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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/13/2009 9:01:17 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CruelNUnsual

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

God forbid any money should be spent on citizens' health when 651.2 BILLIONS of dollars have to be spent on the military budget for the 2009 fiscal year.

Priorities, people! Priorities.

Thats right, priorities. If youre dead you dont need fucking health care.

Conversley,not having fucking health care......can lead to your being dead.
Sooner rather than later....

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/13/2009 9:09:35 PM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

250 million people are covered by insurance in this country. 50 million are not covered. Why don't they worry about the ones without coverage and leave the rest of us alone. I'm happy the way it is. Leave the Feds out of my life.

What part of it are you so happy with?

Seriously. What exactly is it that you're so determined not to give up? You're paying far more than the citizens in almost any other developed country pay for their health care, the quality of care is vastly inferior to that of most other western nations, the cost of maintaining the system is crippling American business and impeding the economy, and every thing that's wrong about it is getting worse every year. What exactly is the part of this that you can't stand to let go of?

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/13/2009 9:14:22 PM

MzMia

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I currently have excellent health care benefits.
I have a PPO plan in which I can go to a variety of physicians or specialists
in and out of my network.
I can even go to a specialist in my network, without a referral.
*Of course out of network, or without a referral costs more.

Growing up I had adequate insurance as a military dependent.
In my 20's and 30's there were periods I had periods of no insurance, good insurance,
very limited insurance, and crappy insurance.

I feel that we need some sort of National Health Insurance for those that need it for whatever reason.
Everyone should have some sort of affordable health plan available to them.
The changes that were made to Medicare, seem to have only complicated many senior's lives.
National health care is something that is long overdue in America.

I just don't want to see something that is created that is hard to understand, raises everyone's taxes sky high, and lowers the quality of patient care for everyone.

We need health care reform in America, I just don't want to see legislation or a system created that is a living nightmare.

< Message edited by MzMia -- 5/13/2009 9:15:14 PM >

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/13/2009 9:25:25 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: CruelNUnsual

Thats right, priorities. If youre dead you dont need fucking health care.

Now is fucking health care an improved or lesser version of regular health care?

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/13/2009 10:59:58 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Not only will they decide what you are entitled to, they will decide when you can see a Dr. How often you can see a Dr. And who that Dr. will be. When the Federal govt. starts paying the bills, they will take control of your medical history and your private files...

Not true at all. All that will be required is a big whopping profit and something called insurance but little if any real healthcare. We'll still be spending more per capita than any other industialized country...still getting less healthcare per capita than any other and still dying younger and younger.

Why is it that people still fail to grasp the easiests of concepts ? Like the concept of a single-payer govt. operated 'health' insurance program for banks called the FDIC and govt, makes no such decisions for bankers until they are rich enough off the bank having broke it. The whole concept fails to take hold even in some of the most inquiring minds.

Are this country's values so screwed up that most aren't even paying any attention to the fact we have several single-payer govt, operated 'health' insurance programs already and for decades ? I guess they are.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 6:12:37 AM

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Fast Reply:

You know... we do have government provided healthcare insurance in this country. It's called Medicare and Medicaid.

Aren't those two programs just wonderful?

Sure gives me confidence in the Federal government's ability to put together and manage a national healthcare program for everybody.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 6:23:58 AM

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The Tenth Amendment is the key. It makes it clear that the Federal government has no authority to be in the health care business - it is a matter for the States. If a State wants to have a State run health care system that is their right. That doesn't mean I think it would be a good idea, but they do have the authority.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 6:59:34 AM

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Good point Treasure. And Medicare is due to go broke by 2018 so yeah, maybe we should get THAT mess figured out before we try to expand the Medicare coverage to everyone who just needs a bed for the night.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TreasureKY

Fast Reply:

You know... we do have government provided healthcare insurance in this country. It's called Medicare and Medicaid.

Aren't those two programs just wonderful?

Sure gives me confidence in the Federal government's ability to put together and manage a national healthcare program for everybody.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 8:05:51 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TreasureKY

Fast Reply:

You know... we do have government provided healthcare insurance in this country. It's called Medicare and Medicaid.

Aren't those two programs just wonderful?

Sure gives me confidence in the Federal government's ability to put together and manage a national healthcare program for everybody.

