WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE

Join Our Community

Collarchat.com

Home Login Search

WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE

Page: [1] 2 3 4 5 next > >>

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 8:57:16 AM

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdoJJaiQj3I&feature=sub

EXPLOSIVE NEWS
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2...
A lingering technical question about the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks still haunts some, and it has political implications: How did 200,000 tons of steel disintegrate and drop in 11 seconds? A thousand architects and engineers want to know, and are calling on Congress to order a new investigation into the destruction of the Twin Towers and Building 7 at the World Trade Center.

"In order to bring down this kind of mass in such a short period of time, the material must have been artificially, exploded outwards," says Richard Gage, a San Francisco architect and founder of the nonprofit Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth.

Mr. Gage, who is a member of the American Institute of Architects, managed to persuade more than 1,000 of his peers to sign a new petition requesting a formal inquiry.

"The official Federal Emergency Management [Agency] and National Institute of Standards and Technology reports provide insufficient, contradictory and fraudulent accounts of the circumstances of the towers' destruction. We are therefore calling for a grand jury investigation of NIST officials," Mr. Gage adds.

The technical issues surrounding the collapse of the towers has prompted years of debate, rebuttal and ridicule.

He is particularly disturbed by Building 7, a 47-story skyscraper, which was not hit by an aircraft, yet came down in "pure free-fall acceleration." He also says that more than 100 first-responders reported explosions and flashes as the towers were falling and cited evidence of "multi-ton steel sections ejected laterally 600 ft. at 60 mph" and the "mid-air pulverization of 90,000 tons of concrete & metal decking."

There is also evidence of "advanced explosive nano-thermitic composite material found in the World Trade Center dust," Mr. Gage says. The group's petition at www. ae911truth.org is already on its way to members of Congress.

"Government officials will be notified that 'Misprision of Treason,' U.S. Code 18 (Sec. 2382), is a serious federal offense, which requires those with evidence of treason to act," Mr. Gage says. "The implications are enormous and may have profound impact on the forthcoming Khalid Shaikh Mohammed trial."/snip

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 9:08:31 AM

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

washington times did not question anything. an op ed piece detailing a guy that wants to have congress investigate some dubious and oft repeated claims with no backing.

more paper and washers.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to pahunkboy)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 9:12:43 AM

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

right- 1000 engineers signed petition.

go figure.

(in reply to mnottertail)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 9:15:20 AM

Posts: 3506
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline

It was a test for professional accreditation and they all failed.

_____________________________

Memory Lane...been there done that.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 9:20:15 AM

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SL4V3M4YB3

It was a test for professional accreditation and they all failed.

http://www.aia.org/index.htm since there is nothing to hide- then sunshine and disclosure is no problem at all. unless of course someone over collected for insurance fraud purposes. but would wall street ever do such a thing?? not as holy and pure as they are..... glunk.

(in reply to SL4V3M4YB3)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 9:29:52 AM

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

Their website is here: http://www.ae911truth.org

The PR Newswire story, carried by Yahoo, is here: http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20100219/pl_usnw/DC57612_1

K.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 9:50:56 AM

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Their website is here: http://www.ae911truth.org

The PR Newswire story, carried by Yahoo, is here: http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20100219/pl_usnw/DC57612_1

K.

AE911Truth's conclusions are shared by thousands of scientists; senior-level military, intelligence and government officials; pilots and aviation professionals; firefighters; scholars and university professors; and 9/11 survivors and their family members/snip

interesting batch of people who question 7. :-)

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 12:18:02 PM

Posts: 2100
Joined: 5/13/2009
Status: offline

_____________________________

"'Till the roof comes off, 'till the lights go out
'Till my legs give out, can't shut my mouth."

(in reply to pahunkboy)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 1:34:59 PM

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

right- 1000 engineers signed petition.

go figure.

Architects not engineers. All architcets are not trained engineers.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 2:36:06 PM

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

quote:

Architects not engineers. All architcets are not trained engineers.

