems to me that these behaviors and feelings must affect your relationships significantly.  Whether you stay in your relationship with your dominant or not, I think you could get a lot out of finding a therapist to work through these issues with.

Best,
MSS



GeekyGirl -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 11:27:25 AM)

Thank you for all the kind words and advice. I have gone to therapy in the past but have had difficult "sticking it out." I go a few times and then stop, perhaps because the results aren't immediate enough and I get impatient. I know that these are issues that I need to work on. You guys are absolutely right about that. I also feel that being with the right supportive partner would be beneficial to me in working through certain problems.

As for this particular relationship, we just got off the phone after a particularly nasty argument and I think things may be over. I can feel his frustration and I feel badly about the fact that I cannot seem to grasp his mindset. I told him I was tired of fighting and bickering and arguing. He said it was over, and hung up...

I don't know if I should be happy or sad. I'm afraid he'll call later and apologize and I'll take him back, even though I really don't want to.



juliaoceania -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 11:44:41 AM)

quote:

Would you be willing to be reflective about those behaviors?  It seems to me that these behaviors and feelings must affect your relationships significantly.  Whether you stay in your relationship with your dominant or not, I think you could get a lot out of finding a therapist to work through these issues with.

Best,
MSS


I would like to note, when I was first starting my current relationship and he was peeling back my layers, this clingy dependent insecure part of me came out. If he had handled it like the person described in the OP, I would probably have felt the issue was one of some fault within me, instead of the opening up of self to another, being vulnerable to another. I am not as clingy feeling as I once was, my insecurities have started to lift over time. My point of stating this is that feeling clingy, dependent, insecure could be a function of becoming vulnerable within a power exchange, it could be because a person senses the withdrawl of a lover's attention, it could be a deepseated need for being filled externally that could use therapy to overcome. But her needs for affection could be innate to her, and not at all something that she needs therapy for.

Many people hold back affection because they are taught they are too clingy, and it is not appropriate. In the beginning of a relationship many are affectionate, and as it continues the patterns of one partner to be less than affectionate come out, leaving the other without the affection needs they have being met. It is a common issue, one that I have heard over and over again from friends and family about their personal relationships. Women are not the only one that suffer from this deficit in their relationships, men also do. I just brought it up because sometimes it seems that we rush into therapy for every little thing, even normal things, like desiring an open affectionate connected relationship. I am not reading that in your post necessarily MySweetSubmissive, it just brought the thoughts to my mind....



Badkitty0810 -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 12:02:21 PM)

When I decided to see a therapist, I stayed out of any serious relationships for that time. I dated here and there, but nothing terribly significant. You can't focus on yourself and on healing when you're worrying about your partner.  Take some time away from romantic entanglements and devote that time to yourself instead. Really, being single isn't all that bad. One thing you should remember is to be with someone because you want to be, not because you need to be. As for not sticking with therapy, maybe you didn't find the right therapist. I got extremely lucky with mine. She was truly wonderful and I feel blessed that I found her. Again, good luck to you and many hugs :)



SimplyMichael -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 12:15:35 PM)

First off, it is posts like this that make me love and treasure this place.  Okay, now I played nice and the gloves come off.

My pattern used to be to pick women exactly like you, I have pretty much ended that pattern and will no longer accept it.   Not because it isn't this or that (I hate labels) but because it isn't healthy for either partner.  You posted so I am ONLY speaking to you, I could care less about him and his role.

quote:

  On my end, I have been involved in some abusive relationships and have some residual mental issues which occasionally flare up (especially trust, rejection and abandonment issues.) I tend to be a little on the overly affectionate or clingy side, I get jealous easily and I don't have the highest confidence or self esteem. If the guy is not very affectionate towards me or doesn't spend a lot of time with me, I get very depressed.


You are substituting affection and attention for self esteem and safety.    They won't, it is never enough because you are trying to fill a black hole.  You need to heal that black hole and then you will be able to deal with those issues from a stronger and more stable place.   That place may be where you would rather have nothing rather than "clinging" to something partial (which is where I have decided I am at) or perhaps that with some communication and agreement around needs you can make this deal work for you.  However, you can't make those choices well until you are strong and not comming from a place of desperation (on whatever level)

quote:

  Then I feel guilty for behaving in an "unsubmissive manner" when I request more time and attention.