...and yet other countries around the world do manage to put together a nationalised health systemthat works. So what's the problem in the States? Is the Federal Government institutionally less competent than, say, France?

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 8:08:53 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy
So what's the problem in the States?

It's full of Americans

*DUCK*.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 8:43:25 AM

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kit, I hate to agree with you so totally but I do.

Which brings up an interesting notion ; perhaps we should let the French come run the healthcare system. Now wait while I don the suit now, but if they have proven experience at being successful at this sort of thing and we do not, what is logical ? Every other damn thing is jobbed out to foreigners anyway, so why not take some of the good with the bad ?

While I realize that this would be very difficult to implement, I was not being sarcastic. It only makes sense, if you want to build something that works, take a close look at something that already works. With the [lack of] confidence I have in US bigwigs these days, I don't mean hiring a few consultants, I mean give out some H1B visas, because I think it would be hard to find anyone here who could do the job. Actually run it.

T

(in reply to kittinSol)

RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 8:44:53 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy
So what's the problem in the States?

It's full of Americans *DUCK*.

Hide behind me, little lady, because I agree.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 8:46:44 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

Which brings up an interesting notion ; perhaps we should let the French come run the healthcare system. Now wait while I don the suit now, but if they have proven experience at being successful at this sort of thing and we do not, what is logical ?

At the very least, there'd be no more scathing jokes about hospital food.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 9:07:27 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

250 million people are covered by insurance in this country. 50 million are not covered. Why don't they worry about the ones without coverage and leave the rest of us alone. I'm happy the way it is. Leave the Feds out of my life.

How well are you covered?

What if you have an accident that leaves you in such poor shape that you need in-home nursing care around the clock?

Will your insurance cover that?

< Message edited by rulemylife -- 5/14/2009 9:08:06 AM >

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 9:13:03 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

How well are you covered?

I bloody well hope that the American taxpayer didn't fork out to have George Bush's polyps removed

.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 9:28:16 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

I bloody well hope that the American taxpayer didn't fork out to have George Bush's polyps removed .

Well, joking aside, those people deciding on a health care program enjoy the best, completely subsidized, health care in the country.

It's no mystery why we have former Presidents living into their 90's and many members of Congress who have, and currently do, hold office at advanced ages.

Yet, many of these same people oppose the government-paid health plans they have being available to the rest of the population.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 9:29:40 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Yet, many of these same people oppose the government-paid health plans they have being available to the rest of the population.

You got my point :-) .

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 9:52:33 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

...and yet other countries around the world do manage to put together a nationalised health systemthat works. So what's the problem in the States? Is the Federal Government institutionally less competent than, say, France?

That's one a' them there, uh, rhetorical questions, right?

Seriously, though - interestingly enough, that's exactly the argument that has been successfully employed by the conservatives who oppose health care reform, even though - remarkably!- they were the ones in power for 8 of the years they were asserting it! I remember seeing Bush himself making this very point - paraphrasing here, but it was something along the lines of, "Do you really trust the federal government to manage something this complex?" In other words, "Do you idiots really trust us not to fuck this up?" Which of course was an entirely valid question, whether he realized it or not, but amazing nonetheless for its audacity as much as its effectiveness.

I've always found it nothing short of flabbergasting that the very same people who strut around punding their chests and bellowing, "we're Americans, we're the greatest country on Earth and we can do anything better than anyone else in the world" are the ones who, as soon as health care is mentioned, will turn on a dime and say, "Well, no, we could never possibly do that as well as the French or the Cubans." Without a trace of irony. It's stupefying to me how easily these people are manipulated, like children in a day care center.

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What immortal hand or eye
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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 10:04:06 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

It's stupefying to me how easily these people are manipulated, like children in a day care center.

Big pharma pushing psychotropic drugs more brazenly than the local drug dealers: that's why they are in such a stupefied state. They'll do anything they're told, and they won't bite the hand that feeds them the pills

.

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RE: I found It! I found it!! Where healthcare is a &q... - 5/14/2009 1:26:39 PM

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FR:

Interesting article:

France's cautionary tale
Valentin Petkantchin
Wednesday, May 6, 2009

At the center of President Obama's newly released budget is a $634 billion reserve fund to help policymakers achieve comprehensive health care reform. But money alone can't fix a country's health care problems. Just ask any Frenchman.

Firm

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