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interested, but she's got an STD - 1/11/2008 8:25:05 AM   
burningdesires47


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OK, so I'm interested in this girl, but she has HPV. I know darn well you can get that no matter how careful you are (short of a full rubber body suit), and in fact she had it before she was sexually active--so my issue here is not feeling that she is somehow unsafe in her sexual practices.

Reality is, I refuse to have sex with someone in a full rubber body suit. My interest in women necessitates lack of barriers, or else I have no desire to participate. Even realizing that 80% of women will have HPV eventually, I'd kinda rather do what I can to stay in that 20%, and yes I've gotten the HPV vaccine.

I like her, a lot, and we've become amazing friends over the last almost-year we've known each other. She really likes my fiance who feels the same, we're all interested in playing together. But I'm afraid that if I gave in, I would not be able to relax and enjoy myself. And if I allowed him to play with her, I'd never be able to bring myself to sleep with him again. Not exactly a healthy start to a marriage.


How do I get over this fear? How do I tell her I'm not interested in being more than friends, or else how do I convince myself it's OK since I'm likely to get HPV eventually anyway? Or maybe there are other options I'm not considering?
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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/11/2008 8:40:13 AM   
hisannabelle


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greetings burningdesires,

maybe it would help to know what strain of hpv? there are 30+ sexually transmitted strains and over 100 strains total. only ten of those have been known to lead to cancer, and some very rarely. some of those types never have physical symptoms. the vaccine protects against four very high risk types that lead to 70% of instances of cervical cancer and 90% of genital warts. the vaccine is almost 100% effective against those four types.

i guess what i'm saying is maybe look at whether this will be a serious health risk or not. the fact that she has hpv in and of itself does not make it a serious health risk offhand, especially considering that you have the vaccine, so there is a possibility that the risk to you could be minimal. i have a friend who has hpv (one of the cancer causing types protected against by the vaccine), and it's hard for her to disclose to new partners, but in the couple of times she's had to do it since i knew her, for them it was not an issue. personally, i hope it would not be an issue for me but i've never been in that situation.

respectfully,
annabelle.

< Message edited by hisannabelle -- 1/11/2008 8:43:16 AM >


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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/11/2008 9:28:28 AM   
juliaoceania


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This is one of the most treatable things out there. Even if one contracts the HPV virus, it is not a killer unless one doesn't get treatment

quote:

Genital HPV is an extremely common viral infection. (Of the more than 100 known HPV strains, 30 are sexually transmissible and are considered genital HPV.) Approximately 5.5 million new genital HPV transmissions occur in this country every year, representing about one-third of all new STD infections, and an estimated 20 million men and women are thought to have genital HPV at any given time. According to a 1997 American Journal of Medicine article, nearly three in four Americans between the ages of 15 and 49 have been infected with genital HPV at some point in their life. HPV infection, which is usually asymptomatic, is also usually harmless. The vast majority of cases are transient: The body's immune system fights off the infection, which then either becomes inactive or resolves on its own. Certain HPV strains lead to genital warts. These warts can be removed, but because the virus typically remains in the body, symptoms may reappear. Other HPV strains are deemed "high-risk" because they occasionally develop into a persistent infection that can progress to cervical cancer if left untreated, usually over the course of decades. Virtually all cases of cervical cancer are associated with these 13 high-risk stra
The incidence of cervical cancer in the United States has been on the decline for some time, and today cervical cancer is relatively rare. The American Cancer Society estimates that 12,200 cases will occur to American women this year, resulting in 4,100 deaths (which represents one percent of all cancer deaths among women). The major reason cervical cancer rates in this country are so low today—despite high rates of HPV infection—is the widespread availability of Pap tests. Pap tests can detect not only early-stage cervical cancer, which is highly treatable, but also cervical dysplasia—precancerous changes of cervical cells which can linger for years—allowing for the removal of affected tissue long before invasive cancer sets in. Since the introduction of the Pap test in the 1950s, cases of cervical cancer in the United States have decreased dramatically—by 74% between 1955 and 1992. As cited in a 2000 article in the Journal of the American Medical Association, more than half of the women diagnosed with cervical cancer in this country have not had a Pap test in the last three years. Indeed, according to the American Social Health Association (ASHA), almost all new cases of cervical cancer, and cervical cancer deaths, could be prevented with regular Pap screening.


