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"protect the property" - 12/15/2007 12:24:22 PM

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my Sir shocked me this morning by saying he no longer believes in "protect the property."

the context is that i'm disabled and have limitations, and his standing orders are to take care of myself, not push myself into crashing, to get rest when i need it. i'm a type-A who used to work 2-3 jobs at a time, so i'm still learning how to balance my activities as i adapt to my ever-changing body. so i'm quite shocked at the change, and i've written him a letter, initiating a discussion. but i also want to hear other's opinions - perhaps it's just how i've been trained since my early 20s and that was those specific Dominants' preferences but not necessarily a good thing?

so, "protect the property" - what does it mean to you?
raven

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 12:29:41 PM

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Depends on how deep you want to take it.

There are plenty of possible realistic life situations in which I would harm, permanently harm, or kill the property. These are not very likely, and tend to serve some perceived "greater lasting purpose" but are still quite possible and real.

It can also be quite annoying to be constantly perceived as protecting something.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 12:29:55 PM

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Im more concerend with what he means by no longer believeing in it.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 12:30:00 PM

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quote:

so, "protect the property" - what does it mean to you?

To me, it simply means that he keeps me from killing myself.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 12:48:14 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenix2raven

so, "protect the property" - what does it mean to you?

With apologies to Issac Asimov, I have modified his Three Laws of Robotics to define my understanding of "protect the property":

A submissive may not seriously injure themselves or, through inaction, allow themselves to come to serious harm.
A submissive must obey orders given by the Dominant, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
A submissive must protect the Dominant's other property as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 12:49:11 PM

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Honestly, Phoenix, I'm not at all sure by what you mean be "protecting the property" or what you felt he meant... so I can't come back with my own response on it as I've no clue what we're talking about. Could you please clarify what you are referring to? Thank you!

The best guess I can make at what you meant is that you'd had previous orders to take basic care of yourself in everyday life...? Is that right?

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:12:44 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

quote:

so, "protect the property" - what does it mean to you?

To me, it simply means that he keeps me from killing myself.

If this is the suicidal "kill myself": your mental healthy is not his responsibility. In the end, if you really want to die, he can't prevent you. Perhaps he's chosen to no longer pretend that he can.

If this is the keep you from over exerting yourself: your physical health is not his responsibility if you are the one choosing to over do...which is wrapped up in your mental health, in which case, see point one.

Learn to take care of yourself and stop playing in the shadow sides of the Damsel in Distress, Victim and Princess. You're much stronger than you think and you don't NEED a protector.

Master Fire

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:13:32 PM

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When I hear that, warning bells ring loudly. What I am about to say may not be what is happening in your situation and I sure hope it isn't! But... I know 'protect my property' well. You are to take care of you, their property, period. You cannot serve them if you are out of it and they care enough to see that you are okay.

After advocating for the the chronically ill and disabled for many years and being a submissive and dominant who is disabled, I have not only my own experience to go on, but many of my former clients. When a spouse starts talking like that, they are often times feeling one or many of these things or others I won't go into... feeling put out... cheated... feel you might be taking advantage and using your illness to get out of things... selfish... have someone else or want someone else... etc. But most often... they are tired of it all.

Most often they will expect you to do things you were not required to do before and then will lay blame on you if you cannot do them, giving them an excuse of some sort, for some reason. They feel the focus of the relationship is not on them and they want it on them. They often want something they couldn't have anyway, but you are their excuse for not having it. Kind of the grass is greener on the other side kind of thing.

Pay attention to what you are doing. Are you sometimes excusing yourself from doing something because you don't feel all that great, but could do if you pushed enough to get it done, but not enough to do yourself harm? Are you talking about things a lot? Are you going through changes that effect your partner? Are the bills piling up or other financial or work issues? A lot can play into this.

One rule I always had was never to use my illness to get out of anything I could do. I also determined to never once lie or make more serious or light of something that was happening.

I have even seen where the partner loves the person so very much and cannot bear to see them suffer and it overwhelms them to the point that they push you away in some way. There are a lot of things that could be happening here and we can't know for sure, but these are things I have seen in the relationships I have had and the one's of my friends.

I wish you both well and hope that I haven't added to what might be a stressful situation, but I call them the way I see them and although I may not see enough here to know much, I see enough to make me a bit worried for you. I really don't want to make you any more insecure than you might be at this moment, but I have always believed that it is better to hear the truth than to hear a smooth lie. This is just my truth and I sure as hell hope it isn't yours! I wish you wellness!

(in reply to RumpusParable)

RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:16:16 PM

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quote:

If this is the suicidal "kill myself":

LMAO
No, it's not the suicidal kind. Though that would have made things so much more easier if it had been...

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:18:24 PM

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I'm afraid I'm a bit confused, as well. Are you saying that by his previous standing orders to take care of yourself were in fact "protecting the property"... and he no longer believes you should do so?

