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Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 4:18:52 AM   
Louve00


Posts: 1674
Joined: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		I haven't seen much media coverage on it, nor has anyone mentioned it here.  I thought it was a great speech.  Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on it?  (I learn so much from you guys!  )

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/04/obama-cairo-speech-video_n_211210.html

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 4:27:57 AM   
Kirata


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From: USA
Status: offline 		Everything I've seen has been remarkably positive. I didn't save the links, but I remember being impressed by the crafting of some of the excerpts I read. Of course, turning rhetoric into reality is another matter. I didn't sense a lot of hope. A little, but not much. Still, it's nice to hear some things said.

K.




< Message edited by Kirata -- 6/8/2009 4:32:20 AM >

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 5:01:33 AM   
Louve00


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Status: offline 		I agree.  It was received positively.  I've heard some negative responses (and most of my source is from the tv, so I don't normally have links, unless I look for one to back up what I heard).  Some think he was too apologetic.  I didn't see it as being apologetic at all.  I think recognition was called for, and probably long overdue.  I had to wonder to myself, as I was listening to it, what Osama bin Laden was thinking.  Obama definitely didn't carry that "Good Ole Boy" attitude with him that sooooo easily falls into the hands of the taliban to support their claims to our negativity.  And while bin laden was piping up before the speech, I haven't heard any ambiguous claims or touts from his corner since.I agree its just a speech.  But I did think it was a step in the right direction

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 5:12:32 AM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Louve00

I had to wonder to myself, as I was listening to it, what Osama bin Laden was thinking.

He was thinking, "Shit, I shouldn't have bet that hand."

K.




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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 6:05:19 AM   
GreedyTop


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From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline 		lol K

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 6:25:17 AM   
TheHeretic


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From: California, USA
Status: offline 		        I haven't watched the video of the speech, but I read the authenticated text that showed up in my email.  He covered a lot of ground, and I thought it was well laid out.  When it comes to the mess in the middle east, I'm willing to give pretty much anything a shot, other than converting to Islam.

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 6:27:27 AM   
Sanity


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Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		I posted a link to the speech right here:

http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2643103




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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 6:45:16 AM   
Louve00


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Louve00

I had to wonder to myself, as I was listening to it, what Osama bin Laden was thinking.

He was thinking, "Shit, I shouldn't have bet that hand."

K.






LOL...agreed again.

(and sorry, Sanity...somehow ((and I wonder how)) I missed your link). 

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 8:46:43 AM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		I like that Obama did not apologize or deny our actions but explained them. He also laid out a path through the future where Muslims and America could live and prosper together with mutual respect.

BUT

As usual the reaction of so-called moderate Muslims was disappointing. Universally they say they will wait for American actions to match words. They don’t seem to understand that they too must act...They must realize they have an equal responsibility for the situation America and Islam find themselves in today.

America wants to see an effort by Muslims to understand America in the same way Muslims want America to understand them...So far it is poor us and evil America…this will not fly in Kansas, or New York…and it shouldn’t.

Butch


< Message edited by kdsub -- 6/8/2009 9:01:52 AM >

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 4:06:01 PM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

As usual the reaction of so-called moderate Muslims was disappointing. Universally they say they will wait for American actions to match words. They don’t seem to understand that they too must act..



Its incredibile that many of you on here have stated you will wait to see if Obama is as good as his word, yet you deny others the same choice.

You should listen to some of Musavi`s comments. He is the guy standing for election in Iran this week.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article6157546.ece

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 4:43:14 PM   
MrRodgers


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Louve00

I had to wonder to myself, as I was listening to it, what Osama bin Laden was thinking.

He was thinking, "Shit, I shouldn't have bet that hand."

K.

Irrelevant as he will never be captured and will never be tried in our courts for anything. He has not even been charged with a crime so I simply don't understand all of the hoopla surrounding this man.

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 5:46:40 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Irrelevant as he will never be captured and will never be tried in our courts for anything.

Look, don't tease us like this okay? If you're going to make posts like that, at least include some winning lottery numbers.

K.



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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 6:46:52 PM   
Louve00


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Status: offline 		Bin Laden may never be captured and tried.  Bin Laden may not even be alive anymore for all we know.  Didn't they find peritoneal dialysis bags left in an Afghanistan mountain as our military chased them (before the Iraq war, that is).  He's a sick guy physically, as well as mentally.  Often, when I say bin laden...I am speaking in a general term meaning Taliban or Al Queda.  If he (Bin Laden) is still out there fine...then he'll do.  If he's not, I refer to the extremists who live in his footsteps.  My point in wondering or even mentioning what he was thinking was because it has been the American "It's our way or the highway" philosophy that gives/gave (in my opinion) the extremists the leverage to prove to Muslim nations that we are dangerous people who wish to hurt them.  Take that irrational, undiplomatic philosophy away and it makes it harder for the extremists to prove their point. 

I also agree with Politesub that we are going to have to show consistency.  Saying it one time doesn't mean anything in comparison to being consistent.  I think thats what I do like so much about Obama's speech.  He didn't make any new promises, hasn't instituted any new changes...just put in some rationale as he re-iterated our position...the position we've had all along, just minus the 'or else' that used to shadow over things.  Most people know US is a force to be reckoned with.  Poking our chests out to show we intend to enforce that attitude takes away all the power we can achieve diplomatically. 

