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hypnosis - 8/15/2005 4:47:13 PM

druid

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Greetings my fellow Doms,
As a progressive Master I am constantly keeping my "bag o tricks" updated. A Dom I met at a party last weekend was raving about
using hypnosis on his slave. unfortunately our talk ended before I could get a good idea on the subject. I've always been under the impression that hypnosis is something that takes a large amount of training (schooling, licensing). It occurs to me that it could be quite damaging
to a sub if it went arwy. I understand tha alot of what we do "could" go badly, but the brain is a complex bit of meat... If any of you could help me out with some info I'd appreciate it.
Be well,
Druid

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 5:25:56 PM

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There is a good book on the topic called "Look Into My Eyes" by Peter Masters.

best regards,
fate

_____________________________

Vision? What do you know about MY vision? My vision would turn your world upside down, tear asunder your illusions and the sanctuary of your own ignorance crashing down around you! Now ask yourself, are you really ready to see that vision? [/size

(in reply to druid)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 7:01:19 PM

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Actually hypnosis is one of the lowest risk kinks a person can get into. Do a search for threads on hypnosis, you will find a few.

(in reply to druid)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 7:25:33 PM

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Well, hypnotizing someone is quite easy. Though most do not realize it, most people go in and out of a low-level hypnotic trance several times a day.

The training mostly revolves around different ways to put a person into hypnotic trance and proper "therapy" practices once a person is under hypnosis. Here is where the problems can definitely occure!

If a person who does not have a concept and knowledge of "The Big Picture" learns to hypnotize someone they have the potential of causing great harm. Messing with a persons subconscious mind can be damaging.

Also, hypnosis has a huge potential for being abused. Yes, I know, people won't do things under hypnosis that they would not normally do when not under hypnosis, so it would seem the potential for abuse would not exist. But it does! I will not go into detail, but I am aware of MANY incidents of hypnotic abuse.

The only way I would recommend using hypnosis is to be formally trained by a reputable teaching facility. With formal training though hypnosis can become the most pleasurable and facinating activity a person can add to their sex life.

As an example, one thing I enjoy doing is taking a woman deep under hypnosis. Then have her subconscious mind search out the best orgasm she has ever had in her life. Then, through a technique I developed, that orgasm can be made to feel up to 5 times more pleasurable, and made to last up to 5 times longer. The new, more pleasurable orgasm can then be hooked up to a "trigger word" which when I say this word she will IMMEDIATELY have the 5 times more pleasurable orgasm and not be able to resist it!

On the other hand, if someone else tried this, one wrong word could render her unable to have an ograsm at all ever!

So, I would not suggest playing with hypnosis unless you know what you are doing! 99 out of 100 times nothing will happen wrong, but.....

Jay

(in reply to druid)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 7:26:11 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

Actually hypnosis is one of the lowest risk kinks a person can get into. Do a search for threads on hypnosis, you will find a few.

I disagree strongly!

< Message edited by Hypnotist4u -- 8/15/2005 7:27:01 PM >

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 7:41:27 PM

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Even though this intrigues me, I would never let anyone near me unless I explicitly had developed undenyable trust in that person....The thought of someone messing with my mind is scary otherwise..

Respectfully,
sultry

_____________________________

Blessed are the cracked,
For it is they who let in the light.

www.themarkbycpi.com

(in reply to Hypnotist4u)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 8:03:42 PM

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And I will respectfully disagree strongly with you. Certainly in terms of your previous post.

Sincerely,
Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Hypnotist4u)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 8:10:23 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hypnotist4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

Actually hypnosis is one of the lowest risk kinks a person can get into. Do a search for threads on hypnosis, you will find a few.

I disagree strongly!

I disagree strongly with you :)

A person cannot be forced to do things in hypnosis any more than they can be forced to do things when they are fully conscious. The mind WILL protect itself the same way a person cannot suffocate themselves by putting their head into a bathtub full of water- the body WILL force itself up. The mind WILL wake itself up to prevent harm being done if it comes against something that makes it uncomfortable or bad.

