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"Campus killer's purchases apparently within gun l... - 4/19/2007 6:06:35 PM   
Vendaval


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"Campus killer's purchases aparently within gun laws"

(CNN) -- When Cho Seung-Hui purchased two handguns this year, he apparently followed the letter of the law to get the weapons he eventually used in a shooting rampage on the Virginia Tech campus.

Some questions have been raised over Cho's mental health and whether that should have prevented him from being able to purchase the handguns.

A Virginia judge in December 2005 deemed Cho "an imminent danger to himself because of mental illness" and ordered outpatient treatment for him, according to court documents. (Watch campus shooting rekindle debate on gun control )

Special Justice Paul M. Barnett, who filled out the certification and order for involuntary admission to a mental health facility, checked the box that said: "The alternatives to involuntary hospitalization and treatment were investigated and deemed suitable."
 
"Only if I order them into a hospital is there any effect on their gun rights," Barnett told CNN on Wednesday. (Read the judge's order - PDF)

Virginia and federal law prohibit the sale of guns to anyone who has been sent unwillingly to a mental institution.

Police twice investigated Cho in the fall of 2005 after female students complained about his contacts with them, university police Chief Wendell Flinchum said Wednesday. Neither of the women pressed charges.

A former suite mate of Cho, who wished to be identified only as Andy, told CNN that Cho had harassed three women and had spoken of suicide after a run-in with police.

"I told the cops that. And they took him away to the counseling center for a night or two," the roommate said.


The Virginia State Police Web site features a 16-question "Firearms Purchase Eligibility Test." The site says that answering yes to any of the queries means a person may not be able to purchase a firearm.
 
Question 9 states: Have you ever been adjudicated legally incompetent, mentally incapacitated, or been involuntarily committed to a mental institution?
 
Because Cho was not involuntarily committed to a mental institution, his appearance before the judge and his evaluation at a mental health facility did not show up when he bought the guns.

Gun buyers are regulated by the laws of the state in which they live.
 
In Virginia, a person 21 or older can buy only one handgun a month, unless he has a license to buy more. Cho bought one gun, a .22-caliber pistol, in early February and another, a 9 mm pistol, in March.

Cho bought one of the guns he used in the shootings from an out-of-state dealer, according to Joe Dowdy, the owner of the pawnshop across the street from campus where Cho picked up the Walther P22 pistol on February 9.

Under federal law, a weapon purchased from an out-of-state dealer must be shipped to an in-state, federally licensed gun dealer, who runs a background check. The buyer must appear in person to pick up the gun, and the dealer receives a small fee -- usually between $20 and $40 -- for facilitating the pickup.

Cho bought a Glock 19 and 50 rounds of ammunition on March 12, staying just within the limit of one gun purchase per month, said John Markell at Roanoke Firearms in nearby Roanoke.

Even though Cho is a resident alien, Markell said, it was legal for him to purchase a firearm, and he presented three forms of identification: a driver's license, a checkbook with an address matching the driver's license, and a resident alien card. Cho moved to the United States from South Korea at age 8.

State police conducted an instant background check that probably took about a minute, the store owner said.
 
Virginia law requires no waiting period, so Cho was able to legally take home the Glock on the same day that he bought it.

Markell, whose daughter graduated from Virginia Tech in 1997, said he was "heartbroken" to find out one of the guns came from his store. But, he said,
"There was no reason for me to deny the sale."

Criminal defense attorney Daniel Gotlin told CNN he believes the easiest way to prevent similar incidents in the future "is to not make guns so easily available to individuals with problems."

"Virginia has one of the easiest gun qualification laws in the whole United States," he said.

And Democratic Virginia Rep. Jim Moran said on the House floor: "It is simply too easy to obtain a firearm."

But Jacob Sullum of Reason magazine says gun-control laws "disarm the law-abiding people, but they leave the criminals free to attack their victims who have no defense."

"It's never been never demonstrated in any conclusive way that gun control reduces crime," he said.

