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Lesbians Attacked - 11/16/2008 6:07:08 AM   
came4U


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Status: offline 		http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_29183.aspx

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 11/17/2008 4:43:19 AM   
TheHungryTiger


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Status: offline 		From the link
quote:

The ugly incident - which alleged assailant Mark Scott claims followed one of the women directing racial slurs at his child .....


So each side is claiming that the other side committed a hate-crime against them. What wins? The race card or the gay card?


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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 11/17/2008 7:46:30 AM   
wulfgarw


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHungryTiger

From the link
quote:

The ugly incident - which alleged assailant Mark Scott claims followed one of the women directing racial slurs at his child .....


So each side is claiming that the other side committed a hate-crime against them. What wins? The race card or the gay card?



I say we settle it fairly.  Paper, Rock, Scissors, best of 3.

But seriously, when are people gonna grow up?



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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 11/17/2008 8:04:29 AM   
persephonee


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Status: offline 		actually, the physical one would win as far as believability....otherwise its he said she said unless there were witnesses....im appalled....this stuff happens with parents at soccer games and stuff and its all disgusting. i still have to protect my son from homophobic slurs and go into school specifically to explain why he has no father....and i am no longer even in a lesbian relationship....go figure.

people do indeed need to grow the hell up.

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 11/17/2008 8:34:10 AM   
LaTigresse


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Status: offline 		What Perse said.......

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 11/20/2008 7:40:38 PM   
NewnImproved


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Joined: 11/13/2008
From: California
Status: offline 		eh.  quite frankly, if I was a father, had someone making racial slurs at my son, I'd kick some ass too.  However, I think its kind of stupid that all these people support the lesbians, calling it a hate crime, when it doesnt seem like a normal, well functioning adult would just up and attack someone, in public, for just existing

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 11/20/2008 8:08:39 PM   
Aszhrae


Posts: 1030
Joined: 3/31/2008
Status: offline 		Girl concurs with perse in reference to the growing up, this is the beginning of the 21st century.
One faction says, all should be hetero in their love of another human being. Who in whatever power-that-be gave another human being the right to determine how someone should love another?
It's an uphill battle against such things such as prejudice, racism and discrimination.
Where does it say in the social liberties that you need to be this or that, to be that or this?
Is it ignorance, fear, protagonism or antagonism that has such incidents still occur?


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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 5:44:03 AM   
stella41b


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NewnImproved

eh. quite frankly, if I was a father, had someone making racial slurs at my son, I'd kick some ass too. However, I think its kind of stupid that all these people support the lesbians, calling it a hate crime, when it doesnt seem like a normal, well functioning adult would just up and attack someone, in public, for just existing


So this would mean that you agree that well-functioning is kicking some ass in a school playground in front of UMs?

I'm sorry, but to agree with that I would have to walk on my hands and teach my ass to sing.

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 10:16:43 AM   
Aszhrae


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Status: offline 		NewnImproved
You would be incorrect in your assumption of someone walking up to another someone and begin beating on them. You only need to go to a particular quarter of Toronto to speak to others concerning others getting a rubber hose beating. It became so bad and that metro police could not keep up with the assaults that the people there created their own guard.

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 1:13:14 PM   
Madame4a


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It is surprising how much gays and lesbians bring up hatred in others...

funnily enough, two lesbians were left beaten... the man wasn't .. was he?  They might have said something, but the response he gave was unwarranted, in any context...and clearly out of proportion


quote:

ORIGINAL: NewnImproved



eh.  quite frankly, if I was a father, had someone making racial slurs at my son, I'd kick some ass too.  However, I think its kind of stupid that all these people support the lesbians, calling it a hate crime, when it doesnt seem like a normal, well functioning adult would just up and attack someone, in public, for just existing


< Message edited by Madame4a -- 12/8/2008 1:14:19 PM >

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 1:19:11 PM   
came4U


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Status: offline 		I think the point is that in 2008 race, sexual orientation or even gender shouldn't even be the reasoning for violence (any where, any place).  I said 'shouldn't' yet it still is.