It's a very misunderstood form of play, due to a lot of bad and half information.

Even more so than manipulating a sub into not feeling they can say no- in hypnosis you HAVE to want it in order for it to occur, it's simply impossible to hypnotize someone if they choose not to be, and even then they can't damage your mind any more than a nightmare can.

(in reply to Hypnotist4u)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 8:15:36 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

And I will respectfully disagree strongly with you. Certainly in terms of your previous post.

Sincerely,
Ron

As to what statement do you disagree?

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 8:25:29 PM

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From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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Originally and until relatively recently, in order to be recognised as a Hypnotherapist or Medical Hypnotist, you were required by the Government to be either a Medical Doctor or a Dentist. Now provided you have completed the suitable training with an accredited facility you can gain legal recognition as a Hypnotherapist.

I am an accredited Hypnotherapist although I rarely practice as one. My reasons are personal and ethical but certainly it is one of my techniques, which I can use within my practice as a Counsellor/Therapist. I’ve lost count of the people I’ve seen hypnotised at parties and the corresponding shirt I’ve had to clean up and deprogram the “victim”. In The Hands Of A Trained Professional, Hypnotism can work wonders. It is NOT a party game no matter what the “Showmen” who supposedly use it in their shows on stage or TV, will tell you. It can be the ultimate Mind Fuck and I’ve seen it all done even using mind altering drugs etc.. If you want the ULTIMATE MIND FUCK… Contact me with US$750,000 cash and make sure that your Will, Medical Insurance and Funeral Plan is paid up and we’ll fly from there.. It will be the ultimate trip from which no person returns in a sane or even human condition….. You don’t want this? Then leave hypnotism alone and in the hands of trained practitioners.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 9:08:32 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hypnotist4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

Actually hypnosis is one of the lowest risk kinks a person can get into. Do a search for threads on hypnosis, you will find a few.

I disagree strongly!

I disagree strongly with you :)

A person cannot be forced to do things in hypnosis any more than they can be forced to do things when they are fully conscious. The mind WILL protect itself the same way a person cannot suffocate themselves by putting their head into a bathtub full of water- the body WILL force itself up. The mind WILL wake itself up to prevent harm being done if it comes against something that makes it uncomfortable or bad.

It's a very misunderstood form of play, due to a lot of bad and half information.

Even more so than manipulating a sub into not feeling they can say no- in hypnosis you HAVE to want it in order for it to occur, it's simply impossible to hypnotize someone if they choose not to be, and even then they can't damage your mind any more than a nightmare can.

And respectfully I would ask you to please share your experience and training with hypnosis to make these statements. I became a certified hypnotherapist over 8 years ago, and I have seen MANY abuses of hypnosis in that time. I know of many people that got themselves into hypnosis play that wish they never got started.

Please stop spreading this type of information when your information is inaccurate. People reading your inaccurate post may place themselves in danger because they take your informatin to be correct, when it is not even close. It is, as you say below "half information".

you wrote: "It's a very misunderstood form of play, due to a lot of bad and half information. " and you should take your own advice. Just your first paragraph, though the content is somewhat true, is very misleading and inaccurate as to the subject as a whole.

I will not disect your entire post in my post, but just your first sentence is so misleading it is dangerous.

you wrote:
"A person cannot be forced to do things in hypnosis any more than they can be forced to do things when they are fully conscious", and that is true, and also misleading. It is totally false that a person will never do something under hypnosis which they would not do when awake. There is a difference.

I can show you 100's of people that have been on stage singing like Elvis that would NEVER in a million years do such a thing without hypnosis. And this applies to abusive situations also. Hypnosis CAN be abused, and IS abused by those without morals every day!

I can go through your entire post with similar comments, but for now I will leave it at this.

It is my direct experience in the field of hypnosis and in working and socializing with "lifestyle" people involved with hypnosis that it CAN be abused, and CAN be abused in extreem ways! There are people being manipulated with hypnosis in ways they never expected, and did not desire, every day.

