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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 5:14:14 AM

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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Lets look at this another way in the hope to break this circular debate. Assume I am meeting a girl, a slave who has said she has no limits.

I want to see precisely what she means by this as it probably was never meant literally. We could establish that she isn't insane nor stupid or completely ignorant. She may even have meant that she hopes to have sufficient trust in me to set the limits. (Not so uncommon as you may think, all the kajirae I know personally have said as much to me over time as have slaves in M/s relationships whom I have the pleasure of knowing (no not in the biblical sense either).

As part of the collaring ceremony I will return certain rights set in stone to the girl which may include:

The right to live.
The right to remain safe from permanent damage.
The right to have suitable medical attention when needed.
The right to bring any issues which she believes are important to my notice at a time and place of my choosing.
The right to peruse a career.
The right to further her education.
The right to be happy.
The right to deal with and be a mother to her children if she has any.
The right to end the relationship and hopefully follow the protocols I stipulate to do this.

I would then set my hard limits which include:

No Scat.
No children (in play etc).
No animals (including "furries").
No spiders.
No clowns of any form.

So she originally came to me as a no limits girl (taking this on a common-sense basis) but I have set limits and re-established a list of rights for her. It may seem to be splitting hairs but for some, we live and breathe by doing things in a precise, well ordered (even clusterfucks) and follow protocols we have decided are pert of our lives where attention to detail in the correct form and format is deemed necessary.

< Message edited by IronBear -- 10/5/2009 5:15:19 AM >

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 5:20:54 AM

Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
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FR

Not sure what is scarier/weirder..people who say no limits..or those who start with ducks in shredders or amputations.
Some people just trust on common sense. Now they are made look like stupid people.
Perhaps instead of asking weird things, one could ask them..what do you mean with "no limits".

And as her Owner ( as IB says) you should protect her.

bitt of cross thinking from 2 "limit" threads

< Message edited by Justme696 -- 10/5/2009 5:28:56 AM >

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 5:29:16 AM

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From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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I think old chap, you may be not understanding the subtlety of some of the humour here. brought on perhaps due to cynicism and longevity in the scene and especially here in CM.

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http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to Justme696)

RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 5:32:40 AM

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From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
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I typed it..at the same time as you ( but had a pee break..lol..so posted late). My reply was already done before I read yours..except the last sentence.
But I read it now..and look for humour

So if I come live with you..I don't get anything in Stone...besides one on my grave?

< Message edited by Justme696 -- 10/5/2009 5:34:26 AM >

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 7:55:01 AM

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Just people being people. Worrying about the rules for others instead of living the life for themselves.

Human nature, vanilla or kink.

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 8:46:52 AM

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Sounds like a good plan Des and Iron Bear! :>
Davan

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 11:46:56 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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~fast reply~

There are things I won't do, and relationship styles that I won't participate in. If you're going to post on common-use sites like CM, the site calls those things "limits"... Me... I just call them "things I'm not interested in getting involved in".

Everything comes down to what we'll accept in our lives and what we won't. It isn't just in fetish or authority-exchange that people worry about whether the things they want in a relationship or -don't- want in a relationship are going to be an issue. Heck... I don't want pets. To me, they severely limit my ability to take off on a moment's notice, and I -don't- like having to travel with animals (and it's been my experience that most animals don't like it much either--at least, if you can judge by the amount of puke cleaned off automobile back seats and floorboards). It has nothing to do with being a dominant individual, or with my fetishes, etc... but I won't get involved with someone who -has- to have pets in their household or who has a house full of pets hirself. Is it a "hard limit"... I guess it is, but it isn't specific to WIITWD -here-.

Most of the things I'm not interested in and that end up going in my 'hard limit' list have nothing to do with kinky stuff -- they have to do with interpersonal stuff. I don't get into adult baby play... but I don't really want any more kids in the house even in a -vanilla- sense, unless they're grandkids who can be shipped back home to mom and dad when I'm tired of chucking them under the chin -- so to me, it's just a reasonable expansion of my general preferences in life. (I don't do scat or water play... but I don't like cleaning a cat-pan or picking dog doo up in the yard, either... see what I mean?)

