"Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant"

"Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (Full Version)

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HeavansKeeper -> "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:11:32 PM)
When I top (here meaning the execution of acts associated with being dominant) my pleasure comes from seeing a bottom getting what they need. I like the way they squirm, whimper and moan and how happily dazed they are after. I don't get any sort of jollies internal to myself. There's no flush of euphoria or power trip. If my partner(s) did not enjoy the evening, then I don't either. My happiness seems to be found in theirs, which is a rather submissive standpoint. I don't know which title matches me better, but that doesn't really matter. I want to know if I'm missing a sensation that many people who align as dominant do experience. I am curious of how others would answer "What do you feel when dominating a person?" Any other thoughts on the matter are welcome as well.

AQuietSimpleMan -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:23:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper When I top (here meaning the execution of acts associated with being dominant) my pleasure comes from seeing a bottom getting what they need. I like the way they squirm, whimper and moan and how happily dazed they are after. Interesting I don't associate Sadism with Dominance as exclusive. To me a TOP is the person in a S&M based scene who is administering the use of tools to a Bottom. But that is how I define it. I will try to accept your example as I go along. quote: ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper I don't get any sort of jollies internal to myself. There's no flush of euphoria or power trip. If my partner(s) did not enjoy the evening, then I don't either. My happiness seems to be found in theirs, which is a rather submissive standpoint. I don't know which title matches me better, but that doesn't really matter. I want to know if I'm missing a sensation that many people who align as dominant do experience. And see I do, I get pleasure from inflicting that pain. I get my jollies off by being able to. I do agree that I as a Sadist REQUIRE a Masochist to play with, I cannot enjoy myself in they don't. I disagree that my enjoyment is found exclusively in their, rather the fact that I know they are enjoying it allows me to better enjoy what I am getting. During the scene I am not doing everything she likes, I am doing everything I like, I am pushing her, I am taking her to different places, I am driving her up the wall when I hit the same spot with the single tail 10 times in a row. As for Dominant (Sadist) the experience is two fold. From a good scene I get out Agression and am able to take my submissive (Masochist) to a place that nothing but the admistering of pain can do. When I give this to her, it also helps to endear her to me. There is a bond that is created when we have this symbiotic relationship. quote: ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper I am curious of how others would answer "What do you feel when dominating a person?" Any other thoughts on the matter are welcome as well. Now I am having an issue with the part that I underlined.Because what I get from DOMINATING someone is very different than what I get when I TOP someone as a Sadist. I can't really answer the question and stay on topic for you. QSM

HeavansKeeper -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:30:31 PM)
Thank you, QSM, for playing with the operational definitions I gave. While I find the single words we use to shorthand our personalities limiting, my dominance/topping does not revolve around the sensation of pain. In fact, physical pain is administered surprisingly rarely around me. When you engage someone as a sadist, or by your words top them, how do you feel?

AQuietSimpleMan -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:39:58 PM)
Raw, Free, Determined, Animalistic, Pure, Refreshed, and Arroused. for me I have definitions that work for me that don't work for everyone but for me.. Dominant is something that I AM - No matter what I am doing I am a Dominant. Sadist is something that I AM - No Matter what I do I am a Sadist TOP is something that I DO - I am only Topping while in a Scene. Master is something that she considers me - I am only a Master if she thinks I am Dom is something that I AM - and no different to me that Dominant but some people feel there is a distinction I don't. Things that I AM I am no matter what I am doing, they tend to be more difficult to see unless I am engaged with someone who accepts and interacts in these things with me. Top and Bottom as I understand means something different than I have noted in the Gay Community, My Definition does not include that but I would like to believe that if I was in the Gay community I would also be a Top there. QSM

kiwisub12 -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:43:04 PM)
I recently met with a man who described himself as a service top. He enjoyed playing with women, but didn't get off on causing pain. Basically, he got his jollys from doing what the bottom wanted. It didn't sit right with me. As a masochist , i need my "top" to enjoy inflicting pain - otherwise it feels selfish/self-centered. There was little dominance in what the service top did, and perhaps this is why it didn't sit properly. It might have looked like a domination scene, but the dynamic wasn't there for me. I enjoyed it , but didn't feel submissive to him, and a large part of what i enjoy in D/s play was missing.