CNN's Drew Griffin, Jeanne Meserve, Christine Romans and Michael Sevanof contributed to this story. 
 
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/19/gun.laws/index.html



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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/19/2007 8:22:50 PM   
Pulpsmack


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The waiting period restriction is more meaningless legislation.

Under the facts in question, there could have been a month long waiting period and it would not have changed anything. The only argument that can be made for a waiting period is that a hot-headed person might have X amount of days to cool off before doing something foolish. I will assume that there exists a case in which somebody purchased a firearm, loaded it, and hours later committed some violent crime, but these high profile slayings which draw all the speculation show that these malcontents make deliberated, well orchestrated steps in planning their mayhem, often in weeks, months, or longer.

Waiting  "X" days doesn't make the computer go "oh shit... I missed that: DENIED." So, now an entire branch of government must be hired to conduct full-scale investigations on each individual purchaser in order to ensure that the computer's records are consistent... an astronomical amount of manhours would be required. And this is only the issues that surround a first time buyer. I have had occasion to buy 4 firearms within the period of 2 months (all purchases were seperate). So what is the choice now, conduct 4 extensive checks as if I was a first time buyer, wasting even more taxpayer dollars, or keeping all my information on file, violating even more civil liberties?

And what about the "necessity" of swiftness? These resrictions do more than delay the hothead.  Consider the following:

- A woman receives contact from her stalker... an abusive ex who has beaten her seriously in the past. He assured her he would kill her if she ever pissed him off again. She reports the information and files a TRO. The police haven't been able to catch up with him and cannot act until he shows up.

- A serial killer is on a rampage, and he has moved from prostitutes, to coeds, to visiting homes (see the Derrick Todd Lee case that happened here only a few years ago). The odds of being the next person are statistically absurd, but that's no comfort to a woman who lives alone. There is no police protection for her individually

- The next hurricane devistates coastal areas in three different states. There are have been stabbings at gas lines and widespread lootings.

So, you are forced between a having a meaningless delay that has no more effect than the instant NICS background check, or you have to make a full-scale commitment that requires millions of tax payer dollars, the potential violation of civil rights, and the promise of human error when red flags slip past tired/overworked eyes. 

(in reply to Vendaval)
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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/19/2007 8:48:01 PM   
Termyn8or


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"shall not be infringed"

These dead people were college students. They were likely to be over 18, and if even ONE of them in that room had another gun, maybe only fifteen people would've died. Tell that to the families of the last fifteen shot.

Tell that to the Parents of the kid they sent to counselling because after Columbine he told the teacher would've felt safer if the teachers were armed.

When somebody opens up in a post office, McDonald's anything, does it really take a 160 IQ to see that if other people had guns they could stop the shit ? Just how much brains does it take to figure out, want to stop hijackings ? Arm the pilots. I could see it now "Take dis plane to Cuba", OK BOOM. Using a hollow point the airplane is not damaged. "Houston, we got a dead hijacker here so we will need a cleanup when we land".

If people do not see that they need to protect themselves, I don't think they are very smart.

As stupid as it sounds, remember All In The Family ? Archie Bunker said "Pass out the pistols, nobody will try anything". That statement was correct. You got what 50 people on a plane and they all got guns, you got one. Try to hijack it ! Irrefutable logic. There are alot of things I don't like about the character, but that statement was right, period.

Every time they take guns, crime increases, when gun ownership is highest, crime is lowest. Proven everwhere in the world. If ONE other person in the room had a gun, things could've turned out way different, with alot less lives being lost. If ONE person at the Columbine shooting had broken the law and brought a gun to school, lives would have been saved most likely, or at least possibly. At least possibly, because they seem to have a penchant for making law abiding Citizens defenseless, while they employ bodyguards and whatever for themselves.

As long as it doesn't bother them.

Nuff. I can feel my BP rising, and not in a good way.

T

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/19/2007 10:15:03 PM   
popeye1250


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Termin8tor, that's true, just look at Boston, NYC and Washington.
If I was a college student going back to school on monday at VT you can bet I'd be packing!

