Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (Full Version)

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knees2you -> Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/9/2006 11:11:29 PM)

People say that there is a difference between
Submissives and Slaves, but what I want to know is
Either way You are doing what was told Correct.
Is that right?

Even  a Master or Mistress who have a Slave
would still talk to them about wanting to
do something to them, right?
quote:

 
"Yes I Said It!"


Always, Ant[;)]



Arpig -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/9/2006 11:18:55 PM)

depends entirely on the people in question



maybeican -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/9/2006 11:29:22 PM)

There is a total difference between a slave and a submissive. A slave devotes their life to the One they serve. A submissive trys to control from the bottom.



goodrachael -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 12:25:59 AM)

I wondered about this also, especially if there is a dom male/fem couple and a female sub or slave.



wytchywoman -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 12:43:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: maybeican

There is a total difference between a slave and a submissive. A slave devotes their life to the One they serve. A submissive trys to control from the bottom.


Whoa! That's a sweeping generalizaion about submissives and one I totally disagree with. While it may be true that some submissives at some time may try to "top from the bottom", the exact same thing can be said about some people who claim to be slaves.

I'm going to cut this short because I need to go do some deep breathing exercises. [:@]



swtnsparkling -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 1:19:45 AM)

quote:

A submissive trys to control from the bottom.


Although there may be a few subs who try to top from the bottom  -   Please dont go stateing this is what a submissive is- it is WRONG



SuspiciousSub -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 1:30:18 AM)

as a submissive all i can say is i dont try topping from the bottom
in what i have seen and learned the only difference is that a slave is ordered and made demands of and does as she/he is told irrespective
where a submissive is allowed his/her limits and is allowed to make choices re her treatment
well that is the way it is with me
by order or demand i will not respond
out of love and respect and as a request i will meet all my Dominant Masters needs (without crossing my limits)
and do it proudly
smiles
suss



SoulfulSadism -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 2:05:43 AM)

Everyone will give you their own views. Mine are:

- Ultimately, it's often a question of degree.

- A sub is someone who has her own dreams in life. Is allowed to say no.

- A slave is someone whose first dream is her master; who may or may not be allowed by her master to say no ... but one who wouldn't allow herself to say no.





twicehappy -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 3:58:27 AM)

ORIGINAL :knees2you

quote:

Even  a Master or Mistress who have a Slave
would still talk to them about wanting to
do something to them, right?



That would ultimately depend on the Master or Mistress. I am most definitely a slave, while I am lucky in that my Master and Mistress both talk quite freely with me about everything and anything; the final decision is always theirs. They are under no onus to do so however.

There have been a few occasions when, although they did eventually explain their reasons, at the time I was simply given an order to follow. As a slave I obeyed, period, trusting that both love me and would always choose the appropriate path for me to follow. They own me, either I trust them or I do not.

From my point of view a submissive retains the right to negotiate, to say yes or no to any given order/request. A slave can pre-collaring negotiate up to a point but once that collar goes on they no longer retain that right.

A case in point; do I have a safe word? Yes. Do they have to stop when I use it? No.

Does a slave have recourse to obeying orders they do not care for? Absolutely, they can always choose to return their collar.

A good owner cares deeply and well for their slave so it is your best interest to pick them wisely, this is a slave’s best defense against those who would be abusive.


quote:

ORIGINAL: goodrachael


I wondered about this also, especially if there is a dom male/fem couple and a female sub or slave.



I am owned by a Dom/Domme couple (ScooterTrash and ShiftedJewel), the way this works is you simply substitute “Ones” they serve for the “One”.  




feastie -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 4:18:39 AM)

The following link leads to a page which gives the best definitions of bottom, submissive and slave I have ever seen.  However, this, like anything else, is not carved in stone and exceptions and humanity do apply.  I also believe that whether someone is a submissive or slave depends entirely on the dynamics between her and her owner.  I also think that almost any submissive has the potential to grow into slavery with the right person.  Unfortunately, it's not black and white, cut and dried.  Humans are involved.

http://www.westom.com/leather/nine_degrees_of_submission.htm



Level -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 4:21:00 AM)

Interesting topic, one that always brings out debate LOL.......
 
Uncle D



feastie -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 4:41:39 AM)

Always! LOL



Tikkiee -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 4:53:20 AM)

I agree with the consensus in that the definitions of each will vary widely, depending on the people involved. My own opinion is that a submissive is one with varying degrees of limits, while a slave's are much more limited. Just my own way of looking at things though.
 
quote:

  There is a total difference between a slave and a submissive. A slave devotes their life to the One they serve. A submissive trys to control from the bottom.


