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RE: New York City buys one-way tickets home for the hom... - 7/31/2009 10:28:49 PM   
Arpig


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Status: offline 		I beleive that in order to qualify for the ticket out there has to be somebody at the other end who agrees to take the homeless folks in, and that they have to confirm their willingness to do so.

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RE: New York City buys one-way tickets home for the hom... - 7/31/2009 11:02:06 PM   
TheHeretic


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From: California, USA
Status: offline 		Well of course, Arpig.  Good intentions are all over the entrance to this path.  Straight up truth, though, is that if I agree to help so-and-so out if he is back home from the big city, and he shows up high and/or crazy, he isn't going to be in my house very long.  He's going to find the rules and policies of my home "uncomfortable" for his lifestyle and leave on his own.

When people wind up living on the streets, or far below the norms, because of choices they have made, nothing changes until they make better choices.  It cannot be forced on them.

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RE: New York City buys one-way tickets home for the hom... - 8/1/2009 6:49:40 AM   
stella41b


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Well of course, Arpig.  Good intentions are all over the entrance to this path.  Straight up truth, though, is that if I agree to help so-and-so out if he is back home from the big city, and he shows up high and/or crazy, he isn't going to be in my house very long.  He's going to find the rules and policies of my home "uncomfortable" for his lifestyle and leave on his own.



Exactly and that's why there's hostels and night shelters and why setting up as many of them as possible is a good thing and why foisting them on well-meaning friends and relatives doesn't work. Homelessness is a stressful, traumatic process and even though only a visible minority succumb to alcohol, drugs or mental illness it's still worth implementing a resettlement program to examine how someone became homeless in the first place and working at ways to prevent them becoming homeless in the future.

Here in London you cannot get off the streets without going through the resettlement programs in hostels and night shelters. Now if you want to sit around on welfare, drink alcohol and get high then okay but what gets you along the resettlement process is working to change your own circumstances, paying your service charges regularly on time, seeking out meaningful occupation, going back to college, retraining, seeking employment, not 'kicking off' and showing that you are a responsible human being, and you have to show this over a period of time before any resettlement worker is going to consider offering you any sort of accommodation.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

When people wind up living on the streets, or far below the norms, because of choices they have made, nothing changes until they make better choices.  It cannot be forced on them.


By and large yes, I agree with you here, but a considerable number of the homeless become homeless despite trying to make good choices and not having any options available to them, such as women escaping from violent or abusive husbands or even men going through divorce who are at the sharp end because they're men and expected to deal with their situations without any support or help.

But about the homeless generally needing to make better choices is a point I agree with you on and this is why a resettlement process is so necessary so that the homeless person can be seen to be consistently making better choices over a period of time before being allowed to rejoin society in their own accommodation.

However in order to be able to make those choices, they need to have options and unfortunately nowadays unless they are considered vulnerable in some way there are no options, just the streets.

ETA: My God! Have I just posted in agreement with TheHeretic?

< Message edited by stella41b -- 8/1/2009 6:51:54 AM >

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RE: New York City buys one-way tickets home for the hom... - 8/1/2009 6:55:42 AM   
DarkSteven


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Meant to get back to this thread sooner...

For the short-term homeless, I think this this is a good thing almost all the way 'round.  By "short-term" homeless, I mean the 'there but for the grace of God' folks, the people who just hit an awful patch, and wind up on their ass.  These are the ones who will benefit most from a ride back to "go."  Of course, they would get themselves back together somehow, anyway.  This is a helping hand.

Where I see the real potential for abuse is with the long-term homeless, the druggies and crazies.  For them, the rule is going to be "wherever you go, there you are."  Unless the programs are effectively targeting those who are ready to help themselves, and handing them tickets with a layover in rehab/mental health treatment, we are just dumping problems on someone else.


 

Interesting, Rich.  My mind jumped ahead to the longterm people. "Deporting" them would simply drop the problem on someone else.  But a government that could prevent the short-term people from becoming longterm... that would be a service to humanity itself AND conserve state resources.


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RE: New York City buys one-way tickets home for the hom... - 8/1/2009 7:18:17 AM   
lronitulstahp


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quote:

Conservatively, one out of every three homeless men who is sleeping in a doorway, alley or box in our cities and rural communities has put on a uniform and served this country.

quote:

47 percent of homeless veterans served during the Vietnam Era. More than 67 percent served our country for at least three years and 33 percent were stationed in a war zone.

quote:

The U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) says the nation's homeless veterans are mostly males (four percent are females). The vast majority are single, most come from poor, disadvantaged communities, 45 percent suffer from mental illness


quote:

In an effort to clarify and understand the problems of the homeless, the authors studied the demographic characteristics, psychiatric diagnoses, histories, and dispositions of 100 homeless patients treated at Bellevue Psychiatric Hospital's emergency service. The most striking finding was that 96.6 percent of the sample had had a previous psychiatric hospitalization. Seventy-two percent of these homeless patients were diagnosed as suffering from schizophrenia; the second most common diagnosis was personality disorder, which accounted for 13.3 percent of the sample


A large portion of homeless people are the mentally ill, or veterans....many being a combination of the two.  You can ship them off anywhere; until their issues are addressed, they will continue the cycle elsewhere. i never understood how a nation that claims to be so staunchly supportive of it's "troops" could leave it's vets by the wayside.

i also wonder how mentally ill people so often fall through the cracks until it's time to imprison them for crimes they commit while suffering through mental illness. If the governement would give them the medical and psychiatric care that many poor people can't afford, they'd save money from later having to support them through the penal system.

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RE: New York City buys one-way tickets home for the hom... - 8/1/2009 7:50:05 AM   
TheHeretic


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Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b
My God! Have I just posted in agreement with TheHeretic?


     And it seemed like such an ordinary day when you got up this morning! 

No worries, Stella.  Your post seems very wrapped up in a "program" that it is impossible to get off the streets without.  I see a very individual sort of process, where individuals have to do things for themselves.

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