As that particular phrase hasn't been used by us, I don't really have a definition for you. Putting it into context based on our relationship, I could hazard that it would mean taking care of what is important to us... and I would think that would be each other and our relationship.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:33:36 PM

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Ditto on the confusion though a lot of the post here have given me a round about idea of what you mean. Please clarify....

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:35:35 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenix2raven

so, "protect the property" - what does it mean to you?
raven

Like any other phrase I am sure there are different meanings.

To me, it means that Sir has my interest at heart, he'll ask for my opinion, he doesnt like me working so much and requires I take my much needed off time, he has time for me on the phone...as much as I need, he corrects me when we both know I have done wrong and its not always a "big" thing, but I do have my rules.

To me, in play, it means that altho he might stretch me a bit, he knows my limitations, wants and desires and with in his control, do what is best for me and of course him.

I live about 40 miles from work and between that distance the weather can drastically change. I am NOT allowed to travel if the roads are hazardous and my boss respects this protection from the one who owns me.
(Not that they know of our D/s relationship).

I guess I received the blessings of God when my owner seems to protect myself from myself....he knows my emotions can run a drift and he is my compass .... that protection is the most imporant to me.

Sir's devoted property

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:38:20 PM

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Maybe he just wants you to be more proactive. To tell him when you're tired and need a break instead of him having to watch you for signs of it.

But you'll never know unless you ask. And caregivers have high rates of burnout. Maybe brainstorm ways to allow for both your needs to be met?

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 1:44:29 PM

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I thought this thread was going to be about burglar alarms and such like.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 2:03:36 PM

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I've always stressed that the Prime Directive of SM is 'Protect the Property'- even from myself, if need be. It's not uncommon for me to chide '...and what's the first rule?' when I think someone is over taxing themselves, or taking needless risk.

I have also seen it used against me, as a passive agressive control tool. When the first commandment is repeatedly cited as the reason that things didn't get done, or won't get done, IMX, I'll be pulling the plug pretty soon.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 2:11:00 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: topcat

I've always stressed that the Prime Directive of SM is 'Protect the Property'- even from myself, if need be. It's not uncommon for me to chide '...and what's the first rule?' when I think someone is over taxing themselves, or taking needless risk.

I have also seen it used against me, as a passive agressive control tool. When the first commandment is repeatedly cited as the reason that things didn't get done, or won't get done, IMX, I'll be pulling the plug pretty soon.

I couldn't agree more with this! I have seen that passive agressive type behavior and it gives a bad rap to a lot who don't use it. In many illnesses, there are good moments and bad moments and some can make no sense at all and people will think the ill are playing a game of choice. I have seen people be fine one minute, having fun and the next look like they are on their death bed. Honesty in a situation like this is the only way a partner can be assured that their partner isn't playing a game.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 2:28:08 PM

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I am a little puzzled as well and wonder if the first question is just a typo?????

But as far as protecting property wear health is an issue

It can mean simply take care of yourself take what ever steps necessary so that so can serve him at your best,

for example if you are not allowing yourself self to sleep when you body needs it, it will interfere will both your physical beauty and your capability of serving him in the way he desires the most, say he enjoys having sex with you out of all services you provide him the most, then he would much rather get himself his own coffee and prepare the meals inorder to allow you to rest inorder to for you to preserve energy and be in the best shaped possible to serve him sexually, it would not be as pleasing for him if you try to continue to to all your noraml service and become so run down that you can only perform sexually at 10% of your capability because you tried to do more than your body can handle. So it may very well mean allowing him to handle some of the tasks you would normally do inorder to make time for yourself to rest and not feeling like you are being disobedient if you are feeling tired and saying to him I need to go lay for a couple hours

< Message edited by Maya2001 -- 12/15/2007 2:31:41 PM >

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 2:33:39 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard

I thought this thread was going to be about burglar alarms and such like.

That's a fun idea... put a car alarm setup on a sub so that they can press the panic button any time another comes too close or hits on them.

I'm joking, of course, other than in the purest sense of playful silliness.

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 2:39:18 PM

TemptingNviceSub

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After advocating for the the chronically ill and disabled for many years and being a submissive and dominant who is disabled, I have not only my own experience to go on, but many of my former clients. When a spouse starts talking like that, they are often times feeling one or many of these things or others I won't go into... feeling put out... cheated... feel you might be taking advantage and using your illness to get out of things... selfish... have someone else or want someone else... etc. But most often... they are tired of it all.

The above quote from Hottlicks was my thought when I read your opening thread...I too hope this is not what was meant or the reason behind what your Master said....I wish you well...Tempting

< Message edited by TemptingNviceSub -- 12/15/2007 2:40:38 PM >

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RE: "protect the property" - 12/15/2007 2:39:28 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenix2raven

so, "protect the property" - what does it mean to you?

It means that he will protect me as I protect him. It means if we hear an odd sound, we both grab swords. It means he will not stand by while someone insults or injures me. It means that he also insists that I be able to take care of myself and do not rely on him for protection.

Honestly I would be quite alarmed if he suddenly decided that he didn't believe in these things anymore.

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