I will agree with the others in that this is a sweeping generalization that is just plain WRONG. Though there are some who do, the majority of submissives do NOT top from the bottom.



feastie -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 5:24:46 AM)

Oh yeah...I forgot that part! (Damn, it's hard getting old).  Submissives do not top from the bottom.  There are some people that do, but it is incorrect (and not fair) to say that everyone does. 



DiannaVesta -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 5:35:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: maybeican

There is a total difference between a slave and a submissive. A slave devotes their life to the One they serve. A submissive trys to control from the bottom.



ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!! I almost peed my pants laughing when I read this!



Elegant -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 5:40:38 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: feastie

The following link leads to a page which gives the best definitions of bottom, submissive and slave I have ever seen.  However, this, like anything else, is not carved in stone and exceptions and humanity do apply.  I also believe that whether someone is a submissive or slave depends entirely on the dynamics between her and her owner.  I also think that almost any submissive has the potential to grow into slavery with the right person.  Unfortunately, it's not black and white, cut and dried.  Humans are involved.

http://www.westom.com/leather/nine_degrees_of_submission.htm


Officer Wes is fabulous!



DiannaVesta -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 5:41:17 AM)

Ok here’s my take on. It is true that everyone has their own definition.

  A submissive is one by nature who may be naturally submissive or enjoys entering into that space. A seemingly dominant person may enjoy being submissive because it’s sexually exciting to them or they seek the balance via power exchange.

  A slave is someone who makes a commitment in a D/s relationship to remain in that space all the time. The word describe exactly what it means- slave & they serve their owner without question; mind, body and soul.



SirCumsSlut -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 5:41:45 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: knees2you

People say that there is a difference between
Submissives and Slaves, but what I want to know is
Either way You are doing what was told Correct.
Is that right?

Even  a Master or Mistress who have a Slave
would still talk to them about wanting to
do something to them, right?
quote:

 
"Yes I Said It!"


Always, Ant[;)]


Again this is different for different people........
 
i am Sir's slave........his decisions are final in all things........When it comes to what Sir is going to do to me (whether for punishment or pleasure) He does not talk to be about it to get my "approval", he tells me about it to heighten my sensationability (if that's a word)....When it comes to household decisions (for He is also my husband) we discuss in length what to do but again the FINAL decision is His.........He will listen if i have a different approach to the "situation" and sometimes, if i have made a valid point, He will adjust his decision to see that point......
 
In response to SuspiciousSub's quote
"as a submissive all i can say is i dont try topping from the bottom
in what i have seen and learned the only difference is that a slave is ordered and made demands of and does as she/he is told irrespective
where a submissive is allowed his/her limits and is allowed to make choices re her treatment
well that is the way it is with me
by order or demand i will not respond
out of love and respect and as a request i will meet all my Dominant Masters needs (without crossing my limits)
and do it proudly"

 
Sir does not "order or demand" that i do anything.......as His slave, i know what His needs and wants are and i take care of them out of my "LOVE AND DEVOTION" to Him.......and also as his slave, i have limits that Sir agrees with and neither one of us will ever cross....  At first Sir considered me a submissive....and yes I balked at some of the things He did, but i "NEVER" had a say either way........
 
In my humble opinion, yes there is a distinct difference between "slave" and "sub".........but again those differences are determined ONLY by those involved..........Stereotypical generalizations do more harm than good..........



Elegant -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 5:43:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: knees2you

People say that there is a difference between
Submissives and Slaves, but what I want to know is
Either way You are doing what was told Correct.
Is that right?

Even  a Master or Mistress who have a Slave
would still talk to them about wanting to
do something to them, right?


In our Master/slave relationship (which is not the same as everyone elses as there are nuances that are different in all relationships) Master Archer does not always talk to me about wanting to do something to me..or asking ('commanding') me to do something. It's his perogative to do what he wishes with his property.



Leather134 -> RE: Slave/Submissive not the Same or are they? (4/10/2006 5:52:45 AM)

I think there is a definte difference between a slave and a submissive. I think it centers around the amount of control /decision making  that each gives up.

While I believe that both slaves and submissives have a say in what ha[ppens  during play I believe that a slave willing gives up more control  over what takes places during play. A sub in my opinion chooses to give up less control than a slave. It's a  matter of degree.

Thanks

Leather134




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