Everyone has boundaries, regardless of which side of the kneel one is settling on, so yes, I suppose I -do- have limits, and have no compunctions about saying so.

Dame Calla

< Message edited by CallaFirestormBW -- 10/5/2009 11:52:13 AM >

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 12:00:32 PM

Kana

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Joined: 10/24/2006
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Damn
Be a bit tongue in cheek and people get up in arms.
Exaggerated yes. But sometimes a graphic example works best. Besides, considering the forum, it's tough to find a fetish that isn't on some one's yummy list.
And I thought the ducks in a shredder example was hilarious.

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 12:07:55 PM

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From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kana

And I thought the ducks in a shredder example was hilarious.

It is.....sorry for using it otherwise...but it fitted in what I wanted to say :P

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 1:25:17 PM

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I don't do scat, I don't have sex outside my poly family and I don't scene while intoxicated. Also big limit on anything that could reasonably send me to jail. I think those are my limits as a dominant. (And actually I guess they are my limits as a submissive too).

(in reply to thishereboi)

RE: Hard Limits - 10/5/2009 6:27:18 PM

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Thank you for that laugh. That one was a deep belly laugh. Yeah many do not get it. Have a great day!

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/6/2009 5:11:05 AM

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Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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FR
I think it's pretty obvious that when someone says no limits they are talking about the normal things, not harming people or animals. Ethical people don't go around torturing others, and the ones who say no limits are presuming that everyone else is ethical. The assumption is wrong, there are a lot of bad people out there, but that in no way negates their statement which has implied boundaries of right and wrong, and that limits here apply to typical bdsm activities. So when they say no limits, they are actually saying it's okay if you want to do needles, cutting, electric, singletails etc as long as you know what you're doing.

If you actually think they are saying otherwise, that they would kidnap and torture at your command, then you've got the problem, not them.

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/12/2009 6:08:55 PM

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Joined: 6/14/2007
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I am pretty accommodating but there are some things that disgust me that I won't do or are simply unsafe that I won't do or beyond my abilities/experience that are unsafe for that reason that I won't do.

If you're cute enough and cool enough, I will be willing to do a lot of things, but at some point I am just going to have to say "no", probably followed by, "no fucking way", then "that is fucking crazy and stupid and dangerous and I am too pretty for jail" and perhaps later followed by "you still want me to beat you with a belt and cum on your face, right?"

(in reply to Kana)

RE: Hard Limits - 10/12/2009 8:22:08 PM

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Joined: 4/19/2009
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My owner has limits, which fortunately match my own hard limits and we also share the same morals and ethics. The other limits I thought I had seem to be disappearing, and I seem to be okay with that...

As long as I am with him, I suppose I can say I have no limits since I know he will not ask of me anything that would cause me to question my submission to him. However if I were not owned, I would certainly not advertise myself as having no limits.

(in reply to TheDomInTheHat)

RE: Hard Limits - 10/13/2009 2:54:16 AM

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Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
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`fr`

Death is not a limit.. for anyone. I mean, you *are* going to die and no amount of yelling out a safeword is going to prevent it. You may be murdered, get killed by a drunk driver or die, peacefully, in your bed when you're 120, but you *are* absolutely going to die, some day, somehow. Might as well get that 'hard limit' out of your head. Now, if you want to say that you have a hard limit of being killed by your partner, that's fine and if you have enough trust and make wise choices, the odds are you won't die at the hand of your partner. That's not a guarentee that you won't, but you'll increase your odds a bit if you're just careful in your considerations of the people you allow to enter into relationships with you.

I grind up duck, chicken, hamburger and a ton of other stuff in my food processor. I don't see the big difference except that my way allows for a damn fine meal and tossing a duck in a tree shredder ruins the meat.

