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Making someone say "I love you" - if they don't know whether they mean it strikes me as not sadistic, but a very strange request, slightly bordering on Narcissicm. Even if you can supposedly "condition them to love you" (via force) in this manner - if it isn't based on their own free choice - then why would you want this from them?

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ORIGINAL: AAkasha

How do you pick partners that you know won't want more from you?

Akasha

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ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

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Making someone say "I love you" - if they don't know whether they mean it strikes me as not sadistic, but a very strange request, slightly bordering on Narcissicm. Even if you can supposedly "condition them to love you" (via force) in this manner - if it isn't based on their own free choice - then why would you want this from them? -  from SusanofO

So, when we're leaving anywhere, he quietly tells me "hugs" and thats my cue to hug people.  Other times he has to tell me to "be social" because I'll try to avoid talking to people.  I'm getting better at these sorts of things and maybe some day the words "I love you" will spontaneously come out of my mouth or I'll just randomly start conversations with friends and hug them when we part.  :)

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ORIGINAL: iammachine

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it's just that the nature of an intense, intimate power exchange relationship FEELS like love, and they WANT to be in love, and all of a sudden, I become the embodiement of what they want as their life partner.

Who's to say that it isn't love? Love is a feeling, it's not something that you can quantify. If they feel that they love you, what's the harm in it if they understand the boundaries of the relationship? You can limit actions, you can set boundaries that define a relationship, but you can't control feelings. What can be controlled is what a person does about those feelings.

For example, I have a friend that I am very close to. We refer to eachother as a "non couple", because though our relationship inspires many of the same feelings as a romantic exchange, I have set a limit at the notion of a romantic commitment. We both understand the boundaries of the relationship, and it is what it is. Despite how he may feel about me, he doesn't expect that I should become involved in any way beyond boundaries that have been set. We care about eachother a lot, and we care enough to be honest about what we may feel, and honest about what we will and will not do or commit to. It works for us, at least. YMMV.

As for someone wanting to fall in love and suddenly a desire for a connection gives them the perception that you are the embodiment of everything they have ever wanted.... that's often loneliness talking. Lots of people really want to feel a romantic connection, they want a romantic relationship. Lots of people are in love with love, as opposed to people. I call this the lost puppy effect. I can respect how someone feels, if they can respect that I may or may not feel the same, and respect what I want (or don't) from a relationship. If they can be content with that, that's dandy. They can feel however they want as long as it doesn't hinder our current relationship. If how I feel, want or not doesn't jive with them, they are free to move on, or dial things back to a point where they can manage their emotions.

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I am a little shocked anyone would want to force someone else to basically devalue this kind of sentiment.

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ORIGINAL: AAkasha

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ORIGINAL: iammachine

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it's just that the nature of an intense, intimate power exchange relationship FEELS like love, and they WANT to be in love, and all of a sudden, I become the embodiement of what they want as their life partner.

Who's to say that it isn't love? Love is a feeling, it's not something that you can quantify. If they feel that they love you, what's the harm in it if they understand the boundaries of the relationship? You can limit actions, you can set boundaries that define a relationship, but you can't control feelings. What can be controlled is what a person does about those feelings.

For example, I have a friend that I am very close to. We refer to eachother as a "non couple", because though our relationship inspires many of the same feelings as a romantic exchange, I have set a limit at the notion of a romantic commitment. We both understand the boundaries of the relationship, and it is what it is. Despite how he may feel about me, he doesn't expect that I should become involved in any way beyond boundaries that have been set. We care about eachother a lot, and we care enough to be honest about what we may feel, and honest about what we will and will not do or commit to. It works for us, at least. YMMV.

As for someone wanting to fall in love and suddenly a desire for a connection gives them the perception that you are the embodiment of everything they have ever wanted.... that's often loneliness talking. Lots of people really want to feel a romantic connection, they want a romantic relationship. Lots of people are in love with love, as opposed to people. I call this the lost puppy effect. I can respect how someone feels, if they can respect that I may or may not feel the same, and respect what I want (or don't) from a relationship. If they can be content with that, that's dandy. They can feel however they want as long as it doesn't hinder our current relationship. If how I feel, want or not doesn't jive with them, they are free to move on, or dial things back to a point where they can manage their emotions.

I can say it's not love because they are basing it on too little information, lack of "vanilla" shared experiences, very little discussion of worldy non kinky things, very little personal one-on-one time, all the things that make you know a "whole" person. What they love is the one part of me they know very intimately, and they are "filling in" the rest with fluffy nice ideas. Until you have gone through a variety of experiences together and have shared time, I find it hard to quantify love as being real.  Infatuation?  Sure!  But c'mon, someone can't LOVE me if they essentially barely know me, compared to - for example - how much boyfriends, lovers or my  husband knew me before we in love.  They are perhaps in love with the idea of being in love.
Akasha

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ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant

I find your reply above to be interesting from several standpoints...

You say that they do not know enough of the "real" you to love you, that they know only the kinky side.  So you are one of the few femdominants that is NOT interested in a submissive who can talk about other things other than kink and/or sex?

You say they have very little one-on-one time with you but they are experienced in the kinky aspects of what it is that you and they do.  So again, you are one of the few femdominants that goes more towards the kinky side right away without knowing much about their vanilla life and with their interest or non-interest in your other aspects of your individuality not counting as a factor in whether or not they will serve you?