HeavansKeeper -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:44:51 PM)
As you know, definitions are merely a construct, but here are mine: Sadist: One who enjoys inflicting physical pain. Dominant: One who enjoys having power established over another or establishing power over another. Dominate: The act of gaining power over another, sustaining power over another. Master: A title of respect. Top: One who engages in acts of domination. Service Top: One who engages in acts of domination in part (or in whole) for the enjoyment of another.

LadyPact -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:56:24 PM)
Your definitions are a bit different than Mine, HK. (Nice to see you posting again, btw.) Top - The person who is the action part of the scene. They are the constructor of the words "to do". The person who applies the sensations. Service Top - When the scene and the sensations applied are specifically for the pleasure of the bottom. The bottom is more in the direction of the scene than the top.

kiwisub12 -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 5:58:38 PM)
That would be what i didn't like about the self proclaimed service top - he wanted me to direct him in play - and i want a dominant that does things he enjoys - for his enjoyment, and incidently, mine.

LadyPact -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 6:11:39 PM)
I hate to use the analogy, but it really is the best one that I can think of. In this rare instance, I'm going to compare topping and bottoming to physical sex. All of us like to do things sexually for our partner at least every once in a while that is purely for their pleasure. But how many of us only enjoy all sex if that is all that motivates them? If the person we are having sex with is only doing it because that is what they think makes us happy, is that as fulfilling as both of us enjoying having sex for our mutual pleasure? When it comes down to it, how many men out there really like it when their female partner fakes an orgasm? Same thing goes for topping and bottoming. Those bottoms want the tops to be getting off on whatever it is that is being done to them. Especially those types that want to take the sensations because it is specifically what the top wants.

juliaoceania -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 6:14:31 PM)
A dominant can also be a service top to their submissive... in other words a person can intrinsically enjoy beating their partner because they like pleasing them, and have a power exchange relationship... the two are not mutually exclusive. I suppose the difference would be in the past my partner did this for me, when he felt like it, not when I felt like it... he had the control over when I got my spanking fix...

DesFIP -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 6:59:28 PM)
HK, nice to see you again. But no, it doesn't make you submissive. It makes you someone like The Man, who feeds off the responses he gets from me. That's why he doesn't let me go into space during play, because I don't give off any response, any energy for him to feed from. (He reserves it for the end, so I can space on my own while he cools down.) I guess I could call you an energy vampire, if anything. I wouldn't dare call him that, I'd get tickled mercilessly!

CynthiaWVirginia -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 7:21:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper When I top (here meaning the execution of acts associated with being dominant) my pleasure comes from seeing a bottom getting what they need. I like the way they squirm, whimper and moan and how happily dazed they are after. I don't get any sort of jollies internal to myself. There's no flush of euphoria or power trip. If my partner(s) did not enjoy the evening, then I don't either. My happiness seems to be found in theirs, which is a rather submissive standpoint. I don't know which title matches me better, but that doesn't really matter. I want to know if I'm missing a sensation that many people who align as dominant do experience. I am curious of how others would answer "What do you feel when dominating a person?" Any other thoughts on the matter are welcome as well. Before I start throwing any of my two cents in over the above, I want to give an opinion/example of how I view a service top. If a Dom/me owns a sub...and tells that sub to top them, and spells out everything clearly of what they want, maybe because they're a masochist but haven't a submissive bone in their body...I've known fem subs in the past who had a Dom like this, and when they topped, they had no real power at all. It was all for him...what he wanted, when, how long, where, with what, and she served him in this way because it was what he wanted. The only joy came from being pleasing. Not everyone who tops a masochist is a sadist, and not everyone who tops has any real or imagined power. This is how I see a service top. Now for the rest. For me, this is a two way street. Their submissive feelings calls out to my dominant ones and it's like throwing gasoline on a flame. I don't feel a "power trip" it's more of feeling...everything more acutely. Like holding onto a power line and feeling it flow through me. Sounds are so much more, colors brighter, things seem to slow down a little and my mind becomes very sharp, noticing everything. I have an intense, erotic, physical reaction going on, which is my polite way of saying that I have a female version of a...what a guy gets. It was startling at first because it had never happened to me before in vanilla, and during a good scene it can last 8-12 hours and I LIKE that. [;)] quote: my pleasure comes from seeing a bottom getting what they need. I like the way they squirm, whimper and moan and how happily dazed they are after. This is what makes everything so good, my enjoyment comes from MAKING them squirm, MAKING them whimper and moan, and MAKING them get all glassy eyed blissful and dazed, words slurring and...mmm. Are you sure you're not enjoying causing this more than you think you are? You don't have any times when you hunger to put them in this state? I couldn't enjoy a rag doll who couldn't wait for the session to be over and was only cooperating for my sake. If they're not enjoying it physically, it has to be really doing something to their head for me to get what I want. quote: I don't get any sort of jollies internal to myself. There's no flush of euphoria or power trip. If my partner(s) did not enjoy the evening, then I don't either. My happiness seems to be found in theirs, which is a rather submissive standpoint. I don't see this as being from a submissive standpoint...but from a symbiotic one. So, if your partner does not enjoy it...what kept you from stopping, as a service top would, and asking for directions to be more pleasing? I don't really want an answer, this is just something to think about. When it's good, I'm too busy enjoying the goodness to recognise any feelings as euphoria or a power trip. I do something, and it feels good and resonates from the primitive side of my nature. quote: I want to know if I'm missing a sensation that many people who align as dominant do experience. I don't know. Maybe...you are expecting huge fireworks to go off outside and haven't noticed the subtle internal ones going off inside your skin. quote: The Loving Owner of HisHeavan You own someone. Something inside you made you want to HAVE them, to OWN them, made you want to mark your territory...right? I'm almost going nuts wanting to claim someone who isn't quite mine yet. [:D] quote: I am curious of how others would answer "What do you feel when dominating a person?" Outside of a scene, when someone is mine I feel secure, at peace, more capable of handling situations that would normally overwhelm me (I have a panic disorder), I feel like I am more than myself. I've only felt this before...when I was very pregnant. I was different in that I'd had many miscarriages before this one, and I loved being pregnant and could have happily stayed that way forever. I bet this makes my explanation clear as mud. [:D]

