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RE: Lighten up. - 2/15/2006 4:47:50 PM   
Sirandlittle1


Posts: 538
Joined: 12/22/2005
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Im going to put myself in the position of your wife and answer.

Its wrong on the basis that you didnt have the courage to try to communicate your needs. Your wife never had a choice, she should be given one.

Spinelessness and dishonesty has no part in a submissives role. You will need far more strength and communication skill to have any success as a sub to a Domme, unless of course you pay her for her serving your needs.

Monogamy is what the majority of marrieds expect.

Having said that, i found myself in the exact situation you describe. For me, the need to submit ruined any chance of our marriage continueing. Tough choices had to be made.
But ive no regrets. Mainly coz i struck gold. I feel for your dilema. Its hard, really bloody hard.

goodluck


(in reply to Zensee)
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RE: Lighten up. - 2/15/2006 4:55:02 PM   
angelic


Posts: 1807
Joined: 1/24/2005
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wrong, wrong wrong. you want to go into another relationship while lying to the first one? umm... wrong...

(in reply to Sirandlittle1)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Lighten up. - 2/16/2006 4:32:02 AM   
Jasminex


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Speak to your wife is the best advice i can offer. The fact that you are having these feelings and are not communicating them to her suggests to me already that there are things within your marriage which need to be discussed. I had the exact same problem, although it was horribly difficult to explain to my husband that I had submissive needs and we are still sorting things out some 6mths later i'm still glad i talked to him and so is he. If you have a good marriage and most importantly a good friendship with your wife something could be worked out, you never know.

(in reply to angelic)
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RE: Lighten up. - 2/16/2006 2:56:21 PM   
Greatcornbow


Posts: 46
Joined: 9/2/2005
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I agree.

Entirely.

(in reply to Jasminex)
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RE: married sub - 2/18/2006 8:26:21 AM   
Wingedcheval


Posts: 1
Joined: 2/16/2006
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I am also married. I dont think there is anything wrong with what you wish for.
If you feel you may loose your wife by telling her what you want then dont tell her.If you think she will understand as you havnt done anything yet then go ahead and tell her.I am one of the lucky ones my hubby know i am in this.

(in reply to pearlandsub)
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RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 5:28:08 AM   
ElektraUkM


Posts: 309
Joined: 2/19/2005
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Well, only you can really answer that question.

I think there's a difference between entering into a relationship with someone else while married, and going to a proDomme for services you really need. I don't know if the latter is any more wrong than going to a prostitute, strip club, or even watching porn. How many husbands do those things?

Having an affair is a whole different thing, and entering into an affair cold-bloodedly to provide yourself with something lacking in a marriage is something I don't like the sound of.

(in reply to Wingedcheval)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 6:30:47 AM   
cloudboy


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Joined: 12/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: pearlandsub

Question: I'm married and want to serve a fem/dom without my wife's knowledge. Wrong or not?


Let me pretty much say you've received the whole plethora of "asshole" responses here. Sorry gallery, but I've been down this road, and your responses, IMO are not the best.

1. Honesty is not always the best policy. People that think like this don't appreciate your situation.

2. Those in an open poly relationship don't always remember/understand what its like to be stuck in monogamy when its not working for you but seemingly working for your spouse.

3. Those saying "why can't you just submit to your wife," as a rule just don't get it.

4. Lastly, don't you just love all those folks who drop the cheating card on you?

5. What's also funny are the monogamy proponents here who haven't really been monogamous in their lives or who have fallen victim to it. That would be the # of folks who haven't even been married and monogamous for say, 10 years. This group can be rather vocal and judgmental. Please remember, YOU, don't live in THEIR ideal world.

-------

Here are some cold hard facts. You are the one who has to live your own life and you are the one who is best positioned to balance being selfish (doing what you need for yourself) and meeting other's needs and expectations. In your position, then, you simply cannot listen to the gallery to tell you what is "right" and what is "wrong." They don't have your life, they don't know your feelings, they won't be there when you expire and your life ends.

What you are experiencing is perfectly natural --- finding out that lifelong monogamy to one person in a marital relationship is far from what you "really want." Of course you cannot really admit this because you will be castigated. People will see you as the problem, not the unrealistic expectations / demands of lifetime "no one else, ever."

Things to think about:

1. John Warren has a good point. If you do venture out and find someone, what will you do if your wife finds out? Its good to have this question settled.

