Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans

Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (Full Version)

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4u2spoil -> Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 12:52:43 PM)
I'm sure everyone's heard about Roman Polanski's arrest, which I thought was completely fair even if late. What really pisses me off is that I actually agree with one of those oft heard Republican phrases that Hollywood values aren't the same as American values. But what can I say when a group of people actually have the collective balls to band together and say that fame/talent should excuse a crime. Seriously, I can't even begin to wrap my head around some of the complete and utter bullshit I've heard from people (some of whom I respect professionally), that equates to "oh, well it was a long time ago and he makes great movies - of course he shouldn't be arrested for a crime he plead guilty to!" It certainly doesn't help that the crime was rape. If this were a janitor living down the block, who skipped out on sentencing for a rape he committed 30 years ago, no one would give a shit if he were hauled in to court and made to serve his system - no mater how good of a janitor he may have become. Completely.Boggles.My.Mind. I'm finally starting to understand why no one wants to hear artists talk about anything beyond whatever film they're promoting.

mnottertail -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 12:57:53 PM)
Took a democratic administration to get out after him though, huh? So, words are cheap, republican words.

Moonhead -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 1:07:14 PM)
Precisely who in Hollywood is big on child abuse? Even Charlie Manson was down on that one. I'm not sure you're right that nobody would give a fuck if he wasn't a famous director, either: rape is rape. (Though he is obviously being extradited for fleeing sentencing more than anything else. Still, if he actually gets sent down and takes a turn for the worse while he's locked up, they'll probably let him out again and he can spent another decade making shit films because he managed a few decent ones back in the '60s and early '70s.)

DesFIP -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 1:14:16 PM)
I think he gets unwarranted sympathy because of the brutal murder of his wife by Manson. The assumption is that he wound up seriously screwed up afterwards.

Moonhead -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 1:53:20 PM)
You could almost believe that if Manson hadn't mentioned Polanski's collection of child porn during his trial, as well.

Musicmystery -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 6:46:21 PM)
I'm not going to excuse him. However, a look at the facts of the case are in order here. The judge at the time acted improperly and maliciously, as several people on all sides of the case readily acknowledge. It's the reason Polanski fled, and even the victim wants the case dropped.

BoiJen -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 7:51:17 PM)
Here's the deal with the victim wanting the case dropped.... As a rape survivor and a psychology student, one learns that rape survivors often don't press charges or even go to the police even when given a chance. The reason is this: to pursue this action is to prolong their own internal focus of the event. It HURTS. And it's entirely selfish in motivation to make that request. It does not take into account the potential that the attacker will likely continue to attack other people in such a way. It's primal in the need to stop the traumatic feelings that come with facing this issue over and over again, and in this case, in such a public manner after so long. When one finally thinks it's all over and it's never possibly going to come up again, bam, it does, and that person's world is coming undone at the seams. That's why she wants the case dropped. She does not realize she will not need to testify again, he ran from sentencing, not the trial. The media is the culprit in this instance of reopening her wounds. It is not a deep desire on her part to see him set free and not pay for fuckin up parts of her childhood and adulthood. Just some insight.... boi

Ialdabaoth -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 7:54:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: 4u2spoil I'm sure everyone's heard about Roman Polanski's arrest, which I thought was completely fair even if late. What really pisses me off is that I actually agree with one of those oft heard Republican phrases that Hollywood values aren't the same as American values. This is absolutely true, and always has been. Unfortunately, it's equally true that the Republican Elite's values aren't the same as American values, and are actually a lot closer to Hollywood's values (and the Democratic Elite's values). There's a scary realization once you examine people's behavior: power corrupts. Hollywood, televangelists, politicians... they all get away with rape, murder, theft, and other sundries because they have power and we don't. Demagogues always say "do as I say, not as I do".

Ialdabaoth -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 7:56:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery I'm not going to excuse him. However, a look at the facts of the case are in order here. The judge at the time acted improperly and maliciously, as several people on all sides of the case readily acknowledge. It's the reason Polanski fled, and even the victim wants the case dropped. This is why the Real World is so difficult to deal with, and why people make such snap judgements all the time. Polanski did a horrible thing. Manson did a horrible thing. The judge was a dick. I doubt the victim was entirely blameless in all this, either. What we have here is everyone behaving badly, and yet we have to figure out who to punish. If only there was some way to drop the focus on "punishment", and shift to a focus on "repair", we wouldn't have this problem. But alas, I don't think society is ready for that yet...

TheHeretic -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 9:53:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail Took a democratic administration to get out after him though, huh? So, words are cheap, republican words. Actually, Ron, The (three term) LA County DA whose office requested the arrest is a Republican. It will be up to the Democrat administration to get him extradited. [;)]

popeye1250 -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/29/2009 11:21:42 PM)
4u, have you ever heard Babs Streisand or George Clooney trying to talk about politics? It's like listening to a drunken schizophrenic. Those people make money because they can act/sing not because they're "smart."

