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RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:18:54 PM

Fitznicely

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2

erm, no, i dont think you can say that - not unless theyre all pretending to be empathetic males.

Well I can only honestly speak for myself and I'm not. The rest? They might be for all we know.

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RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:18:57 PM

sexyred1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fitznicely

quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1
...makes the OP look bad, smug and not trustworthy.

Disciplinary paddling line starts here -----|

Who? Me or the OP?

.......she said hopefully

Hey..if the paddle fits....

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Post #: 62

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:21:01 PM

sunshinemiss

Posts: 17673
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FR ~ * and tongue in cheek of course.

quote:

Every single woman I wrote to responded, and told me that my email and profile were "refreshing."

They are all lesbians. They just didn't know it. Ten percent isn't enough - recruit, recruit, recruit!

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Post #: 63

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:22:15 PM

zephyroftheNorth

Posts: 8159
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

quote:

ORIGINAL: MsLadySue

Wow - that was just a tad harsh!

Agreed. Frazzle, sweetie this isn't like you. I also agree with Fitz (who has been missing lately ) some of the messages should be posted so the not-so-articulate Doms can see how to write a decent message.

Come now, do you really think that would be authentic to have a woman who posted as a man posting fake lovely messages, then post these messages so other real men could fake decent messages?

Does anyone else think this counterproductive, futile and wrong? I would not want to meet a man who needed a course or demonstration of how to write decent messages.

I want one who already knows how to communicate effectively and who is himself, not a copy of herself.

First of all, she (unlike the fakes and scammers) came clean and apparently it was taken well. Secondly not all men are good at written expression; some need a little help. Would you really want to pass someone up simply because he couldn't get the words down on paper (so-to-speak) well? She isn't going to write the messages for them just show how to say things that will get these men some positive responses. Nothing wrong with that.

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Post #: 64

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:22:38 PM

Fitznicely

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

Hey..if the paddle fits....

That''ll be Fitz's paddle

(see what I did there? chortle chortle, fetch coat, run)

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Post #: 65

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:22:40 PM

lally2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fitznicely

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2

erm, no, i dont think you can say that - not unless theyre all pretending to be empathetic males.

Well I can only honestly speak for myself and I'm not. The rest? They might be for all we know.

not my experience at all. everyone ive ever met off cm has been exactly who they said they were and were not pretending anything. and of those i havent me but would have liked to, i know that they are exactly who they say they are because they are consistantly themselves the whole time.

i dont think its the cmails that are the problem. the root of the problem is a persons profile. write a desparate 'do me' profile and youll get desparate do me' types. write a clueless profile and youll get predators. write a miserable snarky profile and youll get fuck all.

< Message edited by lally2 -- 2/6/2010 5:24:49 PM >

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Post #: 66

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:23:18 PM

LadyPact

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jujubeeMB

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

It would be My opinion that you honestly owe some folks an apology.

I completely respect where you're coming from, but the people who deserved the apology (the women in the experiment) got one. I don't think I need to apologize to anyone else. In the scheme of things that happen on this message board, this is the thing that you choose to ask an apology for? Do you think the men writing hundreds and hundreds of offensive, careless form letters owe an apology to all the women they email? I've been non-consensually insulted and harassed by tons of men since I joined, as I'm sure everyone else has. A warm, genuine email from someone who completely meant what they were saying (despite being able to ever act on it) is a negative thing? No one was upset, as far as I can tell, and if they were, it can't possibly be more upsetting than the crap women put up with on a daily basis.

I didn't say you owed Me one. It wasn't Me that you misrepresented yourself to or who's time you wasted. You may think you completely meant what you were saying, but the fact is that you chose to say it from a stand point that was just an illusion.

How is this better than the folks who create profiles of a different gender to mislead others for other things? Dishonesty is dishonesty is the same no matter how you slice it.

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Post #: 67

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:24:03 PM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

Hey..if the paddle fits....

Apparently it does

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Post #: 68

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:26:51 PM

Fitznicely

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quote:

First of all, she (unlike the fakes and scammers) came clean and apparently it was taken well. Secondly not all men are good at written expression; some need a little help. Would you really want to pass someone up simply because he couldn't get the words down on paper (so-to-speak) well? She isn't going to write the messages for them just show how to say things that will get these men some positive responses. Nothing wrong with that.