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/19/2007 10:24:30 PM   
BOUNTYHUNTER


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VIRGINIA has one of the easy states to purchase a weapon.so many of va guns are showing up in DC ,NYC ,Chicago so whats to stop this stuff

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/19/2007 11:11:54 PM   
popeye1250


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I wonder why these wackos never attack police stations, gun stores, certain bars or places like that?
Gun clubs, nope, when is the last time there was a mass killing at a gun club?
With these "No guns" rules schools have become "soft targets" with many targets of opportunity available and no resistance for the kook.
Surely they must know this as crazy as they are because they keep going after the "soft target" schools and not police stations.
It's pretty obvious that we need to scrap all those stupid laws and get guns back into the schools.

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 2:01:26 PM   
Vendaval


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General reply -
 
I am passing along information to the boards as it becomes available in the news. 
If one of you fine fellows can provide some links to the differences between the
gun laws in various states, please do so.  That is very pertinent to the discussion.  

Blessed Be,
 
Vendaval

 

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 2:09:42 PM   
popeye1250


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

General reply -
 
I am passing along information to the boards as it becomes available in the news. 
If one of you fine fellows can provide some links to the differences between the
gun laws in various states, please do so.  That is very pertinent to the discussion.  

Blessed Be,
 
Vendaval

 


Vendeval, I have right here in front of me a 2007 copy of  "The Travellers' Guide to the Firearm Laws of the fifty States."
What would you like to know?

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 2:20:13 PM   
Vendaval


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The press is reporting differences between Federal laws and State laws
regarding firearms.  I am trying to find the differences and how
those are decided and regulated.
 
What branches of the government specifically regulate these laws? 
The obvious one is the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. 
 
At at State level, where are the rules made?
The State legislature?  The State governor? 

 
What about local ordinances at the county and city level? 
How much input does the public have in the decision making process?

And are the laws about no firearms on schools applicable only to

public institutions?  To schools with students under the age of 18?
What about private institutions?

(Some obvious examples of campuses with firearms present
being ROTC, military academies, police academies and
gunsmithing schools.)
 
I am thinking that the FAA regulates the "no guns on planes"
rule.  Does that apply to both domestic and international flights?
 
Are those enough complicated questions?  lol
 
Thank you for offering your resources, Popeye.
 
Regards,
 
Vendaval

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE


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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 2:52:22 PM   
popeye1250


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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

The press is reporting differences between Federal laws and State laws
regarding firearms.  I am trying to find the differences and how
those are decided and regulated.
 
What branches of the government specifically regulate these laws? 
The obvious one is the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. 
 
At at State level, where are the rules made?
The State legislature?  The State governor? 

 
What about local ordinances at the county and city level? 
How much input does the public have in the decision making process?

And are the laws about no firearms on schools applicable only to

public institutions?  To schools with students under the age of 18?
What about private institutions?

(Some obvious examples of campuses with firearms present
being ROTC, military academies, police academies and
gunsmithing schools.)
 
I am thinking that the FAA regulates the "no guns on planes"
rule.  Does that apply to both domestic and international flights?
 
Are those enough complicated questions?  lol
 
Thank you for offering your resources, Popeye.
 
Regards,
 
Vendaval


Well, these are State Laws and yes they are made by the Legislatures.
As for the Feds the only thing it has for all the states pages is "Machine Gun Ownership; Some say "compliance with Federal Law" only.
Some states say Compliance with state & local officials and Federal Laws." as regards machine guns.
Yes, you can get a Federal Lisense to have a Machine Gun.

The categories that this guide coveres by State are;
Firearms Ownership.
Assault Weapons Ownership
Machine Gun Ownership
Firearm Law Uniformity
Right of Self Defense
Open Carry
Vehicle Carry and Transportation
And that's for each individual state.
So, if you want to know some thing about an individual state in the above categories let me know.

