RE: Gorean slave silks (Full Version)

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gitta -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/27/2004 9:25:13 AM)

Destinysskeins,

In book seven Captive of Gor (page 118) panthers are introduced. "These were forest girls, sometimes called panther girls who lived wild and free in the northern forests, outlaw women, sometimes enslaving men, when it pleases them to do so."
They are free women who live as hunters, they apparently live in tribes. i have heard them refered to as Taluna as well.

While my knowledge of Gorean culture is limited, i have found great joy in discovering the philosophy. Often when reading the books, i find myself going over the same text several times. Each sees different things, no one way of thinking is right or wrong.

Some wish to "live online" and others wish to live "real time"...again neither is right or wrong, just different.

Hope this helps, and it is my opinion only...except for the quote lol.



MistressDREAD -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/28/2004 12:07:03 AM)

quote:

Goreans don't have the monopoly on things not being fair. Life isn't fair.

the thread isent about life but about Gor kiki.

quote:

We are
discussing Gorean activities and beliefs, not subscribing to the beliefs.

Those whom call their selfs Gorean are subscribing to the beleiefs and will be treated as Gorean by Me as I stated. I do not expect those not of Gor to act Gorean nor do I read those not of Gor to act as such, if I did I would not be answering you kiki nor would you be posting on this Gor thread as it is not the place of a slave to do such without a Free or Owners permission and subs are not a part of GOR. JMO.
quote:

the content of the thread should in no way dictate
the social structure of those responding

The content of the thread is Gorean and those Gorean will respond to it differently then those not of GOR and if it addresses the social structure of how GOR is then it must also be addressed as such. Gor in its self is a High protical Alternate Society and Lifestyle and for sumone of D/s to expect a Gorean to NOT act as such on a Gorean thread in its self is wrong to Me, thats like saying Ill accept you reaching over My eating place accross a table as you take anothers plate because you have never been trained in simple ettique on how to go around the table to pick up a plate. I wouldent accept this action either and would make a comment about it and show you how to do it right even if you dident want to accept such teachings. Thats just the way I am. JMO



MistressDREAD -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/28/2004 12:44:07 AM)

january
I stated that I treat Goreans as the like being Gorean My self.
I never stated that I treat anyone not Gorean as Gorean when
they are not and teach many on a daily basis the basics when
I am around on Gor and BDSM as well. My statement is for threads
that address a certain area of a Alternate Lifestyle and when I address
such I try to do so in the area the way the area being addressed
usually act in their proticals, afterall how do you expect sumone to learn the differances of all the vast amount of Alternate Lifestyles if One does not show the vast differances that they are about or have from others or learn the differances so that they can be used and practiced and enjoyed. that is all. JMO
There will be sum that is unapplealing to sum and others that will be appealing to others based off of what they see in the structure of the others whom practice such being shown.JMO
Just in this thread alone I can see at least one person whom has learned that there are not only slave woman on Gor but very strong Free Woman and Panthers as well that All live with in the Gor structure according to whats written in the books even if there are sum Goreans whom would tempt to profess that one can be Gorean with out knowing the books, But this is just one such fact that if the books had been read they would of known that there is way much more to Gor then simply Masters and Their slaves. slaves on Gor are the minority and there are said to be 100 Free Woman for every woman slave even tho there seems to be online way more of an abundance of woman slaves and male slaves to Free Woman and Gor Masters whom accept Free Woman in general and real life....... Go figgure LOL JMO~smiles~



Destinysskeins -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/28/2004 6:58:23 AM)

Greetings,

*smiles* thank you, gitta. This was the meaning that i had learned for Panthers and it's reassuring to note that i'd learned something that was actually a fact rather than one of the online misnomers that fly about.

As for the whole Gorean affectation, for my part i've felt quite free to ask questions of those identifying with Gor and have not felt any pressure to conform to their standards and policies. In addition, i don't feel a need to ask them to rework or put aside their Gor demeanors. They are Gor because they identify very strongly as Gor - would i expect a submissive to act in a Dominant nature because that's what i thought suited the thread at the time? Would i expect a gay person to act straight because they were in the company of strictly heterosexuals? Well, in my opinion, you can wish for these things until your face turns blue but in the end - most real subs/slaves (that don't have any switching tendencies & *wince* i'm not saying that those who do aren't real subs - just making a point [;)]) would make piss poor Dominants and let's face it - gay people are just much more fun in their natural state. [:D] And thus are the Goreans.