If one woman - one woman - can put her hand on her heart and say she's never thought "these guys need fucking help", they're liars too. Now someone's in the position to help, and everyone's flaming her. I mean sheesh girls, c'mon. You want Doms to be consistent? Your turn

< Message edited by Fitznicely -- 2/6/2010 5:27:56 PM >

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Post #: 69

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:27:49 PM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

i dont think its the cmails that are the problem. the root of the problem is a persons profile. write a desparate 'do me' profile and youll get desparate do me' types. write a clueless profile and youll get predators. write a miserable snarky profile and youll get fuck all.

Not necessarily true lally - well except for the snarky profile

My profiles have always been of the respectful kind and yet I get the nasty, disgusting messages all the time. I think the blame should be where the blame lies, on the shoulders of those who send those messages.

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RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:29:49 PM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fitznicely

quote:

First of all, she (unlike the fakes and scammers) came clean and apparently it was taken well. Secondly not all men are good at written expression; some need a little help. Would you really want to pass someone up simply because he couldn't get the words down on paper (so-to-speak) well? She isn't going to write the messages for them just show how to say things that will get these men some positive responses. Nothing wrong with that.

If one woman - one woman - can put her hand on her heart and say she's never thought "these guys need fucking help", they're liars too. Now someone's in the position to help, and everyone's flaming her. I mean sheesh girls, c'mon. You want Doms to be consistent? Your turn

errr Fitz I was agreeing with you...

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RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:31:25 PM

Fitznicely

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's OK, zeph, I know

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Post #: 72

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:33:02 PM

sexyred1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

quote:

ORIGINAL: MsLadySue

Wow - that was just a tad harsh!

Agreed. Frazzle, sweetie this isn't like you. I also agree with Fitz (who has been missing lately ) some of the messages should be posted so the not-so-articulate Doms can see how to write a decent message.

Come now, do you really think that would be authentic to have a woman who posted as a man posting fake lovely messages, then post these messages so other real men could fake decent messages?

Does anyone else think this counterproductive, futile and wrong? I would not want to meet a man who needed a course or demonstration of how to write decent messages.

I want one who already knows how to communicate effectively and who is himself, not a copy of herself.

First of all, she (unlike the fakes and scammers) came clean and apparently it was taken well. Secondly not all men are good at written expression; some need a little help. Would you really want to pass someone up simply because he couldn't get the words down on paper (so-to-speak) well? She isn't going to write the messages for them just show how to say things that will get these men some positive responses. Nothing wrong with that.

Sorry zephyr, I don't want to paddle this to death and we can agree to disagree, but I find the actions of the OP to be patently ridiculous. Of course some people do not know how to communicate, if we were all fabulous communicators our world would be far better.

I believe that it would not help men to read what the OP wrote as an example because, as I mentioned before, it would not be authentic. I don't know about you, but I prefer my communications to be honest.

I don't care that she fessed up and came clean. It still makes it bullshit that she did that.

And I don't pass men up because of their ability or inability to write. I pass them up if I do not find them interesting, if I find them rude or unattractive and if they are clearly not someone I would like to know.

Lots of brilliantly written emails come my way; does not make the guy any more appealing to me if he does not meet certain criteria.

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Post #: 73

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:35:04 PM

Shekicromaster

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quote:

I think the blame should be where the blame lies, on the shoulders of those who send those messages.

I think the problem is tat it is a fetish dating/social site. You will probably ( not that I'm sure about that ) not get the same messages on a christian "proud to be virgin" social site. Ths is a place for pervs, what do you expect? :D

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Post #: 74

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:36:33 PM

VaguelyCurious

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fitznicely
If one woman - one woman - can put her hand on her heart and say she's never thought "these guys need fucking help", they're liars too. Now someone's in the position to help, and everyone's flaming her. I mean sheesh girls, c'mon. You want Doms to be consistent? Your turn

But if you change how you represent yourself based on jujubee's ideas of what women want to hear, then surely you would no longer be representing yourself-you would be representing jujubee...