Tell that little voice whispering this to shut the fuck up, that is judgemental bullshit you are heaping on yourself.

quote:

  Throughout these months, this guy has tried hard to help me with these issues , but I still have a hard time trusting him and I get very upset when I feel he isn't spending much time with me.


Think about this.  If he has truly tried hard, why isn't it working?  He can't "fix" you only you can do that, he can help, he can be supportive, but no more, the hard work is for you to do.    Think about your wording "he isn't spending enough time with me"  you are blaming him.  Imagine the power of saying "I need more time"  not need as in "bitch, give me more time" but "as a person, I need, like I need air and food, some more time".  VASTLY different places and motivations.

quote:

  He says he still isn't comfortable yet with being back in a loving relationship and that he sometimes isn't sure how to act or react.


He seems to have clearly communicated this to you but you clearly haven't heard it.  You still at times take his action as being uncaring as opposed to "he sometimes isn't sure how to act."  I know for me, when I was in the EXACT relationship you are in now, I felt blamed when she acted as you do and then got defensive and when I got defensive I attacked.  Oh BOY was that fucking fun!  Anyway, I can't see what your dynamic is but try and step outside and realize he is just as human as you are.

quote:

  It's been an issue from the beginning that I feel he neglects me (doesn't call often enough, doesn't see me enough, etc). He feels that I smother him and don't give him enough space.


Not only do you two need to sit your asses down and have a LONG and HARD conversation as equals about expectations.  As hard as that is, that is the easy part.  You then need to negotiate how to meet those expectations.  He doesn't want to call or hear from you all day but you do.  So perhaps a call in the morning and one in the evening or whatever.  You also better make it clear how to deal with it when he forgets.  This was something it has taken me years to work on but good luck to you.

quote:

  I have a hard time feeling submissive towards him because I don't feel he is actively involved in my life. I don't feel like he takes it seriously to help me with my day to day problems. He gets frustrated because "You're always coming to me for answers." Well, duh..he's my dominant...I turn to him in times of stress to help me make good decisions.


Again, you two need to come to some serious accomodations about this.  YOU though need to be careful to not mask your neediness behind using drama to stay connected.

quote:

  He also maintains a stong emotional distance, and is very vehement about the fact that he is not in love with me and that he is not as attached to the relationship as I am.  I think this is partially "all talk" because any time I've talked of ending the relationship, he's taken steps to convince me to stay.


Oh there is nothing like the lies we tell ourselves.  You need affection and are trying to force this relationship to deliver it.  Believe me, I feel for you, I am very much in the same boat, I am flailing around more than a bit myself for the same reason.  The answer is still the same.  Tough fucking shit, deal with it.  I don't like the answer any more than y ou will but it is the truth.

quote:

  I am clingy towards him because I have strong feelings for him. I always get very attached to my dominant.That's just how I am.


How you are is weak and insecure and scared and you want a big bad dominant to make everything better.  Aint gonna work.  Get your ass strong and healthy and you WILL find someone to make it all better.  It is like the deal with banks, if you are desperate for the money they won't loan it to you and if you don't really need it they will loan you any amount.

quote:

  His side of the story is that I'm being unsubmissive, demanding, whiney, clingy, etc. "I"ve never had a submissive this dependant/attached to me before," he says. He feels like he's making a conscious effort to be there for me and to spend time with me and doesn't understand why I am not satistified.


No offense but he is either the luckiest dominant on the face of the earth or he has far less experience than he thinks he does.  What you to are going through is cliched it is so commonplace.

quote:

  He says he likes sex but that he's not "obsessed" with it like I am.


He is using a guilt trip to control you, that is wrong.  A talented dominant would use the disparity to fuck with your head and control you and make it a good thing, not give you a frigging guilt trip over it.

quote:

  gets genuinely offended when I ask why we don't have sex more often.


