Padriag
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lacyann
Can a Master give insight into the ownership protocol regarding changing Master's.
this girl is in a training agreement with a Master and his Mistress Wife.
this girl's long term goal is to enter a committed long term relationship and Master and MIstress agree that at some point she will be leaving them.
yet other Masters who want to engage this girl are frustrated that this girl is not free to meet them freely and they do not want to go through her training Master for permission to meet or play with this girl.
girl understands this is for her safety but feels some what put in the middle and does not know which way to go or if she should intercede in any way.
thank You for your feed back and information.
lacyann
If you are part of an organized group they will have set protocols about this and you should ask your mentor / trainer. Otherwise you need to realize that in the general sense, there are no set protocols for this. I take it from your brief post that you are dealing with a dominant or dominants who are not part of any group and probably have minimal contact with your trainer, if so I think I can see the source of the frustration. I'll try to explain a few things, and this will involve a short history lesson, but if you will bear with me you'll find it will help you understand the broader picture much better.
Currently the "lifestyle" and those active in it are undergoing some fairly dramatic changes, including changes in ideas of what is "correct" and how things should be done. To understand that, you need a little perspective about how things started to see how much they've changed. Twenty plus years ago most involved in this lifestyle were members of faily small and secretive groups. Lone individuals tended to be so isolated they had no impact on the "community" at large, so the early customs and protocols came from these small groups. Over time, these small groups had established rules of conduct for their own groups about how members should behave, how they should be educated, etc. That was fine for the time, when you have a small organized group thats easy to do because you are not having to deal with outside influences very often. Move forward to about 10 years ago an you have a changing environment. Thanks to BBS networks and the fledgling internet these groups are more and more in contact with each other and exchanging ideas. Those lone individuals are now able to make more connections with other people... you have the beginnings of the larger online BDSM community. The ideas about protocols these smaller groups had tended to dominant the thinking at the time because afterall, they had experience to back them up and few challenged that. However, in the last 10 years things have really exploded and with that has come increasing change and a shift away from organized groups. Individuals who are unaffiliated with any group now make up the majority, and they are a vocal majority. Not only that, but they are overall an educated and intelligent majority, who read quite a bit, and as such they've challenged a lot of that old thinking. Many choose to set their own "protocols" and pursue their own interests, which isn't surprising really, they have little incentive to follow the rules of groups they are not, never have been, and never intend to be part of.
Which brings us round to your problem. From what I gather, your trainers hold to the idea of being involved and having final say in selecting who your Master will be. This is an idea that can be traced back to those older groups from 20+ years ago. Unfortunately in the last 10 years that idea has become very dated, and many of the dominants you meet don't hold with that thinking or even understand it. They may want a slave, but many will have difficulty with the idea of you being owned and given away by another (the idea of slave trading, selling, etc. is repulsive to a lot of the recent dominants coming to this lifestyle, and having a "trainer" dictate who you can go to is too close to that for many to accept). Many will see you as an individual who should be making the choice for herself, not leaving it up to a trainer; and as you have discovered, conflict follows.
As to what you can do in this situation. First you need to foster what communication you can. Make sure dominants interested in you understand your situation upfront, that they know what your boundaries are and what is expected of them. This needs to be very clear from the start. If you're trainers expect an interested dominant to speak with them, provide certain kinds of information, etc, the prospective dominant needs to know this from the start in fairness to them. You need to find out from the prospective dominant in the beginning if they are comfortable with this. You also need to make clear what the prospective dominant can expect in return, what kind of information check will you or your trainer provide? For example (and I'm taking this from personal experience), if the trainer expects a prospective dominant to provide a home phone number, their full real name and submit to a background check... will you and the trainer provide the same in return (in my case they would not, which became very frustrating very quickly). When trainers expect a lot, but don't give an equal measure in return, that can easily put off many dominants.
Finally, you need to understand that some dominants simply will not get too involved with you as long as you are in your current situation. It may come down to something as old fashioned as not wanting to get involved in what they perceive and an existing relationship, it may seem too complicated or too much like someone "playing around". Some may simply not be willing to become involved with you because they don't share and will expect you to leave your current situation before they will get serious about you. You may not like it, but all of those are valid protests on the part of a dominant. I have some more bad news for you, your situation will limit your choices to those who are willing to accept your situation, and that may mean you have to let go of some dominants you otherwise liked. That's just how it is, I'm not trying to ruin your day, but you need some honesty about how things are.