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 1:19:50 PM   
opposingtwilight


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Madame4a


It is surprising how much gays and lesbians bring up hatred in others...

funnily enough, two lesbians were left beaten... the man wasn't .. was he?  They might have said something, but the response he gave was unwarranted, in any context...and clearly out of proportion




We don't know if he was beaten or not. I highly doubt these two women just layed down and let him beat the crap out of them without lifting a finger. I also find it hard to believe that they did absolutely nothing to provoke him ...

I am disgusted by this whole thing for several reasons; adults acting like children, for one thing. Also, the fact that the women are playing the gay card -and- the female card. Growing up I saw lots of little boys told never to hit a girl but I never saw a girl told never to hit a boy.

Its almost ingrained in our heads ... A man hits two women--THAT MONSTER! Now add in the gay card and its ... A man brutalized two helpless women because they were lesbians! THAT MONSTER!!!!!!

They were all adults and they all behaved badly. They were all wrong.


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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 1:57:35 PM   
stella41b


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From: SW London (UK)
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quote:

ORIGINAL: opposingtwilight

Its almost ingrained in our heads ... A man hits two women--THAT MONSTER! Now add in the gay card and its ... A man brutalized two helpless women because they were lesbians! THAT MONSTER!!!!!!



Yeah sure, almost as ingrained as homophobia among certain members of the non-white community. Before this descends into another race issue it's important to remember that black people are struggling to overcome oppression from the black community just as much as they are from the white community.

Every time the race card is played it is a step backwards on the path promoted by Marcus Garvey, Malcolm X and Martin Luther King.

Every time the gay card is played it is also a step backward.

This stupidity is compounded whenever words descend into physical violence, and compounded yet again when it is carried out in the eyes of UMs.

We are all one race, one mind, one heart - the human race.


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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 2:31:29 PM   
Madame4a


Posts: 2045
Joined: 2/4/2008
From: Washington, DC area
Status: offline 		I'm going by what I read... feel free to read it also.. it doesn't say they attacked him.. in fact, quite the opposite...

http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_29028.aspx

you'd be surprised at how passive some people are.. particularly gays and lesbians who live their lives knowing at least one or two people who have been victims of similar situations...

quote:

ORIGINAL: opposingtwilight

quote:

ORIGINAL: Madame4a


It is surprising how much gays and lesbians bring up hatred in others...

funnily enough, two lesbians were left beaten... the man wasn't .. was he?  They might have said something, but the response he gave was unwarranted, in any context...and clearly out of proportion




We don't know if he was beaten or not. I highly doubt these two women just layed down and let him beat the crap out of them without lifting a finger. I also find it hard to believe that they did absolutely nothing to provoke him ...

I am disgusted by this whole thing for several reasons; adults acting like children, for one thing. Also, the fact that the women are playing the gay card -and- the female card. Growing up I saw lots of little boys told never to hit a girl but I never saw a girl told never to hit a boy.

Its almost ingrained in our heads ... A man hits two women--THAT MONSTER! Now add in the gay card and its ... A man brutalized two helpless women because they were lesbians! THAT MONSTER!!!!!!

They were all adults and they all behaved badly. They were all wrong.



< Message edited by Madame4a -- 12/8/2008 2:32:50 PM >

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 2:48:33 PM   
BoiJen


Posts: 2608
Joined: 3/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: opposingtwilight

quote:

ORIGINAL: Madame4a


It is surprising how much gays and lesbians bring up hatred in others...

funnily enough, two lesbians were left beaten... the man wasn't .. was he?  They might have said something, but the response he gave was unwarranted, in any context...and clearly out of proportion




We don't know if he was beaten or not. I highly doubt these two women just layed down and let him beat the crap out of them without lifting a finger. I also find it hard to believe that they did absolutely nothing to provoke him ...