I can just hear the words escaping your lips in a way if you heard them you would be shocked.  The way you wrote it hear implies there is something wrong with his sex drive.  Try begging for more of his cock and that you can't live without it, it might  not work but I think you are bright enough to get the point.

quote:

  His attitude is , "Excuse me for trying to treat you like a friend and human being instead of just a sex object..that's what your ex's did to you and that's part of why you 've got mental problems."


Just guessing here, but I am curious if this is more about what you heard than what he actually said to you or at least meant to say.  Any chance he was trying to say "I am not here just to use you for sex, I like you as a person too?    If not, and it is truly what he said, then again, using guilt is fucked up.

quote:

  He has all the equipment but he hasn't shown much interest in using it on me (he says he doesn't like to do those activities early on in a relationship and that he doesn't feel that I'm emotionally ready for such things.) I've done all these things and more with past partners, but he feels my last Dominant used these activities abusively and that this is why I have certain issues.


Maybe he is right and you are not ready.  If you were mine I just might do something similar.  You did pick shitty partners and perhaps he sees something although there are more positive ways to work on such issues.  Again, you have been deeply open but this is one you need to really step back and look at.  The guy may be doing you a favor and be trying to move you forward, he may be trying to be good and not quite have the skills and you just can't see that what he is doing while imperfect IS good for you.  I don't know but it is worth a thought. 

quote:

  Maybe this means I'm not a real a "real submissive", but I feel like I do at least have the right to feel emotionally satisfied in a relationship and to be happy.


It ain't much of a relationship if only one person is happy.  Don't forget thought that happiness flows from within.  Trust me girl, I am NOT writing this from a place of perfection.  I feel a bit lost myself if I am not in a relationship and I share many of your and your doms patterns.  However, I DO see it and so I have cut off relations here with some wonderful women who just are not local.  I want to wake up next to my submissive, not call her.  I want to know when I get out of school or off of work and go home, she will be there.  I don't have that and it sucks, I NEED/WANT it very very fucking badly.  Wanting it so hard makes it hard to get, you fall harder for even the whiff of it.  You need to step back  but words are much easier than action and I wish you the best of luck.



SweetSarijane -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 12:25:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

You know, this is one of the most objective self reflective posts I have ever seen, without blaming.


I have to echo this and add that it just seems like you two aren't compatible for this relationship...you each have notably different wants and needs from what I read and it's no one's fault really, you're just too different for this to work; and I read your post about the fight on the phone and it may be best for you both if it stays ended rather than making up if it comes to that choice. I honestly wish you all the best and hope that you will find someone who better matches with you.



GeekyGirl -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 12:42:18 PM)

Thank you SimplyMichael. It was very interesting to read a male perspective on the issue.



You are substituting affection and attention for self esteem and safety.    They won't, it is never enough because you are trying to fill a black hole.  You need to heal that black hole and then you will be able to deal with those issues from a stronger and more stable place.   That place may be where you would rather have nothing rather than "clinging" to something partial (which is where I have decided I am at) or perhaps that with some communication and agreement around needs you can make this deal work for you.  However, you can't make those choices well until you are strong and not comming from a place of desperation (on whatever level)

I completely agree with this...I do think I'm using affection and attention to shore up my needs for self esteem and safety. I see this has being a fault in my own character that I desperately need to work on, and I do understand why it is so frustrating for him to deal with.

 
Think about this.  If he has truly tried hard, why isn't it working?  He can't "fix" you only you can do that, he can help, he can be supportive, but no more, the hard work is for you to do.    Think about your wording "he isn't spending enough time with me"  you are blaming him.  Imagine the power of saying "I need more time"  not need as in "bitch, give me more time" but "as a person, I need, like I need air and food, some more time".  VASTLY different places and motivations.

I think he's not trying as hard as he THINKS he's trying. But it's also true that no matter how hard he tries, the change does have to come from within. I feel like "more time" is indeed a need for me right now, and that he is simply not capable of fulfilling this need. He makes what I see as excuses to not give me the time I feel I need. "I just got a new job, I'm tired. I'm having such-and-such problem, etc." My answer to that is "Even if you are tired and busy, a quick 2 minute phone call would do wonders for my mindset...I'm not asking for a 2hr conversation,but just to know you thought of me." But then again, it is a fault within myself that I need such things in order to feel special and cared for.