Ligeia72 -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/3/2010 7:56:47 PM)
I consider myself a 'Service Top' in play. Although I sometimes question the use of the word 'Service', because it's not like I'm just some sort of robototic insert whatever kink here machine. I get off on seeing other people get off/enjoy themselves/go into subspace/etc. I feed off the energy of the scene, and the energy coming from the bottom. 'Service Topping' serves me just as much as it serves my play partner. As for how do I feel when Dominating? I've had limited experience with this, and it made me feel very awkward. I was just cringing inside, and thinking 'Oh god, this is so embarrasing, I feel so stupid'. I will do some limited D/s stuff if my partner really wanted it, but apart from that, no I'm not Dominant at all.

LadyNTrainer -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/4/2010 7:26:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HeavansKeeper I want to know if I'm missing a sensation that many people who align as dominant do experience. I am curious of how others would answer "What do you feel when dominating a person?" From a professional perspective, my experience is similar to yours. I get satisfaction from doing the job well, and effectively motivating my client towards a powerful transformational experience, inspiring them to greater health and fitness efforts, etc. At a casual play party with new partners, the "service work ethic" satisfaction is missing, and there's a more casual, "fun party game" feel to it. The fun there is artistry and novelty, and a social experience with friends. With my personal partners, inside my poly family, it's a major endorphin high for me, though of a somewhat different nature I think than what they describe in their experience in submission. "Fucking intense" doesn't even begin to cover it. I've tried to capture it in words here and there, so I'll share some excerpts from what I've scribbled at those times. There are oceans in his eyes, and sometimes it feels like I’m drowning in them. Their salinity is in equal parts of love and fear, adoration and intimidation. Impossible not to plunge into them, to explore the fascination of their depths, and to be caught in their dark undertow. There is no defense against utter surrender. Serotonin. Dopamine. Oxytocin. Opioid neuropeptides. Hypothalamic neurons discharging their chemical lightning into willing receptors. This is the perfect storm of desire, the blood tide that drowns me in my senses. The taste of his fear and his blood is a heady crimson wine, and I am drunk on it. Formidable, the hold he has over me when he is naked and trembling and vulnerable. I cannot look away; my eyes are locked into place as securely as his collar. Powerless and surrendered, he is totally powerful, totally compelling. The grace and beauty of him at times is enough to break my heart, and to make it whole again. He is John Barleycorn, consort and sacrifice. He is brutally degraded and taken for the most profane of uses, and thus a god worthy of worship and reverence. Crucified in leather, his flesh is violated and sanctified, celebrated and decorated by the bright blood roses of our passion. His body is the altar at which I worship. It is the sacred paradox, and it is the deepest truth and the greatest beauty that I can know in this life. I am the respectful penitent and the savage goddess, and the scourge rises and falls to glorify as much as to humble. I am as deeply reverent as I am merciless to the sacrifice. Dea gratias, forever and ever, amen. That's the closest I can get to describing how it feels for me. It is powerful, and beautiful, and transcendent. It wasn't always this way for me when I first started out in the scene. It was more something that developed over time, and it's not something I can experience easily outside of a committed relationship of trust and desire. Though sometimes the sparks are there from the beginning, and it's a good sign.

