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Starvation - 2/19/2004 7:03:22 PM

Voltare

Posts: 841
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: Santiago, Chile
Status: offline

Greetings,

My question may seem a bit unusual, but it goes out to anyone with medical and lifestyle experience. I know a slave who wishes for her owner to starve her, not strictly for physical changes (she is only slightly overweight) but for the psychological/slavery experience. I know from my own experiences I can go two or three days without significant food - but she wishes to be completely cut off from food, for long periods.

The question then, how long may a person fast safely? Water should be a given, but how long can one fast, and how frequently and still stay within 'safe' limits? Are there alternatives to strict fasting i.e. a small quantity of food and vitimans given daily, that would permit this risk to minimize? What are the risks involved?

Has anyone had any genuine experiences with this?

Respectfully,

Stephan

_____________________________

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"There is always some madness in love, but there is always some reason in madness." - F. Nietzsche

Post #: 1

RE: Starvation - 2/20/2004 8:21:19 PM

Estring

Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

I think that any "starving" of the body is a bad thing. Your body begins to feed on itself at that point for lack of any nutrition.
There is "Fasting" which you stated you had done before, but even that can be harmful if you haven't worked up to it.
When I hear that someone says they want to be starved, that sounds like a profound psychological problem to me.

(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 2

RE: Starvation - 2/21/2004 7:29:21 PM

sub4hire

Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

I agree with Sandy here. I've always said if I was a Dominant the best punishment in the world would be making your submissive go to a good therapist. Making them face their own issues. That could feel like death to some.

However on the topic of starvation. From what I understand the body will feed on itself. It will take the muscles first. Yet, many have fasted for weeks on end.
What was it we learned in grade school? You can go without food for 3 weeks and without water for a week or so?
Yet, I know I've read that some monks..and others have gone for much longer periods. However, you never really hear what condition they are in once their fast is gone.

Anyway, I belong to many medical sites for physicians only. I'll look into it and see if I can find a more intelligent answer for you.

Gloria

(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 3

RE: Starvation - 2/21/2004 8:09:35 PM

sub4hire

Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
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OK, here is a preliminary answer to the question.

A person can live without food for quite some time, usually for many weeks.
The body will use its fat and protein stores (muscles) to help it survive.
If a person has a lot of fat stores (is very heavy), they will live longer than a
person who has very little fat (very thin), so how long a person can survive
depends a lot of the person. Of course, if you go without food for a few weeks,
you will be very weak since you have been using your own muscles for energy.

Water is a different story. A person will die within 3-4 days without water. The
size of the person really doesn't make much difference.

Hope this helps.

Gloria

(in reply to sub4hire)

Post #: 4

RE: Starvation - 2/21/2004 8:15:23 PM

EStrict

Posts: 729
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline

::laughing:: thank you Gloria, but that was EString, not EStrict. And though I also agree with him, he may not like being mistaken for me :)

Sandy

(in reply to sub4hire)

Post #: 5

RE: Starvation - 2/21/2004 10:13:40 PM

Estring

Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
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Lol. There seems to be some confusion about who is who. I am Estring, she is Estrict. Or is it the other way around? Hmm...

(in reply to EStrict)

Post #: 6

RE: Starvation - 2/22/2004 12:29:09 AM

sub4hire

Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
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Hmm...I've been reading both of your intellectual ramblings for what seems like months now. Never realizing you were two different people. Oopps...sorry about that.
I'll get it right the next time.

(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 7

RE: Starvation - 2/23/2004 9:26:59 AM

Jasmyn

Posts: 1234
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: New Zealand
Status: offline

Stephan not my place to comment on others kinks...but my instinctive impression from the small bit you have said about your friend's desire to be starved could be linked with removing the emotional nuturing effect of food and the goddess like attainment gained by followers of pro-anna sites...anorexia, and to some extent, bulima, is very much an issue of self control...giving that control over to someone else could be seen as merely removing responsibility for it.

Please talk to her, see if it really is about submission or self abuse.

Jasmyn

(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 8

RE: Starvation - 2/28/2004 12:29:54 PM

Extrinsic

Posts: 1
Joined: 2/23/2004
Status: offline

Jasmyn's Remarks are right on the money. Fasting has psychological ramifications that are cosmic for the person experiencing it. Motives should be examined carefully. This is not something you want to start a habit of.