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 9:24:58 PM

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........hypnotize someone they have the potential of causing great harm. Messing with a persons subconscious mind can be damaging.

Unless they have deep seated mental problems which should an average joe could become aware of by the time you wanna be doing this........
And you don't have to be under hypnosis to damage a psyche and this will not intensifiy it in any unuseful way.

Also, hypnosis has a huge potential for being abused. I will not go into detail, but I am aware of MANY incidents of hypnotic abuse.
I will go into no detail either

99 out of 100 times nothing will happen wrong, but.....
1 in several million times, bout the worst that can happen is a glaring headache

As I have said many times before...........

You can stab yourself in the tonsils with a fork while eating and bleed to death (yes it COULD happen) So go to a reputable university and learn the fork at a cost exceeding a couple years income....you will probably be certified in what? couple weeks? bout the same as hypnotizm. The dangers are overrated.

Ron
Kinda like that is how I differ in opinion.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Hypnotist4u)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 9:35:52 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

........hypnotize someone .....(edited out. All can read above)

And respectfully, what are your qualifications to make such statements?

You too are posting dangerous inaccurate information, making it easier for those so inclined to abuse hypnosis to do so.

Why do people insist on posting information they are misinformed about that can harm others, as if it is fact, and as if they know what they are talking about?

WARNING! Hypnosis CAN be abused, and IS abused every day by people inclined to abuse others in whatever way they can. There are people who get involved with hypnosis play EVERY DAY who regret it because of the concequences.

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 9:51:21 PM

FelinePersuasion

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Actually the guy who writes look into my eyes covers that. He states explicitly that people will not do things they're not willing to under hypnosis.

The people on the stage up front knows that he's going to try to make them cluck or bark or act stupid. they are willing to be made to do stupid things by consenting to be made to act stupid by going up on stage and allowing him to proceed.

(in reply to Hypnotist4u)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 10:42:58 PM

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quote:

I can show you 100's of people that have been on stage singing like Elvis that would NEVER in a million years do such a thing without hypnosis. And this applies to abusive situations also. Hypnosis CAN be abused, and IS abused by those without morals every day!

Lets just run thru stage hypnotism a second. As the inevitable question comes.... Can I have a couple volunteers from the audience? It is a stampede. People are nearly killing each other to sit in those chairs. In the little town we are sitting in called "the largest BDSM community on the planet" the word we use around here for that is consensual, we do that so we have a word to act as a contrapositive to abuse. Now I am so golden on this that I will daresay that I will recieve no more than three posts by the usual pedantic assholes who will tell me I am wrong. Plus if I have any luck two goofers who will make us all laugh uproariously.

As is everything else. Respectfully my qualifications are I read a book by Anton Mesmer. I read several other hypnosis books. I took a certified course in hypnosis taught by a psychologist in Boston around 30 years ago. Learned more and took longer to read the books. Actually, Mesmer was the most informative and useful of the useless. I have been a hypnotist for over 25 years.

WARNING! Hypnosis CAN be abused, and IS abused every day by people inclined to abuse others in whatever way they can. There are people who get involved with hypnosis play EVERY DAY who regret it because of the concequences.

my answer to that is:
WARNING! Religion CAN be abused, and IS abused every day by people inclined to abuse others in whatever way they can. There are people who get involved with religion play EVERY DAY who regret it because of the concequences.

WARNING! Computers CAN be abused, and IS abused every day by people inclined to abuse others in whatever way they can. There are people who get involved with computers EVERY DAY who regret it because of the concequences.

Ad nauseum.

normal caveats are in order for hypnosis.......
Know something about it, don't advertise you are an expert when you are not, be careful who you mess around with, if they suck at it you are gonna get the mother of all headaches. Sometimes nausea is present. yada yada yada. Common sense and consideration. Do not go to Beetlejuice nor go to John Wayne Gacy to be hypnotized.

How many here have been hypmotize into quitting smoking? raise your hands How many are still smoking? raise your hands. Thank ya vrymch (thats my best Elvis) The asylums and streets are filled with these mental defectives. This is what hypnosis can do to you!!!!