I'll list the laws for my state, South Carolina.
1.Firearms Ownership; unrestricted, no permit or lisense required.
2. Assault Weapon Ownership; unrestricted, no permit or lisense required.
3. Machine Gun Ownership, compliance of relevant portions of federal law.
4. Firearm Law Uniformity; preemption law, firearms laws uniform throughout state.
5. Right of Self Defense; castle doctrine, right protected by statute.
6. Open Carry, prohibited in most "public" areas.
7. Concealed Carry;lisences granted to qualified persons on a "shall issue" basis; reciprocity available for permits from certain other states.
8. Vehicle carry and transportation; loaded handguns may be carried in a closed glove compartment or console;rifles and shotguns may be loaded while in trunk or passenger area. (some exceptions-see below)
Now some states will be more liberal on those laws a few will be more restrictive.

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 3:04:24 PM   
Vendaval


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Well, these are State Laws and yes they are made by the Legislatures.
As for the Feds the only thing it has for all the states pages is "Machine Gun Ownership; Some say "compliance with Federal Law" only.

Thank you for answering that.

Some states say Compliance with state & local officials and Federal Laws." as regards machine guns.
Yes, you can get a Federal Lisense to have a Machine Gun.

Never knew that before!

The categories that this guide coveres by State are;
Firearms Ownership.
Assault Weapons Ownership
Machine Gun Ownership
Firearm Law Uniformity
Right of Self Defense
Open Carry
Vehicle Carry and Transportation
And that's for each individual state.
So, if you want to know some thing about an individual state in the above categories let me know.

Sure thing

I'll list the laws for my state, South Carolina.
1.Firearms Ownership; unrestricted, no permit or lisense required.
2. Assault Weapon Ownership; unrestricted, no permit or lisense required.
3. Machine Gun Ownership, compliance of relevant portions of federal law.

4. Firearm Law Uniformity; preemption law, firearms laws uniform throughout state.

What is does #4 refer too?  Not familiar with the term.

5. Right of Self Defense; castle doctrine, right protected by statute.

"Castle doctrine" ?  As in "your home is your castle" ?

6. Open Carry, prohibited in most "public" areas.

So carrying in the open on private property with the owner's
permission is allowed, but not carrying in the open in public,
i.e. municipal areas, county, etc.  Is that correct?

7. Concealed Carry;lisences granted to qualified persons on a "shall issue" basis; reciprocity available for permits from certain other states.

So in particular states, the permit granted from another state
is honored?  But that does not apply to all states?

8. Vehicle carry and transportation; loaded handguns may be carried in a closed glove compartment or console; rifles and shotguns may be loaded while in trunk or passenger area. (some exceptions-see below)

My friends that transport firearms to the indoor or outdoor range carry in their trunk usually.  I know a few people who carry a handgun
in their glove compartment.

Now some states will be more liberal on those laws a few will be more restrictive.

Some of the posters here have mentioned that my state,
California, has some of the most restrictive laws.
 
Do you have some examples?



_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE


http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to popeye1250)
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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 3:56:18 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Well, these are State Laws and yes they are made by the Legislatures.
As for the Feds the only thing it has for all the states pages is "Machine Gun Ownership; Some say "compliance with Federal Law" only.

Thank you for answering that.

Some states say Compliance with state & local officials and Federal Laws." as regards machine guns.
Yes, you can get a Federal Lisense to have a Machine Gun.

Never knew that before!

The categories that this guide coveres by State are;
Firearms Ownership.
Assault Weapons Ownership
Machine Gun Ownership
Firearm Law Uniformity
Right of Self Defense
Open Carry
Vehicle Carry and Transportation
And that's for each individual state.
So, if you want to know some thing about an individual state in the above categories let me know.

Sure thing

I'll list the laws for my state, South Carolina.
1.Firearms Ownership; unrestricted, no permit or lisense required.
2. Assault Weapon Ownership; unrestricted, no permit or lisense required.
3. Machine Gun Ownership, compliance of relevant portions of federal law.