I am not a doctor, so this advice only goes so far, but I have personal experience with fasting. Do not go for even one day without water. In fact, monitor the amount of water being consumed to insure that at least 32 OZ of water go in every day. If it's during a warm season when you might sweat, increase that to 64oz. minimum. It's hard to drink too much, and easy to drink too little. The size of the person can affect the amount of water needed - adjust as neccessary. Three days without water is likely to kill a person.

After three days, real pain starts to kick in from the hunger. The libido drops significantly, and often, people find it hard to sleep.

After seven days, dizzy spells are not uncommon. The persons activities should be controlled to limit driving or anything that can cause an accident.

After twelve days, it's possible to have mild hallucinations - bright spots, strange sounds.

After fourteen days, you're on your own. I can't tell you what happens.

When you come off a fast, you have to eat very small amounts of food for the first two days, or you will get the runs and stomach cramps. A cup of soup is a good first meal - like Lentil soup. It's bound to run right through you.

Someone who is diabetic can get horribly sick or even die after one day of fasting. If you can, check with your doctor before attempting the fast. Losing weight is not a valid reason for fasting (from a medical standpoint). Spiritual or meditiational reasons are often found acceptable.

(in reply to Jasmyn)

Post #: 9

RE: Starvation - 3/8/2004 10:32:57 PM

tweetygirl

Posts: 19
Joined: 1/9/2004
Status: offline

32oz of water is really low you might get dehydrated from it. It is recomended to drink 2 liters plus of fluids a day. And if your sick or dehydrated have to drink a gallon of fluids a day. Being dehydrated sucks. I was dehydrated when i was sick a few months ago.

Amanda

(in reply to Extrinsic)

Post #: 10

RE: Starvation - 3/13/2004 6:49:03 AM

iwillserveu

Posts: 1633
Joined: 1/1/2004
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One of the biggest dangers is when they start eating again. (One of the biggest dangers, This is a friggin' minefield.)

After a prolonged period without food, regular eating will cause pain and possibly vomiting because the stomach is so un-used to food. I'd recommend easy to digest stuff at first like baby food.

Don't trust the sub to do what is right. I don't care who you are, if you are starving to death and see a cheeseburger the instinct is to wolf it down, not think of your digestive abilities.

You have plenty of people telling you not to do it. (Sounds like she has issues.) If you ignore their good advice, do you really want that responsibility? Frankly, it is a lot. Are you able to eat with a dog staring hungrily at you? (Add to it the knowledge that the dog has not been fed in three days.

)

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(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 11

RE: Starvation - 3/19/2004 9:54:53 AM

MistressKiss

Posts: 295
Joined: 1/1/2004
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As a medical professional for the past twenty years, I am very concerned that this person wishes to starve. My impression from the original post is that one of the motives for doing this is the submissive's desire to lose weight or the fact that she is overweight has prodded this thinking.

Starvation is more likely to kill than cure in this case. What would be more advantageous to the submissive would be to have her eating controlled. It may take some research on the part of the Dominant, but with a bit of forethought and a lot of dedication, the Dom could choose everything that goes into the submissive's mouth (grins...why are ya'll smiling at that comment??) and make sure that the things she eats are only healthy items that will promote weight loss and not weight gain.

I think we have all been innundated with the low carb stuff, but let me say this...I think that works. I have been doing my best to live without the carbs and I went through a bit of a withdrawal period, but I can't tell you how much better I feel with some of that crap out of my body. I am thinking that this feeling will be very rewarding for a submissive.

Also, from all I have been taught over the years, the body hoards fat when a person is not eating instead of burning it. I am not sure if I am remembering correctly, but that is what I am thinking is correct. I will check with my PA friend.

All in all, I think this desire is unwise and can be much more effectively played out by controlling the eating. Heck, you can get downright erotic with that in itself! Don't deny any water at all. (That can lead to a whole OTHER kink, in controlling the bathroom habits of the submissive, too.)

And I also agree - counseling may be appropriate as well.

Attachment (1)

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(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 12

RE: Starvation - 2/9/2008 11:33:11 PM

jamesmk2003

Posts: 1
Joined: 6/24/2005
Status: offline

try http://www.curezone.com water fasing My last fasting was 10 days no drama but you must know how to start up eating again.

(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 13

RE: Starvation - 2/10/2008 12:01:58 AM

FangsNfeet

Posts: 3758
Joined: 12/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Voltare

Has anyone had any genuine experiences with this?