I am disgusted by this whole thing for several reasons; adults acting like children, for one thing. Also, the fact that the women are playing the gay card -and- the female card. Growing up I saw lots of little boys told never to hit a girl but I never saw a girl told never to hit a boy.

Its almost ingrained in our heads ... A man hits two women--THAT MONSTER! Now add in the gay card and its ... A man brutalized two helpless women because they were lesbians! THAT MONSTER!!!!!!

They were all adults and they all behaved badly. They were all wrong.



You don't even know if the women said anything in the way of a slur or not. What can physically be shown is that two women who are in a relationshi together and witnesses tothese events, have seen this same man verbally attack them and now physically attack them. And if you don't think this kind of thing happens unprovoked I highly sugget you start reading up on ndividuals such as Matthew Shepard (who died after being on life support for days after suffering injuries that resulted in sever brain damage from an unprovoked attack) or watch the movie or read the book "Boys Don't Cry" completely based on the unprovoked rape and murder of a transgendered individual named Brandon Teena. And these are only two of hundreds, if not thousands, of unprovoked attacks on those who have different sexualities and choose not to hde them.

When was the last time you got fired from a job only to have a co-worker tell you the person who fired you had the hots for your partner and was telling other females in the office "don't let them turn you....you know they're together"? When was the last time you had to face biggoted family members or suffer from a physical attack from your own parents? People STILL deal with this every day.

Some can fight back. Some do fight back...AND in this instance the shit head landed two blows one to each woman...there's not much time there to turn and attack him. Nor is it the proper thing to do in front of a school. It definately would not surprise me if the women didn't hit him back in this case.

You really should go look at the history of people being attacked without "provoking" the situation. It happens and to assume it doesn't shows a great deal of growing up to be done by the person making the statement.



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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 2:54:43 PM   
opposingtwilight


Posts: 684
Joined: 6/13/2008
Status: offline 		The article was written from a very one sided point of view. All of your statements also come from a very one sided point of view.

I'm sorry but I am not going to fall in line with this one.

The way that article is written pretty much screams, "Look at these poor women, victimized by that awful, dreadful MAN!" I just don't buy it.

As for this part of your post ...

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

When was the last time you got fired from a job only to have a co-worker tell you the person who fired you had the hots for your partner and was telling other females in the office "don't let them turn you....you know they're together"? When was the last time you had to face biggoted family members or suffer from a physical attack from your own parents? People STILL deal with this every day.



I know people deal with that every day. My best friend got fired from a job because she was dating a girl. Ironically, the man who fired her was gay. He openly hated lesbians ... He told another girl that worked there not to hang out with my friend because she'd just "turn her into one of them" ... Her mother essentially disowned her. I was pretty much the only family she had. So please don't try and unload on me just because I disagree with your point of view.

Bearing that in mind, I'm still not going to jump on this band wagon.


< Message edited by opposingtwilight -- 12/8/2008 2:59:41 PM >

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 3:09:14 PM   
BoiJen


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Status: offline 		The article was written with information given and he choose not to make any statement to change tht other than to claim that there was a racial slur. However, the author was able to find information on his past actions against them. And there is no falling in line (what a bullshit line). He struck them...period. It's not k. And whether you choose to believe it or not...these types of things happen unprovoked. They happen frequently...your choice to not see that as the fact that it is ...it's simply incredible.

These types of things happening unprovoked is the very reason why there is such things as hate-crimes laws. Only a narrow minded individual would choose not to take history into account around this type of incident. The reporter included the history of this man's interactions as shared by other people who have witnessed those interactions.

What is this shit with "gay card" sorry n such thing. Men and women and children have been bullied and attacked and killed in unprovoked situations because they were black, because they were hispanic, becuse they were women, because they were gay, because they were trans, because they were different. These things happen in your own backyard. Ignorance is not bliss here...educate yourself on the facts. There is an incredible possibility that this attack happened unprovoked.