4. Firearm Law Uniformity; preemption law, firearms laws uniform throughout state.

What is does #4 refer too?  Not familiar with the term.

5. Right of Self Defense; castle doctrine, right protected by statute.

"Castle doctrine" ?  As in "your home is your castle" ?

6. Open Carry, prohibited in most "public" areas.

So carrying in the open on private property with the owner's
permission is allowed, but not carrying in the open in public,
i.e. municipal areas, county, etc.  Is that correct?

7. Concealed Carry;lisences granted to qualified persons on a "shall issue" basis; reciprocity available for permits from certain other states.

So in particular states, the permit granted from another state
is honored?  But that does not apply to all states?

8. Vehicle carry and transportation; loaded handguns may be carried in a closed glove compartment or console; rifles and shotguns may be loaded while in trunk or passenger area. (some exceptions-see below)

My friends that transport firearms to the indoor or outdoor range carry in their trunk usually.  I know a few people who carry a handgun
in their glove compartment.

Now some states will be more liberal on those laws a few will be more restrictive.

Some of the posters here have mentioned that my state,
California, has some of the most restrictive laws.
 
Do you have some examples?




Number 4 the "Pre-emption law" means that local cities or towns can't make their own gunlaws and have to go by State law. They are "Preempted" from doing so.

Number 5Castle Doctrine, yup, your home is your Castle!
The homeowner does not have to retreat.

Number 6 yup, you can carry openly on private property with permission to hunt or target shoot for example or for some reason you can carry openly while fishing. (The Crocs maybe?)
Of course you couldn't carry openly in a shopping mall or walking down Main street

Number 7 yes, permits from some states are honored here as well, for example permits to carry concealed in the following states are honored in S. Carolina too; Alaska, Arkansas, Louisiana, Michigan, Missouri, North Carolina, Ohio, Texas, Tennessee, Wyoming.
Texas honors carry permits from 38 other states.
Massachusetts won't recognise any out of state permits.
And yes, in South Carolina you can carry a loaded handgun in your glove compartment or console of your vehicle without any type of permit needed.
You can carry concealed from your vehicle to your hotel room and vice versa if passing through the state.
California? It's fucked.
San Francisco banned all handguns despite a State "Premption law!"
They broke state law! lol
No reciprocity for other states.
Limited CWPs.
No open carry in incorporated areas.
Can carry openly in rural unincorporated areas.
Also, I think that if issued a CWP (concealed weapons permit) is only issued for the County of residence and not the state!
That's screwed up!
Sounds like you guys have a lot of work to do on your state legislators!

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 5:53:20 PM   
Termyn8or


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In my circumstance, well there has been some discussion.

I know someone who shot someone in the back and got away with it, the reason is because the guy was fleeing with one of my buddy's other guns. He still sat in jail for a couple of days under investigation.

This was years ago and the guy is dead from a car wreck, but he did get the gun he shot the guy with back. Problem is it took connections to do it.

Under current law, if I find someone broke into my home while I was there I would kill them without hesitation. But what happens next is not what you expect.

In a country I would call my own I would of course call the law and have them get this dead MF out before he stinks up the place, but the current climate forces another method.

At this point what I would do is just sit there, if the door was not kicked down I would lock it. I would wait an hour or so, get a razor knife and roll the body up in the carpet. Believe me that is the only sensible thing to do, but you need some real friends that'll help you do that.

It may be wrong, but so what ? If the laws were right they would pick the body up, notify the family and have a proper burial. The current laws would force me along with a few others I know, to act to conceal the shooting, no matter how justified.

I read the Turner Diaries with about as much horror as I can muster, not toward the end where things get really hairy, in the beginning  When a person protecting themselves gets a stiffer sentence than the burglar. Can you imagine a world like that ? A world where they can kick your door down and rape your olady, take all your valuables and you can't shoot them.

The reasons for this have been crystal clear to me for a long time. How about you ?