Lastly, I have a question for your trainers... what are they doing to help resolve this situation? Are they actively trying to work with this prospective dominant to find a happy compromise everyone can live with? Or are they sitting on their asses expecting him to come to them and kowtow to their rules? If its the later, then your trainers are contributing to the problem, and that is something you need to consider.
quote:
ORIGINAL: FuriousAngel
I wonder why exactly it is that the Dom's you speak of have issue with contacting your trainer? I've always been led to understand that in cases such as yours, where it's required that the Dom go through the trainer, that it's quite accepted by experienced Dominants as they are respectful of such arrangements?
This just isn't true anymore, and for the very reasons I gave above. In the rapidly changing, and increasingly freeform, "community" we have now these kinds of rules or understanding of protocols cannot be relied upon. Don't assume anyone you meet in this lifestyle will automatically understand your protocols or ways of doing things, because increasingly the odds are they will not. This is chiefly because of the growing diversity in the "community" and all the exploration of new ideas and methods that is happening. As to why is her prospective dominant not being respectful of her situation... possibly because he doesn't understand what is being expected of him, possibly because he doesn't feel he has been respected and is responding in kind, its difficult to say but I've seen enough such situations to know how easily they can spin out of control over misunderstandings.
quote:
ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2
While I think the need for trainers and especially "protectors" is pretty much BS, the fact is that you have an established relationship and other people are not respecting the choices you made for yourself.
I agree, I think its an idea that has in recent years become rapidly outdated. There was a time when having trainers was practical, when groups were smaller and more homgeneous in composition and ideals. But that is now uncommon, and it is much more common that a dominant or submissive came to this lifestyle on their own and is self educated. With the proliferation of books, literature, fetish events and public BDSM clubs, that kind of self education is now very possible. You don't need to learn the "secrets" from an "grand master", you can pick up a dozen or more books that contain a wealth of information on everything from ropework (Jay Wiseman's Erotic Bondage Handbook - Jay Wiseman) to flogging (Flogging – Joseph W. Bean) to how to be a Top or Bottom (The New Topping Book – Dossie Easton, Janet W. Hardy and The New Bottoming Book – Dossie Easton, Janet W. Hardy respectively) to the fundamentals of a Master / slave relationship (Slavecraft: Roadmaps for Erotic Servitude – Guy Baldwin). You can attend fetish events or visit BDSM clubs where you can try out that ropework, flogging, etc. first hand with any number of causal play partners you can find there. Increasingly the insular and secretive "groups" and "Houses" have less and less to offer that cannot be found elsewhere. And with that change the need for trainers is passing its time as well. We are increasingly a community of individuals making individual choices (this is one reason standards vary so much now, why we have debates over what exactly a sub or slave is, as a larger community we don't have those nice, neat definitions so common to smaller, insular groups). As such, I think people in lacyann's situation will find themselves increasingly isolated and less accepted. That's my opinion based on what I see as trends in the lifestyle, not a value judgement.
Additionally, because of the increasing diversity I referenced above, it becomes less and less a practical possibility for anyone to train a submissive or slave for someone else. Because dominants now have so many different styles within the lifestyle to choose from, such diversity of interests, protocols, ideals, etc. I can't really see it as even being realistic to actually train someone as a slave anymore, except to train them for your own use. The only general education I can see still being realistic is just a general introduction to the lifestyle and the broader concepts and ideals, the more established styles and play forms. Beyond that, it really is to each his own.
quote:
ORIGINAL: stormsfate
That being said, anyone who does not respect a collar, training or otherwise, would raise red flags....
Ordinarily I'd agree with you about this, I feel collars should be respected. But I also see the opposite side here. Training collars, protection collars, etc. are concepts that began with good intentions, but online have been so badly abused that many are now highly suspicious of any such collars. I can't help but wonder if that is the case here, a dominant who is suspicious of the situation, of the motives of the trainers, etc. If so, that lack of respect could be evidence of a skepticism regarding her situation. The only remedy I can think of is for all parties involved to talk with each other, preferably face to face if possible, or a conference call at minimum, and discuss things. They need to clear the air, make a point not to take offense at anything said so that everyone can speak freely and openly and get everything anyone might be feeling out on the table. It is possible the whole conflict stems from misunderstandings about expectations.
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Padriag
A stern discipline pervades all nature, which is a little cruel so that it may be very kind - Edmund Spencer
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