RE: What went wrong?

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Lockit -> RE: What went wrong? (7/11/2009 8:04:32 PM)
I really hate when things come down to teams or sides and the dom's and the sub's thing or even men and women. We are all human beings and subject to the same emotional things. Poor behavior can take place in any human being and to clump everyone all together as if we are all the same is a really sad state of affairs here. Although I may give my opinion on what some may do doesn't mean I think all do. I have defended more than one male submissive and have thanked the one's I felt were really sincere for being out there and doing what they do. People are people and some will be safe and sane, some insane, some blend of a number of things... some happy, some sad or mad, but we all aren't from the same mould doing the same things. I think a good many of us try to understand one another especially on an individual basis, but something said can come out as if we don't want to understand and don't. Some of us get excited or sarcastic or many things and that too is human nature, but I doubt anyone I have seen here really wishes others ill. We may feel strongly on certain things and can disagree, even to the point of some upset sometimes, but I would hope that we would all know that we aren't hating one another as a person. Too many of these threads turn into a team us and you and it defeats us all I think. I'm including myself here...

Venatrix -> RE: What went wrong? (7/11/2009 8:15:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer If you re-read my posts, I think you'll see that I did say that whilst it might be understandable that someone is confused, there was still no incentive for most women to put up with it, particularly when accompanied by bad behaviour. Actually, there is an incentive for women to put up with it because they'd know that the next submale they meet might be even worse. Given this, it's worth understanding what is going wrong and why, in hopes that a nearly-good man might be made wholly good. Oh, I'm sorry. I misunderstood. I didn't realise that dominant women were supposed to settle for whomever came along and see if they could make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Thank you for setting me straight. I've wasted all this time waiting for a person of quality to come along. Silly me. quote: I find it presumptuous and patronising to suggest that our remarks would cause LD to question her judgement of men. I think you probably realise that I didn't mean it in that way. People just do start thinking 'what's wrong with me that this person should treat me this way?' They shouldn't, of course, but they do. I certainly have done in such situations - that is, when women have been rude, childish or otherwise nasty to me. It always helps to understand why they're being this way in order to stop that 'what's wrong with me' question arising unnecessarily. Yes, I expect the skill to mind-read why women are behaving in a certain way must be quite useful. If only Freud had had it, he wouldn't have had to pose the question, "What do women want?"

Venatrix -> RE: What went wrong? (7/11/2009 8:24:43 PM)
Your points are valid, Lockit, but sometimes there is a subtext going on between the participants that colours their interactions on the boards, which may seem unfathomable to those of us who are not involved. When I come across posts where it seems that more is going on than is related to the thread, I find that that's a discussion I tend to avoid getting in the middle of. It seems a wise thing to do.

LadyPact -> RE: What went wrong? (7/11/2009 9:21:28 PM)
Is that something like, if we can't tell the players without a program, quit interrupting the show? [sm=popcorn.gif]

Venatrix -> RE: What went wrong? (7/11/2009 9:26:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact Is that something like, if we can't tell the players without a program, quit interrupting the show? [sm=popcorn.gif] Hey, the tickets are free, and the original material is excellent. You couldn't do better with a Broadway show.

Danemora -> RE: What went wrong? (7/11/2009 11:05:57 PM)
There ultimately is no excuse or justification for not extending basic decency to another human being. Whether you are a man, a woman, a dominant, or a submissive. OP...glad to see you are not letting this particular individual become more than a speed bump in your life's journey.

PeonForHer -> RE: What went wrong? (7/12/2009 3:13:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Venatrix quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer If you re-read my posts, I think you'll see that I did say that whilst it might be understandable that someone is confused, there was still no incentive for most women to put up with it, particularly when accompanied by bad behaviour. Actually, there is an incentive for women to put up with it because they'd know that the next submale they meet might be even worse. Given this, it's worth understanding what is going wrong and why, in hopes that a nearly-good man might be made wholly good. Oh, I'm sorry. I misunderstood. I didn't realise that dominant women were supposed to settle for whomever came along and see if they could make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. Thank you for setting me straight. I've wasted all this time waiting for a person of quality to come along. Silly me. I think you're still misunderstanding. Earlier, the OP updated us on her partner. I suggested that she say 'Bollocks to him'. I think you can grasp what that implies. This is not a man who I'd classify as 'nearly a good man'. My point is, you both try to understand and condemn and ditch someone, where necessary. Understanding and justifying aren't the same thing. More generally: if you don't learn from history, you're doomed to repeat it. From what I can see, this certainly happens to a lot of people with their relationships. I think you yourself would agree that it would be good not to repeat previous mistakes with partners, if at all possible. quote: ORIGINAL: Venatrix quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer I find it presumptuous and patronising to suggest that our remarks would cause LD to question her judgement of men. I think you probably realise that I didn't mean it in that way. People just do start thinking 'what's wrong with me that this person should treat me this way?' They shouldn't, of course, but they do. I certainly have done in such situations - that is, when women have been rude, childish or otherwise nasty to me. It always helps to understand why they're being this way in order to stop that 'what's wrong with me' question arising unnecessarily. Yes, I expect the skill to mind-read why women are behaving in a certain way must be quite useful. If only Freud had had it, he wouldn't have had to pose the question, "What do women want?" [:D] I started writing an answer to this snappy wee comment, then realised I was typing exactly what I'd already written in the paragraph of mine that you'd cited above. I didn't do any mind-reading. I just got the idea that the OP felt hurt and tried to help given what I thought she was feeling, as indeed we all did in one way or another.