You know why I say that I have no limits? Because I'm not a mind reader nor can I see the future. There are things I will not do of my own accord, but there may be circumstances that crossing that *hard limit* boundary is actually the lessor of two evils. I don't know what they are, what they may be, but with some of the stuff I've witnessed, I don't rule out anything. I gotta tell you, when I'm trussed up like a Thanksgiving turkey, unable to move, gagged, blindfolded, any and all limits I may want to have or claim to have get thrown out the window because if my partner is Jack the Ripper Jr., limits are going to mean squat if *I* can't enforce them in any given moment. All I have at that point, is the trust in my own ability to make good choices. Next time you're being held up at gun point, yell out your safeword, then write back and let me know if that worked for ya. ::giggles::

Eating the flesh of other humans.. how many people would say HARD LIMIT to that one? I'd suspect it would encompass a term I don't use very often which is 'most' .. and yet, that plane that crashed in the Andes .. the survivors turned to canabalism to survive. Eating their fellow passengers was preferable to them over dying. Who's to say that they were right or wrong unless you are in their shoes and going through what they went through? That's the thing about limits with me.. I never know what the future is going to bring to me, so I'd rather hedge my bets and be comfortable enough to honestly assess that I can't claim I have any limits when I 'know' there may be a circumstance in which fate laughs at my puny effort to dictate life, the universe and everything and puts me into an exactly the situation which calls for boundaries to be crossed.

This attitude gets me called crazy, applicant for the funny farm, in dire need of a straight jacket and makes people back away slowly .. and my attitude is .. you can claim any limit you like and if you're careful and luck smiles on you, you may actually lead a charmed life where your limits are never, actually, tested. I'm more like a boy scout and I like to be prepared and just deal with things in such a way that I don't tempt fate with a declaration that I may not be able to uphold. That's a lot easier to do when I say I have no limits because I don't know what tomorrow may bring.

I see statements like "everyone" has limits and it makes me chuckle because it's just not true! Much more accurate would be to say that no one has limits but most people have preferences and things they would rather 'not' do, but may be forced to do under a specific set of circumstances .. except I don't speak for most people or even some people. I speak only for myself and *I* have no limits. Now, you can tell me that I'm wrong, bring out your chainsaws and ask me if it's okay if you cut off my nipples. Yeah, so I'll take off my bra and jut those puppy's out for you.. then what? Are you going to cut them off or not? I'd bet dollars to donuts.. not. As I still have both my nipples, so far I've been right 100% of the time .. but then, I'm also careful about who I let into my life as well and the odds of me having someone in my life who would actually cut off my nipples are pretty damn slim. The odds of me robbing a bank or killing someone are equally slim, but they are not 0%.

When I was younger, I would have said .. "Wetting myself is a hard limit! I will never pee myself! NO! It just won't happen! It's disgusting, it can lead to all sorts of rashes and other medical issues and I just will NOT go there. Hard limit! Hard limit!" Now, at the age of 49, I pee myself when I sneeze, when I laugh and sometimes just bending over to tie my shoes. Ah, limits. Gotta love em. ::chuckles::

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RE: Hard Limits - 10/13/2009 5:46:07 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

Yes it could be a translation problem. I had a guy write me and tell me he was a "no limits" slave. I asked him what that meant and he said that meant he would do ANYTHING I asked him to do. I told him I had always wanted to see ducks thrown into a tree shredder and he said he would NOT do that. WTF, I thought anything meant anything. Apparently he meant anything within reason. Go figure.

LOL, that's a good hard-limit challenge.

Another one that usually gets a refusal (although you have to be careful about who you say this too, as there are more that would agree to it than to duck shredding) is "go get operations and become the opposite sex. I'll even pay for it." For the right person I could do that one, just as I could do the amputation and be relatively happy (or maybe even a lot happy). Neither one of these is tied up in my identity the way being a sub is.

But ducks... tree shredder? That's just...icky. :/

...

Although there is something worse. Kittens in a tree-shredder! :(

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