I would agree that a "landscape architect" would not be qualified to make an informed dicision concerning how a building would or would not be affected by an airplane impact. However if we use the word architect in the sense of one who designs buildings then I fail to see a meaningful distinction between engineer and architect except that the architect might be more knowledgeable. If I have missed something in your analysis please bring me up to speed.

< Message edited by thompsonx -- 2/25/2010 2:37:48 PM >

(in reply to DomKen)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 2:46:18 PM

Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline

Hey thompsonx, actually as a General Contractor, the engineers are the ones that put the final stamp of approval on the structural integrity of our buildings, not the architects. I personally believe that architects are more informed and work harder, but in most cases, especially when we do commercial work, the engineers are the final word, not the architects. Just some fyi. We need the engineers to ok anything as far as the code enforcement and getting approval on commercial structures, not the architects, although it may vary in other states. Probably AnimusRex can answer for his part of the world, but where I am and for the past 20 years that I have been doing this, it's that way.

_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)

(in reply to thompsonx)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 2:55:59 PM

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

I can appreciate that someone needs to put a final signature on the plans. As you point out it is the engineers who do this. Am I correct in my assumption that the Architect is the one who designs the building and any failure of his design is his responsibility. And that it is the engineer who signs off that the architects design has been faithfully followed.
Yes I,like you, had hoped that Rex would comment on this from his professional perspective.

(in reply to Aynne88)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 2:59:37 PM

Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

AE911Truth's conclusions are shared by thousands of scientists; senior-level military, intelligence and government officials; pilots and aviation professionals; firefighters; scholars and university professors; and 9/11 survivors and their family members/snip

interesting batch of people who question 7. :-)

Just out of morbid curiosity, what are those pilots and aviation professionals saying about those conclusions?

(in reply to pahunkboy)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 3:03:23 PM

Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline

no matter how that card is played when it comes down to a suit they hunt down anyone who has their names attached. I am surprised they dont go after the truck drivers that haoul the materials.

25% of the 1000 engineers are mechanical and another 25% are electrical, the remainder are all other branches surprisingly including attorneys.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to thompsonx)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 3:06:11 PM

Rule

Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy
How did 200,000 tons of steel disintegrate and drop in 11 seconds?

Magically.

It was all caused by mnottertail. He found an old Arabic bottle with a djinn in it when he was digging for stone arrow points in an Indian burrow. On the label it said in Aramaic "Free me and I will grant your first wish!" Unfortunately mnottertail could neither read nor understand Aramaic, or else he might have left well enough alone. Instead he supposed that an earlier arrow point digger had left or forgotten the bottle and as it seemed half full and he hoped that the wine might still be drinkable, he broke the wax seal. No wine was in that bottle, though. The fluid started to get turbulent and evaporated. A huge, multicolored cloud escaped from the opened bottle and twisted and whirled and then solidified into a three metre tall djinn. "Mortal!" he cried. "I have promised that I will grant the first wish of anyone who freed me."
"That is great," mumbled mnottertail. "I wish for a blond chick to suck my dick."
"Two thousand years ago an African chief found my bottle in the great desert and I intended to build him a palace with ten slave girls - but he did not free me."
"That was too bad," commisserated mnottertail. "On second thought, I would like ten slave girls to suck my dick."
"Twelve hundred years ago a grave robber found my bottle in the grave of the African chief and I intended to build him ten palaces with a hundred slave girls each - but he did not free me either."
"Man that must have sucked! If that thief had only known! Say mr. Djinn, I have changed my mind: I would like a hundred slave girls to suck my dick."
"He was a homosexual, but never mind, I would have gladly given him as many boys. Unfortunately he got drunk on the beach and a wave snatched my bottle away. For three years I floated in the ocean and then my bottle washed up on another shore where it was found by an indian warrior. At last I would be freed, I hoped, and I intended to build him a hundred palaces with a thousand slave girls each..."
"Say, say! A thousand slave girls to suck my dick: that is even better!" said mnottertail enthousiastically.
"- but he did not free me either," said the djinn grimly. "Twelve hundred years more my bottle lay in this burrow and during those years I started to hate all humans and I decided to kill the being that would finally free me from my prison!"
mnottertail's faced blanched. "But no slave girl has yet sucked my dick!" he objected. "Be reasonable, mr. Djinn: let me find one to suck my dick first."
Now it so happened that the djinn was not only angry, but compassionate as well. "Oh, very well. I give you three years to find a slave girl that will suck your dick. As soon as she does, I will flatten the first structure that houses you, killing you. If the three years elapse without you finding such a slave girl, I will do so anyway."
Thus it came to pass that mnottertail went for three years without a slave girl sucking his dick, for he did not want to die. Meanwhile he planned to trick the djinn into not killing him. He called his plan "I will trade the world for my life" and built a Japanese paper house in his back garden. This house was at the very core, the center, of his plan: he could not possibly be killed when the djinn brought down that paper structure. mnottertail lived at number six and got a post address number 7 for his Japanese villa, which for short he called his world trade center. He fully intended to spent the appointed day in that villa, preferably with his slave girl to suck his dick. He had owned her for almost a year and all that time he had wanted her to suck his dick, but that could not be. "Tomorrow, though," he told her the evening before, "I will have you suck my dick in the world trade center number seven."
Now as it happened, the djinn, whoms name was el Mus'ad, overheard mnottertails announcement and instead of staying around he went about on his own business and the next day at the appointed time, when he perceived that mnottertails dick was being sucked by a slave girl, he by mistake - it was an error! - flattened World Trade Center 7. He much regretted it when he realized his mistake.