MistressDREAD -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/28/2004 9:18:45 AM)

Why Jashi Destinysskeins
Jashi= ]Thankyou in online roleplay Gor]
I agree wholly and think the Goreans abound
here on Collarme bring to it much of its
Z I N G! ~wink~
*Looks over to Mine and smiles*[:)]



kiki blue -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/28/2004 8:37:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressDREAD
the thread isent about life but about Gor kiki.


Oh I'm sorry, Dread, I didn't realise Gor existed outside of life.

quote:


Those whom call their selfs Gorean are subscribing to the beleiefs and will be treated as Gorean by Me as I stated. I do not expect those not of Gor to act Gorean nor do I read those not of Gor to act as such, if I did I would not be answering you kiki nor would you be posting on this Gor thread as it is not the place of a slave to do such without a Free or Owners permission and subs are not a part of GOR. JMO.


As I'm happily single, I need no ones permission to do anything. And even if I were in a relationship, it would have no bearing on how you should behave towards me, as this is board isn't protocol specific. This thread, as I've previously said, is discussing aspects of Gor, not one that is for Gorean behaviour only.

quote:


The content of the thread is Gorean and those Gorean will respond to it differently then those not of GOR and if it addresses the social structure of how GOR is then it must also be addressed as such.


Of course those who are Gorean will respond to it differently, just as those who are XYZ will respond to it differently than those who are ABC. We can discuss Gorean social structure, just as we can that of the Ottoman and/or Roman empires and their attitude towards slavery, but that doesn't mean we're meant to exhibit behaviour shown by Romans, now, does it?

Discussing it doesn't mean being it.


quote:

Gor in its self is a High protical Alternate Society and Lifestyle and for sumone of D/s to expect a Gorean to NOT act as such on a Gorean thread in its self is wrong to Me, thats like saying Ill accept you reaching over My eating place accross a table as you take anothers plate because you have never been trained in simple ettique on how to go around the table to pick up a plate. I wouldent accept this action either and would make a comment about it and show you how to do it right even if you dident want to accept such teachings. Thats just the way I am. JMO


Expecting others to treat you as you expect in all your Gorness in in a non Gor setting is as poor an ettiquette as reaching over the table to take something off someone elses plate. Basic social ettiquette, as supported by the general society you live in (in your case, the USA) is what's expected here, from what I understand.



MistressDREAD -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/28/2004 10:57:59 PM)

quote:

Oh I'm sorry, Dread, I didn't realise Gor existed outside of life.

I did not say this, I said that this thread is not about life outside of Gor but about slaves silks. of course Gor can exsist in Life Living, however that is not what I was addressing.
quote:

this is board isn't protocol specific

this is true however those whom profess to stand in a certain position with in the lifestyle in general usually in a non specific board still act with in those roles that they choose to live in. Do you feel your words are those that would be said to any Dominant other then I, and do you feel that your words are looked on positivly or negativly by other Dominants whom you are not addressing but see how you address Me?hmm more thought.

quote:

Expecting others to treat you as you expect in all your Gorness in in a non Gor setting is as poor an ettiquette as reaching over the table to take something
off someone elses plate.

I dident have any expectations of others on the Gor thread that were not Gorean, I stated that I will treat Goreans as such on a Gor thread and that is My choice that you nor anyone else will choose for Me to do and other Goreans Im sure will also act much the same as They have allready done. And I have no Gorness thank You. [Would the word Gorness be sum kind of slant as to My Beliefs towards My Choice of Gor Alternate ways of Living and being Gorean?hmmmmmm things to ponder...]

quote:

Basic social ettiquette, as supported by the general
society you live in (in your case, the USA) is what's expected here, from what Iunderstand.


You understand wrong for this is NOT the general society or a board of the general society but a board of a alternate lifestyle living which is actually a outcaste site to society in general and of whats concidered the general society as you put it in the USA and as you feel is in My case alltho I am not at the moment in the USA but at My Home outside of the Country however since You seem to think you know My current where abouts Ill not tell you that you are also wrong in this assumption. Here are the rules of this board and I followed My protical of My Alternate Lifestyle to address My Lifestyle ways here just as the rules stated I have a right to do.

As the description for this section states, this is a forum for the open discussion of topics pertaining to BDSM and related subjects. ( this does not say the general society of the USA but BDSM and its related subjects.)All members are welcome to join in the conversation here regardless of experience or interest.

Subjects which are unacceptable regardless of circumstance include, but are not limited to - minors, bestiality, incest, necrophilia, snuff and criminal activities. Any other questions of acceptability will be determined based on the content of the given essay.