And really it comes down to two woemn who have children were left bruised and bleeding infront of their children's school from a man who hit them. It was not self defense and it was totally uncalled for. It's a crime to hit someone without their consent. Period. He committed a crime knowingly and willfully by attacking these women. I don't care what these women may or may not have said...he is automatically in the wrong for it. Just as if one of them had struck him for any reason...they would have been in the wrong.

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 3:22:01 PM   
beargonewild


Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: opposingtwilight

quote:

ORIGINAL: Madame4a


It is surprising how much gays and lesbians bring up hatred in others...

funnily enough, two lesbians were left beaten... the man wasn't .. was he?  They might have said something, but the response he gave was unwarranted, in any context...and clearly out of proportion




We don't know if he was beaten or not. I highly doubt these two women just layed down and let him beat the crap out of them without lifting a finger. I also find it hard to believe that they did absolutely nothing to provoke him ...

I am disgusted by this whole thing for several reasons; adults acting like children, for one thing. Also, the fact that the women are playing the gay card -and- the female card. Growing up I saw lots of little boys told never to hit a girl but I never saw a girl told never to hit a boy.

Its almost ingrained in our heads ... A man hits two women--THAT MONSTER! Now add in the gay card and its ... A man brutalized two helpless women because they were lesbians! THAT MONSTER!!!!!!

They were all adults and they all behaved badly. They were all wrong.



opposingtwilight: before you start ignoring the fact, had you bothered to click the link to the original story? Here is a quote from the original:

Tuesday November 11, 2008 CityNews.ca Staff A routine day became anything but for parents outside an Oshawa elementary school last Monday. As Anji Dimitriou walked from the parking lot towards her six-year-old son, police say a man approached her. Her girlfriend, Jane Currie (pictured), was watching from their truck. According to the women, he asked Dimitriou, "Which one of you two men spoke to my kid?" He allegedly called the couple "f***ing dyke lesbians."
Now, you tell me how this aggravated assault isn't crossing the line into a prejudicial slur and hate crime? It is one thing to physically assault another because they spat on you or they were retaliating against a perceived threat from you, yet to start slinging prejudicial slurs against a same sex couple is a whole new ball game. I can guarantee that if a man pulled that same bullshit on you, you'd be the first to pull the female card against your attacker. Maybe if you walked in our shoes for a month and see that living life as a gay man or a lesbian woman is no effin bed of roses at times. I live in a city of 58,000 and Oshawa has approx 146000 people. It is a damn shame that in a city 3X the sze as mine something such as that had to happen. The cold hard truth is homophobia happens in every damn city, town and village on this planet. And it's attitudes like yours which makes me really wonder about the mentality of humans.


< Message edited by beargonewild -- 12/8/2008 3:30:59 PM >

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 3:36:27 PM   
LadyPact


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Status: offline 		Just a curiosity here, but does anyone think the possibility exists that the attacker went to the racial slur idea because he might know that the assult would be considered a hate crime in the first place?  Should he chose to go to trial over the matter, and is entitled to trial by jury, he might have been thinking about what his best chance would be to get off.

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RE: Lesbians Attacked - 12/8/2008 3:46:05 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline 		Well, hard to 'prove' without an impartial witness at the scene that any N word was even uttered.  Yet, easy to prove intent when the actual abuse/attack was witnessed and she has injury because of it.

UPDATE: "Mark Scott, 43, of Oshawa has been charged with two counts of assault causing bodily harm. He was released and is scheduled to appear in court on Dec 16."

http://www.xtra.ca/public/National/Currie_Dimitriou_speak_at_Oshawa_rally_in_wake_of_vicious_attack-5839.aspx

""Mr Scott, a visible minority, is outraged at the racial and physical abuse that he has suffered at the hands of Ms Dimitriou and Ms Currie," the release states. "Mr Scott is eagerly looking forward to his day in court when he will no longer have to be a victim anymore. The truth surrounding this incident will come to light and the parties responsible will be held accountable for the racially motivated and unprovoked attack he suffered."


< Message edited by came4U -- 12/8/2008 3:51:45 PM >

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