I am simply saying the dangers are overrated there will be no Manchurian Candidates out there unless they were Manchurian in the first place.

Let's chill out on the dangerous and misinformed information stuff, at least where I am concerned.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 8/15/2005 10:52:35 PM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to Hypnotist4u)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 11:13:51 PM

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The compromise that we can look at here is to agree that the use of hypnosis is ok if firstly the subject is happy about it and secondly (and most importantly) the hypnotist is known and accredited in more than just the entertainment areas but also is an accredited and experienced Hypnotherapist.

When I was using hypnosis to help people quit smoking, it was as a part of a package, which included acupuncture, which was done by my late sensei. We used hypnosis for a number of such things including helping people come of hard drugs. The success rate with smokers was quite good especially with those who no longer smoke. OK this was pre patch days here.

Generally under most conditions and especially the areas of entertainment, subjects whilst may have no idea what they may end up doing, are still willing participants and thus are susceptible to suggestion. There was one classic case where in Australia where a very popular hypnotist some years back had his own TV program and in one of the early shows, it was found that many of the viewing audience had in fact been hypnotised. It did take some work to deal with and remedy the problems which occurred.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 11:16:12 PM

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I have been a Hypno Master for a very long time now. It was always part of my bag-of-tricks. As I got older I began to prefer to use a technique that I will call Alchemical Hypnotherapy to train. In other words I might program a trigger that puts a sub/slave into a dreamscape. Where she thinks she has experienced her most severe and exciting torture punishment. She will have experienced all the torture and punishment as if it happened to her in real time. She will even remember that it really happened to her, just no residual scars, bruises or debilitations. Before I started using this technique, and after an intense scene, I would have to give a slave a few days to recover. Now when she awakes she is just fine. I usually make her think she has rested for a couple of days. This is so much better and less time consuming on my part. Also the sub has experienced the most intense orgasm of there lives and I have many more levels I can push there mind and body. It also helps them with motivation as well as weight loss. Since some physical experience is necessary for good health, a programmed fitness program is a must. Real life sexual encounters are also a must for the same reason.

Alchemical Hypnotherapy is a synthesis of; NLP, Regression, Shamanism, Gestalt, Jungian work, Psychosynthesis. Identifying root causes, accessing and generating positive resources which are then anchored in the body, thus empowering the sub/slave. Emotional clearing, involves processing unresolved issues - a deeper aspect of time line therapy.

In NLP terms I think it would be called reimprinting, though in my work energy is worked through within the body, the body being the alchemical vessel. In alchemy a lot of the subpersonality work (parts work) is done using reframing processes. Here again rather than silent process, I work with the body in an interactive trance state, rather than at the mental insight level.

I find this makes a happier sub/slave and by no means a robot. She might not have wanted to do the things I ask of her before Hypno but she is happy to do so afterwards. I have never concerned myself with whether they were doing something they would never do or not do without Hypno ( they usually were no limits, no safe word collared slaves) but I do want them to be happy.

If you would like to learn more, I will be glad to discuss it.
Sir Rand

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: hypnosis - 8/15/2005 11:26:25 PM

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From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirrand

I have been a Hypno Master for a very long time now. It was always part of my bag-of-tricks. As I got older I began to prefer to use a technique that I will call Alchemical Hypnotherapy to train. In other words I might program a trigger that puts a sub/slave into a dreamscape. Where she thinks she has experienced her most severe and exciting torture punishment. She will have experienced all the torture and punishment as if it happened to her in real time. She will even remember that it really happened to her, just no residual scars, bruises or debilitations. Before I started using this technique, and after an intense scene, I would have to give a slave a few days to recover. Now when she awakes she is just fine. I usually make her think she has rested for a couple of days. This is so much better and less time consuming on my part. Also the sub has experienced the most intense orgasm of there lives and I have many more levels I can push there mind and body. It also helps them with motivation as well as weight loss. Since some physical experience is necessary for good health, a programmed fitness program is a must. Real life sexual encounters are also a must for the same reason.