Edited to add, since this virus is extremely common, you could be a carrier for strains of it and be completely unaware of that. If I really cared for someone with HPV it would not impact my decision to be involved with that person. It is not like it is AIDs or even herpes.


< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 1/11/2008 9:30:14 AM >


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(in reply to burningdesires47)
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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/11/2008 6:21:07 PM   
Termyn8or


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So does this mean that the vaccine doesn't work ? It either does or not. The V means virus, so if you are alone on a desert island you would not need it right ?

I mean in what way does this vaccine prevent one from contracting the disease ? From a toilet seat ? Maybe I don't know enough about it, but I would think if you got the vaccine you should be OK no ?

What I don't understand is why take a vaccine that does not work ?

Perhaps someone can explain.

T

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/11/2008 8:27:23 PM   
tasha_tart


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

So does this mean that the vaccine doesn't work ? It either does or not. The V means virus, so if you are alone on a desert island you would not need it right ?

The vaccine is very effective against the strains of the virus it was developed and approved for, those that are responsible for a very large percentage of cervical cancers.  As with many vaccines, such as the influenza vaccine, it can't offer protection from every strain of a family of viruses.
 
If you were alone on a desert island, the use of the vaccine is a moot point.  There'd be no one to administer it.

I mean in what way does this vaccine prevent one from contracting the disease ? From a toilet seat ? Maybe I don't know enough about it, but I would think if you got the vaccine you should be OK no ?

As with sexually transmitted infections in general, it's usually spread by sexual activity.  Toilet seats are vastly overrated as spreaders of STIs. 
 
The vaccine works as most vaccines do; by stimulating the production of antibodies to the virus prior to any infection, enabling the immune system to better attack the virus.

What I don't understand is why take a vaccine that does not work ?

Well, if a vaccine doesn't work at all, I'd say taking it would be silly.  With the HPV vaccines, as with most vaccines, you weigh the benefits against the risks, and make your decision.  It is an effective enough vaccine, that many people feel the risks outweigh the benefits, but it's an individual decision.

Perhaps someone can explain.

T

(in reply to Termyn8or)
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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/11/2008 11:13:25 PM   
hisannabelle


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greetings termyn8or,

the vaccine has proven to be nearly 100% effective for what it is meant to do - but there are 30-some strains of hpv that can be transmitted sexually, and it only protects against 4. the 4 it does protect against are the ones that cause the majority of cervical cancer and genital warts, but there are rarer strains that can cause both of those problems as well as ones that do not necessarily express symptoms, and there are also many other strains that are not sexually transmitted. assuming the op is vaccinated against the same strain her potential partner has, she's likely quite safe, or if her partner has a strain that is not known to cause problems, it may not be as much of a risk or fear.

respectfully,
annabelle.

< Message edited by hisannabelle -- 1/11/2008 11:15:22 PM >


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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 3:10:42 AM   
burningdesires47


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I'm not sure which strain it is, but she got told she tested positive for HPV, IIRC, 4 years ago, so SHE may not even remember. So, if I were to pursue this, I don't know how I would ask that (which is not making up excuses, more asking, how would you go about having that conversation?)

I suppose at least a small factor in this is that due to my fibro, I have no freaking immune system. Which is only slightly exaggerating. So a vaccine that is 100% effective on a healthy human being may not even work for me, or not effectively. I got the vaccine to minimize my risk as much as possible, but I (and by "I/me" I mean "my doctors") can't quantify what that risk is, with me vs. the typical immune-compromised person vs. the general population. It's not the first time it has come up and sadly won't be the last.

And at least part of my problem is getting over the idea that STD=avoid like the plague... and also understanding why I would WANT to get over that idea. I feel this could easily be a slippery slope, from which I then choose to be with someone who has, for example, herpes... and while I don't think I would do that NOW, if I chose to change my personal coda of rules for her, then who's to say I wouldn't change them a little more for someone else later down the line? and for someone who isn't interested in a long-term RELATIONSHIP, but only play, fuck-buddies with some BDSM play if it comes to that, I guess I just don't see the prudence in doing that.

As usual with these boards I've just made myself late for work again lol... so I don't have time to go back and re-read, forgive me if anything is written badly/unclear.

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 3:18:43 AM   
MissMagnolia


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What a sad situation. All I can think of is using femidoms, dentaldams and condoms.