He seems to have clearly communicated this to you but you clearly haven't heard it.  You still at times take his action as being uncaring as opposed to "he sometimes isn't sure how to act."  I know for me, when I was in the EXACT relationship you are in now, I felt blamed when she acted as you do and then got defensive and when I got defensive I attacked.  Oh BOY was that fucking fun!  Anyway, I can't see what your dynamic is but try and step outside and realize he is just as human as you are.

And this is where my indecision comes in...I know that he is really trying, or thinks he is,and I do not want to be too quick to judge him. It is obvious to me that he is hurting and frustrated just as I am.


Not only do you two need to sit your asses down and have a LONG and HARD conversation as equals about expectations.  As hard as that is, that is the easy part.  You then need to negotiate how to meet those expectations.  He doesn't want to call or hear from you all day but you do.  So perhaps a call in the morning and one in the evening or whatever.  You also better make it clear how to deal with it when he forgets.  This was something it has taken me years to work on but good luck to you.

We have been attempting this, but it seems like the conversation goes in circles and nothing gets accomplished. I suggest he could just call me every other day, just for a few moments, and he seemed to feel that I was setting demands upon him. His response was basically, "I'll call you when I have time and I can't promise to do that on a certain schedule." I get tired of having the same conversation about these things with him over and over again, since it makes both of us angry and nothing is resolved. I tend to feel like I am willing to compromise, and he isn't...but I may not be seeing both sides of the situation.

Again, you two need to come to some serious accomodations about this.  YOU though need to be careful to not mask your neediness behind using drama to stay connected.

That's a good point...sometimes I feel like he won't talk to me just for the sake of having a conversation, but if something is "wrong", he'll take the time to talk to me. Therefore whenever something, no matter how small, goes "wrong", I use that as an excuse to spend time on the phone with him. If I call him and leave him a voice message saying, "Gee I'd really like to talk to you tonight, just because I miss you," then he never calls back...If I leave a message saying, "I have a problem and I need to talk to you", then he DOES call me back. It's wrong of me to do this....but sometimes I'm just desperate for his company.

How you are is weak and insecure and scared and you want a big bad dominant to make everything better.  Aint gonna work.  Get your ass strong and healthy and you WILL find someone to make it all better.  It is like the deal with banks, if you are desperate for the money they won't loan it to you and if you don't really need it they will loan you any amount.

I hate to admit this, but yes you are right...I feel like the right dominant will make "everything better." It IS weak...and it's something I have to find the strength within myself to fix.

No offense but he is either the luckiest dominant on the face of the earth or he has far less experience than he thinks he does.  What you to are going through is cliched it is so commonplace.

I think he tries to make it sound like he is more experienced than he is really is sometimes...He swears that none of his ex's were as attached to him as I am, but I tend to think it's fairly commonplace for submissives to get too dependant upon their dominant.

 I can just hear the words escaping your lips in a way if you heard them you would be shocked.  The way you wrote it hear implies there is something wrong with his sex drive.  Try begging for more of his cock and that you can't live without it, it might  not work but I think you are bright enough to get the point.

LOL, been there and done that...I'm pretty obvious about my sexual needs! The problem is that we are apart so often, and he has no interest whatsoever in phone sex, etc and gets annoyed if I ask for it..when I'm with him in person, it's easier to persuade him to go to bed with me. However, even in person, it depends on his mood....I try to be all cute and sexy and he just ignores it if he is  in the wrong mood. It's very hard on my self esteem when he does that.

Just guessing here, but I am curious if this is more about what you heard than what he actually said to you or at least meant to say.  Any chance he was trying to say "I am not here just to use you for sex, I like you as a person too?    If not, and it is truly what he said, then again, using guilt is fucked up.

No, that was a direct quote, lol...

Maybe he is right and you are not ready.  If you were mine I just might do something similar.  You did pick shitty partners and perhaps he sees something although there are more positive ways to work on such issues.  Again, you have been deeply open but this is one you need to really step back and look at.  The guy may be doing you a favor and be trying to move you forward, he may be trying to be good and not quite have the skills and you just can't see that what he is doing while imperfect IS good for you.  I don't know but it is worth a thought. 

