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The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 6:50:56 AM   
Aneirin


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The intelligence Quotient, the I.Q. since it's introduction in 1909 as a standard method of measuring intelligence has been used and abused by so many to further their agendas, but aside from it's use in the pseudo science of eugenics which caused so much damge to society, it appears the IQ of a person might reveal some interesting facts.

Whilst reading a post on another website. I came across a posting where the person said that they believed it is no coincidence that the higher the education level of a country, the less importance religion carries, this made me wonder if this was true, could a better world be gained simply by investing more in the education of all, not just the privileged few.

Could famine be sorted out, could poverty be sorted out, could war be sorted out and with that, could war based on religious ideals be sorted out? Could we infact have a more productive and settled world, you know, the utopian dream where people see the futility of war and resign it to the history books and we all sort of live happily ever after, to a fashion.

For example ;

On religion ;

In 2008, intelligence researcher Helmuth Nyborg examined whether IQ relates to denomination and income, using representative data from the National Longitudinal Study of Youth, which includes intelligence tests on a representative selection of American youth, where they have also replied to questions about religious belief. His results, published in the scientific journal Intelligence demonstrated that on average, Atheists scored 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasions. [4] "I'm not saying that believing in God makes you dumber. My hypothesis is that people with a low intelligence are more easily drawn toward religions, which give answers that are certain, while people with a high intelligence are more skeptical," says the professor

On Fertility ;

Among a sample of women using a reliable form of birth control, success rates were related to IQ, with the percentages of high, medium and low IQ women having unwanted births during a three-year interval being 3%, 8% and 11%, respectively. [15] Since the effectiveness of birth control is directly correlated with proper usage, an alternate interpretation of the data would indicate lower IQ women were more prone to misuse of birth control. Another study found that after an unwanted pregnancy has occurred, higher IQ couples are more likely to obtain abortions [16]; and unmarried teenage girls who become pregnant are found to be more likely to carry their babies to term if they are doing poorly in school.[17]

On Aggression ;http://www.crimetimes.org/95c/w95cp10.htm

Also;

A final causal explanation links IQ to crime through school performance. Less intelligent students do less well in school, which results in academic frustration. This frustration, in turn, weakens their attachment and commitment to schooling, and a weakened bond to school, as per social control theory, allows for more criminal behavior (Hirschi and Hindelang). This school-performance hypothesis has received strong support from empirical studies, and it is probably the most widely accepted explanation of the IQ-crime correlation (Moffitt). One last approach to IQ and crime deserves mention even though few criminological studies have examined it. Rather than low IQ increasing criminal behavior, criminal behavior might decrease IQ. Many facets of a criminal lifestyle can impair cognitive abilities, including physical injuries, especially head traumas, drug use, and withdrawing from school (Moffitt).

So, if IQ testing is a method of perhaps explaining some of the human ills in our world, can IQ be increased ?

Maybe ;

Dickens and Flynn[56] postulate that the arguments regarding the disappearance of the shared family environment should apply equally well to groups separated in time. This is contradicted by the Flynn effect. Changes here have happened too quickly to be explained by genetic heritable adaptation. This paradox can be explained by observing that the measure "heritability" includes both a direct effect of the genotype on IQ and also indirect effects where the genotype changes the environment, in turn affecting IQ. That is, those with a higher IQ tend to seek out stimulating environments that further increase IQ. The direct effect can initially have been very small but feedback loops can create large differences in IQ. In their model an environmental stimulus can have a very large effect on IQ, even in adults, but this effect also decays over time unless the stimulus continues (the model could be adapted to include possible factors, like nutrition in early childhood, that may cause permanent effects). The Flynn effect can be explained by a generally more stimulating environment for all people. The authors suggest that programs aiming to increase IQ would be most likely to produce long-term IQ gains if they taught children how to replicate outside the program the kinds of cognitively demanding experiences that produce IQ gains while they are in the program and motivate them to persist in that replication long after they have left the program.[56][57]

But what would it take to enable the rise of IQ in the world ?

Is it feasible ?

Or do we just keep chasing our tail until someone or something encourages our extinction ?

( Disclaimer : This post is not designed to create yet more differences where they might not exist, nor is it posted for the purpose of flaming anyone, but it is posted for the sole purpose of inviting thoughtful and positive discussion on something that affects us all )


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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 7:06:16 AM   
Real0ne


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The problem isnt simply believing in God makes you dumber, its the way it is taught.

The elites go by the law of God nearly to the letter perfect if one were to scrutinize it under a microscope.  Hence society as a whole was set up under the laws God, which is not the same as respecting an established religion as some would immediately jump up and scream.