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 3:24:22 AM   
AquaticSub


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~Fast Reply~

Because you feel the way you do about her, you could always take a trip to a doctor's office. Find out exactly what strain she has, if your shot covered that and see how dangerous things really are. Find out what ways risks can be reduced and the like. It might help if both of you had a chat with a doctor used to treating couples where one person has a STI and the other doesn't.

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 8:52:37 AM   
Termyn8or


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Thank you for the enlightenment, I guess I see the dikemma now.

If ya don't ask ya don't find out.

T

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 9:28:03 AM   
sub4hire


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quote:

ORIGINAL: burningdesires47



I suppose at least a small factor in this is that due to my fibro, I have no freaking immune system. Which is only slightly exaggerating. So a vaccine that is 100% effective on a healthy human being may not even work for me, or not effectively. I got the vaccine to minimize my risk as much as possible, but I (and by "I/me" I mean "my doctors") can't quantify what that risk is, with me vs. the typical immune-compromised person vs. the general population. It's not the first time it has come up and sadly won't be the last.

And at least part of my problem is getting over the idea that STD=avoid like the plague... and also understanding why I would WANT to get over that idea. I feel this could easily be a slippery slope, from which I then choose to be with someone who has, for example, herpes... and while I don't think I would do that NOW, if I chose to change my personal coda of rules for her, then who's to say I wouldn't change them a little more for someone else later down the line? and for someone who isn't interested in a long-term RELATIONSHIP, but only play, fuck-buddies with some BDSM play if it comes to that, I guess I just don't see the prudence in doing that.




Education is power.  Go see the doctor with her.  Go to your own doctor.  Nobody here can make you feel ok to have sex with her.  Only you can do that.
So, educate yourself then decide.


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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 1:05:06 PM   
proudsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissMagnolia

What a sad situation. All I can think of is using femidoms, dentaldams and condoms.


Unless you covered the entire genital area it those wouldn't pretect you.  HPV is transmitted by skin contact not fluid exchange.

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 5:05:57 PM   
MissMagnolia


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I know that.

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 5:40:04 PM   
SeeksOnlyOne


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i would talk to a dr about it....my dr had a poster up in the room i was in last week about this, and it said something like this....

there are 77 strains of hpv, with 15 causing cancer and genital warts.....the vaccine protects against these 15.....

those numbers are estimates, as i had a fever of 101.6 and was a bit loopy, but thats pretty close to the actual numbers that were on that poster.

it implied to me that some strains are not dangerous, but then im not a dr.

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 7:31:40 PM   
defiantbadgirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Edited to add, since this virus is extremely common, you could be a carrier for strains of it and be completely unaware of that. If I really cared for someone with HPV it would not impact my decision to be involved with that person. It is not like it is AIDs or even herpes.



I have a friend that contracted HPV from her cheating husband. She has to get her genital warts burned off every year and one of her vaginal lips had to be removed because of it. Around 90% of the population has herpes and both oral and genital herpes can cause cold sores to develop on the mouth and genitals. Even chicken pox is a form of herpes (herpes zoster). In my opinion, HPV is far worse than herpes.

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 7:55:44 PM   
juliaoceania


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Here is some information

L
quote:

ike most viral infections, there is no cure for Human Papillomavirus.  Treatment consists of destroying the infected cells, but it often comes back due to infection of normal-appearing nearby skin.  If left untreated, genital warts may go away on their own.  One study showed that nearly 1/3 of all patients had spontaneous resolution of the growths. For those not wanting to wait to see if they disappear on their own (e.g., most people), destruction of the abnormal cells can be done via a number of methods such as freezing the growths with liquid nitrogen, destroying the tissue with laser surgery, using a blistering agent (such as podophyllin - made from rain forest beetles), or burning them off with a potent acid (e.g., trichloracetic acid).   A doctor trained in one of these techniques should be seen to prevent damaging the normal surrounding tissue.


I know of a friend with this issue that had it resolved before she ever had an outbreak because of an abnormal pap smear. She told me she never had any warts at all, ever.. they never came back and her doctor told her they may never come back.. I haven't talked to her in about 5 years, but when she told me about it she hadn't had a problem in over 10 years

Edited to add, since this problem is spread through the skin, it is not only an STD, it can be spread through other types of contact, like diapering, or someone who is washing another.

Seriously, if I was very attracted to someone, and thought they maybe right for me, and I had a vaccine, why wouldn't I go with it? I definitely would.