Keep the discussions civil and mature, and do not insult the kinks, preferences, lifestyles, etc. of others.
( you desire to insist that I have no right to act and be the Gorean that I am and on a Gor thread no less, however the rules here state that I have such a right and it is you whom have no right to insult My Lifestyle or My preferences kiki and this is how I define what I read in the rules that differ from you.) JMO.



kiki blue -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/29/2004 7:43:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressDREAD

I did not say this, I said that this thread is not about life outside of Gor but about slaves silks. of course Gor can exsist in Life Living, however that is not what I was addressing.


You quoted "Gor is not fair", as if that was something different to the rest of life. Most of us learn early on that life isn't fair.

quote:


this is true however those whom profess to stand in a certain position with in the lifestyle in general usually in a non specific board still act with in those roles that they choose to live in.


I feel that would be bad manners. At least, it is where I am. I treat everyone the same, as how they ID in a personal relationship has no bearing on how I interact with them, unless I am involved with them.

quote:


Do you feel your words are those that would be said to any Dominant other then I, and do you feel that your words are looked on positivly or negativly by other Dominants whom you are not addressing but see how you address Me?hmm more thought.


I talk to you as I would anyone else. I quite honestly don't care how any random dominant feels about how I interact with other people, their opinion bears no weight on the manners my mother taught me. I'm intelligent, assertive and able to hold a conversation - which are usually more attractive than being able to "yes Sir/no Sir".

quote:

You understand wrong for this is NOT the general society or a board of the general society but a board of a alternate lifestyle living which is actually a outcaste site to society in general and of whats concidered the general society as you put it in the USA and as you feel is in My case alltho I am not at the moment in the USA but at My Home outside of the Country however since You seem to think you know My current where abouts Ill not tell you that you are also wrong in this assumption.


Oh, I'm sorry. I thought because you mentioned you were in Florida, that it meant you were in Florida. As I don't memorise all online interactions, my apologies.

What is perceived as good manners by Western society, still stands though.

quote:


( you desire to insist that I have no right to act and be the Gorean that I am and on a Gor thread no less, however the rules here state that I have such a right and it is you whom have no right to insult My Lifestyle or My preferences kiki and this is how I define what I read in the rules that differ from you.) JMO.


I'm not saying you have no right to act Gorean, I'm saying that on this board you should treat everyone as equals, because that's what we are. How you ID in a relationship, as I've already said, should bear no weight on how others interact with you on a board that is not protocol specific (ie Gor, high formal).

I think I'm done dancing in circles with you on this, though. Talk how you want, but people gain more respect by treating others with respect.



stormiKnightBEAR -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/29/2004 10:06:40 AM)

kiki,

You are RIGHT ON THE MARK!!

EVERYONE is entitled to ask questions,
receive an answer if possible, but most
of all EVERYONE has the right to live their
bdsm/leather/gor life as they choose.
Regardless of what others think.


Hang tough..

stormi
property of Master Bear



Synocense -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/29/2004 9:40:39 PM)

Just a friendly reality check.....

None of us, no how, no way...are Gorean, nor will we ever be. We are Earthlings and we live in a society different from that which Mr. Norman writes about. We might be able to incooperate certain ideals, certainly, but then we're still just Earthlings living a lifestyle which fits us individually, no? I have all the books, read all the books and I think they are awesome. I fantasize about such a life! Then I come back down to Earth. : )

syn



MistressDREAD -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/30/2004 2:43:46 AM)

kiki,
Gor is not fair, Gor is Gor
is not My Quote but a common one of Gor
and what it means is that the way of Gor
and Goreans
to those not of Gor might seem extream
or as you call it being rude however I do
not feel as a Gorean that I was being such.
That was My point of saying such and not
that it paralles real life in any way in terms
of being fair or unfair.

For you to judge Me as being rude with in Gor terms
not being of Gor or baseing your opinion towards Me
with vanilla common terms and ways in its self goes
against alternate lifestyle ways to Me. hELLLLOOooo!

I do not treat everyone the same. I treat people how
they desire to be treated and carry My self the same,
and give those back what I get from them, good, bad or ugly.
If I treated everyone the same no one would like the way
I treated them nor would anyone be different, how boring.

I am not like anyone else hence your treatement of Me as such
to Me is the actual rudeness. Conversations need two or more
people whom have a desire to learn or speak on the topic of choice,
however We are not discussing manners that your mother taught you but
what slaves wear and I bet your mother dident discuss this issue with you.

