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A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 8:34:30 AM   
xBullx


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Ok, I heard the voice of a man today. Not the voice of a politician, the voice of a man that does not view friends as political assets or libilities. A man that just might believe we are all part of the equation that adds up to America. He has done what I believe shows the world one of America's greatest assets; taking a castatrophy and building something greater. They said he wrote this speech himself, I hope so, I sincerely hope so.

I've waited a long time for a man that is about more than politics. Is that man you Senator Obama? Do you and I share a Home Stone?

Ok Senator, now you have my attention, now I'm listening......

But remember, those claiming a higher standard are held to it. I'm watching you. We all are.

Another man,

Bull

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 9:07:16 AM   
pahunkboy


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all i hear is a bunch of wall street babble talk. 

hint- when i get to a cashier- ill tell him that "we" have a liquidity problem. and that an injection of funds is needed. that todays investment waters are uncertain. 

i then  will gather my purchases and leave the store.

(in reply to xBullx)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 9:12:10 AM   
Mercnbeth


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Sorry my friend, Senator Obama lost me with this speech. If Senator Clinton doesn't, against all the numbers, get the first spot I'll be looking from the list of 'no vote' third party candidates.

My reasons have nothing to do with Reverend Wright. It would have been good to hear something to the effect that Reverend Wright is dead wrong. If the Senator then said he was "lazy" or "got too comfortable" or "excused what he said because I knew him a long time and he performed my wedding ceremony and baptized my kids"; he would have gained more of my respect. He did reference the old some of Reverend Wright's best friends are white by noting how he never heard the Reverend disrespect or insult a white person to their face. I guess I would be the only one who considered that Reverend Wrights private talk was hypocritical compared to his public sermons. At best he just called the Reverend a hypocrite, I'd say he was also a coward and liar, but that's me.

But a 'liberal', Senator Obama's description of himself, can never be or say they were wrong. There is always someone else to blame, always a victim to exploit. One of these subjects raised was the "quality gap between white and black education". The solution is more government money, without any reference to the lack of discipline or the current state of those poor inter city schools being caused by the very students and people living in those areas. How many "whites" are there to blame for those conditions? However, this shouldn't be about Reverend Wright. This is about a man who whats my vote for president. I can't do that.

Why?

I'm don't fall for image and style. He looked 'presidential', very eloquent. However, I hear and then read the words to understand the message. There were quite a few but respecting your beliefs how can you stand by a man who represents Sunday as "the most segregated hour in the US". That's a reference to people's choice of worship. Segregation doesn't come into play in a choice to attend church service. The idea that someone would think so portray beliefs of the paranoid. Will there be a move in a President Obama administration for a Church De-Segregation movement?

How about the impossible reconciliation of the US being "irrevocably linked" to its past of slavery yet representing change? Something is either "irrevocable" or can change. It can't be both.

Apparently the Democratic side of the election campaign is hoping to build a coalition of 'victims'. They want to create a majority who see themselves incapable of managing their own life. They want people who want to blame someone for their lack of advancement, lack of vision, lack of planning. They would never subscribe to "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your county." Instead they want all these victims to beg for the government to 'save them'. I don't see myself as a victim and if I ever did, the government would be the last source of 'help' I'd seek.  My statement concerning Senator Clinton notwithstanding, it makes it a difficult party to support.

However, back on point...

I can't support Senator Obama. I could never vote for a racist regardless of his color.  

(in reply to xBullx)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 9:18:55 AM   
faerytattoodgirl


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you must be schizo if your hearing voices. 

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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 9:42:01 AM   
philosophy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

How about the impossible reconciliation of the US being "irrevocably linked" to its past of slavery yet representing change? Something is either "irrevocable" or can change. It can't be both.



..personally, i'm irrevocably born in the UK, but i changed and now live in Canada.........not sure what you're saying here. Seems to me that all Obama was saying was that he believes in a USA that moves forward, while recognising where it came from......

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 9:45:16 AM   
DesertRat


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quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl
you must be schizo if your hearing voices. 