chamberqueen -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/4/2010 8:35:49 AM)
HK, I was a service top. I did everything I could think of to make the dreams of my subs come true. I got my enjoyment out of getting them to let down their guard and sharing things with me that they had never even shared with themselves, and then making things happen. I expected obedience and respect, but in return I gave them fulfillment beyond what they dreamed possible. I couldn't stay that way because I wasn't getting my own fulfillment, but I can see where some could be very satisfied in that role. There is something almost magical about watching someone blossom, seeing them open up, and watching trust grow. I hope it is working well for you.

Andalusite -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/4/2010 4:51:05 PM)
I don't identify as a service top. I enjoy getting various reactions from the bottom, especially when it rides that edge of almost too much. I want their moans and whimpers and flinches and tears and the way their breathing changes. I like doing things they dislike, as well as things they enjoy. I don't have any problem with getting suggestions or learning something new if the bottom likes or wants to try something I don't have experience with. I've recently learned needleplay and cell popping specifically because my femsub playpartner enjoys both. I enjoy the artistry that goes with them, and her reactions, and we do other things as well in most of our scenes. It seems silly to specifically say, "No, it was your idea, so I refuse to try it!" stomp grumble stomp If I'd found I didn't enjoy either of them, I wouldn't have continued using them.

ExSteelAgain -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/4/2010 8:05:50 PM)
Sure, it's complicated at times because we want to see her get what she needs. But I remember the first time I ever beat a submissive. It was with a hairbrush she gave me to use. I cummed during the beating. Even though that is the only time I ever cummed while beating someone, it shows my heart is in the right bdsm place. It does turn me on.

Mishna -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/5/2010 8:51:05 AM)
I used to play with someone who claimed to be a dom. While we were playing, he was amazing. He could read me like a book, and both of us got immense pleasure out of our interaction. He decided he wanted to pursue something more, and so did I. We wanted a D/s relationship. However, while he could play and wield a whip like nobody's business, he lacked the skills to be someone's dominant. Communication with him was non-existent yet he had expectations that I would know what he wanted and how he wanted them, yet all without opening his mouth to tell me. Neither was he willing to take responsibility for his actions nor to work out problems as they arose. He preferred to pretend they didn't exist. I think the difference between a "service top" and a "dominant" is the willingness to take responsibility outside of a scene and engage in those things, such as communication, that lead to a deeper and more meaningful relationship.

Andalusite -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/5/2010 9:02:45 AM)
I disagree. There are some tops who are responsible and have great communication and connection, and want deep and meaningful relationships. There are some Dominants, Masters, and Mistresses who are focused primarily on service and/or control, and who don't offer any emotional connection at all, or who have difficulty in communicating clearly. Relationship skills do not depend upon D/s orientation.

SimplyMichael -> RE: "Service Top" as compared to being "Dominant" (7/5/2010 9:09:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mishna I used to play with someone who claimed to be a dom. While we were playing, he was amazing. He could read me like a book, and both of us got immense pleasure out of our interaction. He decided he wanted to pursue something more, and so did I. We wanted a D/s relationship. However, while he could play and wield a whip like nobody's business, he lacked the skills to be someone's dominant. Communication with him was non-existent yet he had expectations that I would know what he wanted and how he wanted them, yet all without opening his mouth to tell me. Neither was he willing to take responsibility for his actions nor to work out problems as they arose. He preferred to pretend they didn't exist. I think the difference between a "service top" and a "dominant" is the willingness to take responsibility outside of a scene and engage in those things, such as communication, that lead to a deeper and more meaningful relationship. Topping is like sex, one can be a great lover and a shitty boyfriend/husband just as one can be a great boyfriend/husband but lousy in bed. One can top like a greedy bastard or one can do it for the sheer pleasure of the person being topped.

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