Alchemical Hypnotherapy is a synthesis of; NLP, Regression, Shamanism, Gestalt, Jungian work, Psychosynthesis. Identifying root causes, accessing and generating positive resources which are then anchored in the body, thus empowering the sub/slave. Emotional clearing, involves processing unresolved issues - a deeper aspect of time line therapy.

In NLP terms I think it would be called reimprinting, though in my work energy is worked through within the body, the body being the alchemical vessel. In alchemy a lot of the subpersonality work (parts work) is done using reframing processes. Here again rather than silent process, I work with the body in an interactive trance state, rather than at the mental insight level.

I find this makes a happier sub/slave and by no means a robot. She might not have wanted to do the things I ask of her before Hypno but she is happy to do so afterwards. I have never concerned myself with whether they were doing something they would never do or not do without Hypno ( they usually were no limits, no safe word collared slaves) but I do want them to be happy.

If you would like to learn more, I will be glad to discuss it.
Sir Rand

You and I are definitely walking a similar if not the same path here. I don’t consider using this area of hypnosis as training for BDSM, however I do use it with advanced members of lodge and something similar with what I’ll call “Mind Walks” through different realms….. I also use trance meditation extensively with people and with myself as part and parcel if entering other conscious levels and dream or spirit walking. Its is handy when I don’t have a good shamanic drummer handy.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to sirrand)

RE: hypnosis - 8/16/2005 3:58:03 AM

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[/quote]
I’ll call “Mind Walks” through different realms….. I also use trance meditation extensively with people and with myself as part and parcel if entering other conscious levels and dream or spirit walking. Its is handy when I don’t have a good shamanic drummer handy.[/size][/font]

[/quote]
Yes it seems we are traveling simular paths. Let us hope we are not few but many.

"Mind Walks" is a good term. The Shaman, with the American Indian Church, that taught me called it "Spirit Walks" but what ever name you call it the results are the same, insight into your true purpose. I usually am the shamanic drummer for others but I don't like to do it if I am the guide.

Sir Rand

(in reply to IronBear)

RE: hypnosis - 8/16/2005 7:00:05 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FelinePersuasion

Actually the guy who writes look into my eyes covers that. He states explicitly that people will not do things they're not willing to under hypnosis.

The people on the stage up front knows that he's going to try to make them cluck or bark or act stupid. they are willing to be made to do stupid things by consenting to be made to act stupid by going up on stage and allowing him to proceed.

First off, just because it is in print does not make it true.

This second statement is correct. That IS why people do what they do on stage. I used that example to simplify my example. It was an easy for laypeople to understand, but was not a good example.

The guy who wrote the book is wrong though if "He states explicitly that 'people will not do things they're not willing to under hypnosis'", and if you will have him contact me I will be happy to give him phone numbers of several females I have worked with who have been abused by hypnosis!

They found themselves participating in activities that they had no desire to participate in, and were physically abused.

I can put him in touch with a girl who was hypnotized by her boyfriend and seriously burned with a lighter without her permission while under hypnosis, and then told when she awoke she would remember getting burned by the hot oven door she bumped into when she felt the pain while awake. How about hypnotizing her to stand naked on a low table and become stiff as a board, then wacking the back of her legs with a broomstick until she collapsed to the floor? Yup! She wanted to be burned and allowed it to happen. And she begged for the broomstick beating too! Yea right!

She only remembered these, as well as other abuses when they were uncovered by hypnotic regression.

So, please can someone tell me why others reply to posts as if they have accurate knowledge, yet they do not? Do they intentionally do this to mislead others, or do they do it to give their ego a boost and feel important?

I have worked with these people, and I know the realities of what CAN be done with hypnosis. If the Erotic Hypnosis chat room on Yahoo was still active I would send any doubters there to ask if there were any women in the room that had been abused with hypnosis. You used to be able to find them there 24/7.

(in reply to FelinePersuasion)

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