In this subject, I think he is being genuine and he truly feels I am not ready. He feels my previous dominant rushed things with me and caused some mental and emotional damage, and he feels he is trying to heal me. He's not always doing a good job of it, but I do see his effort for what it is...he is trying hard, even if he is not succeeding.

It ain't much of a relationship if only one person is happy.  Don't forget thought that happiness flows from within.  Trust me girl, I am NOT writing this from a place of perfection.  I feel a bit lost myself if I am not in a relationship and I share many of your and your doms patterns.  However, I DO see it and so I have cut off relations here with some wonderful women who just are not local.  I want to wake up next to my submissive, not call her.  I want to know when I get out of school or off of work and go home, she will be there.  I don't have that and it sucks, I NEED/WANT it very very fucking badly.  Wanting it so hard makes it hard to get, you fall harder for even the whiff of it.  You need to step back  but words are much easier than action and I wish you the best of luck.

I feel like you on this...I want to be there with him physically and the distance is taking a huge toll...Thank you for the support and honesty.




MySweetSubmssive -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 12:48:24 PM)

And I didn't make my suggestion lightly.  I don't know this young woman, or all the circumstances.  I don't want to pose as a trained therapist (I'm not).  However, to *my* eye, it looks like therapy *might* be useful.  Do note that my suggestions in my post were not posed as absolutes.

I think that male modes of being have been used as a healthy standard -- "independence" that manifests as not asking for help or stoical non-connection.  In medical (and psychological) care, "women's" ways of being -- interdependence, nurturing, affection -- have often been seen as pathological.  Please know that this is not what I'm advocating.  I'm a pretty interdependent person myself. 

However, the unexamined idea that the amount of love one feels for someone can or should be expressed as clinginess does give me cause for concern.  It looks to me like GeekyGirl is seeing her dominant as "the source" for herself and her happiness.  In her post, she goes to him for a lot, in a relationship that is fairly new.  It seems like too much, too fast to me. 

I hope this clarifies where I'm coming from.

I agree that his way of being isn't likely to bring out the best in someone (it would drive me nuts!).  However, he isn't asking for advice, she is.

MSS



junecleaver -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 1:08:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GeekyGirl
I feel like I do at least have the right to feel emotionally satisfied in a relationship and to be happy.
 Yes, you do.   He's not meeting your needs.  He seems to have no intentions of meeting your needs.  It's not that he is a bad guy, but he's maybe not the right guy for you?   At one time I thought that because I was submissive I was suppose to be flexible.  I didn't feel like I had a 'right' to have criteria like affectionate and lovey-dovey.  It was just a difference that I had to 'get over.'  But at least for me, there are some important fundamentals and I cannot just get over not having them in a relationship.  If I need x,y,z to be satisfied in a relationship, then I expect my partner to give me x and y and at least be working on some z. I think you have the right to be selective and keep specific standards.  In the end, settling for something only causes a lot of trouble which I'm sure you've already found out from previous experience. Being lovey-dovey is a gift.  You don't push away affection because you are scared of the feeling.  It kind of forces you to stay open.  He has his own issues to work out and it sounds like maybe being in control of another person (especially one who says herself she has issues) is not the best place to do that. Break it off now if you're going to break it off.  Living three hours away will actually come in handy if you decide to break up.  You don't have to worry about bumping into him.  It will still hurt, but the longer it lasts the worse it becomes. and long distance sucks. :(



Celeste43 -> RE: Tough Decisions and Knowing When to Move On (1/28/2007 1:26:12 PM)

Neither one of you are wrong, you just aren't compatible. You need a D/s relationship with affection and affirmation and a lot of contact. He needs a D/s relationship with less of a personal relationship and only contact once or twice a week. It doesn't make you needy and it doesn't make him afraid of emotional intimacy, it just makes you incompatible.

He can't meet your needs and you can't meet his. You could try compromise and agree to talk at ten three times a week but he'll be dreading the required calls and you'll feel his desire to get off the phone immediately. When you add to this the fact that there's no chance for the relationship to work in the long term, I think you know that you would do better seeing others while remaining friends.



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