T

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 8:00:54 PM   
Sinergy


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I know in the state of California you may carry a gun inside your car provided the ammunition is locked in the trunk, or vice versa.

I have any number of martial arts weapons (police PR-24 side handle baton, extending police baton, etc) in my martial arts bag.  These are a felony to carry except to and from training class.

You also have the right to strike the first blow if you feel your life is in danger.  There are aspects to shooting an unarmed person with a gun that make it difficult to convince a jury that you felt your life was in danger.  While we dont have the "Make My Day" law like Colorado, odds are fairly good you will not be convicted of anything if you drop a person in your own home.  This is California, though, so if the person is not dead you will be sued for their medical care.  There are aspects to California law that seem a bit bizarre to me.  That one basically tells me that our laws are set up that if you drop somebody in your house make sure they are dead.

I had a friend up in the high desert who would wear his holstered sidearm out jogging.  He was not in the city; he was in the desert.

I never went to Dragon Firearms in Colorado Springs to "get it out of my system" firing their twin .50 caliber machine guns.  I may have to go back there to make sure it is out of my system.

Sinergy

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/20/2007 9:22:11 PM   
popeye1250


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Termin8tor, yeah, if I had to shoot someone -get rid of the body or in the case of an armed robbery just pick up your shells and walk.
The Police are the LAST people to call.
Sinergy, you mean like Nun-chuks and stuff like that are illegal to carry in Calif?
It's a felony? That's fucked!
You guys really need to change a bunch of laws out there!

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/21/2007 12:28:31 AM   
Vendaval


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I have know about the martial arts weapons restrictions for years.
And the law suits out here are frequently mind-boggling.
 
Your friend who takes a weapon jogging while alone in a rural
area makes sense to me.  If I was going hiking out in a remote
area taking weaponry along would be a very good idea, along
with a way to communicate in case of injury.  Not all areas
get cell reception, so what would be the best type of radio
to carry in a vehicle for those circumstances?

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE


http://KinkMeet.co.uk

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RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/21/2007 12:34:38 AM   
Vendaval


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Thank you for looking up that information, Popeye.
 
I remember an incident in my family's neighborhood several
years ago.  A house across the street was no longer occupied
by the owners but instead was a rental for a family that sold
drugs.  They had all kinds of people coming and going at all
hours of the day and night.  One night, either a rival pusher
or a dis-satisfied customer pulled up in his car and started
waving a hand gun around and shouting, "I got a piece!"
 
I got to the back bedroom, called the house next door and told
the girls there to go to the back of their house and stay down low.
Then got on the phone with 911.  The dispatcher asked me to
describe the gun in greater detail.  I told her that was not possible.
(What, you want me to go ask him?!)  The cops arrived and dealth
with the problem.  Thankfully nobody was shot or injured.
 
We had firearms in the house and were ready to deal with
the situation if he targeted us.

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE


http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: "Campus killer's purchases apparently within g... - 4/21/2007 11:31:23 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

Thank you for looking up that information, Popeye.
 
I remember an incident in my family's neighborhood several
years ago.  A house across the street was no longer occupied
by the owners but instead was a rental for a family that sold
drugs.  They had all kinds of people coming and going at all
hours of the day and night.  One night, either a rival pusher
or a dis-satisfied customer pulled up in his car and started
waving a hand gun around and shouting, "I got a piece!"
 
I got to the back bedroom, called the house next door and told
the girls there to go to the back of their house and stay down low.
Then got on the phone with 911.  The dispatcher asked me to
describe the gun in greater detail.  I told her that was not possible.
(What, you want me to go ask him?!)  The cops arrived and dealth
with the problem.  Thankfully nobody was shot or injured.
 
We had firearms in the house and were ready to deal with
the situation if he targeted us.


Ven, I've never had anything like that happen to me. No gun incidents at all and carrying for 20 years or so and never had to use it and I hope it stays that way.
Well in "civilian life" anyway.
In the Coast Guard things were different.

(in reply to Vendaval)
Profile   Post #: 18
Page:   [1]
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