Politesub53 -> RE: What went wrong? (7/12/2009 4:03:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lockit I really hate when things come down to teams or sides and the dom's and the sub's thing or even men and women. We are all human beings and subject to the same emotional things. Poor behavior can take place in any human being and to clump everyone all together as if we are all the same is a really sad state of affairs here. Although I may give my opinion on what some may do doesn't mean I think all do. I have defended more than one male submissive and have thanked the one's I felt were really sincere for being out there and doing what they do. People are people and some will be safe and sane, some insane, some blend of a number of things... some happy, some sad or mad, but we all aren't from the same mould doing the same things. I think a good many of us try to understand one another especially on an individual basis, but something said can come out as if we don't want to understand and don't. Some of us get excited or sarcastic or many things and that too is human nature, but I doubt anyone I have seen here really wishes others ill. We may feel strongly on certain things and can disagree, even to the point of some upset sometimes, but I would hope that we would all know that we aren't hating one another as a person. Too many of these threads turn into a team us and you and it defeats us all I think. I'm including myself here... Nice post Lockit xx

Venatrix -> RE: What went wrong? (7/12/2009 8:31:28 AM)
Peon, I can't speak for every femdom, but I'm going to say this one last time. I do understand; I know submission is difficult for a lot of, or perhaps all, submissive men. But I don't want to deal with someone who has issues with his submission. He needs to have worked them out before I can begin a relationship with him. I'm not going to spend any time wondering what when wrong; I'm done with that. I'm simply going to walk away and that will be the end of it. Maybe it's because I have so many other interests and I enjoy being alone so much that I never feel the desperation to take on a DIY project in the hopes that he might become "wholly good," as you put it earlier. I just don't need the drama. In all honesty, I don't know any dominant women who would be interested in a man who comes to them not having resolved his internal conflicts. And now I'm done with this thread. It's made me more discouraged than ever, and served only to reinforce whether the chances of finding a fulfilling relationship with a submissive male are so slim that it's even worth bothering with looking.

PeonForHer -> RE: What went wrong? (7/12/2009 9:05:41 AM)
As I often say, PS, Lockit is a rocket. [;)]

undergroundsea -> RE: What went wrong? (7/12/2009 11:26:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SueACydell It's not just submissive men, belieeeeeeve me! I am surprised other people have not seen this attitude in different places. It is not specific to submissive men. It is not specific to submissives. It is not specific to online interactions. This behavior is exhibited by men, women, dominants, submissives, by those in social situations, by those in professional situations, by customers, by businesses, by service providers, in online situations, in real life situations, more. Just because I do not come and post about my experience on the forums does not mean I do not encounter this situation when I deal with dommes. In the past, I used to wonder what happened and whether I did anything wrong. Because it did not happen every time, and because sometimes it was I who did not feel compatibility, I came to accept that what happened is not necessarily because I did something wrong but because chemistry or compatibility simply did not happen. Whatever the reason, the situation is that the other person is not feeling interested to proceed further. Whether chemistry happens is not a conscious choice. It just happens. I have had times where I wish I had felt chemistry because situational compatibility was there but I did not feel it. When someone does not feel chemistry towards me, I do not hold it against them because I understand that when I don't feel chemistry towards someone, it is not a conscious choice. I empathize the frustration the OP feels for not getting a straight answer because it is certainly not a good feeling. I do not get too upset about it and move on because it happens everywhere. Unfortunately, our culture favors avoiding the awkward conversation versus more candid or, better yet, compassionate communication. Cheers, Sea