You say that you have little in common in tersm of shared "vanilla" experiences.  At 52, I am unlikely to meet a female submissive with who I am going to have a past history of shared vanilla experiences.  But from what I have seen of most female submissives...here and elsewhere...they make it clear that they expect time to be spent on "vanilla" getting-to-know-each-other before D/s even comes into play, let alone kink.  They expect it to continue even after the kink has started.  Most of the femdominants seem to want that too, except for many of the professionals.  Are you different from the others then?  You don't want that "vanilla" getting to know-each-other time, before and during and after you have begun engaging in kinky play with the male submissives?

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ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant


I find your reply above to be interesting from several standpoints...

You say that they do not know enough of the "real" you to love you, that they know only the kinky side.  So you are one of the few femdominants that is NOT interested in a submissive who can talk about other things other than kink and/or sex?

You say they have very little one-on-one time with you but they are experienced in the kinky aspects of what it is that you and they do.  So again, you are one of the few femdominants that goes more towards the kinky side right away without knowing much about their vanilla life and with their interest or non-interest in your other aspects of your individuality not counting as a factor in whether or not they will serve you?

You say that you have little in common in tersm of shared "vanilla" experiences.  At 52, I am unlikely to meet a female submissive with who I am going to have a past history of shared vanilla experiences.  But from what I have seen of most female submissives...here and elsewhere...they make it clear that they expect time to be spent on "vanilla" getting-to-know-each-other before D/s even comes into play, let alone kink.  They expect it to continue even after the kink has started.  Most of the femdominants seem to want that too, except for many of the professionals.  Are you different from the others then?  You don't want that "vanilla" getting to know-each-other time, before and during and after you have begun engaging in kinky play with the male submissives?

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No, of course we have enough compatibility to have conversations outside of kink - and shared interests, and things we can laugh about and enjoy.  Our relationship may be more than 50% or 75% kinky, but we have compatibility *right now* in all areas.  That's my point -- he knows me very little, compared to someone I have dated for a long time.  You have to have a certain level of common interests and compatibility to interact/engage for a few months - what do people say infatuation lasts - three months? Others say six.  But inside of 6 months, if someone is saying they "are falling in love" with me, I call that infatuation. Until you have *shared common experiences* (that means person A and person B go through a trial, a joy, an argument, etc.) -- which is FAR different from "common interests" -- I don't think it's practical or realistic to think the warm, fuzzy feelings you are having are "love." Akasha

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It just sounds like you want to find a person to be on a perpetual third date with and to me that is highly unrealistic.

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ORIGINAL: toservez

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No, of course we have enough compatibility to have conversations outside of kink - and shared interests, and things we can laugh about and enjoy.  Our relationship may be more than 50% or 75% kinky, but we have compatibility *right now* in all areas.  That's my point -- he knows me very little, compared to someone I have dated for a long time.  You have to have a certain level of common interests and compatibility to interact/engage for a few months - what do people say infatuation lasts - three months? Others say six.  But inside of 6 months, if someone is saying they "are falling in love" with me, I call that infatuation. Until you have *shared common experiences* (that means person A and person B go through a trial, a joy, an argument, etc.) -- which is FAR different from "common interests" -- I don't think it's practical or realistic to think the warm, fuzzy feelings you are having are "love." Akasha

I am sorry if this comes off in a mean spirit as it is not my intention but from all of what you have written it just looks like you are theorizing up a storm to feel right and comfortable with wanting all the good things in a relationship and none of the obligations.

Six months for most people of seeing a person even if it is not a lot but certainly enough to be called a relationship, the term love would be entirely appropriate. Relationships/love has stages and infatuation might be the first stage of love but it is in the concept of love. If you spend significant time with a person regardless of the experience you are going to get to know the person and form feelings of some type for that person. Throw in back to the OP passion and intimacy then six months for most I would think is easily enough time to develop thoughts of love. Shared experiences with ups and downs go more toward sustaining love and compatibility, a later stage of the love process.

It just sounds like you want to find a person to be on a perpetual third date with and to me that is highly unrealistic.

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ORIGINAL: AAkasha

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ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant


I find your reply above to be interesting from several standpoints...

You say that they do not know enough of the "real" you to love you, that they know only the kinky side.  So you are one of the few femdominants that is NOT interested in a submissive who can talk about other things other than kink and/or sex?

You say they have very little one-on-one time with you but they are experienced in the kinky aspects of what it is that you and they do.  So again, you are one of the few femdominants that goes more towards the kinky side right away without knowing much about their vanilla life and with their interest or non-interest in your other aspects of your individuality not counting as a factor in whether or not they will serve you?

You say that you have little in common in tersm of shared "vanilla" experiences.  At 52, I am unlikely to meet a female submissive with who I am going to have a past history of shared vanilla experiences.  But from what I have seen of most female submissives...here and elsewhere...they make it clear that they expect time to be spent on "vanilla" getting-to-know-each-other before D/s even comes into play, let alone kink.  They expect it to continue even after the kink has started.  Most of the femdominants seem to want that too, except for many of the professionals.  Are you different from the others then?  You don't want that "vanilla" getting to know-each-other time, before and during and after you have begun engaging in kinky play with the male submissives?

No, of course we have enough compatibility to have conversations outside of kink - and shared interests, and things we can laugh about and enjoy.  Our relationship may be more than 50% or 75% kinky, but we have compatibility *right now* in all areas.  That's my point -- he knows me very little, compared to someone I have dated for a long time.  You have to have a certain level of common interests and compatibility to interact/engage for a few months - what do people say infatuation lasts - three months? Others say six.  But inside of 6 months, if someone is saying they "are falling in love" with me, I call that infatuation. Until you have *shared common experiences* (that means person A and person B go through a trial, a joy, an argument, etc.) -- which is FAR different from "common interests" -- I don't think it's practical or realistic to think the warm, fuzzy feelings you are having are "love."

Akasha