Crazy people usually don't know they're sick. Some of 'em...if they're glib enough and are around enough to rack up some 'seniority' even end up with followers. It's all basically meaningless but does have entertainment value.

Bob

_____________________________

When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro--Hunter S. Thompson
It's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide!--Chief Dead St. Knockout, 1933, Liverpool
Damn the crops. I'll only find peace at the end of a rope.--Winston Van Loo, 1911

(in reply to faerytattoodgirl)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 9:56:00 AM   
faerytattoodgirl


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quote:

Crazy people usually don't know they're sick.


im not crazy...im just a freak...and i know im quite sick....

muahahahahaha all the way to the funny farm...where i will always be as happy as can be...



_____________________________

I did not reply to your cmail.
I am flawed.
Imperfect.
MUST SPANK!!!
SPAAAAAAAANK!!!

(in reply to DesertRat)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:03:04 AM   
christine1


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lol....glad to see you back faery....

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http://wavcentral.com/cgi-bin/log/log.cgi?id=2856&sound=/sounds/movies/godzilla/roar.mp3


He's the "boom" overwhelming...

He is my Master, my lover, my best friend my everything.

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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:07:10 AM   
faerytattoodgirl


Posts: 5824
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wont be for long..mod just viewed my profile...

_____________________________

I did not reply to your cmail.
I am flawed.
Imperfect.
MUST SPANK!!!
SPAAAAAAAANK!!!

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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:20:53 AM   
xBullx


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Howdy Merc,

I hear ya, but I seen some purity in his words, at least enough to at least listen to his ideas now. Prior to today I thought he was another political blowhard. I’m still not sure, but I’m open to listen to him now.

His war policy is wrong in my opinion, at least from this point forward.

There are some other issues as well, but I said I’m listening now, not voting.

I have more to say but duty calls.

Live well,

Bull

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:21:02 AM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
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quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

Ok, I heard the voice of a man today. Not the voice of a politician, the voice of a man that does not view friends as political assets or libilities. A man that just might believe we are all part of the equation that adds up to America. He has done what I believe shows the world one of America's greatest assets; taking a castatrophy and building something greater. They said he wrote this speech himself, I hope so, I sincerely hope so.

I've waited a long time for a man that is about more than politics. Is that man you Senator Obama? Do you and I share a Home Stone?

Ok Senator, now you have my attention, now I'm listening......

But remember, those claiming a higher standard are held to it. I'm watching you. We all are.

Another man,

Bull


I didn't hear the speech, so I can't comment on its merits other than to say that speeches may inspire, but for me they never impress.

Obama "rejects" Rev Wright's polemics with his words, but what do his actions say?  After the speeches are done, we still have the image of Obama standing shoulder to shoulder with a man who preached "God damn America".  Obama's rejection has not altered that image, nor has it altered the fact that had not Rev Wright not stepped down, Obama would still accept him as his spiritual teacher.

The man who would lead me and mine starts off very badly when his spiritual guidance includes damning me and mine.


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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:24:01 AM   
subtee


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~FR

Do we really want to make our leaders personally responsible for the words of any/all in their lives?

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Don't believe everything you think...

(in reply to celticlord2112)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:39:39 AM   
xBullx


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Hello CL,

I agree the Pastor needs a mental health examination, but listen to the speech and judge the Senator for that.

I'm not in his camp mind you. I'm just a man out here valuing an honorable gesture hoping to discover another man seeking to bestow one.

Bull

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to celticlord2112)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:45:28 AM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
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quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

Hello CL,

I agree the Pastor needs a mental health examination, but listen to the speech and judge the Senator for that.

I'm not in his camp mind you. I'm just a man out here valuing an honorable gesture hoping to discover another man seeking to bestow one.

Bull


Didn't hear it, but I did read the transcript.  They are eloquent words, and I'm sure they were eloquently spoken.  However, at the end of the speech I still see Obama standing shoulder to shoulder with a man who preaches "God damn America".  So far, Obama has not persuaded me to look past that image.


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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:50:40 AM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
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quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

~FR

Do we really want to make our leaders personally responsible for the words of any/all in their lives?