Ive been in Florida amone just one of a few states and few Countrys in the past week.

as I said befor, This is not western society here and the mannerizums of such are not used in Gor nor by Me on a Gor thread and for you to say that this is what will be used here is where your rudeness stands slanting Gors rules or manners.

To tempt to tell Me how I should treat anyone is your error. Just because you choose to look at everyone on a thread or in a lifestyle as equal does not mean that I must also do what you do the way you do it because you say so or think this is right.

Respect on Gor is gained differently then the ways of your way of thinking kiki. Respect is gained differently in BDSM then from the vanilla world as well kiki. I have no need for your respect nor anyone else here in order to post My opinion on My Alternate Lifestyles as I allready have My Respect gained in places thru many years of My Life and Work and Deeds in real life. I have no need to gain any online respect on your terms as that vanilla main line frame of thought doesent work for Me anyhow, its the reasons Im a part of a Alternate way of Living in the first place.

Also there is no need for you to apoligize for your opinion to Me. your opinion is just that, yours and has as much right to be heard as anyone elses and if you feel that you have to apolgize for what you say then there is sumthing that you are saying that you feel regretful in saying. Dont.

FYI, I do not speak My Opinions to gain anyones respect but for others to gain insite into the makeup of One such as My self and My Lifestyles ways and personnas that differ from the vanilla norm. Maybe you have a need for others respect and carry your self in such a way to always gain such but I however live by My Own way and that action in its self that I always speak and Live in My Own Honor and Integrity is what gains Me My Respects and from those whoms opinions I care about.
JMO

Syn
Being Human does NOT define Me.
Every person on the earth is Human.

your tempt to tell Me that I am not Gorean is like telling Me that I am not a BDSMer or a Mistress or a Sadist or a Humiliationist or Rastafarian or Jamaican or Arowok, or a white Black or a Free Woman or a Mother or a Gran Mom or a Wife or a Dominant or a slave Owner or a Business Owner simply because you have not made your fantasies reality and all of My Fantasies Ive made become My LIFE. however I have and My Life is Real not a fantasy and My Definitions of who and what I am are just that, Reality. Sum of us only dream of what can be while others of Us make Our dreams Reality. Dont knock it till you try it. And thats My REALITY CHECK for you.JMO



Deleted User -> [Deleted] (8/30/2004 6:10:32 AM)

[Deleted by Admins]



Destinysskeins -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/30/2004 7:22:46 AM)

*offers coffee to kiki blue and black wine to MistressDREAD*

How bout we just sit and watch the fire for a bit? *oo, pretty flames*

Guess i really should've left sleeping dogs lie (not a pun! honestly!).



MistressDREAD -> RE: Gorean slave silks (8/30/2004 9:37:10 AM)

O.K. ModSix Ill try...........
no garuntees tho....* blinks~[8|]
[takes the black wine offered.
Jashi.... I need sumthing hot
this morning ~smiles!~] spits on the dog.......



GreyDragon1952 -> RE: (9/3/2004 7:10:08 AM)

quote:

I have no problem with Gorean interactions in a Gorean setting. If I were to participate in a Gorean board, then I'd be choosing to follow their rules. It's when it's on a public non-Gorean specific board, that some feel they should be thrusting it down the throats of others, that gets to me.
kiki blue


The topic as stated at the start was Gorean slave silks There are lots of threads that have nothing to do with Gorean themes. No body is thrusting anything down anyone’s throat, at least I didn’t think I was.

I was taking a break and didn’t keep up with all the replies, I was surprised at the number of hits and responses to this thread, only one other thread had more hits, but this one had more responses. And In its way is gratifying. Far from thrusting things down peoples throat, I found this thread rewarding in that I learned a lot, from others, and maybe some learned from me.

Some of the points made

1. Slaves silks as tags in a slaves name are more important to the slave than, some might think, and that not everyone sees any color as meaning the same as another.

2. While white does not always mean virginal, it been used as a symbol of it, but added meanings can also be expected. A restricted slave for one.

3. I do not need to be told a girl is white silked slave, in order to restrict my use of her. After all if she does not wear my collar, It means she’s not mine. But is she wearing any collar means she has an owner, one that most likely would not like me making free use of their slave. The Master will let me how I may interact with his slave. The slave can also state his wishes. Note His wishes not hers!

4. Gorean Slaves for the most part defer to Free males and females, its expected in what looks to be a Gorean environment as I felt this thread was. This seems not to follow real life as closely as it does online. Now real life I would only expect a slave to defer to me if in a gorean group setting, I was a part of, not the outside world as a whole.