2. He raised another good point as well. If you find someone and a relationship develops --- how will you balance the two relationships. This is quite an emotional hardship.

3. Here's my story. My wife is 100% vanilla. On top of that she found out about my kink before we got married. She rejected it. As much as I thought I could closet the kink or manage it in private, I really could not not deny it. The end result between us was that two very compatible loving people were not meeting each other's needs on an intimate level. Rather than break up, we went through a period of frustration "why aren't you more for me...." Then we went into a period of acceptance and now we have opened things up. We have an agreement that we are allowed to see other people, discreetly. This presents its own challenges, but its nice now to be able to raise one's middle finger at all those who would accuse me of cheating. Next, life is just alot better and more exciting since we changed out of strict monogamy. Life once again feels like it holds unseen, untapped, and exciting possibilities ---- I myself no longer feel "finite" and "permanently decided."

Plus, I still have the stability and love of marriage behind me --- to someone I am not seeking to replace.

4. What you need to do is gain some extra marital experience to see how it feels. Next, you need to see what kind of dialogue you can engineer with your wife. In sum, you need to try and get yourself unstuck and more liberated while staying married.

5. If you do open things up, how will you handle your wife being "out in the field?"

6. Get the female perspective on affairs. This weekend at the bookstore I read two chapters on this subject in:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0066211662/qid=1140444771/sr=1-4/ref=sr_1_4/002-7942022-1968052?s=books&v=glance&n=283155

I found it particularly interesting that one woman held up Katherine Hepburn as one of her idols/role models. It was also interesting to see these women describe the difference between being with their husband and their affairee, and about how one dealt with her husband having a Mistress.

On reading these two chapters, I thought to myself, the key to life is being able to think outside the box in ways that allow you to be your truer self. It also helps to know that you are not alone, that you are facing a rather classic problem. This helps you feel less insane and isolated, and it helps you laugh off other's who would suggest you are a criminal or might end up old, deserted, and living in and old van all by yourself, unloved.

What I appreciate more than anything is how complicated your situation is and how much courage and vulnerability you must exhibit to take chances and risks while you are marrred.

Good luck.



< Message edited by cloudboy -- 2/20/2006 7:26:43 AM >

(in reply to pearlandsub)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 6:42:30 AM   
IrishMist


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Cloudboy, I resent the implication that we all jumped on the 'let's bash him' bandwagon. All the responses here were justified using ONE piece of information that the OP gave us.

quote:

I'm married and want to serve a fem/dom without my wife's knowledge. Wrong or not?


WITHOUT HER KNOWLEDGE


No where did the OP mention that he was going to say ANYTHING to his wife about this. He was asking point blank if it was right or wrong to go behind her back, without her knowledge, to satisfy his needs.

Now if he had elaborated and said that yes, I have talked to my wife about this, and she still refuses me this freedom...I am sure that the responses would have been different.

You can not use your own relationship as a arguing point for this. Your wife knows, and you BOTH agreed to the terms of your marriage that are now in place. There is a big difference there.

_____________________________

If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.


(in reply to cloudboy)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 7:20:35 AM   
cloudboy


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quote:

I've only skimmed to this point. There is a dreary sameness to the lynch-mob mentality this question elicits


Basically its just a series of knee-jerk reactions. Amayos was pretty smart and concise on the matter when he said, "be sure its worth it."

(in reply to WikedUncle)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 7:31:57 AM   
mons


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hi

i am not here to judge what you want and your needs, but even in our lifestyle there is a things still called cheating. even with my slave and i do not know what the others may say but i am not going to goto anothet slave and let him sit and wonder what in the world is going on. have youtry to let your wife know what you need? ithink that it would be not right to do this to your wife she will know something is different about you. they all do this is why i would not ever see amarried man. i for one would hate someone to have anaffiar with my man this drives some woman crazy i hope yourethink what your about to do andifyou have childern isitworth ifshe found out the lose of so manything just for a thrill yes that is what it will be a thrilll. do this try and introduce you wife slowly very slowly and see what happens

with well wishes

mons

(in reply to pearlandsub)
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RE: Lighten up. - 2/20/2006 5:19:47 PM   
PenelopePitstop


Posts: 254
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From: UK
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To the OP. Wrong, foolish, unfair, but if it helps any, I feel for you.