For the record: el Mus'ad had nothing to do with the collapses of WTC1 and WTC2. He also strongly objects to being called an Arab terrorist. He wasn't even there when he flattened the building; he was in Riad at the time.

< Message edited by Rule -- 2/25/2010 3:10:28 PM >

(in reply to pahunkboy)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 3:15:53 PM

Posts: 3506
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
Am I correct in my assumption that the Architect is the one who designs the building and any failure of his design is his responsibility. And that it is the engineer who signs off that the architects design has been faithfully followed.

Depends how you define the term 'Engineer' in the contract. Sometimes the Architect is deemed to be the principle engineer and sometimes a structural engineering consultant is. I would say that for most projects, to do it economically, specialist structural engineering knowledge is required.

You also have to consider that structural stability is one aspect along with: acoustics, circulation spaces, means of escape, service distribution, thermal insulation, appearance. It's not often any company will be happy taking on responsibility for all these aspects; they often pass ownership of some to specialists.

The Architect should have an understanding of structures but such knowledge isn't going to compare to that of a specialist. You wouldn't go to a GP for open heart surgery.

It's confusing because people define Engineer and Architect far too loosely.

(In my world anyway; which differs from Real0ne's world)

< Message edited by SL4V3M4YB3 -- 2/25/2010 3:23:41 PM >

_____________________________

Memory Lane...been there done that.

(in reply to thompsonx)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 3:25:03 PM

Posts: 2165
Joined: 5/13/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aynne88
I personally believe that architects are more informed and work harder, but in most cases, especially when we do commercial work, the engineers are the final word, not the architects.

Actually, architects have bigger cocks and tinglier clits, but we do not work any harder than anyone else.

You are right, engineers would be the most expert voices here; architects have a generalists knowledge of how strutures work, and can speak in general terms. So if 1,000 structural engineers (as opposed to aerospace or hydraulic engineers) signed a petition, I might take more notice.

Which brings me to the bigger point- the official story, that the towers fell from structural weaking caused by fire, is perfectly consistent with general principles of structures and fire protection; we apply fireproofing on columns to prevent exactly this. This is something I can speak with perfect clarity and expertise on.