Do we want leaders who are unwilling to accept that responsibility?

My standing order both to my boys and to any who work with or under me:  "Thou shalt not embarrass me".

I raised my boys--I am accountable for the lessons they learned.  When I assemble a team for a project, I lead them and am accountable for the work they do.  I set the standard of excellence, and am prepared to answer when those around me fail to meet that standard.

The man who would claim a mantle of leadership over me will do at least that much, or I will reject his claim.


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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 10:58:03 AM   
philosophy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

~FR

Do we really want to make our leaders personally responsible for the words of any/all in their lives?


Do we want leaders who are unwilling to accept that responsibility?

My standing order both to my boys and to any who work with or under me:  "Thou shalt not embarrass me".

I raised my boys--I am accountable for the lessons they learned.  When I assemble a team for a project, I lead them and am accountable for the work they do.  I set the standard of excellence, and am prepared to answer when those around me fail to meet that standard.

The man who would claim a mantle of leadership over me will do at least that much, or I will reject his claim.



.......i see your point, but no-one.....not even politicians........can control what those around them say. It seems to me that, with this speech directly addressing what the Pastor said, does take responsibility. Think of it like this......your boys, against your order, embarass you.......you them have to stand up and deal with that. Surely thats exactly what Obama has done with this speech.

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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 11:00:21 AM   
domiguy


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I think you and Obama might share a "homie stone."

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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 11:03:30 AM   
DomKen


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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

Hello CL,

I agree the Pastor needs a mental health examination, but listen to the speech and judge the Senator for that.

I'm not in his camp mind you. I'm just a man out here valuing an honorable gesture hoping to discover another man seeking to bestow one.

Bull


Didn't hear it, but I did read the transcript.  They are eloquent words, and I'm sure they were eloquently spoken.  However, at the end of the speech I still see Obama standing shoulder to shoulder with a man who preaches "God damn America".  So far, Obama has not persuaded me to look past that image.


So do you also reject McCain for standing beside a man who calls for the destruction of Islam? What about one who calls the Catholic church "the great whore" and who believes Katrina hit New Orleans because god wanted to prevent an upcoming gay pride parade.

Obama rejects Wright's opinions while McCain actively sought the endorsement of Parsley and Hagee. So who exactly has the hate filled rhetoric from a preacher problem?

(in reply to celticlord2112)
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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 11:06:22 AM   
domiguy


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Joined: 5/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

Hello CL,

I agree the Pastor needs a mental health examination, but listen to the speech and judge the Senator for that.

I'm not in his camp mind you. I'm just a man out here valuing an honorable gesture hoping to discover another man seeking to bestow one.

Bull


Didn't hear it, but I did read the transcript.  They are eloquent words, and I'm sure they were eloquently spoken.  However, at the end of the speech I still see Obama standing shoulder to shoulder with a man who preaches "God damn America".  So far, Obama has not persuaded me to look past that image.



At times it takes someone to say "God damn America" to get people's attention...You think that there are not serious and real complaints that people have experienced at the hands of this Country? Aids? Foreign relations? Hurricane Katrina? Just to name a few. We live in a great land...But being an American is not easy. Being an American gives us the right to confront our leaders and Country. Too many think that exercising that "right" makes one unpatriotic....I say that it is more than a right it is our responsibility...It is the very thing that defines an "American Citizen."


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RE: A man's voice should be his own. - 3/18/2008 11:09:16 AM   
luckydog1


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Obama did not go to pander for votes from Wright's congregation.  He personally gave Wright 5 figure donations, after he was giving God Damn America speeches, and saying 911 was the chickens coming home to roost.  It was only when the national spotlight was shined on the Wright that he began distancing himself.    Its not real.  If Obama had distanced himself 7 years ago, it wuld mean something.  Now he is just doing it for the votes.  What kind of man would jetison his "personal spiritual advisor" of 20 years, to win an election.?

Are people really going to accept the speech of a Lawyer and Politician at face value?!?!?!

(in reply to DomKen)
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