People are carriers for this disease all the time, they never know it unless they have an abnormal pap or they break out in warts. A person can have it lay dormant in their skin for long periods of time... years even. Just saying


< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 1/12/2008 8:06:19 PM >


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 9:29:22 PM   
proudsub


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Many varieties of HPV never show up as warts.  I had a non-wart strain that was diagnosed after an abnormal pap.  It was a strain that can cause cancer so i had the LEEP procedure where they scrape the surface of your cervix.  That was about 5 years ago and all my paps have been normal since than.  I had no visible symptoms, so ladies, keep getting regular pap smears, it is such a common problem.  By the way i contracted it from my affair with a dom who swore he was clean.  I don't blame him because he also had no symptoms.  He is the only man besides Hubby that i have had interocurse with in 40 years.

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proudsub

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 9:32:05 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

ORIGINAL: burningdesires47

I'm not sure which strain it is, but she got told she tested positive for HPV, IIRC, 4 years ago, so SHE may not even remember. So, if I were to pursue this, I don't know how I would ask that (which is not making up excuses, more asking, how would you go about having that conversation?)

I suppose at least a small factor in this is that due to my fibro, I have no freaking immune system. Which is only slightly exaggerating. So a vaccine that is 100% effective on a healthy human being may not even work for me, or not effectively. I got the vaccine to minimize my risk as much as possible, but I (and by "I/me" I mean "my doctors") can't quantify what that risk is, with me vs. the typical immune-compromised person vs. the general population. It's not the first time it has come up and sadly won't be the last.

And at least part of my problem is getting over the idea that STD=avoid like the plague... and also understanding why I would WANT to get over that idea. I feel this could easily be a slippery slope, from which I then choose to be with someone who has, for example, herpes... and while I don't think I would do that NOW, if I chose to change my personal coda of rules for her, then who's to say I wouldn't change them a little more for someone else later down the line? and for someone who isn't interested in a long-term RELATIONSHIP, but only play, fuck-buddies with some BDSM play if it comes to that, I guess I just don't see the prudence in doing that.

As usual with these boards I've just made myself late for work again lol... so I don't have time to go back and re-read, forgive me if anything is written badly/unclear.


I missed this post before.... if your doctors do not know if you would catch it, then perhaps you should pass on this person....

As far as standards being lowered.. to me there are things I would put up with people I care about that I would not put up with for a "fuck buddy"... STD is just one of those things.

If your immune system is that shot, you should definitely be screened for everything under the sun along with your prospective partners in the future. My Daddy and I were screened before we became involve.... both given a clean bill of heath. If HPV could make you that ill, they can screen for it.. but often people that are contagious with it don't show up as having it...




_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 10:17:50 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: proudsub

Many varieties of HPV never show up as warts.  I had a non-wart strain that was diagnosed after an abnormal pap.  It was a strain that can cause cancer so i had the LEEP procedure where they scrape the surface of your cervix.  That was about 5 years ago and all my paps have been normal since than.  I had no visible symptoms, so ladies, keep getting regular pap smears, it is such a common problem.  By the way i contracted it from my affair with a dom who swore he was clean.  I don't blame him because he also had no symptoms.  He is the only man besides Hubby that i have had interocurse with in 40 years.


That is really my point to the OP, this is so common, it is unbelievable. So the only way to completely protect herself maybe complete abstinence, or take a risk on getting someone tested for all the strains and hope they remain monogamous. With it being so common, and so easy to remain undetected, it is just unknown.

For example, both my Daddy and I believe we are clean, one of us could come down with it tomorrow... since it lays there dormant and it is not commonly tested for in men, and women only detect it in pap smears. (which reminds me, I am due for one)


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: interested, but she's got an STD - 1/12/2008 10:35:15 PM   
FangsNfeet


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quote:

ORIGINAL: burningdesires47

How do I get over this fear? How do I tell her I'm not interested in being more than friends, or else how do I convince myself it's OK since I'm likely to get HPV eventually anyway? Or maybe there are other options I'm not considering?


It's your life and you should realize that no one is going to live forever. There's no changing the past and there are no garuntees of the future. We might as well focus and live in the now. If you want her, then you should have her. Play safe and whatever happens is what happens. By some chance you become infected, oh well, there's nothing to worry about anymore.

I'm not going to judge you. There's no right or wrong answer as to if you should be with this person. Sometimes, we have to decide what's best for ourselves and the family we plan on having.

Whatever you choose, choose wisely, never regret, and you'll still have my respect.


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