Lucylastic -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (9/30/2009 12:14:00 AM)
THe big surprise was that woody allan is behind him all theway NOT [:-]

SirLost -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 6:33:34 AM)
Even though I admire Polanski's works, one should be judged regardless of his talents and thoughts. About the victim wanting the case to drop, there is the possibility of her being 'persuaded' by the ones who hold power, adding to the psychological situation that boijen explained.

tazzygirl -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 6:36:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Ialdabaoth quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery I'm not going to excuse him. However, a look at the facts of the case are in order here. The judge at the time acted improperly and maliciously, as several people on all sides of the case readily acknowledge. It's the reason Polanski fled, and even the victim wants the case dropped. This is why the Real World is so difficult to deal with, and why people make such snap judgements all the time. Polanski did a horrible thing. Manson did a horrible thing. The judge was a dick. I doubt the victim was entirely blameless in all this, either. What we have here is everyone behaving badly, and yet we have to figure out who to punish. If only there was some way to drop the focus on "punishment", and shift to a focus on "repair", we wouldn't have this problem. But alas, I don't think society is ready for that yet... AH so you are saying that a 13 year old girl who drugged is "partly" responsible for what an adult did to her? just like a man to point that out. lol

BoiJen -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 6:47:46 AM)
I've got to find the article/blog/whatever that posed this question: What if it were "Father Polanski" rather than "Director Polanski"? The Vatican did a great job for decades, dare I say, potentially centuries, of pushing child molesters and pedophiles around to escape punishment. When that was exposed, the world erupted in anger and demanded retribution and justice. Why is this any different? boi

tazzygirl -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 6:55:07 AM)
i agree its no different. he was allowed to get away with what he did then, based upon his status, and his using his wife and mother as "excuses". he committed a criminal offence. no excuses allowed. adults are supposed to be the guardians of the young... not the predators. doesnt matter what the excuse. to place even part of the blame on a child, the man is owning up to his inability to control himself ... hardly what i would call a man. if the law allows a grown woman to "change" her mind in the middle of a "consensual" act of sex, saying no and the man MUST agree or be faced with rape charges... how is it any different for a female child under the same circumstances. she can strip and beg... she is still off limits. or have men become so damn weak that their cocks do all the thinking for them, and they later point to their crotch and say to the legal system.... I am weak, I simply could not resist the charms of a child? if thats the case.. no matter who the adult is... is this a man we want as part of our society? is this a man any of us could ever trust, anywhere?

Ialdabaoth -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 3:03:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl if the law allows a grown woman to "change" her mind in the middle of a "consensual" act of sex, saying no and the man MUST agree or be faced with rape charges... how is it any different for a female child under the same circumstances. she can strip and beg... she is still off limits. or have men become so damn weak that their cocks do all the thinking for them, and they later point to their crotch and say to the legal system.... I am weak, I simply could not resist the charms of a child? if thats the case.. no matter who the adult is... is this a man we want as part of our society? is this a man any of us could ever trust, anywhere? If there's anything I've learned from life, it's that things are never as clear cut as we want them to be. In fact, the more clear-cut we act like things are, the more complex they often really are.

SpinnerofTales -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 4:31:16 PM)
quote: If there's anything I've learned from life, it's that things are never as clear cut as we want them to be. In fact, the more clear-cut we act like things are, the more complex they often really are. ORIGINAL: Ialdabaoth I have said it before and I'll say it again, when necessary. I don't hold to many moral absolutes but there are two I can think of right off the bat. 1) Toilet training is a good idea and should continue to be encouraged in the future. 2) the molestation of children is rape of the foulest kind and the fact that we let those who do it continue to walk among us is a disgrace to all of us. The rest, we can debate at our leisure.

Kirata -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 5:33:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales quote: If there's anything I've learned from life, it's that things are never as clear cut as we want them to be. In fact, the more clear-cut we act like things are, the more complex they often really are. ORIGINAL: Ialdabaoth I have said it before and I'll say it again, when necessary.... You definition of "when necessary" appears to be whenever someone expresses any view that is not absolute, final, and wholly in accord with your own. Precisely what it is about that that makes it "necessary" for you to drill us on your opinion again and again and again? "The rest, we can debate at our leisure," you say, to someone who wasn't even talking to you! May I suggest you try to get over the idea that you are moderating this thread? K.

servantforuse -> RE: Damn Polanski for making me agree with Republicans (10/1/2009 7:22:39 PM)
It is clear to me that Whoopi Goldberg, Debra Winger and the other hollywood elites that think he is being treated unfairly have not read the courtroom testimony. She was not only raped, she was sodomized. A 13 YEAR OLD GIRL...

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