It's not that I don't think guys could use help-I suppose that IMHO how to write a successful memo is something you should work out for yourself. Not something you should be cribbing off someone else.

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RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:37:04 PM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fitznicely

's OK, zeph, I know

thanks for clarifying, Fitz

zeph

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Post #: 76

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:38:44 PM

EbonyWood

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jujubeeMB

I know this is not going to make me particularly popular, ......

.....So all the men complaining that women don't respond to messages: make a better profile, and write a kind, warm, respectful, personalized email. We may be on this website because of our sexuality, but our sexuality is not what's going to make us want to talk to you.

To those defending jujubee against criticism, it should be noted that she expected to cop flak for this, which suggests she knows she acted with less than perfect ethics. Also, that she's big enough to defend herself if need be.

I'm with sexyred and just don't understand what was proved. It wasn't an experiment by a long shot - we don't know the profile makeup of the recipients nor the contents of the messages. There was no control group. It's more of a prank than an experiment, which is probably how it should be viewed.

Like all pranks, there is a victim. How much they suffered is an unknown.

To me it just perpetuated some stereotypes that we know exist already.

Your sexuality isn't the only thing that's going to make us men want to talk to women either.

Well, not this particular man.

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Post #: 77

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:41:43 PM

Fitznicely

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Joined: 10/18/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

I don't care that she fessed up and came clean. It still makes it bullshit that she did that.

And I don't pass men up because of their ability or inability to write. I pass them up if I do not find them interesting, if I find them rude or unattractive and if they are clearly not someone I would like to know.

Lots of brilliantly written emails come my way; does not make the guy any more appealing to me if he does not meet certain criteria.

Ah, but do you reply to those brilliantly written ones, specifically the ones you reject - and of the ones that are less than brilliantly written, how do you assess their compliance with their criteria?

The crux of the experiment was to, as far as I can see, prove that a well written, thoughtful mail is more likely to get a response. I personally don't see that gender matters. Yes, the subterfuge was unfortunate, but as I said, how's that different to the majority of people on the other side?

If you reply to all the well written mails, regardless of interest and bin all the less well written ones, aren't you proving Juju's point?

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RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:42:11 PM

zephyroftheNorth

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quote:

ORIGINAL: VaguelyCurious

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fitznicely
If one woman - one woman - can put her hand on her heart and say she's never thought "these guys need fucking help", they're liars too. Now someone's in the position to help, and everyone's flaming her. I mean sheesh girls, c'mon. You want Doms to be consistent? Your turn

But if you change how you represent yourself based on jujubee's ideas of what women want to hear, then surely you would no longer be representing yourself-you would be representing jujubee...

It's not that I don't think guys could use help-I suppose that IMHO how to write a successful memo is something you should work out for yourself. Not something you should be cribbing off someone else.

For Red and Curious

It's the method not the actual messages men would be learning to write, I honestly see no harm in it. It's not like she wold be doing the actual writing or that they would be copying them off her. They would just see what a message that gets responses....positive responses looks like.

Red, I think you're right, we will have to agree to disagree

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Post #: 79

RE: An Experiment - 2/6/2010 5:44:39 PM

lally2

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth

quote:

i dont think its the cmails that are the problem. the root of the problem is a persons profile. write a desparate 'do me' profile and youll get desparate do me' types. write a clueless profile and youll get predators. write a miserable snarky profile and youll get fuck all.

Not necessarily true lally - well except for the snarky profile My profiles have always been of the respectful kind and yet I get the nasty, disgusting messages all the time. I think the blame should be where the blame lies, on the shoulders of those who send those messages.

.

i agree that the poisenous pricks who write shite all day every day should be put in barrels and tossed over victoria falls

. but that isnt going to happen (sadly) that would be a fun day out!

. theyre asshats. but in amongst the asshats you must be getting some decent folk saying hi.

i dont seem to be getting them anymore, not sure why but to be honest ive rarely had that much trouble from them. one or two a week tops and i just dont ever write back.

or are we talking about the great pretenders. cos i used to get those and i guess i still do, but i spot them immediately and give no further thought to them. its part of being on cm really.

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So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

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