_____________________________

Wickedness is a myth created by good people to account for the curious attractiveness of others ~ Oscar Wilde

"You had me at Goodbye"

(in reply to Zensee)
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RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 6:00:47 PM   
MsSonnetMarwood


Posts: 1898
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: Eastern Shore, Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

What's also funny are the monogamy proponents here who haven't really been monogamous in their lives or who have fallen victim to it. That would be the # of folks who haven't even been married and monogamous for say, 10 years. This group can be rather vocal and judgmental. Please remember, YOU, don't live in THEIR ideal world.


It isn't a monogamy issue.

It's a being honest with your partner issue. Like it or not, if you're a couple, you BOTH should have a choice whether the relationship is monogamous or poly, and what are acceptable parameters.

< Message edited by MsSonnetMarwood -- 2/20/2006 6:03:15 PM >


_____________________________

~Ms. Sonnet Marwood~

Deja Moo: The feeling you've heard this bull somewhere before.

(in reply to cloudboy)
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RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 8:25:13 PM   
cloudboy


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Joined: 12/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsSonnetMarwood

quote:

What's also funny are the monogamy proponents here who haven't really been monogamous in their lives or who have fallen victim to it. That would be the # of folks who haven't even been married and monogamous for say, 10 years. This group can be rather vocal and judgmental. Please remember, YOU, don't live in THEIR ideal world.


It isn't a monogamy issue.

It's a being honest with your partner issue. Like it or not, if you're a couple, you BOTH should have a choice whether the relationship is monogamous or poly, and what are acceptable parameters.


You missed my point, which was that its precisely the folks who have no substantial background in monogamy who tend to be the most judgemental about what a married person does or choses to do.

(in reply to MsSonnetMarwood)
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RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 8:53:00 PM   
kc692


Posts: 3701
Joined: 3/24/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MsSonnetMarwood

quote:

Question: I'm married and want to serve a fem/dom without my wife's knowledge. Wrong or not?


Of course it's fine.

But do make sure you approach a domme correctly. The only acceptable way a married boy is to approach a domme is to address her as "Hey Babycakes!" followed by a laundry list of sexual acts you want her to perform on you. Don't even think about offering to do anything for her - it's all about YOU.

<koff>



I'm going to have to learn not to drink or eat ANYTHING while reading the boards., it's dangerous to my keyboard and monitors' health....Thank you for the belly laugh o the evening

(in reply to MsSonnetMarwood)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: married sub - 2/20/2006 10:17:23 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


You missed my point, which was that its precisely the folks who have no substantial background in monogamy who tend to be the most judgemental about what a married person does or choses to do.


i see your point. What many do not see is that "cheating" or dishonesty, when a marriage comes to that, is typically a symptom of a far bigger problem. No one really knows what goes on in another's household or how things may have deteriorated. i have seen cases where i could not possibly have judged. Except i did, loudly, and found myself embarrassingly wrong.

...something about he who has not sinned casting the first stone...

~ 2 cents in the bucket ~

(in reply to cloudboy)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: married sub - 2/21/2006 12:00:39 AM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
::skips in, notices the OP hasn't responded to a single post, skips out::



_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to ownedgirlie)
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RE: married sub - 2/21/2006 12:13:04 AM   
FelinePersuasion


Posts: 4792
Joined: 11/20/2004
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Having "curage" to come out online about bdsm and being honest at home aint no where near the same. There's nothing at all curagous about speaking online, it's anonomous, it's secret behind a screen behind a fake nick name. It's not face to face and should you be shunned you just simply start a new name and whalah fresh identity.


Not so easy coming out face to face person to person live name to live name. Where it's not so simple to take it all back once it's been said.
quote:

ORIGINAL: WikedUncle



I think you can do it. After all, you had the courage to ask online BDSM's most unpopular and unfashionable question. Show the same courage at home. Yes, your marriage may end, but it may also go places you didn't imagine.


(in reply to WikedUncle)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: married sub - 2/21/2006 4:01:43 AM   
MsSonnetMarwood


Posts: 1898
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: Eastern Shore, Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

It isn't a monogamy issue.

It's a being honest with your partner issue. Like it or not, if you're a couple, you BOTH should have a choice whether the relationship is monogamous or poly, and what are acceptable parameters.


You missed my point, which was that its precisely the folks who have no substantial background in monogamy who tend to be the most judgemental about what a married person does or choses to do.


Ah I knew that was coming; you do like to say a person has missed your point when they disagree with you.