I've always been willing to try new things and experience other cultures. Religiously, Muslims and Bahi have a fasting period Ramidon where they are not to eat from sun up unitll sun down. A college friend of mine was Bahi. I did this fasting practice with him for a week to see how mentally strong I was. Needless to say, no physical harm came to me. It's just all mental. After Sun Down, I hit the buffets.

I'd stick with the No Food from 7am to 7pm idea with the exception of water.

The human body can do extordinary things and last longer than any one can predict.

Health wise, just make sure the peron isn't diabetic. Have some type of sugar pill handy should the person fasting have some type of hypoglycemic attack. Should the person become pale or faint, then just let them eat. Hunger pains are one thing but passing out is another.

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(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 14

RE: Starvation - 2/10/2008 1:05:47 AM

hisannabelle

Posts: 1992
Joined: 12/3/2006
From: Tallahassee, FL, USA
Status: offline

greetings voltare,

she should know that after long periods, her body is going to start eating her organs. literally. once she's started a refeeding process, regardless of how thin she is, her body will hold onto every calorie - so when she goes back to eating, she will eventually end up weighing more than she already does. she'll have murdered her metabolism.

i personally can't fast during ramadan (whenone is supposed to wait until after sundown) specifically because i have to eat all day long, otherwise my metabolism shuts down extremely quickly and i gain weight because i spent years restricting calories. the other issue is also that at some point her body will shut down and force her to eat - so unless her master is watching her all the time, it's not uncommon to be halfway through a pizza you don't ever remember ordering after you've been starving for awhile.

i can't speak for regular, healthy fasting or detox diets. but i can speak for (in my case self-imposed) starvation and calorie restriction. i personally advise against it. i've been in recovery for quite some time now and i seriously doubt my metabolism will ever recover. it's been years and i still have to baby it.

respectfully,
annabelle.

< Message edited by hisannabelle -- 2/10/2008 1:06:42 AM >

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i have the kind of beauty that moves...

(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 15

RE: Starvation - 2/10/2008 2:09:23 AM

winterlight

Posts: 1319
Joined: 2/18/2006
Status: offline

This question brings up bad memories. My Mom quit eating and this went on for months even though i had a Nurse care organization here. She finally ate some but by that time she was in a Nursing home. She stopped eating again and died.
I would never , ever support this...shudders...

(in reply to hisannabelle)

Post #: 16

RE: Starvation - 2/10/2008 11:47:47 AM

Notanaddict

Posts: 100
Joined: 12/18/2005
From: Sydney
Status: offline

I can just tell you as a nurse (psych) that this is not a good idea.. Food restricyions is one thing, but wanting to be straved..

It almost seems as if she WANTS to be anorexic, but doesn't have the will power to do it and wants someone to do it for her..

I have a patient who survives on 500 mls of liquid nutrition through a feeding tube... but its no life at all, and she will probably die before she turns 27 (she is 25)..

When a person does not eat, the body will eventually shut down, and massive organ failure will come. And she could any number of underlying healthconditions that she doesn't know about that could speed up this process...

a responsible domme with regard for his subs life would never try to starv her. There is no "safe" way of starving someone for more than a day or two.

Just my opinion

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Killing under the cloak of war is nothing more than murder.

albert einstein

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Post #: 17

RE: Starvation - 2/10/2008 12:04:05 PM

proudsub

Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
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Since this thread started 4 years ago, i am curious if the OP gave in to her request of starvation and how it went.

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proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan

(in reply to Notanaddict)

Post #: 18

RE: Starvation - 2/10/2008 12:48:50 PM

sub4hire

Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: proudsub

Since this thread started 4 years ago, i am curious if the OP gave in to her request of starvation and how it went.

Can you believe that Proud, we've been here 4 years now? Remember IWill? He still e-mails me from time to time.

(in reply to proudsub)

Post #: 19

RE: Starvation - 2/10/2008 1:33:57 PM

Vendaval

Posts: 10297
Joined: 1/15/2005
Status: offline

I agree with having the young lady have a thorough medical and psychological check up to rule out anorexia and/or bulimia.

_____________________________

"Beware, the woods at night, beware the lunar light.
So in this gray haze we'll be meating again, and on that
great day, I will tease you all the same."
"WOLF MOON", OCTOBER RUST, TYPE O NEGATIVE

http://KinkMeet.co.uk

(in reply to Voltare)

Post #: 20

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