On a side note, I've often wondered if Obama ever studied NLP?

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/8/2009 7:17:03 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		Hi Politesub53

I deny no one the choice... only now is the time to act...for both sides...We can't move forward if only one side changes their course while the other sets back to judge. I can tell you Politesub America will not stand for that type of response…we are still in the position of power.

There has been fault on both sides and the only way this will be worked out is if both realize their part in this stalemate. The US has reached out ...now it is time for Islam to reach back…Not set with arms folded looking at the reaching hand with suspicion and distain.

Obama has set the stage where if he reneges world opinion will destroy him on the world stage. If Islam rejects these overtures of peace Europe will again join with America in a concerted economic fight against their extremism. This would be disastrous for Islam in the Middle East.

Butch


_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/9/2009 7:26:29 PM   
MarsBonfire


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Status: offline 		Oh, hey, and just to bring this thread up to today's headlines... Now, just a few days after Obama's speech... Hezbolla loses the election, and a more moderate faction takes control... Next up... the elections in Iran... do you suppose current extremeist Ahmadinnerjacket might be sweating, since, (after the speech) the polls show him behind to the more moderate candidate?

Gosh, you DON'T SUPPOSE that maybe some leadership and diplomacy is actually working, instead of this "You're either with us, or against us." Or "we're on a crusade" BUSH SHIT?


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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/9/2009 7:51:29 PM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		Do you actually believe that a few months of an administration have impacted the elections in a foreign country? Your logic and thoughts are amazing. Based upon this, I expect the new home construction and loan industry to bounce back within 6 weeks, and the economy to turn around and be at it's peak by the end of the week.


quote:

ORIGINAL: MarsBonfire

Oh, hey, and just to bring this thread up to today's headlines... Now, just a few days after Obama's speech... Hezbolla loses the election, and a more moderate faction takes control... Next up... the elections in Iran... do you suppose current extremeist Ahmadinnerjacket might be sweating, since, (after the speech) the polls show him behind to the more moderate candidate?

Gosh, you DON'T SUPPOSE that maybe some leadership and diplomacy is actually working, instead of this "You're either with us, or against us." Or "we're on a crusade" BUSH SHIT?




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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/10/2009 4:58:26 AM   
LadyEllen


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From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MarsBonfire

Oh, hey, and just to bring this thread up to today's headlines... Now, just a few days after Obama's speech... Hezbolla loses the election, and a more moderate faction takes control... Next up... the elections in Iran... do you suppose current extremeist Ahmadinnerjacket might be sweating, since, (after the speech) the polls show him behind to the more moderate candidate?

Gosh, you DON'T SUPPOSE that maybe some leadership and diplomacy is actually working, instead of this "You're either with us, or against us." Or "we're on a crusade" BUSH SHIT?




it would be nice to think that the Lebanese result is a consequence of the speech, but to be honest I doubt it really did anything more than to strengthen pre-existing voting tendency for those switching to more moderate parties anyway. The Lebanese have been through a sea of shit over the last few decades; theyve heard it all before I'm afraid when it comes to peace efforts and are not going to be too vulnerable to a few words of conciliation - but they are a damned good start and much preferable to the stupidity that obtained in former times in that they are helpful not harmful to the goal we'd all like - peace, freedom and opportunity for all in that region.

As for Iran its definitely too early to count chickens yet, but he is worried alright. In fact more than worried according to his behaviour in a television debate between him and the more moderate candidate who apparently tore him to pieces on air and was then accused of corruption on air, in a classic tactic used by megalomaniacs everywhere. If the opposition makes it to the election, rather than taking a long break from politics at the bottom of the Gulf, the result will be interesting. As to whether such an interesting result would be a consequence of the speech is another matter - we greatly underestimate the Iranians if we think them so simple minded and forgetful of previous dealings, where they have several thousand years experience to call on, that they should be swayed so readily.

E

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/10/2009 5:14:06 AM   
MarsBonfire


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Status: offline 		I'm not saying that Obama's speech was 100% the reason... but hearing that the US is interested in talking instead of bombing (at least until another GOP hawk slimes his way into office) might have helped the people there decide that it's time to put extremisim aside.

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/10/2009 4:04:40 PM   
Politesub53


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Status: offline 		I think the reason for the Lebanese result is that the vote split on religous and tribal lines. The Sunni didnt vote for Hammas, as the Shia did. The bigger test for Obamas speech will be the Iranian election result on Friday.

Incidently, the Iranian President doesnt hold the power, despite his claim of wanting to obliterate Israel. The real power is still held by the religious leaders. As far as I know none of them have made a statement about wiping Israel from the map.

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RE: Obama's speech to the Muslims - 6/10/2009 6:59:04 PM   
MarsBonfire


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Status: offline 		Ahmadinnerjecket is really just Iran's counterpart to Rush Limbaugh. He stirs up the rural population that voted him into office. Populist ranting on a mideast, national scale.Yes, I know he doesn't have much power. Also, much the reason most polls show him lagging are due to the rising, younger generation of Iranians who are getting, really, really tired of their country getting a black eye from the kind of stereotypical BS he's been spewing for years.

Still, the speech didn' hurt...

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