The biggest problem with IQ is it pertains [almost] strictly to social constructs and your knowledge therein.

In other words intelligence is mostly how well do you relate to the world around you and the social constructs.

One good thing is that the iq tests have become broader in that they now take into consideration spacial reasoning as an example.

So from my experience there are 2 religios sectors.  One at the bottom of the rung, the beaten trying to pull themselves up by the bootstrap and one at the top of the rung who literally live it, at least as how it is applied to society and take it for granted.



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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 7:41:47 AM   
eyesopened


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I don't know how we raise the collective IQ.  If intelligent people use birth control and elect to have abortions and stupid people have babies then there's no hope.  But even stupid people produce gifted children from time to time.

There are still religious people who are gifted scientists, teachers, authors, artists and the kind of people who add wisdom, beauty, and joy to humanity.

It seems like the executives at Goldman-Sachs as well as BP and a host of other companies are really intelligent but are also some of the worst theives and murderers. 

Your thread smacks of a cleansing... if raise the IQ then the world will have more people who are responsible breeders, are acceptable atheists and limit crime to the more acceptable white-collar kind.

Or maybe... we change our attitude and see value, worth, and beauty in each child and construct our society to help more than hinder, celebrate more than criticize, give more than take.

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 7:59:38 AM   
Real0ne


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How would/could that happen?

Its corporatism built around commerce that is the roots of all evil.

Look at the people here starting threads to bash arabs because they dont treat their women the way we think they should be treated, and oh yeh you wil get some arab women to agree, but the majority want it just the way it is simply because its their culture and "Religion".

Yet the corporatists over here feel we should go in and save them from what? Freedom to practice the religion of their choice?

These marvy positions people take have deep rooted ramifications that does not even cross their shallow minds. (and that is not directed at you)

The problem is western society is built around commerce and the banking system is at the heart and we can take one very quick glance at our own us of a and quickly see that anyone who has dissented against the "god of commerce" and the banking industry is dead.  In fact just had a recent assignation of 2 people who went up against the banks and hurt their domination of well,,, everything.


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 8:00:18 AM   
pahunkboy


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Ok- we value knowledge - yet colleges are so expensive.

We value science- which is hyper dollar driven.

We fluoridate the water. Our food supply is pathetic.

We encourage pills- the most at the highest price rather then any real cures.

s0-  even dogs know better then to shit in the bed that they sleep in.

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 8:06:38 AM   
Real0ne


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Ok- we value knowledge - yet colleges are so expensive.

We value science- which is hyper dollar driven.

We fluoridate the water. Our food supply is pathetic.

We encourage pills- the most at the highest price rather then any real cures.

s0-  even dogs know better then to shit in the bed that they sleep in.



yup!

That is the evils of commerce.

Keep people chasing their tail and a dollar that loses 1/2 its value every 10 years at the cost of advancement.

Then think they will actually get a cure for cancer?

Cures are bad for business!  long term care fucking rocks lots of money in it.

replacement parts are history, you buy the whole assembly or throw it out and buy a new unit altogether.

Here is a great example!  Front load washers are designed to fail in approximately 10 years and its a known fact among the repair people.  Its been admitted.  If the drum bearing goes you replace the whole fucking plastic drum at 700 bucks!!!  Instead of the 25 dollar bearing that went out because of the faulty seals they put in.

Waste resources and lives to promote commerce and frankly keep the western banking systems bs monetary system afloat..  Effectively forcing you to spend your money rather than save it.

Why? to protect existing business interests.

and we better because we are all ass deep in it! LOL  trapped in a sinking ship!

Incidentally the people who write the laws of this country have a starting IQ of 160+ and not mensa that rates everyone 30 points higher than a standard test.




< Message edited by Real0ne -- 6/2/2010 8:40:59 AM >


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"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 8:29:08 AM   
Eigenaar


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I.Q. has nothing to do with education, it in a way measures the potential. Education will not improve I.Q. Because learning materials are constructed with the average pupil in mind most people with a high I.Q. do not do well at school and one finds a lot of school dropouts among them. A high I.Q does not guarantee a higher income.

< Message edited by Eigenaar -- 6/2/2010 8:33:17 AM >

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 11:30:33 AM   
Aneirin


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Yes, I agree, cleansing of a sort, cleansing the world of famine, poverty and war, is that acceptable ?

If attempts were made to raise the IQ of everyone through correct conditions, nutrition, education and stimulation maybe, just maybe we just might move away from our present selves and become something a bit more advanced.