While someone who has been monogamous for years might be more sympathetic,
I actually consider those who have managed serial monogamy and know when to cut losses and move on, or who have successfully managed poly relationships in a fair, ethical manner in a much better position to offer advice.

The perspective that YOU don't have is that of one who has been approached by literally thousands of married men over the years, wanting you to be their dominant. With very few exceptions, these are NOT boys who are tortured souls due to having to suppress their true nature because of a vanilla marriage that they can neither leave nor work with. They're greedy little boys who don't want to deal with the choices and promises they made in life and think they somehow deserve to have every fantasy that crosses their mind fulfilled. Never mind that they'd most likely find it in themselves to get that divorce and move on should their wife decide to have an affair because THEY weren't meeting her needs. Again, that's not all married men who seek outside their marriage, but that is an accurate picture of MOST of them.

< Message edited by MsSonnetMarwood -- 2/21/2006 4:14:36 AM >


_____________________________

~Ms. Sonnet Marwood~

Deja Moo: The feeling you've heard this bull somewhere before.

(in reply to cloudboy)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: married sub - 2/21/2006 4:15:45 AM   
MysticalPhoenix


Posts: 212
Joined: 11/30/2005
From: Kelloggsville, Vanilla County MI
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
the folks who have no substantial background in monogamy who tend to be the most judgemental about what a married person does or choses to do. [/color][/size]



This may be because poly folk take a dim view of people who cheat on an unknowing partner. Before I knew there was any such thing as poly, I spent 10 years as a totally faithful monogamous married woman-because I keep my word, and that meant my marriage vows, and I take a particularly dim view of the OP's potential action. Like many other monogamous married women, I've been cheated on by my husband.

I was very relieved when I discovered that my own wish for more than one relationship partner was not weird, just polyamorous. However, I would never have anything to do with someone who was stepping out behind someone else's back. I think it is cowardly, at best.

Phoenix


_____________________________

---------------------------------------------------------
Every one sees what you appear to be, few really know what you are.

(in reply to cloudboy)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: married sub - 2/21/2006 5:59:40 AM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsSonnetMarwood

quote:

It isn't a monogamy issue.

It's a being honest with your partner issue. Like it or not, if you're a couple, you BOTH should have a choice whether the relationship is monogamous or poly, and what are acceptable parameters.


You missed my point, which was that its precisely the folks who have no substantial background in monogamy who tend to be the most judgemental about what a married person does or choses to do.


Ah I knew that was coming; you do like to say a person has missed your point when they disagree with you.

While someone who has been monogamous for years might be more sympathetic,
I actually consider those who have managed serial monogamy and know when to cut losses and move on, or who have successfully managed poly relationships in a fair, ethical manner in a much better position to offer advice.

The perspective that YOU don't have is that of one who has been approached by literally thousands of married men over the years, wanting you to be their dominant. With very few exceptions, these are NOT boys who are tortured souls due to having to suppress their true nature because of a vanilla marriage that they can neither leave nor work with. They're greedy little boys who don't want to deal with the choices and promises they made in life and think they somehow deserve to have every fantasy that crosses their mind fulfilled. Never mind that they'd most likely find it in themselves to get that divorce and move on should their wife decide to have an affair because THEY weren't meeting her needs. Again, that's not all married men who seek outside their marriage, but that is an accurate picture of MOST of them.


Well, I get some perspective of being approached by married men through my Mistress and now my wife. What they have told me is that you have to be discriminating, and what they have also told me is that these men are not just 'awful fucks' as one might assume. The thing about being with another married person is the relationship is tethered and you do not hold the #1 spot in the other's life. So the trick to making it work is not wanting to be #1 or not needing to be #1. In truth, there are many advantages to being #2.

What also is true is that most wives don't know. I have a problem with this, but I understand it. I don't just outright become judgemental about it.

As for monogamy, serial monogamy is just that, "serial." There is no way you can compare serial monogamy to being married and monogamous to one person for 10-15-or 20 years. There is no comparable committment in serial monogamy --- its more just a preference to be with one person for a period of time. Being married to another person for ten years or more is a real achievment. It doesn't just happen by itself. It can also get rather claustrophobic as you change over time.

Peace out and good luck.

Bitatruble made a good point, where has the OP gone? We're all just talking to ourselves, [pause] now I just feel used [tears welling up....] I am such a fool......

(in reply to MsSonnetMarwood)
Profile   Post #: 60
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