5. Gorean slaves are known for the way they are to please males, all males! Even when being outspoken they are to do it in a pleasing manor.

6. Masters fight their own battles slaves do not. Slaves should not be fighting Free, on behave of their Masters. They act for their Masters pleasure not their own.

7. Contrary to what might have been thought I do not think slaves are to be seen and not heard. How boring it would be if it was all one sided.

8. Female slaves give males pleasure in everything they do, this something valued far more than most people think.

9. Are slaves less than males? Not really they just deport themselves as males being the Dominant part of the relationship. The Dominant takes care of their slave or quickly find they don’t have a slave. Slaves take care of the male or find themselves without a Master.

10. Gor is not for every one. Why should it be? Gor is more a state of mind than anything else. And few of us think alike.

11. Gor is not for the timid, Free or slave. A timid slave will find it walked over in such a way as to make a rug feel good about itself. An outspoken slave can be of far more value than the meek. There are simply guidelines for it. Just stay within them as your Master has laid them out for you.

12. Slaves! I do not always agree with your Masters. This does not mean I disagree with you. Your opinion might and can be valid but it can in no way be enforced on Me, and will have little influence if not presented in pleasing manner. Something I’m sure you have already found out with the one that you call Master.

13. Slaves have value. Some will say they have none. If slaves had no value they would not be sought out or fought for. Good slaves are treasures to those that own them. And alto not always shown it loved dearly. And would find anyone harming one to be in real danger of bodily harm.

14. For the Gorean slave the Master is the center of their life, from which all comes from.

15. For the Gorean Master a slave is a constant source of wonder and pleasure that make us glad to be males, and the owners of slaves.

16. Finally that all here are worthy of respect, and that I have found good people to talk with and share ideas and thoughts. To debate and when the dust settles we can say it was fun. Lets do it again some time. Sure its hard not to take things personally, we would not be human if we didn’t. But then there are few of so mean spirited as to think the world is against them, or they feel they have to be right every time. Some one said we are all equal, I don’t agree fully with that, but we all have an equal chance to debate it here.

These are my thoughts
Grey Dragon

I used a spell checker and have looked for other grammar errors, I might not have found them all, most of us read typos and understand what being said, even if done poorly. Try not to use that as a argument if you find something you don't agree with in my posts. GD



MistressDREAD -> RE: RE: (9/3/2004 5:02:52 PM)

[:)]



Thanatosian -> RE: RE: (9/14/2004 10:24:27 AM)

quote:

Gorean Slaves for the most part defer to Free males and females, its expected in what looks to be a Gorean environment as I felt this thread was.


I believe the point kiki was trying to make is that this is NOT a Gorean environment, but a discussion about certain aspects of Gorean culture

Simply because a thread mentions Gor (or an aspect of Gorean culture) does not make it a Gorean environment, where Gorean rules and protocols must need be followed



stormiKnightBEAR -> RE: RE: (9/14/2004 9:00:24 PM)

You are very correct. It is not a Gorean chat
or "camp" .

It is however, a thread that wanted more information.
There have been several views on what silks and the colors mean. It is
very obvious that they many different things to different Goreans.

However, this girl will readily admit, that there are few here in collarme.com
that this girl would address as Goreans unless told so by Master. Some
of the examples seen here, even in this thread do not carry or hold themself
to the similar beliefs that the Goreans that are known by Master and his girl.
(Which could explain how come many are on ignore).

It simply is beyond this girl why there can not be a discussion or question without
someone jumping on someone as has been done here. This girl enjoys reading
what kiki has to say on most threads. Does not mean that this girl is in total agreement
but she is intelligent, articulate, and offers food for thought at times,
of course that is merely stormi's point of view.

Be Well and kiki, don't let'em get the best of you.


stormi
property of Master Bear



kiki blue -> RE: RE: (9/16/2004 2:56:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: stormiKnightBEAR

Be Well and kiki, don't let'em get the best of you.


Aww thank you stormi :) I'd have responded to this thread sooner, but I'm cavorting around the US at the moment (though strangely, it's been mostly with non kinksters, which I find amusing!).

It takes a lot for someone to offend me on a board or mailing list - I try to use the manners my mother taught me, which is to treat everyone with the same respect until their actions indicate otherwise. If others wish to be rude to others or about a topic during a discussion, that's their problem, not mine.

Gorean behaviour done properly, with respect for others in and out of that lifestyle choice, reflects well upon that community. Bad behaviour done in the name of Gor demeans it, just as bad behaviour in work or school uniform demeans that school.



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