< Message edited by Aneirin -- 6/2/2010 11:31:03 AM >


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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 12:56:05 PM   
Real0ne


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by who's standards of education?  we have a snoot full of the of flunkies from the methods used over the 100 years.

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"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 12:58:31 PM   
Moonhead


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The only real use of the IQ that I'm aware of, is that you have to be above a certain level to join MENSA.

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 12:59:52 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

by who's standards of education?  we have a snoot full of the of flunkies from the methods used over the 100 years.

By nobody's standards of education. The IQ test is run solely by problem solving ability in all of the tests I've ever seen.

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 1:09:50 PM   
Real0ne


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well th epoint is here in the us when asia was kicking our asses in the sat scores we lowered our by nearly 10 points so we would look and feel good instead of the real tardation being front and center.

mensa ratings are roughly 30 points difference from the standard tests.  I have had the fortune of dealing with 160+ people and there is no comparison between mensa and standard.

In fact I had several people take a standard test and their scores on the standard test was precisely 30 points lower than their mensa feel good scores.

in as much as public education goes when college people graduate as retards that does not say much.

You see a marked difference when dealing with japan, the swedes etc than here.


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"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 1:13:14 PM   
Moonhead


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Your point being what?

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 1:13:45 PM   
eyesopened


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin
Yes, I agree, cleansing of a sort, cleansing the world of famine, poverty and war, is that acceptable ?

If attempts were made to raise the IQ of everyone through correct conditions, nutrition, education and stimulation maybe, just maybe we just might move away from our present selves and become something a bit more advanced.


If the world moved toward giving each person the correct nutrition and education we would already have to be more advanced than our present selves.  We would have to have replaced greed with compassion.

But we could set up a system whereby undesirable people could be neutered and the right kind of people encouraged to breed or even set up selective breeding.  Then we could also set up the system whereby only the correct conditions and the correct education and the correct stimulation is offered those offspring.  The world could have a master or super race of people who are advanced.  A final solution as it were. 

< Message edited by eyesopened -- 6/2/2010 1:19:09 PM >


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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 1:17:05 PM   
Newnshiny


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No, it's just not feasible. There are too many extraneous variables. Smart people have morons kids, morons people have smart kids, etc.

And IQ is no substitute for compassion, kindness, and common sense.

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 1:28:33 PM   
Moonhead


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When has anybody ever said it is?
There are emotional IQ tests that measure for people's maturity on that level, but these are a lot less widespread, presumably because the results they produce are even more depressing than the results from the other.

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 1:48:23 PM   
kdsub


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So …the monsters of this world were stupid and if they were just better educated they would not have been responsible for the death of millions…Do you really believe that?

So…if people were only better educated then religion would be a thing of the past and all reason for war would go with it….Do you really believe that?

So…My next door neighbor who is Lutheran or my local Mayor who is Catholic… or my doctor who is Muslim are of lower intelligence because they believe in God…Do you really believe that?

If you do believe the above then I think you are of lower intelligence or you are a racists.

Butch

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 1:55:08 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

So …the monsters of this world were stupid and if they were just better educated they would not have been responsible for the death of millions…Do you really believe that?

So…if people were only better educated then religion would be a thing of the past and all reason for war would go with it….Do you really believe that?

So…My next door neighbor who is Lutheran or my local Mayor who is Catholic… or my doctor who is Muslim are of lower intelligence because they believe in God…Do you really believe that?

If you do believe the above then I think you are of lower intelligence or you are a racists.

Butch

I don't think he said any of that Butch, or even implied as much. let's face it, whatever else can be said against Goebbels (and there's little else that can't be said against the evil cunt, as he doesn't even seem to have shared any of his boss' few saving graces) he was not a stupid man. Those Nazi propaganda films would not still be worth watching if he were, and a couple of the ones I've seen are masterpieces. (I'm told Jew Suss is as well, but I've not seen that one.)

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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 2:04:13 PM   
Newnshiny


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

When has anybody ever said it is?



They haven't, I'm sure. But I was thinking more along the lines of the super-smart academic types I know who are barely able to tie their own shoelaces, and have almost no grip on the realities of life outside their given fields. They're not the people I think I would want to rely upon to stop wars, famines, etc.. So in that instance, I see no advantage to a collectively higher IQ.


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RE: The intelligence Quotient and it's uses ? - 6/2/2010 2:12:41 PM   
Moonhead


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Can you be sure that these sorts (assuming that they actually exist: I've met quite a lot of academics in my time, and none of them fit that template) have a high IQ in the first place, rather than say, an eidetic memory and the sort of idiot savant talent that Stephen King insists you're not a proper writer without for whatever they're chosen specialisation is?

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