SthrnCom4t -> RE: What went wrong? (7/13/2009 8:03:29 AM)
I haven't read some of the other responses, but I do agree with AAkasha, LadyP, and sea. Here is the part where it becomes evident that D/s and the relationship take two, equally willing partners. For sure, he is still processing. Until he contacts you, there is basically nothing you can do except send one note saying you had a good time, and hope he is doing well. No doubt, you could help him process through, but if he can't communicate that becomes a moot point. I've had similar scenarios happen to me. I hated not getting closure, so ultimately I started creating my own. I wrote the initial short, upbeat, no pressure note. (just in case he was too overwhelmed to contact me first.) No response. So in about 2-3 weeks, I wrote a follow-up closure letter, essentially stating that I was disappointed in not being able to follow up with him. That because of the silence, I had no idea what was going on in his head, but that I was assuming from lack of contact that he did not have enough interest to continue exploration. Also that I had come to the conclusion we were not compatible, secondary to his penchant for shutting down the pathways of communication and that was something I felt to be extremely important in any person I was considering as a submissive. I know you are feeling a myriad of emotions right now, but please go back and read what Dark Steven said.....you did not waste your time, you took a chance.

Andalusite -> RE: What went wrong? (7/13/2009 8:31:43 AM)
The first time I play with someone, unless I'm specifically keeping it casual, I usually only do very subtle stuff rather than a full-blown scene. I almost always do this within the first date or two, so I can get some idea of chemistry before I have emotional involvement, or give a lot. This applies no matter which side of the whip (or both) I'm on. A little hairpulling, a bite on the neck, holding wrists down - how do we react? How do I feel when I think about him the next day? Does he call or e-mail me right away and indicate he's enthralled, or back off, or say/do something rude in other ways?

daintydimples -> RE: What went wrong? (7/13/2009 9:20:43 AM)
It has been my experience (and yes even vanilla experience, although admittedly that was a loooong time ago) that men, in general, just really suck at breaking up with women. They tend to fall off the face of the earth, or behave so badly you dump them (this way it gets to be your fault). From a female perspective it seems obvious you just bite the bullet and say: "I like you, I think you are a wonderful person, but it is just not going to work out with us." For some reason most men seem to have a hard time doing that. Yes I realize this is a major generalization. JMO

unforegvn -> RE: What went wrong? (7/13/2009 7:27:30 PM)
Personally, I like to meet as soon as possible and test the waters so to speak otherwise, you get some 'emotional' barriers that may cloud your ability to judge how the meeting went. I agree with most of the responses, I believe he played you like a fine tuned fiddle. Our responses and observations are based on the information provided by you. ONLY you know what his behavior and responses were... Do not dwell on the negative aspects of meeting someone. There is always an opportunity to learn from out interactions with submissives.

SthrnCom4t -> RE: What went wrong? (7/13/2009 10:30:22 PM)
I had something similar happen, and wouldn't you know, 6 months later he was emailing me like crazy. After 2.5 years (I have not seen him since) he still trys to see me at least every few weeks. Some people's kids!!! quote: ORIGINAL: TheLadyIsADomme Final Update: Well, I did send him an email, and he sent a reply, which basically was that he did not enjoy any aspect of our "experience" together and that he is now re-evaluating whether he really wants to pursue a submissive relationship with anyone. And he didn't tell me that at the time because I was enjoying myself and he didn't want to ruin it for me. Time for a new thread, I think. (smile) Warmly, LD

LadyPact -> RE: What went wrong? (7/13/2009 11:03:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SthrnCom4t I had something similar happen, and wouldn't you know, 6 months later he was emailing me like crazy. After 2.5 years (I have not seen him since) he still trys to see me at least every few weeks. Some people's kids!!! Yep. I know the feeling on this one. LOL.

Lockit -> RE: What went wrong? (7/14/2009 7:45:43 AM)
What tops off the missing in action and then coming to try to revisit you is when they tell other dominant's they had a thing with you and not just a moment in time! lol High five to Sthrn on that some people's um's!

AngelicaGoddess -> RE: What went wrong? (7/14/2009 8:02:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheLadyIsADomme I get the "retreat into my cave" mentality. And I don't particularly condone or condemn it. I think what got me more upset here was twofold: One: the lack of respect/contact which was expected, and two: the actual reply which, in my opinion, is not truthful (and possibly intended to be hurtful). But, all that being said, I learned many things from the experience itself, and the aftermath (gee, that makes it sound so awful, doesn't it? LOL). I have been able over the course of this week to put the whole thing into perspective, and move past it. And certainly, I will behave/react/expect differently the next time. Does this make me not want to seek out another boy? Absolutely not. Does this make me question my "dom-hood", my womanliness or even my judgment? Not a bit. With this guy, in this situation, it did not work. That is not indicative of what will happen the next time around. Thanks all. Warmly, LD That's a great approach and the guy wasn't worth your time! It's wonderful to see you taking such a positive attitude, I wish more women would - in and out of the scene - unfortunately a lot of women get so bitter and turn "bad luck with men/submissives" into a self-fulfilling prophecy, then wonder why they're alone. I see it with vanilla a scene friends far too often! All the best for your search!

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