But being a generalist, I can't refute blurry photos showing gray smoke that should be black, or discuss in articulate detail the presence or absence of- what is it again? "advanced explosive nano-thermitic composite material" that someone claims to have found.
AND NEITHER CAN MR. GAGE! Nor can any single solitary soul on these boards. As someone else pointed out, its amazing how suddenly insurance adjusters, office managers, mortgage brokers, and tv repairmen suddenly turn into chemists, metallugists, physicists and structural engineers, and speak confidently and with complete authority about crap that they had never even heard of until 3 days ago.

Its like if suddenly I started speaking in detailed terms about heart surgery, and questioning your doctor about the results of your last EKG, or holding myself out as the expert voice on that thumping sound in your engine.

(in reply to Aynne88)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 3:25:16 PM

Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline

youve got a flair for satire LOL

Hey if you wanna really cut it up, there are unmoderated free speech sites and as long as it is not against the law such that the owner gets tossed in jail you can pulverize these people that suck the government 911 tit. Moderated sites these posters always hide behind the TOS or crybabies whine for its removal and or moderators tend to moderate based on their own agenda and its a never win situation. In fact I know one site where you can set the rules in the beginning of the debate and the owners uphold your wishes, you can ban people that the only thing they have to say is slurs, you can do a 1 on 1 and its completely up to you how you want to run your thread. 3 times not putting up evidence for the claim and they lose. You can even agree on other members to be judges if you want. If you really wanna rip em up thats how its done cuz they cant escape once they agree to debate this topic. That and you can post as many pics as you want to prove up the case without limit.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Rule)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 3:27:15 PM

Posts: 382
Joined: 9/19/2004
Status: offline

You can gather all the evidence about WTC 7 and 9/11, lay it out there for the public to see, including the fact that the engine pictured as 'recovered' from the Pentagon was not from the same kind of plane that supposedly hit the Pentagon, the fact that jet fuel doesn't burn hot enough to evaporate steel, the fact that in 2001 no commercial flight had the ability to enable personal cell phones to be used while cruising at those altitudes, the fact that the footage of the Pentagon exists on cameras from the Highway Department traffic cams as well as the gas station and hotels across the freeway, and a host of other scientific facts, and it won't make any difference. The joke is, and the tyrants are counting on it, "The American People Won't Stand For It!!!" How's that working out for us?

(in reply to Rule)

RE: WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE - 2/25/2010 3:30:02 PM

Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aynne88
I personally believe that architects are more informed and work harder, but in most cases, especially when we do commercial work, the engineers are the final word, not the architects.

Actually, architects have bigger cocks and tinglier clits, but we do not work any harder than anyone else.

You are right, engineers would be the most expert voices here; architects have a generalists knowledge of how strutures work, and can speak in general terms. So if 1,000 structural engineers (as opposed to aerospace or hydraulic engineers) signed a petition, I might take more notice.

Which brings me to the bigger point- the official story, that the towers fell from structural weaking caused by fire, is perfectly consistent with general principles of structures and fire protection; we apply fireproofing on columns to prevent exactly this. This is something I can speak with perfect clarity and expertise on.

But being a generalist, I can't refute blurry photos showing gray smoke that should be black, or discuss in articulate detail the presence or absence of- what is it again? "advanced explosive nano-thermitic composite material" that someone claims to have found.
AND NEITHER CAN MR. GAGE! Nor can any single solitary soul on these boards. As someone else pointed out, its amazing how suddenly insurance adjusters, office managers, mortgage brokers, and tv repairmen suddenly turn into chemists, metallugists, physicists and structural engineers, and speak confidently and with complete authority about crap that they had never even heard of until 3 days ago.

Its like if suddenly I started speaking in detailed terms about heart surgery, and questioning your doctor about the results of your last EKG, or holding myself out as the expert voice on that thumping sound in your engine.

so does that mean you are not qualified to cook up burgers because you do not have a degree in burger flipping?

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to AnimusRex)

Page: [1] 2 3 4 5 next > >>

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> WASHINGTON TIMES QUESTIONS WTC 7 COLLAPSE

Page: [1] 2 3 4 5 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2024

Terms of Service

0.044